It is now illegal for state workers to collectively bargain in Wisconsin. 

The Wisconsin Supreme Court overturned a state court finding that the passage of Wisconsin Budget Repair Bill violated the Wisconsin open meetings law.  The bill, pushed by far right governor Scott Walker (R), increases state employee pension contribution requirements, raises health insurance premiums for state workers, and cuts state worker salaries. 

Class warfare is on, baby, and the fascists just won another battle!
>:(

Gov. John Kasich (R-Lehman Brothers) pushed through similar legislation in Ohio  ::), though I think it will be up for referendum this November.

Not sure I agree with the court's logic applied here.

But bottom line even if law was thrown out, the legislature easily could have re-passed the measure with whatever advance notice was alleged.

I agree with the Republicans on most economic issues but this is definately not want one of them. They went way to far to the right with this whole union busting thing. Kasich and Walker should be voted out of office.

I agree with the Republicans on most economic issues but this is definately not want one of them. They went way to far to the right with this whole union busting thing. Kasich and Walker should be voted out of office.



They were both just voted in. They should be recalled.



Cat

They were both just voted in. They should be recalled.



Cat


I would rather see them voted out in the next election.  The Republican party has trailed too far right for most Americans.  They want to cut taxes for billionaires and pay for them by slashing nutrition assistance to moms and kids.  People are finally getting sick of it.
::)

They were both just voted in. They should be recalled.


Cat
Well with Kasich I haven't heard of a petition that is being shown around and signed by people in order to recall Kasich.

Of course with Walker yes he probably be recalled.  Russ Feingold or Tom Barrett will be probably the Dem Nominee in the recall election. Barrett lost to Walker last year.

How come the Dems who are so upset about the Wisconsin deal are not introducing bills to allow FEDERAL employees collectivbe bargaining rights? ???

Mind you I am not a supporter of many unions, but I have no problem with workers being able to collectively bargain and strike.

WHAT THE F***

...and get ready, this is just a portent of things to come if they are allowed to get away with it.

WHAT THE F***

...and get ready, this is just a portent of things to come if they are allowed to get away with it.


There's no law against it.  Denying collective bargaining rights to government workers is not unusual in the USA.  It's nothing new.

I don't agree with it, but the Repubs in Wisconsin certainly did not invent it.

WHAT THE F***

...and get ready, this is just a portent of things to come if they are allowed to get away with it.


Yes! See there is a great deal of populist rage out there now.  If the Democrats had the cajones to bypass the corporate paymasters and take it right to the street, they could revitalize much of the New Deal sentiment.  Scott Walker is the result of forty years of mushy moderate thinking in the Democratic Party.  They have allowed the political discourse to get drawn to the extreme right.  Scott Walker grew up in the Reagan era in which government was called "the problem."  We can't afford the "me too" politics of Clinton, Gore, Kerry, and Obama.  That's no kind of counterweight to the fascist politics of creeps like Walker.  The Dems have to start saying government is up to you, the voter.  Corporate interests are always going to be the same: Make more money for executives and shareholders.  Government can either be a lapdog or a guard dog.

Yes! See there is a great deal of populist rage out there now.  If the Democrats had the cajones to bypass the corporate paymasters and take it right to the street, they could revitalize much of the New Deal sentiment.  Scott Walker is the result of forty years of mushy moderate thinking in the Democratic Party.  They have allowed the political discourse to get drawn to the extreme right.  Scott Walker grew up in the Reagan era in which government was called "the problem."  We can't afford the "me too" politics of Clinton, Gore, Kerry, and Obama.  That's no kind of counterweight to the fascist politics of creeps like Walker.  The Dems have to start saying government is up to you, the voter.  Corporate interests are always going to be the same: Make more money for executives and shareholders.  Government can either be a lapdog or a guard dog.
Thats funny. It made me think of a dog guarding a door and barking at a person.

Yes! See there is a great deal of populist rage out there now.  If the Democrats had the cajones to bypass the corporate paymasters and take it right to the street, they could revitalize much of the New Deal sentiment.  Scott Walker is the result of forty years of mushy moderate thinking in the Democratic Party.  They have allowed the political discourse to get drawn to the extreme right.  Scott Walker grew up in the Reagan era in which government was called "the problem."  We can't afford the "me too" politics of Clinton, Gore, Kerry, and Obama.  That's no kind of counterweight to the fascist politics of creeps like Walker.  The Dems have to start saying government is up to you, the voter.  Corporate interests are always going to be the same: Make more money for executives and shareholders.  Government can either be a lapdog or a guard dog.

They did take it to the streets heck the protesters  were in the states capitol (Madison) building. Remembers the protests in Wisconsin a few months ago? Those protests lasted a few weeks.

They did take it to the streets heck the protesters  were in the states capitol (Madison) building. Remembers the protests in Wisconsin a few months ago? Those protests lasted a few weeks.


My opinion, the Wisconsin unions made a colossal strategic error. Shortly after the legislation was proposed, they went to the Guv and said "hey we'll give you everything you want, just don't terminate the collective bargaining rights."

