President sinking in ratings

By Susan Page, USA TODAY

WASHINGTON — Americans' views of President Bush and his leadership have soured in the wake of dismay over the government's response to Hurricane Katrina, the course of the Iraq war and the future of the economy.

President Bush's approval rating for handling the hurricane dipped after his adress to the nation. 

Bush's rating for handling each of those issues dropped to his lowest yet in a USA TODAY/CNN/Gallup Poll taken Friday through Sunday. Assessments of his personal qualities also fell: For the first time, a majority says he isn't a strong and decisive leader. (Related: Poll results)

Bush's overall approval rating is 40%, equaling a previous low. His disapproval is 58%, a new high.

"Bush stands at a precipice," says Carroll Doherty of the non--——partisan Pew Research Center. "He's lost ground among independents. He seems to be starting to lose ground among his own party. And he lost the Democrats a long time ago."

By a record 66%-31%, independents disapprove of the job Bush is doing as president.

White House press secretary Scott McClellan says the president "knows a leader must govern based on what he believes is right, not based on polls." Bush is "working to address the priorities that Americans are most concerned about," he says.

Of the poll's respondents, 30% identified themselves as Republicans, 33% as independents and 36% as Democrats.

The survey shows signs of friction between the two most pressing concerns on Bush's agenda: the Iraq war and Katrina recovery.

A 54% majority says the best way for the government to pay for hurricane relief is by cutting spending for the war. Just 6% support spending cuts in domestic programs, as Bush has suggested.

Nearly two-thirds of those polled, 63%, say some or all of the U.S. troops in Iraq should be withdrawn. A record-high 59% say it was a mistake to invade.

Bush's standing declined even though Americans by 45%-27% approve of the proposals he unveiled in a nationally televised address Thursday to deal with Katrina. Seven in 10 express confidence the administration can assist victims.

But assessments of Bush on the hurricane dipped after the speech: 56% say he has taken steps to help victims mostly for political reasons, not because he cares about them.

By more than 4-to-1, Americans want an independent panel — not Congress — to investigate the government's response to Katrina.

Original Article:

http://www.usatoday.com/news/washington/2005-09-19-bush-poll_x.htm?csp=24

USA TODAY/CNN GALLUP POLL:

http://www.usatoday.com/news/polls/2005-09-19-poll.htm

Rankings are a bunch of crap.  They mean nothing, and the ideals of who they come from mean everything. 

If you think  Rankings mean something, look at Movies. Are the best movies the most popular?  No they aren't.  The American public as a whole, is stupid. Nough said.

I agree with you Hairspray - GALLUP SURVEYS/POLLS are a very good indication of Public feeling at the present time.

What is a good are polls exept to let supporters glote if there good and to let opposers glote if there bad.  It's kind of silly, isn't it?

Rankings are a bunch of crap.  They mean nothing, and the ideals of who they come from mean everything. 

If you think  Rankings mean something, look at Movies. Are the best movies the most popular?  No they aren't.  The American public as a whole, is stupid. Nough said.


Were you saying that when Bush had high approval ratings?

Rankings are a bunch of crap. They mean nothing, and the ideals of who they come from mean everything.

If you think Rankings mean something, look at Movies. Are the best movies the most popular? No they aren't. The American public as a whole, is stupid. Nough said.


Movie rankings aren't supposed to rate the best, they're supposed to rate what people like.

Movie RANKINGS and approval RATINGS are completely different things anyway

Movie RANKINGS and approval RATINGS are completely different things anyway


Yeah, i thought that was a very silly comparison..

Rankings are a bunch of crap.  They mean nothing, and the ideals of who they come from mean everything. 

If you think  Rankings mean something, look at Movies. Are the best movies the most popular?  No they aren't.  The American public as a whole, is stupid. Nough said.


I beg to differ.  Opinion polls are not "a bunch of crap".  They reflect what people think.  And I'm sorry you have so little regard for our fellow citizens, in fact, I concider that sentiment somewhat arrogant.  Nough said, although I could add a phrase or 2.

If Bush sticks to his current agenda (including Operation Balboa) his ratings have nowhere to go but down.  The American public, however, doesn't get it yet.  Their opinion doesn't matter.  Democracy is O-V-E-R!*
:o

*we have a slight chance of reviving it if we throw these bums out.

