I've been reading this forum on and off for about a month, and one of the things I've seen talked about are cultural shifts and when they occurred. There seems to be some disagreement about when exactly these shifts occurred. I'm looking for more of a general outline of the big shifts. (ex., many seem to agree that there was a huge shift in 2008/09)

Shifts can happen daily for the effects on industrial shift workers of the timing of the changeover from the night to morning shift and of the length of the shift were examined. Two groups changed over at 6 a.m. and worked either 8-hr or 12-hr shift systems; the other 2 groups changed over at 7 a.m., working either 8- or 12-hr systems. Night sleeps between consecutive shifts that started at 6 a.m. were shorter and more disrupted than those starting at 7 a.m. Day sleeps following night shifts that finished at 6 a.m. were longer and less disrupted than those finishing at 7 a.m. Early starts were associated with poorer psychological and physical health. These effects of changeover time are considered in relation to the circadian rhythms in sleep duration and propensity. Although several measures favored 12-hr shifts, physical health indicators appeared to favor 8-hr systems, especially in combination with late changeovers. However, the observed effects of shift length on chronic outcome measures are somewhat inconsistent with previous research findings.

I think the fact that there is disagreement on when these shifts occurred tells you all you need to know

In music, transposition refers to the process or operation of moving a collection of notes (pitches or pitch classes) up or down in pitch by a constant interval.

"The shifting of a melody, a harmonic progression or an entire musical piece to another key, while maintaining the same tone structure, i.e. the same succession of whole tones and semitones and remaining melodic intervals." — Musikalisches Lexicon, 879 (1865), Heinrich Christoph Koch (trans. Schuijer)

For example, one might transpose an entire piece of music into another key. Similarly, one might transpose a tone row or an unordered collection of pitches such as a chord so that it begins on another pitch.

I think the fact that there is disagreement on when these shifts occurred tells you all you need to know


Since I read about these supposed "shifts" all the time here, I just wanted to see if there was any general consensus about when they were. But I guess there isn't, and that's fine.

I used to make a lot of big shifts, but the truck I drive now is an automatic.

I use the shift key every time I am on a keyboard.

I used to make a lot of big shifts, but the truck I drive now is an automatic.


Carlos STILL drives a stick. They are getting harder and harder to find.


Cat

I used to make a lot of big shifts, but the truck I drive now is an automatic.

What kind of truck do you drive?

Hubby has made the accusation to me, "You have a song for everything!"    ;D    So, here ya go -

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KL6UsDlO86E
George Harrison - It's What You Value

Carlos STILL drives a stick. They are getting harder and harder to find.


Cat


See, I used to be one of those old-school truckers who thought that someone wasn't a real truck driver unless they knew how to drive a manual. But since I got my city route and they assigned me a truck with an automatic (my company hasn't bought any new trucks with manuals since 2015), I love it. I can just push the button on the dash, put it in gear, and cruise around.


What kind of truck do you drive?


A Mack single-axle day cab with a 53-foot trailer.

See, I used to be one of those old-school truckers who thought that someone wasn't a real truck driver unless they knew how to drive a manual. But since I got my city route and they assigned me a truck with an automatic (my company hasn't bought any new trucks with manuals since 2015), I love it. I can just push the button on the dash, put it in gear, and cruise around.



We are debating whether this will be his last stick or not. We are thinking of getting a hybrid for our next car. Who knows when that will be.

We had an 2008 Honda Civic that the A/C died in 2016. We figured it was time. So we traded the 2008 for a 2016. Then 2 years later, the Honda place made us an offer we couldn't refuse-a 2018 Civic for our 2016. The only thing was, our payments extended 2 more years. Actually the payments went down a dollar. We didn't think they would do that again, but we were wrong. Yup, in 2020 there was the offer. Only this time they offered a different car. Carlos insisted on the stick. They only make them in the Sport version which is a bit more expensive so the car payment went up-but only $5. So now it is 2022. Are they going to? We shall see. They usual make the offer in September so we will have to wait until then. Even if they don't, we still have a 2020 car that will be good to go for many years (EXCEPT the battery. We are on our 3rd battery because Honda isn't make their batteries like they used to. But at least it was still under warranty.)



Cat

1 person making a joke is fine, but really people? How about a REAL answer

1955 - basically the year rock music became a thing, the first signs of societal rebellion
1964 - the Beatles really changed everything
1979 - disco died FAST, by the end of the year a lot of true 80's vibes were already in place
The entirety of 2001 - 2003 was kinda like one constant shift from Y2K to mid 2000's
2009 is another obvious answer, the start of that year still felt core-2000's, by the start of 2010 it was pure early 2010's
2013 - similar to 2009, culture from the start VS end of that year have a stark contrast

Maybe 2016? We don't have enough retrospect yet, but I feel like the ENTIRE past 4 years have been a giant cultural shift, especially with all the craziness that was the year 2020

1 person making a joke is fine, but really people? How about a REAL answer

1955 - basically the year rock music became a thing, the first signs of societal rebellion
1964 - the Beatles really changed everything
1979 - disco died FAST, by the end of the year a lot of true 80's vibes were already in place
The entirety of 2001 - 2003 was kinda like one constant shift from Y2K to mid 2000's
2009 is another obvious answer, the start of that year still felt core-2000's, by the start of 2010 it was pure early 2010's
2013 - similar to 2009, culture from the start VS end of that year have a stark contrast

Maybe 2016? We don't have enough retrospect yet, but I feel like the ENTIRE past 4 years have been a giant cultural shift, especially with all the craziness that was the year 2020


People make jokes because, honestly, it's kind of a jokey topic. Take the hint.