This telegraphed weakness to the Governor, and sort of signalled to the rest of the world that the unions admitted that their compensation packages were 'part of the problem'.  Or... it telegraphed that Union Management would do anything to hold on to their own jobs.  In either event, I saw this as a strategic blunder as it totally exposed their position.  :-X

My opinion, the Wisconsin unions made a colossal strategic error. Shortly after the legislation was proposed, they went to the Guv and said "hey we'll give you everything you want, just don't terminate the collective bargaining rights."

This telegraphed weakness to the Governor, and sort of signalled to the rest of the world that the unions admitted that their compensation packages were 'part of the problem'.  Or... it telegraphed that Union Management would do anything to hold on to their own jobs.  In either event, I saw this as a strategic blunder as it totally exposed their position.  :-X



Bullhocky!  Lots of unions, including the pub sec unions in VT offered help to cover budget deficits as a civic duty.  "We all need to share the pain, but lets try to spare the most vulnerable from the most of it" was their attitude.  Only a fascist would consider that a capitulation and pounce.  Not to get personal LB, but what you know about unions and union leadership would hardly fill a nut shell

I gotta go with LB on this one.  Never let a bully smell fear.  I'm more the Jimmy Hoffa type when it comes to unions.  Fight dirty, kick ass and take names.  They'll call you corrupt and they'll call you a thug.  Better than the alternative I say.  You can send some pencil neck geek to Madison to play nicey-nice with the corporate lickspittles BUT  If you let the management stooges get the upper hand, soon you'll be tossing salad for some vile little puke like Scott Walker!  Scott Walker should have been quaking at the knees and begging for union support from the get-go!
8)

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_29_shKT4Elw/TRFDor4tgeI/AAAAAAAALS0/tASc0SXBuuQ/s1600/small_jimmy%252520hoffa%252520finger.jpg

I gotta go with LB on this one.  Never let a bully smell fear.  I'm more the Jimmy Hoffa type when it comes to unions.  Fight dirty, kick ass and take names.  They'll call you corrupt and they'll call you a thug.  Better than the alternative I say.  You can send some pencil neck geek to Madison to play nicey-nice with the corporate lickspittles BUT  If you let the management stooges get the upper hand, soon you'll be tossing salad for some vile little puke like Scott Walker!  Scott Walker should have been quaking at the knees and begging for union support from the get-go!
8)

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_29_shKT4Elw/TRFDor4tgeI/AAAAAAAALS0/tASc0SXBuuQ/s1600/small_jimmy%252520hoffa%252520finger.jpg


I'm not talking about fear, but collective bargaining.  Those unions should all go out on strike

I'm not talking about fear, but collective bargaining.  Those unions should all go out on strike


Walker can now call in the national guard and have them arrested!
:(

I'm not talking about fear, but collective bargaining.  Those unions should all go out on strike


I agree.

Walker can now call in the national guard and have them arrested!
:(


I don't think so, not even Reagan could do that to the air traffic controllers.  Their contracts were abrogated by fiat, so they should use the power of their organization and the public support they now have to demand a renegociation of their contracts.  At the same time they should appeal to the federal courts to enforce the contracts that already exist.  FCS, the sanctity of contract goes back to the John Marshal court.

I don't think so, not even Reagan could do that to the air traffic controllers.  Their contracts were abrogated by fiat, so they should use the power of their organization and the public support they now have to demand a renegociation of their contracts.  At the same time they should appeal to the federal courts to enforce the contracts that already exist.  FCS, the sanctity of contract goes back to the John Marshal court.


I would tend to agree with you, DC.  I don't know how a government can simply abrogate contracts (short of an armed conflict sort of situation).  Nobody held a gun to the government's head to sign those contracts.  The contracts should run thru whatever their terms are.

And yes, the workers affected SHOULD go on strike.  If they don't then they have done more damage to their labor cause than anybody else ever could.  The strength of any labor movement is NEVER in the government, it is in the collective actions of the union members themselves.

I would tend to agree with you, DC.  I don't know how a government can simply abrogate contracts (short of an armed conflict sort of situation).  Nobody held a gun to the government's head to sign those contracts.  The contracts should run thru whatever their terms are.

And yes, the workers affected SHOULD go on strike.  If they don't then they have done more damage to their labor cause than anybody else ever could.  The strength of any labor movement is NEVER in the government, it is in the collective actions of the union members themselves.


I totally agree, which is why I have never seen the Wagner Act (NLRA) as labor's bill of rights.  It was always labor's leash.  It sapped the energy from organization drives, it blinded workers to how important activism is, and it turned union leaders into union bureaucrats, just like Mr Block

Governor Walker readily admitted he was willing to do pretty much anything including illegal and or unethical acts in order to get the bill through.  Quite a few Democratic Senators went into hiding because they were unwilling to vote and Republicans sent law enforcement after them.  The bill should never have seen the light of day.

Governor Walker readily admitted he was willing to do pretty much anything including illegal and or unethical acts in order to get the bill through.  Quite a few Democratic Senators went into hiding because they were unwilling to vote and Republicans sent law enforcement after them.  The bill should never have seen the light of day.