Operation Balboa?
http://www.dailykos.com/storyonly/2005/9/17/154253/344
http://lists.topica.com/lists/ANTINATO/read/message.html?mid=912504343&sort=d&start=41788

If Bush sticks to his current agenda (including Operation Balboa) his ratings have nowhere to go but down. 


I totally agree... ::)

Interesting that people only think opinion polls are crap when they don't agree with their own opinion. That Operation Balboa thing is pretty scary. If Chavez does what he says he can do, and hand over real evidence of this, Koppel should get the Pulitzer.

Interesting that people only think opinion polls are crap when they don't agree with their own opinion. That Operation Balboa thing is pretty scary. If Chavez does what he says he can do, and hand over real evidence of this, Koppel should get the Pulitzer.

I'm afraid the Republic Noise Machine will just run Koppel out of town, like they did to Dan Rather.  It's sad how much power those bozos have over the media!

Were you saying that when Bush had high approval ratings?


I say that..PERIOD.

Movie rankings aren't supposed to rate the best, they're supposed to rate what people like.


Which in this day in age, isn't the good stuff.

I beg to differ.  Opinion polls are not "a bunch of crap".  They reflect what people think.  And I'm sorry you have so little regard for our fellow citizens, in fact, I concider that sentiment somewhat arrogant.  Nough said, although I could add a phrase or 2.


Well whatever.  I'm comparing it to the fact of the high percentage of American's who want to legalize cocaine.  Or how about the large percentage of Canadian's who want to legalize Pedophilia. 

William Shakespeare proved a long time ago in his play "Julius Ceasar" that people are not leaders they are followers.  One person gets enough people to believe in something, no matter how bad/stupid/evil/wrong it is, everyone else will join in.

One person gets enough people to believe in something, no matter how bad/stupid/evil/wrong it is, everyone else will join in.



I knew if you kept posting, eventually you would give your plan away.

I knew if you kept posting, eventually you would give your plan away.


That's not my plan.

My refusal to get caught up in the flock, is not a campaign for power.

Well whatever.  I'm comparing it to the fact of the high percentage of American's who want to legalize cocaine. Or how about the large percentage of Canadian's who want to legalize Pedophilia." 
William Shakespeare proved a long time ago in his play "Julius Ceasar" that people are not leaders they are followers.  One person gets enough people to believe in something, no matter how bad/stupid/evil/wrong it is, everyone else will join in.





WHAT!?!?!?  

"Or how about the large percentage of Canadian's who want to legalise Paedophilia."   

Is this fact Mr H?  where did you get your source of information??

Rankings are a bunch of crap.  They mean nothing, and the ideals of who they come from mean everything. 

If you think  Rankings mean something, look at Movies. Are the best movies the most popular?  No they aren't.  The American public as a whole, is stupid. Nough said.



Wow, it's very hard to not get personal when one person insults "The American public as a whole" in general; but I'll try.  Directing my commentary to the immediately concerning statement, I don't feel the patriotism there.  Maybe it's just me, but I love my country and I'm proud to be an American and would never, ever degrade any of it.

With regard to polls, I'll repeat the sentiment of the majority in stating that polls indeed very-well reflect the feelings, thoughts and opinions of the majority of the public; and anyone with the education to truly understand politics and the elements that drive all of it would know the importance of such information: potential future voters and possible shifts in political agendas and other consequences stem from these so-called useless, meaningless polls.  Heck, the results of such uselessness, as polls seem to be for some, has driven a president to get-off his butt and actually make himself look active!  It is in every politician's best interest to keep tabs on the mood of the people because when united and strong, people CAN make a difference.

I agree with you Hairspray - GALLUP SURVEYS/POLLS are a very good indication of Public feeling at the present time.


Thank you. It is a fact that these polls are quite informative and sometimes influential.

What is a good are polls exept to let supporters glote if there good and to let opposers glote if there bad.  It's kind of silly, isn't it?


That's one negative take on it, for sure. I don't agree with this view, but respect it no matter how negative.

Well whatever.  I'm comparing it to the fact of the high percentage of American's who want to legalize cocaine.  Or how about the large percentage of Canadian's who want to legalize Pedophilia. 




I demand that if strong / controversial statements are made, whether or not they're alleged statistics, that evidence of such and their supposed results is posted and a verifiable link from a reputable source is furnished along with such statements.

Gratuitous flaming will not be tolerated in these forums on my watch.

That's not my plan.

My refusal to get caught up in the flock, is not a campaign for power.



