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Subject: UN looking to seize the internet?

Written By: GWBush2004 on 11/15/05 at 5:37 pm

Am I the only one who thinks the UN should keep their hands off?

http://today.reuters.com/news/newsArticle.aspx?type=internetNews&storyID=2005-11-14T082115Z_01_RID429696_RTRUKOC_0_US-SUMMIT.xml

Subject: Re: UN looking to seize the internet?

Written By: ADH13 on 11/15/05 at 7:26 pm



What exactly is it that they want to control??

"The internet" itself is absolutely nothing.  What makes the internet useful are people's web pages that they spend money or time creating, and the internet service providers who allow us to email each other, and access these web pages. 

And are all the UN nations planning to foot the bill for whatever it is they want to do??  Probably not. 

Subject: Re: UN looking to seize the internet?

Written By: IanWinn on 11/15/05 at 7:56 pm

They want to control the flow of information.  With the internet as it is, information flows freely, as do the opinions of those who post the stories.  There really is no way to control the internet short of bringing it down.

IMHO, that is just what they will do:  They plan to launch a really nasty virus-type program that will bring the whole internet to a grinding halt.  They will then set up "Internet 2", or somesuch name for it, which will be touted as a safer environment because everyone on it will have to pass "rigorous inspections" in order to post information on it.  The reality is that websites would have to be gov't/UN approved, and that would entail swearing that website owners would not post any information that would be defamatory to the gov't (no matter how true).  Gone would be the expose's on the UN "Food for Oil" debacle, or reports on Dubya's tantrums.  In their place would be pablum of how wonderful the UN is, and how smashingly well the War on Terror is proceeding.

Subject: Re: UN looking to seize the internet?

Written By: ADH13 on 11/15/05 at 8:59 pm




Gone would be the expose's on the UN "Food for Oil" debacle, or reports on Dubya's tantrums.

Subject: Re: UN looking to seize the internet?

Written By: MaxwellSmart on 11/15/05 at 10:50 pm

I'm more fearful of corporate control than UN control, because the way U.S. corporations are going, corporate control will mean Chinese control of the internet within the next, say, twenty years!

For now, they're just talking, I don't see the need to get all John Birch Society about it!  They're not going to seize the internet and force your children to watch communist French beatnik pornography, or whatever atrocious visions are haunting your conservative cranium!
http://www.clicksmilies.com/s0105/fragend/confused-smiley-017.gif

Subject: Re: UN looking to seize the internet?

Written By: IanWinn on 11/15/05 at 11:24 pm

And you believe that corporations are the opposite of government?  Sorry, Maxwell, but corporations are the greatest buddies of government the world has ever known, because they both seek the same thing:  power; power over people's lives, hearts, minds, and pocketbooks; power to decide who lives and who dies, for any reason, or even no reason (death as entertainment; it's been done).  To them, we are their slaves, and they are our masters.

The only philosophy that opposes them is liberty, the belief that one's life is theirs to live without undue interference; to live, to think and form opinions, to work, to marry and raise children, to be at peace with one's neighbors, to worship as one sees fit.  Liberty recognizes also that one has the responsibility to be lawful.  For a Christian like me, that means, "Love God, Love your neighbor as yourself, Do for others as you would have them do for you.  For Jews, it is (at the very least) the 10 Commandments.  For those who do not believe in God, it ought to be Ayn Rand's great commandment, You shall not initiate the use of force or fraud against anyone for any reason.  All the above show that we as human beings have rights AND responsibilities.

The people who run the corporations and governments of the world operate on a different philosophy:  We in the corporate/government leadership have the rights; you who are outside of our little circle have the responsibilities.  Now get to work!

THAT is what we must fight against, not liberals v. conservatives, not Democrats v. Republicans, not corporate v. government.

Subject: Re: UN looking to seize the internet?

Written By: MaxwellSmart on 11/15/05 at 11:48 pm


And you believe that corporations are the opposite of government?

Subject: Re: UN looking to seize the internet?

Written By: IanWinn on 11/16/05 at 1:12 am

I apologize for the misunderstanding, but I am a little late to this party.  :)  Hope the sushi's still fresh!  ;D

Also, you hit the nail on the head:  Money and power go hand in hand, and when they become concentrated, that's when corruption and oppression begin.  It's not so bad, though, when a person with a concentration money/power has things to do (ie, run a corporation, deliberate legislation, etc) but when they have too much time on their hands, that's when they get into "the devil's workshop" (old Scottish proverb).  THAT's when they decide that they can determine the morals (or lack thereof) for the people around them.

