I just read this article and it deeply saddens me.  More blood will be shed and for what???

Islamic Web site claims revenge killing
Video shows beheading of man identified as American
BREAKING NEWSThe Associated Press
Updated: 1:28 p.m. ET May  11, 2004
CAIRO, Egypt - A video posted Tuesday on an Islamic militant Web site showed a group affiliated with al-Qaida beheading an American civilian in Iraq, saying the death was revenge for the abuse of Iraqi prisoners by American soldiers.  The video showed five men wearing headscarves and black ski masks, standing over a bound man in an orange jumpsuit â€â€Â� similar to a prisoner’s uniform â€â€Â� who identified himself as Nick Berg, a U.S. contractor whose body was found on a highway overpass in Baghdad on Saturday.  “My name is Nick Berg, my father’s name is Michael, my mother’s name is Susan,â€ÂÂ� the man said on the video. “I have a brother and sister, David and Sarah. I live in ... Philadelphia.â€ÂÂ�  After reading a statement, the men were seen pulling the man to his side and putting a large knife to his neck. A scream sounded as the men cut his head off, shouting “Allahu Akbar!â€ÂÂ� â€â€Â� “God is great.â€ÂÂ� They then held the head out before the camera.  Berg was a small-business owner from the Philadelphia suburbs, his family said Tuesday.  “For the mothers and wives of American soldiers, we tell you that we offered the U.S. administration to exchange this hostage with some of the detainees in Abu Ghraib and they refused,â€ÂÂ� one of the men read from a statement.  “So we tell you that the dignity of the Muslim men and women in Abu Ghraib and others is not redeemed except by blood and souls. You will not receive anything from us but coffins after coffins ... slaughtered in this way.â€ÂÂ�  The video bore the title “Abu Musab al-Zarqawi shown slaughtering an American.â€ÂÂ� It was unclear whether al-Zarqawi â€â€Â� a lieutenant of Osama bin Laden â€â€Â� was shown in the video, or was claiming responsibility for ordering the execution.  Internet site has carried previous statements
The Web site on which the video was posted is known as a clearing house for al-Qaida and Islamic extremist groups’ statements and tapes.  The family of Berg, 26, of West Chester, Pa., said they were informed by the U.S. State Department on Monday that Berg was found dead near a highway overpass in Baghdad.  Berg’s mother, Suzanne Berg, said her son was in Iraq as an independent businessman to help rebuild communication antennas. He had been missing since April 9, she said.  “He had this idea that he could help rebuild the infrastructure,â€ÂÂ� she said.  The U.S. military Tuesday said an American civilian was found dead in Baghdad, but did not release his identity. State Department spokeswoman Susan Pittman said she couldn’t release the name of the dead American, but said she not aware of more than one civilian found dead in recent days.  The military said there were signs of trauma to the body. Suzanne Berg said she was told her son’s death was violent but did not want to discuss details.  Berg, who was in Baghdad from late December to Feb. 1, returned to Iraq in March. He didn’t find any work and planned again to return home on March 30, but his daily communications home stopped on March 24. He later told his parents he was jailed by Iraqi officials at a checkpoint in Mosul.  “He was arrested and held without due process,â€ÂÂ� his father, Michael Berg, told the Daily Local News of West Chester recently. “By the time he got out the whole area was inflamed with violence.  The FBI on March 31 interviewed Berg’s parents in West Chester. Jerri Williams, a spokeswoman for the Philadelphia FBI office, told The Philadelphia Inquirer the agency had been “asked to interview the parents regarding Mr. Berg’s purpose in Iraq.â€ÂÂ�  Parents last heard from son in April.  On April 5, the Bergs filed suit in federal court in Philadelphia, contending that their son was being held illegally by the U.S. military. The next day Berg was released. He told his parents he hadn’t been mistreated.  The Bergs last heard from their son April 9, when he said he would come home by way of Jordan, Turkey or Kuwait. But by then, hostilities in Iraq had escalated.  Suzanne Berg on Tuesday said she was told her son’s body would be transported to Kuwait and then to Dover, Del. She said the family had been trying for weeks to learn where their son was but that federal officials had not been helpful. “I went through this with them for weeks,â€ÂÂ� she said. “I basically ended up doing most of the investigating myself.â€ÂÂ�

© 2004 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed.