I beg to differ.  I propose, perhaps, some are caught up in a different flock.  Also based on previously read posts, I'm of the opinion this statement is one which reflects, IMO, stubborn, closed-minded blind faith. Hmm....

WHAT!?!?!?  

"Or how about the large percentage of Canadian's who want to legalise Paedophilia."   

Is this fact Mr H?  where did you get your source of information??


A magazine in the library.  I wasn't reading it, but my friend started laughing, and I was like, "what's so funny" and he said, "listen to this".  Use your imagination to figure out the rest.

And as far as pedophilia, as in Canadian's want to see Dirty Old men get there hands on little girls or sex deprived women get there hands on little boys, that is not at all the case.  They want to legalize it so that 18-2? year olds can have sex with 17 and younger year olds and not get in trouble. 

Wow, it's very hard to not get personal when one person insults "The American public as a whole" in general; but I'll try.  Directing my commentary to the immediately concerning statement, I don't feel the patriotism there.  Maybe it's just me, but I love my country and I'm proud to be an American and would never, ever degrade any of it.

With regard to polls, I'll repeat the sentiment of the majority in stating that polls indeed very-well reflect the feelings, thoughts and opinions of the majority of the public; and anyone with the education to truly understand politics and the elements that drive all of it would know the importance of such information: potential future voters and possible shifts in political agendas and other consequences stem from these so-called useless, meaningless polls.  Heck, the results of such uselessness, as polls seem to be for some, has driven a president to get-off his butt and actually make himself look active!  It is in every politician's best interest to keep tabs on the mood of the people because when united and strong, people CAN make a difference.



You show me how the American people are brilliant then. You show me where I'm wrong, and everyone in America has a great head on there shoulders and where we don't have problems.  You show me where this is at.  Cause I want to see it.  I suppose that the country I love isn't being over ran with a bunch of evil things like hate crimes and drugs, I suppose the smoke is like my faith, blinding.

That's not my plan.

My refusal to get caught up in the flock, is not a campaign for power.


If you don't want people to think the way you do, why do you argue.  If you just don't want to get caught up in the flock, keep the flock away.

I beg to differ.  I propose, perhaps, some are caught up in a different flock.  Also based on previously read posts, I'm of the opinion this statement is one which reflects, IMO, stubborn, closed-minded blind faith. Hmm....


You prove to me how people are like eagles, and I'll be more than happy to show you throughout thousands and thousands of years how people are like sheep.

If you don't want people to think the way you do, why do you argue.  If you just don't want to get caught up in the flock, keep the flock away.


A To show that not everyone in this world is a part of the flock. B To Voice another opinion(If you haven't noticed by now there are only about 4-7 members on this board that don't have the same views as the rest of them)  C Provide challenge

attention kettle: the pot has a comment to make regarding your hue

You prove to me how people are like eagles, and I'll be more than happy to show you throughout thousands and thousands of years how people are like sheep.


You're impying people are not individuals and do not have the ability to think for themselves.

Well I for one, along with the vast majority of reasonably intelligent people, DO have an ability (believe it or not    ::) ) to form and make our own opinions - just as you do yourself about people who post here and your chosen subject - GOD.

Who's the sheep now then Harmonica    ;D

 Not me, I'm a gliding, swooping Eagle - trust me   ;)

You're impying people are not individuals and do not have the ability to think for themselves.

Well I for one, along with the vast majority of reasonably intelligent people, DO have an ability (believe it or not   ::) ) to form and make our own opinions - just as you do yourself about people who post here and your chosen subject - GOD.

Who's the sheep now then Harmonica   ;D 

 Not me, I'm a gliding, swooping Eagle - trust me   ;)




People have the ability to think for themselves, they don't.  Big difference.  They conform.  Have an opinion, first check to see what everyone elses is, if not in conformity, change it.

I believe in the unity of people based on trust, love, education and understanding, as in a God.  The unity of people based on fears is no unity at all, as in what happens day in and day out in the USA as well as the rest of the world.

What flock?  And who do you want to show?

There is no reason to give an opinion except if you want to try to get other people to think the same way.

To who? What kind of challenge?


Of Sheep, people.  I want to show that there are other ways to think about things besides what the majority has in mind.  I used to think about things a lot differently than I do now, but then I started listening to everyone, not just the majority and found truth.  The ones of the past did it for me.  My duty to repay them for doing it for the ones of the future.

yes there is a reason to give your opinion besides to get people to think the same way.