Money is not necessarily a bad thing; it lets us pay the bills so that we have the necessities, and gives us options.  But it's when you have more than you know what to do with that people tend to get corrupted.  Either that, or they can't handle it and they lose it, and FAST (which is why you never hear too much about lottery winners more than a couple of months after they win the jackpot).

As for the UN, it's part of the problem, and it is making inroads to having it's dictates made into law that ALL people must obey.  It cannot do so, however, without the support of the nations AND corporations that fund it.  A solution must be found.

Cheers, Maxwell!

Subject: Re: UN looking to seize the internet?

Written By: Davester on 11/16/05 at 1:33 am


Am I the only one who thinks the UN should keep their hands off?

http://today.reuters.com/news/newsArticle.aspx?type=internetNews&storyID=2005-11-14T082115Z_01_RID429696_RTRUKOC_0_US-SUMMIT.xml


Subject: Re: UN looking to seize the internet?

Written By: Billy Florio on 11/16/05 at 1:59 am


communist French beatnik pornography


a friend of mine actually has some of that...it's quite histerical.

Note, Im not joking. 

Subject: Re: UN looking to seize the internet?

Written By: Mushroom on 11/16/05 at 11:06 am

Now here is the "reality" of the "Internet".

There is no such thing as "The Internet".

What we have is a bunch of "people" who all agreed on a few simple things.  They agree to use TCP/IP, and the addressing and naming scheme.  And there is already an "Internet 2", which uses IP6.  And there are tens of thousands of other "nets", which use their own name and addressing systems.

A good example of the "third party" nets is FidoNet.  Fido has been in existance since 1984.  And there are thousands of other "Nets", including the IRC nets, the Usenet nets, and myriad of others.

The Internet is simply a concept that people agree upon to use.  That is all.  Nobody controlls it, and ever since the Government opened it up to outside access, it has been impossible for anybody to control it.

The Internet is simply hundreds of millions of computers, all connected together by an agreed upon set of standards.  And as long as 2 or more people agree to use them, it will continue exist.  I am sure that in 200 years, when the current computer and networking technology has become long obsolete, you will still have people use this original Internet, for nostalga reasons if nothing else.  In much the same way that Global communications have made Short Wave obsolete, yet thousands of people still use it.

In short, nobody can controll the internet.  No country or organization can controll the internet.  It is simply impossible to do, because it does not exist.  It only exists in the minds of those that use it because they agree to use the standards which make it up.

Subject: Re: UN looking to seize the internet?

Written By: McDonald on 11/16/05 at 11:10 am


a friend of mine actually has some of that...it's quite histerical.

Note, Im not joking.

Subject: Re: UN looking to seize the internet?

Written By: McDonald on 11/16/05 at 11:11 am


Now here is the "reality" of the "Internet".

There is no such thing as "The Internet".

What we have is a bunch of "people" who all agreed on a few simple things.

Subject: Re: UN looking to seize the internet?

Written By: GWBush2004 on 11/16/05 at 3:31 pm

From Neal Boortz's website:

KEEPING CONTROL OF THE INTERNET

I've told you in the past about the United Nations' efforts to wrestle control over the Internet away from the United States.  The idea that the UN would be put in charge of the Internet is more than a disaster...it's downright frightening.  But there may be good news.

Yesterday, at something called the World Summit on the Information Society in Tunis, Tunisia, delegates at the U.N. meeting agreed to establish a new forum to discuss Internet issues, but it would have no policy-making powers --- for now.  Translation: the U.N. is not taking over the Internet, at least not yet.  Imagine how disastrous it would be for the UN to control the Internet.  For example, would they censor content?  Would you be allowed to criticize Muslims on the new U.N.-controlled Internet?  Remember, the United Nations' own Human Rights Declaration only permits free speech and freedom of the press so long as what is being said or written does not "interfere with the goals and purposes of the United Nations." 

