Talk about waiting until the last minute.... anyway I have a midterm due in about 9 hours and I need to know something about Wall-E  
Since I've only seen it once (and I slept thru most of it) I'm hoping the parental units on the board may have the answer for me...


Is Eve able to say anything other than uttering Wall-E's name?
Can someone give me a quick and synopsis of what happens to her once she returns to the "mother-ship" with her plant sample?
and finally how do they get off the ship?  I think the ending was all hearts and flowers and they return to earth with revitalizes itself (right?)

are there other women in the film? I'm talking about robots not the lazy humans floating in chairs.... thanks.





This thread started out as plea for help with some info about Wall-E for a paper I was writing for my Children's Film class but it put some serious thought into my head about the roles of women, and to some extent men, and also racial depictions in Disney and Pixar films.

there has been serious study going around this issue for decades but this is the first time I even bothered to think about it.... your thoughts?

I've only seen the movie once and slept through it...wish I could help you but I don't remember much about it.

I've only seen the movie once and slept through it...wish I could help you but I don't remember much about it.


that's cool...i'm just glad I'm not the only one who was bored with it.  ;)

Had I known at the time I watched I was going to need to incorporate it into a paper for a class some 6 months later I might have tried harder to stay awake.  ::)

I actually thought it was OK, though aware that it would get criticized since there's not much not talking or CGI film cliches like pop culture referances and musical numbhers (not counting the video Wall-E watches).  Wall-E sneaks into Eve's ship and pretty much gets chased by another robot. Don't remember that much, though would admit that the "save the Earth" message wasn't preachy like (dare I say) "Happy Feet".



Honestly, I liked "Prest-O Chang-O" better, which gives a nod to Jay Ward on the credits since the short's all about a magician and his rabbit.

I haven't watched it in ages, wish I had known you needed this, I would have made time over the weekend and live blogged it!

Ok, Eve doesn't say much except his name except for when they slip in the f bomb (just once)

I don't remember if there was a woman computer in the captain's control area or not, but I think it was a female voice who gave him data about plants and dirt, etc when he typed it in after scanning the plant.

She takes it back to the ship and they scan it and say that the mission is over, but they have been in space so long and been inactive all that time, there are going to be physical problems for everyone.  That leads Eve and Wall to bust out and try to hide the plant because the robots and capt don't want to go back to Earth.  In the end, they do go back.  Sorry that's all I remember.  Hope someone else comes through!

I actually thought it was OK, though aware that it would get criticized since there's not much not talking or CGI film cliches like pop culture referances and musical numbhers (not counting the video Wall-E watches).  Wall-E sneaks into Eve's ship and pretty much gets chased by another robot. Don't remember that much, though would admit that the "save the Earth" message wasn't preachy like (dare I say) "Happy Feet".



Honestly, I liked "Prest-O Chang-O" better, which gives a nod to Jay Ward on the credits since the short's all about a magician and his rabbit.



thanks woops but what i'm writing deals specifically with female representation in disney films.  I want to compare Ariel giving up her voice to Eve not being given a voice at all.

I remember the musical film clip and I know wall-e doesn't have dialogue either (much any way if I recall) but he is allowed to communicate. He has expressions, visible emotions etc and can seemingly engage with others around him- (the roach on earth and -if I recall correctly eventually the other robots on the ship.)

Prest-O chango was a good short but not relevant to my argument.

I haven't watched it in ages, wish I had known you needed this, I would have made time over the weekend and live blogged it!

Ok, Eve doesn't say much except his name except for when they slip in the f bomb (just once)

I don't remember if there was a woman computer in the captain's control area or not, but I think it was a female voice who gave him data about plants and dirt, etc when he typed it in after scanning the plant.

She takes it back to the ship and they scan it and say that the mission is over, but they have been in space so long and been inactive all that time, there are going to be physical problems for everyone.  That leads Eve and Wall to bust out and try to hide the plant because the robots and capt don't want to go back to Earth.  In the end, they do go back.  Sorry that's all I remember.  Hope someone else comes through!


hmmm I forgot about the captains computer.  wonder if she has "a voice of her own" or just tells the captain what she wants to hear.

Thanks Aim- this is great- its jogging some of my memory.

I figure Sami, Jess and Shannon have kids the right age so maybe they have seen it more recently... now if only theyd log on...  ;)

Is Eve able to say anything other than uttering Wall-E's name?

Yes, she speaks in different dialects and languages at first to see which one Wall-E would respond to.  She finally says, "Directive" in English and Wall-E responds.  When Wall-E repeats back to her the word "directive", she says, "Classified".  Also, at the end of the movie, she starts humming to Wall-E when she thought he was not going to remember her.

Can someone give me a quick and synopsis of what happens to her once she returns to the "mother-ship" with her plant sample?

A signal goes off to the Captain and Otto (the auto-pilot) that their EVE probe has come back positive for life.  The captain is completely befuddled by this, but finally figures out what he is supposed to do to open Eve up and see the plant.  The plant is not there, however, so the Captain thinks it is a false alarm and sends her to be checked over and cleaned up.

and finally how do they get off the ship?  I think the ending was all hearts and flowers and they return to earth with revitalizes itself (right?)

Well, there was a bit of conspiracy because the people that screwed up the Earth 700 years before realized that it would never be cleaned (this was figured out halfway through the movie), so that humans would always be floating through space.  However, the Captain realizes that he wants to go back and see, but Otto tries to sabotage it because he was given directions to make sure humans never went back.  The plant is finally put in the niche on the ship that would automatically make the whole ship head back to Earth.  This was achieved by the Captain finally standing up to Otto and turning off his auto-pilot function.