"Who is your favorite NFL football team"  "the Miami Dolphins"  I can be the only Miami Dolphin fan in the whole entire world for all I care. 

Challenge those who all have the same opinion.  Challenge the principals and foundations from which there opinion came.  I have no problem when people follow something, my problem comes in when they follow something because they are unaware of what else is out there, what else is out there in the world.

Now I already can imagine where your gonna wanna take this, so let me put up my counter argument now.

I follow Christianity best I can(notice I didn't say impeccably).  I have friends, good friends that I talk with often that are atheist.  I've read a lot of atheist opinions, including Howard and Young, who are two atheist who pick apart the Bible.  I'm welll aware of all the options presented in front of me, when it comes to christianity.  I do not close my eyes, ears, mind or heart to listen to those who oppose christianity.  Just because I don't say, "hey your right, life sucks their must be no God" does not mean I'm blind to the views I'm supposed to see from atheist, it means I listened I saw there valid points, but I got valid points of my own and I hold on to what holds most true.

Just becuase people agree does not mean they do it without thinking.  A lot of people are Christian, and they don't agree about how to be Christian, because they think about what it means for thereself.  If you challenge people just because they are the majority, then if 99% of the world believed like you, would you be the 1% atheist just to not go along with the "sheep"?  Being different just to be different is just as nonthinking as being the same just to be the same.  A point is good or bad on its own, its not good or bad because everybody agrees or because everybody disagrees.


I'm not being different just to be different.  Believe me, I've tried to be part of the "norm" more than once in my life.  It just doesn't work.  I think it comes down to where you place your priorities.  Peer pressure, has seldomly gotten to me.

And if everyone else happens to agree with what I say, like for instance everyone's opinion for the majority on why Bush attacked Iraq, I don't change my opinion.

Well, everybody should have an opinion.  But a lot of the time, you come off like your right and other people are wrong.


that's what a debate is.  Secondly I respect others views, but I you don't see me accusing other people of opinion when they post facts.  That happens to me a lot. I post a fact, and all of a sudden it becomes my opinion.  I attack facts and show why they're the way they are, but I don't make it out to be as if someone is making it up out  of thin air in there own head.

Lots of action on this thread today, but one post stood out.  Seems that many of the most active posters on this board are, to varying degrees, left of center (and I suspect I'm left-most) so we seem to be a majority.  That is certainly NOT the case in the general population where Mr H's political conservatism and religious fundamentalism dominate.  In fact, I always tell my students that because my academic freedom (to decent from the popular view) is so important to me that I must champion theirs, as I do.  How many "Let Cuba Live/End the Blockaid" bumper stickers do you see on the road?  I have one.

Well, I THINK a debate is more useful if people try to argue the best way to solve a problem.  But you argue stuff like "A lot of Americans want to legalize cocaine" and make it seem like most people think cocaine is good.  Which I THINK is dishonest, because MOST people don't think it's good, they just don't necessarily think that making it illegal is the best way to make people not use it, or the best way to spend law enforcement money or whatever.  I just think its disnonest or oversimple to try to make it seem like most of those people just want there kids to go out and do coke.  Thats just an example.


I just went on a recent poll that I saw.  The lesser of two evils doesn't make something good, it just makes it the lesser of two evils.  I know as well as the next guy that allowing everyone and there dog that wants to get high is in sense going to lower the death rates for gun related drug crimes.

But you explain to me how, allowing everyone and there dog that wants to get high, to do so, is not in one way or another promoting it.

  That is certainly NOT the case in the general population where Mr H's political conservatism and religious fundamentalism dominate. 
I'm not sure conservatism or Christian fundamentalism in the manner of Rush Limbaugh/Pat Robertson is as prevalent as the media blowhards would have us believe.
I think a far bigger problem among the general public is fear and stupidity.  I know that sounds awful of me to say...and it is awful, just look at the results!

At this point, I'm not really looking at his ratings....I figure there's nothing we can do about it now and I feel good knowing that I had no part in him being reelected (or elected, for that matter) so I can tell people who voted for him and complain "Well, YOU'RE one of the people who helped vote him into office" ;)

Oh, so you didn't vote for Bush?  But he's the one who wanted to get rid of your estate tax!

At this point, I'm not really looking at his ratings....I figure there's nothing we can do about it now and I feel good knowing that I had no part in him being reelected (or elected, for that matter) so I can tell people who voted for him and complain "Well, YOU'RE one of the people who helped vote him into office" ;)


Oh, so you didn't vote for Bush? But he's the one who wanted to get rid of your estate tax!