For an anti-American, anti-Israel and anti-Democratic institution like the U.N. to be put in charge of really what is the last bastion of pure free speech on Earth would ruin the Internet.  Some in Congress remain skeptical of the U.N.'s latest move, saying this forum is one step closer to them taking over the Internet.  We'll have to keep an eye on that.

Hopefully people are now aware of the issue and won't forget. It also goes without saying that the reason the Internet is prospering is probably because we're in charge of it.

Also ... if you're one of those who believe that this could never happen, that the UN could never get control of the Internet ... just remember the Panama Canal.

http://boortz.com/images/funny/get_off_my_internet.jpg

ALSO:

You do realize that there's a meeting going on right now ... a meeting of world leaders dedicated to the proposition of seizing control of the Internet from the United States. Too many people are asleep at the switch on this one.

More on the attempt by the U.N. to seize control of the Internet. Apparently the effort is being met with cheers from the dictators of the world.

Subject: Re: UN looking to seize the internet?

Written By: IanWinn on 11/16/05 at 3:38 pm

The article makes excellent and valid points.  I don't always agree with Neal, but he's got his information straight on this one.

Subject: Re: UN looking to seize the internet?

Written By: Don Carlos on 11/16/05 at 4:12 pm

To say that the UN is anti-US, anti-Isreal, and anti-democracy is a bit off the wall IMHO.  That many nations of the world are opposed to current US policy does not make them anti-US.  To suggest that the fact that many nations are frustrated that Isreal refuses  to comply with UN resolution makes them anti-Isreal, and I can't figure out where the anti-democracy swill comes from.  In fact, one could argue that the US use of its veto on the Security Council, which we have used to block the will of the majority, is the height of anti-democratic behaviour.

Subject: Re: UN looking to seize the internet?

Written By: GWBush2004 on 11/16/05 at 4:26 pm


In fact, one could argue that the US use of its veto on the Security Council, which we have used to block the will of the majority, is the height of anti-democratic behaviour.


I thought that was set up to protect the right of the minority.  Democrats seemed to talk about that all the time during the filibuster debate.

Subject: Re: UN looking to seize the internet?

Written By: Mushroom on 11/16/05 at 4:54 pm


In fact, one could argue that the US use of its veto on the Security Council, which we have used to block the will of the majority, is the height of anti-democratic behaviour.


I would agree, except for one thing.  The US is not the only nation with veto power.

At this time, China, France, Russia, United Kingdom, and United States all have veto power.  In fact, without the granting of this power most of the major signatories would have not joined the UN in the first place.  Both the US and USSR refused to join the UN without this power.  And without them, the UN would simply have been "The Leage Of Nations II", which was totally impotant.  Now, we have an organization which is only 50% impotant.

Subject: Re: UN looking to seize the internet?

Written By: MaxwellSmart on 11/16/05 at 10:42 pm


The article makes excellent and valid points.

Subject: Re: UN looking to seize the internet?

Written By: GWBush2004 on 11/16/05 at 11:08 pm

U.N. loses bid for control of Internet

Subject: Re: UN looking to seize the internet?

Written By: MaxwellSmart on 11/16/05 at 11:24 pm


U.N. loses bid for control of Internet

Oh, I'm heartbroken.  I'm gonna hug my teddy bear and cry myself to sleeep tonight.\ ::)

Subject: Re: UN looking to seize the internet?

Written By: GWBush2004 on 11/16/05 at 11:35 pm


Oh, I'm heartbroken.

Subject: Re: UN looking to seize the internet?

Written By: Mushroom on 11/17/05 at 10:38 am


If Joe Shmo starts Joe Shmo's kiddie porn and heroin sales dot com, authorities will track him down and throw him in jail.


Not as long as he hosts it in another country.

One of the things a lot of the people in the US do not realize is that gambling on the internet is illegal.  That is why all of the "Online Casinos" are in foreign countries.  And most of them have connections to organized crime and drug cartels (they are an excellent way to launder money).

And the same with "kiddie porn".  Until recently, pictures of nude children (in non-sexual poses) was legal in Japan.  That is why a lot of child porn sites were hosted there.  Since that is illegal there now, most of them have moved to countries like China.  For the most part, China does not care what laws you break, as long as they get money.

All this simply proves how it is impossible for anybody to controll the internet.  If the US Government can't even stop gambling on the internet, how could the UN ever hope to "controll" the Internet?

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