This is absolutely horrifying.  I read an article saying just this today, that the photos and videos of the mistreatment of Iraqi prisoners are practically recruitment posters for Al Queda and Muslim extremists.  I wondered how long it would take until they started retaliation and prayed they wouldn't. 

The abuse on Iraqi prisoners only added fuel to the raging fire.  The Islamic extremists are now validating their actions by cursing and wishing death upon the Americans.  The truth is...we as an american nation have been a target from Day 1. 

Other nations are jealous of our wealth...power...intelligence...way of life...religious freedoms...etc.  Oil and possible weapons of mass destruction are other factors here that are taken into consideration. 

9/11 was the most horrific thing I ever bared witness to...  We have sent troops over to Iraq.  We successfully de-throned Saddam Hussein.  Now we've tried to help rebuild their country.  Let them rebuild their own country.  Why should that be our problem?  We're not trying to rebuild Haiti and other countries.

Key words:

Retaliation
Vengeance

This seems like a never-ending nightmare. 

I don't think this has much to do with revenge at all.

Remember, they did the same thing to that reporter Daniel Pearl over a year ago, waay before the prison thing ever happened.  Now they are just using the photos as an excuse for their actions.

I don't think this has much to do with revenge at all.

Remember, they did the same thing to that reporter Daniel Pearl over a year ago, waay before the prison thing ever happened.  Now they are just using the photos as an excuse for their actions.


Daniel Pearl was killed in Pakistan, not Iraq.

I agree with 80srocked in that it was just an excuse.  I don't think it is retaliation, I think it is Al Quaeda's ongoing "war" against the US. 

I think this is horrifying and my thoughts and prayers go out to his family.

Daniel Pearl was killed in Pakistan, not Iraq.



True, but by the same type of people with the same feeling towards America.

Fortunately, Pearl's murder wasn't taped or film. Unfortunately, it shows once again how cowards kill those that can't defend themselves to promote their sick agenda. These fundamentalists need to be taken care of. >:(

Fortunately, Pearl's murder wasn't taped or film. Unfortunately, it shows once again how cowards kill those that can't defend themselves to promote their sick agenda. These fundamentalists need to be taken care of. >:(


Actually the Daniel Pearl murder was taped. I believe CBS took some heat for showing clips of it.

Well I just saw the latest video.

After seeing it, I am now 100% certain it had nothing to do with revenge or with the prison photos(depsite what CNN is insisting).  It just proves how much these Islamic extremeists hate our guts and will do anything to wipe us off the earth.

If these people are going to kill someone, not only Americans nut all "infedels", they will do it no matter what.  They have proven that over and over.  The prison photos have absolutely nothing to do with today's video.


In addition, it makes me glad we are finally doing something about terrorism.  After seeing this, it puts in perspective how many more incidents like this have happened, but just weren't caught on tape.

I agree with 80srocked in that it was just an excuse.  I don't think it is retaliation, I think it is Al Quaeda's ongoing "war" against the US. 

I think this is horrifying and my thoughts and prayers go out to his family.
:oI agree with that.They're just trying to make an excuse.

How do we get them to stop killing us?

How do we get them to stop killing us?



The neverending question.



Considering that they have been determined(and successfull) in doing it for many years (US Emabassy bombings, USS Cole bombing, WTC Bombing #1, Sept. 11, etc etc), they won't stop until someone stands up to them and stops them.

Finally it is being done after many years of appeasement and neglect by former administrations. 


Its a long and ongoing process to stop them, and this is just the beginning, and long overdue I might mention.

The neverending question.
Considering that they have been determined(and successfull) in doing it for many years (US Emabassy bombings, USS Cole bombing, WTC Bombing #1, Sept. 11, etc etc), they won't stop until someone stands up to them and stops them.
Finally it is being done.
Its a long and ongoing process to stop them, and this is just the beginning, and long overdue I might mention.

It's the never-ending part of it that disturbs me.  I have no reason to believe you can ever kill enough of them to intimidate them into submission.  BTW, "Islam" means "submission."  I believe at least some of the effort has to come from a change in American foreign policy.

How do we get them to stop killing us?

Step one: STOP GOING OVER THERE.

I imagine that if another country invaded US areas, removed the president and then started marching around trying to change everything to their way, and imprisoned some of us. there would be plenty of groups willing to jump in and start dishing out death and punishment to them.