Neither did I. ::) In fact, i didn't vote for him either time.

Harmonica I used to feel some sort of sympathy for you - thinking you were being picked on, but as I read your posts you come across as a total raving Religious fanatic only intent to force your ideals on people.

Can't you be a good Christian without trying to ram a metaphorical Bible down everyone's gullets?

Isn't being Christian about living a decent honest life or did I miss something here?

You need to chill out a little more often sonny.

Harmonica I used to feel some sort of sympathy for you - thinking you were being picked on, but as I read your posts you come across as a total raving Religious fanatic only intent to force your ideals on people.

Can't you be a good Christian without trying to ram a metaphorical Bible down everyone's gullets?

Isn't being Christian about living a decent honest life or did I miss something here?

You need to chill out a little more often sonny.


Name me the time's when I'm quoting Bible verses and cramming them down other people's throats?  Name me when I do that, cause I must have a spilt personality, cause I don't remember doing that. 

I do live a decent honest life.  I may not be the smartest man in the world, but I never post full bore lies. If I ever post a lie, I'm unaware that the source that I got it from lied to me.  I think apparently you are missing something, cause I do live a decent honest life. 

I'm chilled out, the last time I got rilled on these message boards is when someone tried to compare my sister's miscariage to an abortion.  That was one time when I did get pi$$ed off, since then I haven't been.  Some may think I was, but I wasn't.

I'm not sure conservatism or Christian fundamentalism in the manner of Rush Limbaugh/Pat Robertson is as prevalent as the media blowhards would have us believe.
I think a far bigger problem among the general public is fear and stupidity.  I know that sounds awful of me to say...and it is awful, just look at the results!


Hopefully you are right about conservatism & funntmentalism, but I just don't think so. 

Fear?  Yes, the rupugs have been hyping it (the smoking  gun will be a mushroom cloud crap).  Stupidity?  No. Ignorance, a desire to believe our "leaders", a hope that we are the good guys, and the constant drone of the right wing media with its "we're all in the same boat, what's good for corporate America is good for you bs, the mezmerizing influance of consumerism, and a declining sense of purpose, these have sapped the vitality and the critical ability of our people.

I'm not sure conservatism or Christian fundamentalism in the manner of Rush Limbaugh/Pat Robertson is as prevalent as the media blowhards would have us believe.


I don't think it is.  We get attracted to crazy outragous stories. 

Name me the time's when I'm quoting Bible verses and cramming them down other people's throats?  Name me when I do that, cause I must have a spilt personality, cause I don't remember doing that. 

I do live a decent honest life.  I may not be the smartest man in the world, but I never post full bore lies. If I ever post a lie, I'm unaware that the source that I got it from lied to me.   I think apparently you are missing something, cause I do live a decent honest life. 

I'm chilled out, the last time I got rilled on these message boards is when someone tried to compare my sister's miscariage to an abortion.  That was one time when I did get pi$$ed off, since then I haven't been.  Some may think I was, but I wasn't.


Noooo!!    you took that line ("Isn't a Christian about...) personally and it was meant as an open question/statement.

You do need to relax a bit though.

Hopefully you are right about conservatism & funntmentalism, but I just don't think so. 

Fear?  Yes, the rupugs have been hyping it (the smoking  gun will be a mushroom cloud crap).  Stupidity?  No. Ignorance, a desire to believe our "leaders", a hope that we are the good guys, and the constant drone of the right wing media with its "we're all in the same boat, what's good for corporate America is good for you bs, the mezmerizing influance of consumerism, and a declining sense of purpose, these have sapped the vitality and the critical ability of our people.

Yes, ignorance is a much better word.  However, when ignorance is intractable, it is reasonable to call it stupidity.  Well, maybe just denial.  It's much more comforting to call man-made global warming a lie peddled by environmental whackos than to accept overwhelming scientific evidence to the contrary.

^ Now watch what happens!
;)

Noooo!!    you took that line ("Isn't a Christian about...) personally and it was meant as an open question/statement.

You do need to relax a bit though.




I had no way of knowing whether it was open or directed. No way of knowing.  That was not my error, it was yours.

I'm relaxed, any more relaxed and I'd be in a coma.

I would like to interject by saying that you do not have to be deeply religious to be Republican/conservative, and you don't have to be an atheist or Satan worshipper to be a Democrat/liberal.