Having said that...your assessment makes some good points. But  I would change, or rather, add onto, the 1964 shift and make it the assassination of JFK (Nov 63)/the arrival in the USA of The Beatles (Feb 64). Those two things in concert are what really brought about the shift in 1964 and "The Sixties" as we know them truly began. The newly widespread availability of the oral contraceptive was another factor. 

I also need to correct your 1979 contention. That was NOT the shift. The shift was January 1981. Whatever "80s vibes" people who weren't born yet want to find in 1980 (or even more inaccurately, 1979), good, you can have them. Find them all you want. But take it from someone who was there and know the truth. The shift came with the assassination of John Lennon in December 1980 and the election of Ronald Reagan at that same time. BANG. BANG. 1981 was a different world. We could feel it and it happened fast. Many, many "70s vibes", 70s politics, even 70s music hung on throughout 1980. The fact that you point to disco dying as indicating the shift is another of those things people who weren't there do, as if disco defined the whole era by itself. It did not. The decline of disco in itself did not bring about a shift.

I read the title of this wrong and thought, hmmm, the last big one I had was when I ate a whole pot of chili

I sometimes get topic titles wrong, but hey, shift happens :D

I read the title of this wrong and thought, hmmm, the last big one I had was when I ate a whole pot of chili

I sometimes get topic titles wrong, but hey, shift happens :D


;D  ;D  ;D

I also need to correct your 1979 contention. That was NOT the shift. The shift was January 1981. Whatever "80s vibes" people who weren't born yet want to find in 1980 (or even more inaccurately, 1979), good, you can have them. Find them all you want. But take it from someone who was there and know the truth. The shift came with the assassination of John Lennon in December 1980 and the election of Ronald Reagan at that same time. BANG. BANG. 1981 was a different world. We could feel it and it happened fast. Many, many "70s vibes", 70s politics, even 70s music hung on throughout 1980. The fact that you point to disco dying as indicating the shift is another of those things people who weren't there do, as if disco defined the whole era by itself. It did not. The decline of disco in itself did not bring about a shift.


1980 was the last year disco songs charted, like "Funky Town", imo the bigger shift into the "Tubular Eighties" sound was in 1983/1984 when gated drums, digital synths/samples, and reverby mixes became dominant. These sonic markers were used across multiple genres, be it R&B, rock, funk, hip-hop, ect.

Even much of the early new wave stuff attributed to the '80s was still dominated by the '70s "dry" mixing and analog synths.

1980 was the last year disco songs charted, like "Funky Town", imo the bigger shift into the "Tubular Eighties" sound was in 1983/1984 when gated drums, digital synths/samples, and reverby mixes became dominant. These sonic markers were used across multiple genres, be it R&B, rock, funk, hip-hop, ect.

Even much of the early new wave stuff attributed to the '80s was still dominated by the '70s "dry" mixing and analog synths.


Musically speaking, that is correct. There was still a semblance of an "organic sound" in the very early 80s. But it was soon swept away into cheesiness.

1 person making a joke is fine, but really people? How about a REAL answer



Welcome to inthe00s.    ;D

I read the title of this wrong and thought, hmmm, the last big one I had was when I ate a whole pot of chili

I sometimes get topic titles wrong, but hey, shift happens :D


I'm getting too old for this shift.  ;D

People make jokes because, honestly, it's kind of a jokey topic. Take the hint.

Having said that...your assessment makes some good points. But  I would change, or rather, add onto, the 1964 shift and make it the assassination of JFK (Nov 63)/the arrival in the USA of The Beatles (Feb 64). Those two things in concert are what really brought about the shift in 1964 and "The Sixties" as we know them truly began. The newly widespread availability of the oral contraceptive was another factor. 

I also need to correct your 1979 contention. That was NOT the shift. The shift was January 1981. Whatever "80s vibes" people who weren't born yet want to find in 1980 (or even more inaccurately, 1979), good, you can have them. Find them all you want. But take it from someone who was there and know the truth. The shift came with the assassination of John Lennon in December 1980 and the election of Ronald Reagan at that same time. BANG. BANG. 1981 was a different world. We could feel it and it happened fast. Many, many "70s vibes", 70s politics, even 70s music hung on throughout 1980. The fact that you point to disco dying as indicating the shift is another of those things people who weren't there do, as if disco defined the whole era by itself. It did not. The decline of disco in itself did not bring about a shift.


