I say No, although I think there is something special about Earth.  I don't know what it is, but I think there's something peculiar about our planet.

no. i don't believe God created the universe either. how could someone create something out of nothing. God came after.

  I don't know what it is, but I think there's something peculiar about our planet.


It's the smell.    ;D

It's the smell.    ;D


;D Men are a virus.

It's the smell.    ;D


;D  Is there anything as aromatic as gas from Washington DC?  "I love the smell of Napalm in the
morning, It smells like Victory."

It's the smell.    ;D
;D


no. i don't believe God created the universe either. how could someone create something out of nothing. God came after.
Someone couldn't create something out of nothing.  See that's the point, God is special, not like us mortals.

I don't think I believe that we are the only planet with life thou.  I mean if you had the power to create planets and people, would you stop at just one?

If you believe in Genesis you would have to say yes even though all it mentions are "the heavans and earth".  As a non-believer I have to say no.  What people for millenia have not understood is the mechanics of it all.  To anchient people, armed with their religious doctrines and what they could see, the answer was obvious.  Everything moves but us.  Sun, moon, stars, all rise and set, so they must revolve around earth.  As we learned more, we became less geocentric, but that geocentrism was just an expanded version of our ethnocentrism.  We are here by chance IMHO, floating around a puny little star far from the center of our galixy, which itself contains millions, if not billions of other stars.  And, of course there are other galixies, maybe thousands, also with millions or billions of stars.  How could that "chance" happen just once?  WE ARE NOT ALONE, although we may never be able to prove it, evan at the speed of light.  So unless Star Trek got it right, and we can achieve "warp speed" we will probably not find the others, nor them us.  And why should they try?  Does anyone remewmber the movie Contact?  Its been less than 100 years since we started sending messages into space.  They have traveled less than 100 light years.

No. We are just a tiny speck in the big picture.




Cat

No. We are just a tiny speck in the big picture.




Cat


I agree.

Yes, because it says so in the Bible. 8)

It was questions like this that kept me up at night. Honestly I don't know WHAT to believe.

If you believe in Genesis you would have to say yes even though all it mentions are "the heavans and earth". 
That's true, but the Bible doesn't tell us everything, only what we need to know.  The Bible also does not mention that Adam and Eve had daughters, but they did.  Also, it only talks about Adam and Eve and their sons, so where did those other people come from?  Remember when Cain killed Able and was sent to live in another town?

That's true, but the Bible doesn't tell us everything, only what we need to know.  The Bible also does not mention that Adam and Eve had daughters, but they did.  Also, it only talks about Adam and Eve and their sons, so where did those other people come from?  Remember when Cain killed Able and was sent to live in another town?


or how about that eve wasn't the first woman God created. the first woman was lillith but she wouldn't put out for adam or take his crap and God tossed her out. she was the first feminist.

Yes, because it says so in the Bible. 8)


But as a non-believer, I reject the bible as a source of truth.  This reponse seems to reject science from Galieo onward.  Is that your intent?


That's true, but the Bible doesn't tell us everything, only what we need to know. The Bible also does not mention that Adam and Eve had daughters, but they did. Also, it only talks about Adam and Eve and their sons, so where did those other people come from? Remember when Cain killed Able and was sent to live in another town?


I guess somebody pulled off a creation in the next county.  SEriously though, the bible is filled with so many contradictions I just can't understand how people could even consider taking it literally.


or how about that eve wasn't the first woman God created. the first woman was lillith but she wouldn't put out for adam or take his crap and God tossed her out. she was the first feminist.


Yes, she told him to get his own pipe and slippers.  You go girl!

But as a non-believer, I reject the bible as a source of truth.  This reponse seems to reject science from Galieo onward.  Is that your intent?


Well this might offend some people, it has before, but my father and I have no problem in believing in both God and the Big Bang theory. 

Well this might offend some people, it has before, but my father and I have no problem in believing in both God and the Big Bang theory. 


The 2 are not irreconcilable if you take the Bible as allegory.  The  Bible is, to me, a good biok filled with wisdom,. but it is not history and it is not consistant.  I neither believe nor disbelieve in God (nor the Goddess), but I do believe that if there is either, he/she/it gave use that gray matter between our ears to use, to discover the truths of the universe, and not to accept what or how our anchient ansestors explained what they observed.

The universe revolves around ME in case you didn't notice.
I don't know why everybody seems to resent me for it.
???

Yes, because it says so in the Bible. 8)


Not being a biblical scholar, I ask, in all sincerity, which chapter and verse?  I assume somewhere in Genisis, but don't recall anything like that, especially the "spiritual" part.

The universe revolves around ME in case you didn't notice.
I don't know why everybody seems to resent me for it.
???