The Dems who left town were cowards. Instead of standing and fighting they tried to take their football and go home. If they had manned picket lines with the unions I might have some respect for them. If they had any guts today, they'd be calling for statewide work stoppages in protest of the law. Instead they tried to hide behind a court's apron over a law which, in the worst case scenario, could easily have been reintroduced and passed once more with no question about prior notice of legislators who abandoned ship.

In their absence the Repubs figured how to restructure the bill to get around the dem boycott. Not much different than when the Dems crammed obamacare thru the federal system after Scott Brown was elected.

The Dems who left town were cowards. Instead of standing and fighting they tried to take their football and go home. If they had manned picket lines with the unions I might have some respect for them. If they had any guts today, they'd be calling for statewide work stoppages in protest of the law. Instead they tried to hide behind a court's apron over a law which, in the worst case scenario, could easily have been reintroduced and passed once more with no question about prior notice of legislators who abandoned ship.

In their absence the Repubs figured how to restructure the bill to get around the dem boycott. Not much different than when the Dems crammed obamacare thru the federal system after Scott Brown was elected.


Man picket lines?  Only if they promise to have the Stanley Cup passed around, or a favorite baseball player, or some such nonsense.  I go to rallys and picket lines, but I am rare.  State wide work stoppage isn't going to happen. Union rank and file are there own worst enemy.

Man picket lines?  Only if they promise to have the Stanley Cup passed around, or a favorite baseball player, or some such nonsense.  I go to rallys and picket lines, but I am rare.  State wide work stoppage isn't going to happen. Union rank and file are there own worst enemy.


You got that right Danoota.  You didn't see Jimmy Hoffa or the earlier labor power players sitting back in an easy chair hoping for some judge in a dress to do their work.  Those cats were activists, they hit the streets to get what they wanted and to stand up for what they felt was right.  Labor strikes, sit-ins, the whole deal.  I don't agree with everything those guys did, but they took the situation into their own hands and made decent progress for their 'cause'.  Yes they also pursued some legal cases but those cases gained popular backing due to the hands-on labor solidarity approach.  Today... "Solidarity" is a punch line.

Today's Union movement is simply a game to make sure that the Union's "leadership" keeps getting their cushy paychecks while the average Joe Lunchbox guy does not have his basic needs met.  I work just outside a manufacturing plant that is a safety hell hole.  You'd think the union would stand up to get things changed, but they are so friendly with the company that nothing is done about it.  >:(

You got that right Danoota.  You didn't see Jimmy Hoffa or the earlier labor power players sitting back in an easy chair hoping for some judge in a dress to do their work.  Those cats were activists, they hit the streets to get what they wanted and to stand up for what they felt was right.  Labor strikes, sit-ins, the whole deal.  I don't agree with everything those guys did, but they took the situation into their own hands and made decent progress for their 'cause'.  Yes they also pursued some legal cases but those cases gained popular backing due to the hands-on labor solidarity approach.  Today... "Solidarity" is a punch line.

Today's Union movement is simply a game to make sure that the Union's "leadership" keeps getting their cushy paychecks while the average Joe Lunchbox guy does not have his basic needs met.  I work just outside a manufacturing plant that is a safety hell hole.  You'd think the union would stand up to get things changed, but they are so friendly with the company that nothing is done about it.  >:(




Yu got that straight!

Speaking of labor solidarity, check this article out http://www.latimes.com/business/la-fi-hiltzik-20110703,0,1163343.column

If the Teamsters were one-tenth of what they were under the original Jimmy Hoffa (and not his buffoon of a son) this decision would never stand.

You got that right Danoota.  You didn't see Jimmy Hoffa or the earlier labor power players sitting back in an easy chair hoping for some judge in a dress to do their work.  Those cats were activists, they hit the streets to get what they wanted and to stand up for what they felt was right.  Labor strikes, sit-ins, the whole deal.  I don't agree with everything those guys did, but they took the situation into their own hands and made decent progress for their 'cause'.  Yes they also pursued some legal cases but those cases gained popular backing due to the hands-on labor solidarity approach.  Today... "Solidarity" is a punch line.

Today's Union movement is simply a game to make sure that the Union's "leadership" keeps getting their cushy paychecks while the average Joe Lunchbox guy does not have his basic needs met.  I work just outside a manufacturing plant that is a safety hell hole.  You'd think the union would stand up to get things changed, but they are so friendly with the company that nothing is done about it.  >:(




Labor organizers were beaten, arrested, jailed, and sometimes killed in order to create the union representation the working class enjoyed in the 1950s and 1960s.  The corporate press regards unions at best as quaint and at worst as criminal nowadays.  You'll see the stock market scrutinized on CNN, NBC, and FOX, but no coverage of labor until there's some conflict between some hapless public employees union and thuggish management.

Labor organizers were beaten, arrested, jailed, and sometimes killed in order to create the union representation the working class enjoyed in the 1950s and 1960s. 


Well to be fair the union organizers did their share of ass kicking too.  My grandfather worked as a mine inspector and he had to carry a gun as protection against both management and union alike.