Im definetly not saying its right. and I am myself horrified by what is going on.

But we share half the blame.
its bad enough our military is all over the place there. but WHY are US civilians traveling to a place where they know we are hated?  Thats just stupid.

I say we should protect our own, and stop trying to force others to live like us.

It's the never-ending part of it that disturbs me.  I have no reason to believe you can ever kill enough of them to intimidate them into submission. 

That wasn't what I was implying.

My basic point is that they have been terrorizing us and killing us for many years, and what have we don't about it up to this point?

Nothing.


They bombed us several times in different venues, nothing was done about it.  When you are determined to elimate a group of people from the earth like they are, and after several attempts that group does nothing to stop them, why would they stop?

Finally we are doing something about all the past years of neglect to stop all of this.

That wasn't what I was implying.

My basic point is that they have been terrorizing us and killing us for many years, and what have we don't about it up to this point?

Nothing.


They bombed us several times in different venues, nothing was done about it.  When you are determined to elimate a group of people from the earth like they are, and after several attempts that group does nothing to stop them, why would they stop?

Finally we are doing something about all the past years of neglect to stop all of this.




Terrorizing us? Us who?

Forcing a democracy in Iraq is not going to stop terrorism.  And need we be reminded that these people rejoiced in the streets on 9/11, along with most of the Arab world?  What are we doing there?  There are no weapons of mass destruction, Hussein had no ties with Al Queda, we don't belong there.

More justice and fairness for Arabs on the world stage (esp. vis-a-vis Israel) would quell most of this clerical anti-American rhetoric.  Killing and mistreatment of Arabs & Muslims will only stoke the propaganda of the imams and mullahs.
I know the images of the western civilians torched and strung up form a bridge, and the recent beheading of an American, are hard to take.  However, we mustn't use them to justify torture of Iraqi prisoners.  Once again, violence will beget more violence.

I was thinking more of an eye for an eye. Why waste more of our dollars on only torture? ::)

More justice and fairness for Arabs on the world stage (esp. vis-a-vis Israel) would quell most of this clerical anti-American rhetoric.  Killing and mistreatment of Arabs & Muslims will only stoke the propaganda of the imams and mullahs.
I know the images of the western civilians torched and strung up form a bridge, and the recent beheading of an American, are hard to take.  However, we mustn't use them to justify torture of Iraqi prisoners.  Once again, violence will beget more violence.

Forcing a democracy in Iraq is not going to stop terrorism.  And need we be reminded that these people rejoiced in the streets on 9/11, along with most of the Arab world?  What are we doing there?  There are no weapons of mass destruction, Hussein had no ties with Al Queda, we don't belong there.


I agree...by forcing democracy upon a nation will not stop terrorism.  I personally don't think you could ever stop terrorism.  It's impossible.  It's like saying...you can stop every criminal from committing crimes.  NOT!!!!  It's just not going to happen.  We have been able to deal with it by creating the correctional/prison systems.  However, crime still exist.   People continue to commit crimes while being fully aware of the consequences. 

Islamic extreme terrorists are willing to give their lives for what they believe in.  They are NOT afraid of being captured.  They are NOT afraid of being put on trial.  They are NOT afraid of death itself.  It makes them a deadly opponent. 

Finally we are doing something about all the past years of neglect to stop all of this.

"We" aren't.

Bush is doing something though and until recently, it had little to do with taking out terrorists in Iraq, per se. There are terrorists in many countries and going into Iraq wasn't about going-in and taking out terrorists in that country. The agenda involved taking out Saddam and finding and destroying the alleged weapons of mass destruction which were supposed to be an imminent threat to the U.S. Then, the focus came to be about the reconstruction and democratization of Iraq.

Step one: STOP GOING OVER THERE.

It's too late now. Unfortunately, the U.S. can't back away and leave because it is a matter of finishing what Bush started and also a matter of our country's resolve, strength and pride. No matter how many are lost, the U.S. can't run with its tail between its legs because other countries opposed to what the U.S. stands for will certainly and inevitably attempt to break us down.

I was thinking more of an eye for an eye. Why waste more of our dollars on only torture? ::)




I'll agree with that.  These people make me sick to my stomach.  I seriously think its getting close to time to level the place.

"You get what you give..."