Well, I guess we live in different universes, because mine revolves around ME  ;)  ;)  ;)

Yes, Don, in Genesis. In fact, it's at the beginning.
Not being a biblical scholar, I ask, in all sincerity, which chapter and verse?  I assume somewhere in Genisis, but don't recall anything like that, especially the "spiritual" part.

Well, I guess we live in different universes, because mine revolves around ME  ;)  ;)  ;)



Yeah right! You expect ME to believe THAT??  ;)




Cat

Yes, Don, in Genesis. In fact, it's at the beginning.


But which verses suggest that the universe revolves around the earth in any way?  "And God created the heavans and the earth..."  Nothing there evan suggests this relationship.

Yeah right! You expect ME to believe THAT??  ;)




Cat


To answer this would require a long, philosophical discussion in which I would rather not engage here.  Suffice it to say that I stand by my statement.  :-*  :-*  :-*

To answer this would require a long, philosophical discussion in which I would rather not engage here.  Suffice it to say that I stand by my statement.  :-*  :-*  :-*



We shall see about that later.  ;)




Cat

We shall see about that later.  ;)




Cat


Is that a threat or a promis?  ;)

Is that a threat or a promis?  ;)



Wouldn't you like to know?  ;)





Cat

But which verses suggest that the universe revolves around the earth in any way?  "And God created the heavans and the earth..."  Nothing there evan suggests this relationship.

Right now 33% of the American public would rather have that "Creationist" hogwash taught in school, instead of evolution.  At least Rush Limbaugh declared the figure to be 33%, and when the heck has he ever been wrong?

or how about that eve wasn't the first woman God created. the first woman was lillith but she wouldn't put out for adam or take his crap and God tossed her out. she was the first feminist.


You knew about Lillith too? Guess I'm not the only one reading up! I salute you!  :D

You knew about Lillith too? Guess I'm not the only one reading up! I salute you!  :D



I know about Lillith also. But you are right, very few people know about her.




Cat

no. i don't believe God created the universe either. how could someone create something out of nothing. God came after.

read genisis one.
"God created the heavens and the earth."

I do believe some of what the bible says, but i question other parts of it.

The bible says that people were on earth soon after earth was formed, but with the discovery of dinosaur bones proves that earth is older that the bible says. On the other hand, if we evolved from apes or whatever we were supposed to evolve from, how did they get here, who made them. That part goes back to the question of where did all life begin.

no. i don't believe God created the universe either. how could someone create something out of nothing. God came after.


god can preform miracles, therefore he can create something out of nothing

We didn't evolve from apes. 

We didn't evolve from apes. 


I don't think we did either but there are some that do.

I don't think we did either but there are some that do.

The stupid scientists say that.  They also say that all of this country is too fat.

The stupid scientists say that.  They also say that all of this country is too fat.


perosnally I believe in the lord, I just question parts of the bible.

The stupid scientists say that.  They also say that all of this country is too fat.


the same stupid scientists that gave you the technology to type that statement into your computer and to send it through the internet to a server for the rest of us to read.... ::)

i believe in science and i believe in God. i think God created life on this planet and through careful selection over the eons created us. God is hampered by the same rules of physics like all of us.

perosnally I believe in the lord, I just question parts of the bible.


Same ere. I question a lot more. Things like Predestination, Etenal Damnation, and all that jazz. Anyhow, sputnikcorp's got some good points too.

read genisis one.
"God created the heavens and the earth."


Well, I'M convinced!  ;D

We didn't evolve from apes. 


No, we didn't.  We and modern apes evolved for a common ancestor eons ago.


I do believe some of what the bible says, but i question other parts of it.

On the other hand, if we evolved from apes or whatever we were supposed to evolve from, how did they get here, who made them. That part goes back to the question of where did all life begin.


The creatures we evolved from themslves evolved from the earliest forms of life, single celled creatures that either god created, or naturally developed from chemicles in the ancient oceans. 


The stupid scientists say that. They also say that all of this country is too fat.


And in both instances the "stupid scientists" are right.

The evidance supporting evolution is overwhelming, and operates right before your eyes.  In fact, we use controlled "natural selection" to enhance both our livestock and our plant foods.  That ear of corn we so love to drench with butter did not occure in nature until we selectively bred it, so too with just about every domestic animal you can name, by controlling their reproduction.  In other words, we have used evolution to increase the productivity of the plants and animals on which we have come to rely.  Neither the St Bernard nor the Chiuhaha existed until we bred dogs for the traits both exibit.

No. We are just a tiny speck in the big picture.




Cat


I agree with that. There are billions of planets in the universe. Our's is different in our solar system, sure, because we have life here. But considering the dead planets to living planets ratio in our solar system is 8:1, those are some darn good odds to argue that there are other "living" planets out there in the universe.