I think you're taking the wrong approach to opinions of those younger than you. They're not wrong (assuming the younger person is self-educated in pop culture like I am), in fact they provide more insight! For example, even tho I wasn't alive during 1979/1980, I hear some songs from those years that sound like they're pure 80's, thus there WAS a notable amount of 80's culture already there by the end of 1979. People like you who lived thru that time may not have been aware of the shifting culture, but it was happening. I've experienced this myself with the 2010's. Living through 2013 - 2016, I witnessed the rise of trap rap, but it wasn't until it became the dominant genre in 2017 that I was finally "felt" that culture. But now looking back I can see that it was there even before I "felt" it. Hopefully I explained that well & you know what I'm trying to say 😅

I can agree tho that 1981 might be the more accurate 70's - 80's transition year

People make jokes because, honestly, it's kind of a jokey topic. Take the hint.

Having said that...your assessment makes some good points. But  I would change, or rather, add onto, the 1964 shift and make it the assassination of JFK (Nov 63)/the arrival in the USA of The Beatles (Feb 64). Those two things in concert are what really brought about the shift in 1964 and "The Sixties" as we know them truly began. The newly widespread availability of the oral contraceptive was another factor. 


Absolutely



I also need to correct your 1979 contention. That was NOT the shift. The shift was January 1981. Whatever "80s vibes" people who weren't born yet want to find in 1980 (or even more inaccurately, 1979), good, you can have them. Find them all you want. But take it from someone who was there and know the truth. The shift came with the assassination of John Lennon in December 1980 and the election of Ronald Reagan at that same time. BANG. BANG. 1981 was a different world. We could feel it and it happened fast. Many, many "70s vibes", 70s politics, even 70s music hung on throughout 1980. The fact that you point to disco dying as indicating the shift is another of those things people who weren't there do, as if disco defined the whole era by itself. It did not. The decline of disco in itself did not bring about a shift.


100% agreed. Nailed it. I've said something like this in other threads in the past.

...even tho I wasn't alive during 1979/1980, I hear some songs from those years that sound like they're pure 80's, thus there WAS a notable amount of 80's culture already there by the end of 1979...


Can I draw a distinction between normal cultural "evolution" vs. "big shifts"?  Culture always goes through slow steady changes.  Naturally, the musical changes being heard in the late 1970s would continue into the 1980s - that's not surprising in the least.  It always happens.  For instance, with fashion - most people didn't open their closets on Jan 1, 1980 and say "all this 70's stuff has gotta go now!".  But typically, 80's styles would get added to the wardrobe to eventually replace the 70's stuff, which steadily became passe.

"Big shifts" most often occur based on either something happening that precipitates it, or else a cultural revolt of one form or another.  For instance the JFK assassination coupled with the arrival of the Beatles - that pair of occurrences caused a major shift.  Similarly, the murder of John Lennon and the presidency of Ronald Reagan also caused a shift.  These big shifts couldn't be predicted by everyday evolution; they were precipitated by events.

Can I draw a distinction between normal cultural "evolution" vs. "big shifts"?  Culture always goes through slow steady changes.  Naturally, the musical changes being heard in the late 1970s would continue into the 1980s - that's not surprising in the least.  It always happens.  For instance, with fashion - most people didn't open their closets on Jan 1, 1980 and say "all this 70's stuff has gotta go now!".  But typically, 80's styles would get added to the wardrobe to eventually replace the 70's stuff, which steadily became passe.

"Big shifts" most often occur based on either something happening that precipitates it, or else a cultural revolt of one form or another.  For instance the JFK assassination coupled with the arrival of the Beatles - that pair of occurrences caused a major shift.  Similarly, the murder of John Lennon and the presidency of Ronald Reagan also caused a shift.  These big shifts couldn't be predicted by everyday evolution; they were precipitated by events.


Yes this is correct. Once could almost say "everything is going on at the same time". The fact that there may have been a few songs in 1979 that point the way to the 80s really doesn't mean anything, and in no way defines 1979,because at the same time there were probably songs with a lingering sound of whatever the LAST thing was. The "mid 70s sound" or what have you. Not to mention whatever the exact current thing was, disco, punk, whatever, which was also going on. So there is this constant process of evolution blending together but in and of itself it's really not an indicator of anything. It's just the ongoing turning of the world.

The Jefferson Airplane had a great song called "Young Girl Sunday Blues" that sums this up perfectly:

"Today is made up of yesterday and tomorrow".

Perhaps the "80s sounding songs" from 1979-ish stick out to someone looking back like JacobthePlante  because when the shift DID come in 1981 it might have been easy to look back and say "See! THOSE songs saw this coming". Whereas it may not have been so stark and distinct if the 1981 shift hadn't been so staggering and had just been more "same old same old".