If George W. Bush wasn't such a power-hungry mass-murderer trying to take over the world, none of this would have happened. Get out of Iraq and stop all of this already! Isn't there enough oil for you guys in Texas? And doesn't Bush know that stopping terrorism completely will be next to impossible? Is it worth sacrificing the lives of millions of innocent people?

The American Dictator...I mean, President should be charged with mass-murder and put to death as is so common in the US, and since he's from Texas, it'll be done that much quicker.

No attacks, please. I'm just stating my point of view...

Absolutely Vile

Fortunately, Pearl's murder wasn't taped or film. Unfortunately, it shows once again how cowards kill those that can't defend themselves to promote their sick agenda. These fundamentalists need to be taken care of. >:(
I have to agree.

I like to focus on what the media hardly ever shows. Pictures of children free and happy and families thanking our soldiers for trying to give Iraq freedom. Whether or not there ever were weopans of mass destruction, the fact is that sadam and his brothers were murderous, evil dogs and they had to be stopped.

Whether or not there ever were weopans of mass destruction, the fact is that sadam and his brothers were murderous, evil dogs and they had to be stopped.

And George W. Bush isn't, and doesn't??

Absolutely Vile

And George W. Bush isn't, and doesn't??

Absolutely Vile


At least Dubya hasn't cut off American tongues or hands or had Nancy Pelosi raped in a rape room :P  I sense a lack of moral equivalency here.

At least Dubya hasn't cut off American tongues or hands or had Nancy Pelosi raped in a rape room :P  I sense a lack of moral equivalency here.


And killing people is any better?

And killing people is any better?


Okay, a continuation of this lack of moral equivalency.

Saddam killed his own citizens.

Bush (indirectly through the use of troops) is killing people who want to destroy our very way of life. 

*Flips coin*

Yeah, I'll go with Bush on this one, Alex.  May I have "Appeasement" for $400?

Okay, a continuation of this lack of moral equivalency.

Saddam killed his own citizens.

Bush (indirectly through the use of troops) is killing people who want to destroy our very way of life. 

*Flips coin*

Yeah, I'll go with Bush on this one, Alex.  May I have "Appeasement" for $400?
Well said, Rice ;)

Okay, a continuation of this lack of moral equivalency.

Saddam killed his own citizens.

Bush (indirectly through the use of troops) is killing people who want to destroy our very way of life. 

*Flips coin*

Yeah, I'll go with Bush on this one, Alex.  May I have "Appeasement" for $400?


Bush is not only killing "people who want to destroy your very way of life." He's also killing his own people in the process, as well as millions of other innocent people who have nothing to do with his agenda.

Absolutely Vile

Bush is not only killing "people who want to destroy your very way of life." He's also killing his own people in the process, as well as millions of other innocent people who have nothing to do with his agenda.

Absolutely Vile


Millions?  Did you just pull that out of your nether regions or something? 

Of COURSE it's bad that people are dying!  Yeah, of course soldiers know that they might die in battle, and just because they volunteered for it and know the ramifications doesn't make it okay, and no matter HOW careful the troops are some civilians are going to get hurt as well, it's been like that in every single war in the history of humanity.  But MILLIONS?? 

Millions?  Did you just pull that out of your nether regions or something? 

Of COURSE it's bad that people are dying!  Yeah, of course soldiers know that they might die in battle, and just because they volunteered for it and know the ramifications doesn't make it okay, and no matter HOW careful the troops are some civilians are going to get hurt as well, it's been like that in every single war in the history of humanity.  But MILLIONS?? 


OK, fine. A hell of a lot of people. The point is, innocent people are being killed. And for what? Their freedom? No! It's so Bush can have control!

Absolutely Vile

OK, fine. A hell of a lot of people. The point is, innocent people are being killed. And for what? Their freedom? No! It's so Bush can have control!

Absolutely Vile


Innocent people are killed every day, in EVERY country. It's a fact of life. No matter what is said or done or talked about or argued about, it remains the same that people die and the living will disagree over their deaths. Deal with it.

I doubt Bush will get any control out of THAT.

And having said my piece, I will bow out now and let you guys keep yakking.

OK, fine. A hell of a lot of people. The point is, innocent people are being killed. And for what? Their freedom? No! It's so Bush can have control!

Absolutely Vile



I agree with Rice there.