The evidance supporting evolution is overwhelming, and operates right before your eyes.  In fact, we use controlled "natural selection" to enhance both our livestock and our plant foods.  That ear of corn we so love to drench with butter did not occure in nature until we selectively bred it, so too with just about every domestic animal you can name, by controlling their reproduction.  In other words, we have used evolution to increase the productivity of the plants and animals on which we have come to rely.  Neither the St Bernard nor the Chiuhaha existed until we bred dogs for the traits both exibit.



but what did we breed them from? People can argue this for eternity, it comes down to the fact that if we go back to when it all began, what or who made that first cell for all the different life forms?

I do beleive in evolution on some things, but to evolve also means that there has to be something to evolve from.

but what did we breed them from? People can argue this for eternity, it comes down to the fact that if we go back to when it all began, what or who made that first cell for all the different life forms?

I do beleive in evolution on some things, but to evolve also means that there has to be something to evolve from.


all life on this planet had it start in some hydrocarbon goop. hydrocarbons had been discovered in the clouds of jupiter and on titan. if we take that example and add in the fact that numerous planets have been discovered orbiting surrounding stars we can hypothesize that life in the universe is more common than we can imagine.

When I think spiritually, I do not think the universe revolves around the Earth. 

Essentially, don't you KINDA have to believe in SOME evolutionism? Isn't heredity, in it's most basic form, related to evolution? I mean, as times goes on, and things breed, traits are inheirited. Some are bred out, others bred in. Things change.

Same ere. I question a lot more. Things like Predestination, Etenal Damnation, and all that jazz. Anyhow, sputnikcorp's got some good points too.


All That Jazz, that movie was like eternal damnation!
http://imdb.com/title/tt0078754/

I'm not gonna get into a massive theological debate here because religion requires faith and faith, in the case of religion, must always, it appears be blind, so anything I say or anyone says that contradicts that faith will, by the tautologies of the faith be a form of testing of the faith and therefore will be rejected by the faithful.

However in terms of my own beliefs having recently read relatively deeply into the history of this universe and our role within it I do accept the scientific known facts so far expressed in sofar as we are merely a blink in the eye of the history of this universe. In terms of the history of planet earth if you stretch your arms out and state that the earth was formed at the far tip of your left hand and then place this very moment in time at the tip of your right hand then the history of mankind on this planet could be wiped out with a single brush of a nail file. Thats how new we are to good old planet earth.

The one question that remains - well two I guess - is 1) What existed before the universe was born from the big bang? 2) What caused the big bang to occur ? No-one knows and never will I guess so there is always room for spirituality and mystery in this universe. More things in heaven and earth Horatio...etc

Oh and check out "The Motorcycle Diaries". I saw it tonight - amazing, inspiring, beautiful film :)

but what did we breed them from? People can argue this for eternity, it comes down to the fact that if we go back to when it all began, what or who made that first cell for all the different life forms?

I do beleive in evolution on some things, but to evolve also means that there has to be something to evolve from.


Absolutely, and this is where one can logically say that there is no contradiction between Genisis and evolution.  One could believe that God created life, and then let it run its course, evolving as its potential, objective conditions, and serendipidy allowed.  As to the Genisis time frame, one can ask how long were the  days before the sun was created? 

A man asked God how much $1,000,000 was worth to him.  He said "a penny".

He then asked low long a million years was to him and God said "a second".

"Well than" he said, can I have a penny?" 

"In a second."

all life on this planet had it start in some hydrocarbon goop. hydrocarbons had been discovered in the clouds of jupiter and on titan. if we take that example and add in the fact that numerous planets have been discovered orbiting surrounding stars we can hypothesize that life in the universe is more common than we can imagine.



Absolutely, and this is where one can logically say that there is no contradiction between Genisis and evolution. One could believe that God created life, and then let it run its course, evolving as its potential, objective conditions, and serendipidy allowed. As to the Genisis time frame, one can ask how long were the days before the sun was created?

A man asked God how much $1,000,000 was worth to him. He said "a penny".

He then asked low long a million years was to him and God said "a second".

"Well than" he said, can I have a penny?"

"In a second."


And this is the secular answer (to which I personally sebscribe).

Essentially, don't you KINDA have to believe in SOME evolutionism? Isn't heredity, in it's most basic form, related to evolution? I mean, as times goes on, and things breed, traits are inheirited. Some are bred out, others bred in. Things change.


Yes, and that is evolution, today based on 2 things.  Oldest is random natural selection, then comes human interferance in (or exploitation of) that process.

If the Eiffle Tower represented the age of the earth, tyhe period of human habitation would be represented by the layer of paint on the orb at the very top.  I guess the tower was made to support that layer of paint, I guess.

No quotes but this is a paraphrase of something Mark Twain said.

If the Eiffle Tower represented the age of the earth, tyhe period of human habitation would be represented by the layer of paint on the orb at the very top.  I guess the tower was made to support that layer of paint, I guess.

No quotes but this is a paraphrase of something Mark Twain said.


That I agree with, earth is obviously older than the Bible makes it out to be.