Thank you.

I would like to interject by saying that you do not have to be deeply religious to be Republican/conservative, and you don't have to be an atheist or Satan worshipper to be a Democrat/liberal.

Thank you.


100% correct

I had no way of knowing whether it was open or directed. No way of knowing.  That was not my error, it was yours.

I'm relaxed, any more relaxed and I'd be in a coma.


Ho-hum

Yes of course you are Harmonica of course, whatever you say.  ;D

Ho-hum

Yes of course you are Harmonica of course, whatever you say.   ;D


Being a smart alec is helping you how?

Being a smart alec is helping you how?


No! I'm not the smart Alec here.  ;D


http://images.net3media.com/funnyfreepics/chill_pill.jpg

Now CUT THAT OUT you 2.

Good!

Rankings are a bunch of crap.  They mean nothing, and the ideals of who they come from mean everything. 

If you think  Rankings mean something, look at Movies. Are the best movies the most popular?  No they aren't.  The American public as a whole, is stupid. Nough said.

Well, it's interesting to see this thread back up, and Harmy's post on the first page was the first one I saw.  I agree the American public as a whole is stupid.  However, I'm a liberal, and I'm not allowed to say that because I get called an elitist.  If the American people were smart as a whole, fr'instance, Alan Greenspan would have been exiled to the Canary Islands!

I am also inherently distrustful of polls.  "Rankings are a bunch of crap."  However, there has been a sea change in the portion of the American public the Repugs could rely on for votes.  Rich white suburbanites don't like the government lying to them and spying on them any more than marginalized lefties like me do!
Ronald Reagan remained popular because he kept his atrocities out of sight.  Out of sight, out of mind.  Sure, he was funding guerilla warfare and murder in Central America, and he quadrupled our national debt, but those who voted for Reagan in '80 and '84 didn't give crap about Central America or the national debt, because their taxes were lower and they were making more money.  The Dubya administration is quite a different beast!

Like I say, I hate polls and pollsters no matter what they reflect.  I'm more interested in right and wrong.  The bigger problem is Bush's policies are "a bunch of crap."  They're stupid, evil, and insane all at once!
::)

Let me comment by stating that some of the posts on this forum border on the completely outrageous.  Whenever someone posts someone that contradicts the radical beliefs of the majority, they belittle them and utterly ridicule their ideas. 

Personally, I consider myself a relative (although left-leaning) political moderate.  I didn't vote for out now ratings-beleaguered lame duck president, but that doesn't imply that I view all Democrats as angels.  They have to prove to me that they have a legitimate alternative to the corruption perpetrated by the Republican party.  So far, all the dithering by the likes of Kennedy and Ill Hill hasn't convinced me.  And the unabashed extreme views and insensitivity of some of the hard-line liberals on this site hasn't done much to bolster my confidence. 

The forum moderator made a statement regarding the intolerance of "gratuitous flaming," and then turned around and flamed the initiating poster in turn.  Sounds like a double standard and an overt attempt to control the political current of the posts on this supposedly democratic forum.  And if we can criticize our politicians, why don't we have the freedom to also criticize our fellow citizens by labeling them ignorant or apathetic?  Personally, I don't like the term "stupid" or its derivatives.  It's a broad term that not only insults those of naturally low intelligence but also seems to be used frequently by individuals who have no right to refer to others as short on intelligence.

Here's a suggestion:  Instead of hurtling lame insults at posters who have alternative views, find legitimate evidence to support your views and convince the other to understand your viewpoints.  In reading these posts, I haven't seen any evidence of the accused "faith forcing" that you accuse the initiator of, but I have seen plenty of evidence of unjustified bashing.  I'm not saying that any of the opposing sides is more reasonable, I'm just saying that some people on this forum have some maturing to do.  Curtail the animosity and unfounded accusations. 

The maintenance of a stable, productive society is not about harassing those who do not share your ideals and calling them "stupid".  It's not about who is a Democrat, who is a Republican, who is a Libertarian, who is mentally feeble, who is legally insane, who is a bully, or whatever personality characteristics or cliche insults you can think of.  It's about compromising your values, making sacrifices to improve your society, and otherwise making your best effort to get along and tolerate others regardless of their views. 

I'm afraid the Republic Noise Machine will just run Koppel out of town, like they did to Dan Rather.  It's sad how much power those bozos have over the media!
And oh yeah, the GOPers have their very own news PROPAGANDA channel....Fox News Channel!