Millions...is a bit of a stretch. ::) 


Are you saying that you are suddenly concerned about the innocent Iraqi's that have died because of us being over there?  Where was all this concern when they were being killed by Saddam no more than 2 years ago on a daily basis?


And as far as Bush wanting to "have control".  Have control of what?  Even if he is re-elected in November, that will make him Pres for only another 4 years.  After that, he will be just another civilian.  How will that make him "have control" of anything?  Especially Iraq?

Are you saying that you are suddenly concerned about the innocent Iraqi's that have died because of us being over there?  Where was all this concern when they were being killed by Saddam no more than 2 years ago on a daily basis?


So your justification for killing thousands of innocent Iraqi civilians is "Well Saddam did it too"?

So your justification for killing thousands of innocent Iraqi civilians is "Well Saddam did it too"?




No absolutely not.

My point was that so many people seem so concerned and upset over the innocent Iraqi deaths now since it was caused by us, but when Saddam did it on a daily basis as just an everyday thing, none of these same people said a word.  Mass graves?  Hello?

A death is a death, no matter how it is caused it is a bad thing.  But it just seems hypocritical to suddenly become concerned when its caused by us (which are accidental btw), but not when its caused by Saddam (which was intentional btw).

So your justification for killing thousands of innocent Iraqi civilians is "Well Saddam did it too"?




It wasn't a justification, it's an observation on global inconsistency.

No absolutely not.

My point was that so many people seem so concerned and upset over the innocent Iraqi deaths now since it was caused by us, but when Saddam did it on a daily basis as just an everyday thing, none of these same people said a word.  Mass graves?  Hello?

A death is a death, no matter how it is caused it is a bad thing.  But it just seems hypocritical to suddenly become concerned when its caused by us (which are accidental btw), but not when its caused by Saddam (which was intentional btw).


Because people like me hold the U.S to a higher standard than Saddam. I also don't believe the U.S or Britain had any right to invade in the first place.

Because people like me hold the U.S to a higher standard than Saddam. I also don't believe the U.S or Britain had any right to invade in the first place.


Exactly.  I don't believe we have the right to tell people how their government should run.  Originally, we were told that the US government was searching for WEAPONS OF MASS DESTRUCTION then it quickly changed to we're helping to liberate the Iraqi people.  Geez...talk about a whole lot of horse crap! ::) 

My suggestion would be to put Al-Qaeda captured members (if any) into a locked room with our prisoned serial killers and allow them to swoop down on these terrorists.  They haven't experienced terror until they come across an american psycho serial killer. 

Green River Killer
Zodiac Killer  (still at large I think)
Ed Gein
Ted Bundy
Charles Manson
David Berkowitz
Richard Ramirez
etc...

My suggestion would be to put Al-Qaeda captured members (if any) into a locked room with our prisoned serial killers and allow them to swoop down on these terrorists.  They haven't experienced terror until they come across an american psycho serial killer. 

Green River Killer
Zodiac Killer  (still at large I think)
Ed Gein
Ted Bundy
Charles Manson
David Berkowitz
Richard Ramirez
etc...


Ted Bundy is dead.  Maybe he'll work them over when they go to the afterlife and expect their 72 virgins ::)

Ted Bundy is dead.  Maybe he'll work them over when they go to the afterlife and expect their 72 virgins ::)


Thanks Rice Cube.  I couldn't remember if he were alive or not.  Hopefully, he'll get them in the afterlife.  I know Jeffrey Dahmer will be in hell waiting for them.  LOL ;D

Ted Bundy is dead.  Maybe he'll work them over when they go to the afterlife and expect their 72 virgins ::)


That reminded me of something that Dennis Miller had said about the 72 virgins that cracked me up.

And to the suicide bombers: how are you helping to improve the lives of your people when you so patently disregard your own life? And really, isn't this 72 virgins thing just a little overrated? I mean, after three or four, doesn't the thrill kind of wear off? And by Virgin 23, you're going to be begging for a pro, someone who knows when and when not to use their teeth.

That reminded me of something that Dennis Miller had said about the 72 virgins that cracked me up.

And to the suicide bombers: how are you helping to improve the lives of your people when you so patently disregard your own life? And really, isn't this 72 virgins thing just a little overrated? I mean, after three or four, doesn't the thrill kind of wear off? And by Virgin 23, you're going to be begging for a pro, someone who knows when and when not to use their teeth.



LOL.  Haaaa.  Good point.