It ends with the humans landing on Earth, and through the end credits, there are small hand drawn cartoons showing how the humans started rebuilding civilization and the giant tree that flourishes from the small plant that Eve originally found.

are there other women in the film? I'm talking about robots not the lazy humans floating in chairs.... thanks.

Mo the cleaning robot might be female.  The robots that do haircuts and manicures and such in the beauty parlors and for the Captain are female (with a stereotypical Jewish distinction, I might add).

Hope that helps.

Why no, I haven't seen this movie fifty million times.  Why do you ask? ;D

Why no, I haven't seen this movie fifty million times.  Why do you ask? ;D


this is exactly what I was looking for! Thanks! 

I thought you were about to blow my theory out of the water but you redeemed it with the gender/ethnic slant of the domestic robots! I just have to rework my argument around that! 

Thanks Jess Wish I could give you more than just one measly karma! is a  :-* too much?  ;)

this is exactly what I was looking for! Thanks!  

I thought you were about to blow my theory out of the water but you redeemed it with the gender/ethnic slant of the domestic robots! I just have to rework my argument around that!  

Thanks Jess Wish I could give you more than just one measly karma! is a  :-* too much?  ;)



;D

Not at all.  And no problem.  We had just watched it the other day, so it is still fresh in my mind. :D

That Jewish manicurist/beautician thing always bugged me about that movie.  So did the stereotypical fat Americans.  Where were the other ethnicities in all this?  Did the other countries get wiped off the face of the earth or what?  That always irritated me.  Other than that, I did rather enjoy it and its message about polluting the planet.

;D

Not at all.  And no problem.  We had just watched it the other day, so it is still fresh in my mind. :D

That Jewish manicurist/beautician thing always bugged me about that movie.  So did the stereotypical fat Americans.  Where were the other ethnicities in all this?  Did the other countries get wiped off the face of the earth or what?  That always irritated me.  Other than that, I did rather enjoy it and its message about polluting the planet.


after the deconstruction I just did on disney let me tell you it will be a long time before I can watch one of their movies!  ;D

The little mermaid bugs me the most because - and you know I saw it once in 1990 so I never gave it much thought but.... Ariel gives up her voice just so she can marry the man of her dreams!  How effed up is that!?!  >:(

thanks again guys. it really helped- even tho, after all of this I ended up not referencing Wall-E at all  ;D  I was able to construct a solid thesis and pull fine examples--thank god for Wiki Plots-- that way I didn't have to sit thru all the films (again)  that I referenced 

Karma was given to each of you for your quick response. 

I would lock the thread but I wonder if Tam might move it to More than a decade or TTT so that we could- oh I don't discuss further the discourse of gender and racial roles in Disney films...the topic is rather fascinating.

I just finished reading an article on the depiction of the "new man" in Pixar films.  if anyone wants to read it I'd be happy to email it to them its about 7 pages long...

after the deconstruction I just did on disney let me tell you it will be a long time before I can watch one of their movies!  ;D

The little mermaid bugs me the most because - and you know I saw it once in 1990 so I never gave it much thought but.... Ariel gives up her voice just so she can marry the man of her dreams!  How effed up is that!?!  >:(


You should read the original fairytale.  It's even worse. :P

You should read the original fairytale.  It's even worse. :P


yeah we talked about it in class!  All that crap about sacrificing herself to the sea so that he can be with the woman he really loves (or loves at that moment in time  ::) ) Give me break!

Personally, I have only seen parts of it, and sadly the ending made me tear up a little bit even though I really had no clue what was going on.

The Son on the other hand, has watched it a gazillion times, so I have pointed out this thread to him and he should be replying right shortly. ;)



Now, if you wanna talk about Cars or Finding Nemo - I'm your Girl! Hahaha!

quoting for Tam's benefit!  ;)




I would lock the thread but I wonder if Tam might move it to More than a decade or TTT so that we could- oh I don't know- discuss further the discourse of gender and racial roles in Disney films...the topic is rather fascinating.

I just finished reading an article on the depiction of the "new man" in Pixar films.  if anyone wants to read it I'd be happy to email it to them its about 7 pages long...

quoting for Tam's benefit!  ;)



Ah!

Thanks girl.

I will move it to TTT for sure! 8)

Ah!

Thanks girl.

I will move it to TTT for sure! 8)


you rock.

Sorry I got here late, Q, but I didn't remember enough about this film to add anything.  

Karma to Jess, though!

Talk about waiting until the last minute.... anyway I have a midterm due in about 9 hours and I need to know something about Wall-E 
Since I've only seen it once (and I slept thru most of it) I'm hoping the parental units on the board may have the answer for me...


Is Eve able to say anything other than uttering Wall-E's name?
Can someone give me a quick and synopsis of what happens to her once she returns to the "mother-ship" with her plant sample?
and finally how do they get off the ship?  I think the ending was all hearts and flowers and they return to earth with revitalizes itself (right?)

are there other women in the film? I'm talking about robots not the lazy humans floating in chairs.... thanks.




Ok yes Eve can say something other than Wall-E's name. She can say 'directive' and 'no' that's pretty much it. Other than that it is pretty much just 'Wall-E' but in different tones of voice to show her agitation, annoyance, or sometime affection and joy.


When she gets the plant sample it is just her on earth with Wall-E taking care of her for a few days and then the ship that dropped her off comes to pick her back up. Wall-E, however doesn't want to let her go alone so he climbs up the side of the and holds on for the entire ride back to 'The Axium' (the 'mother ship' which is either owned or highly sponsored by the company Buy 'N' Large) When they get there they go through a series of events that focus on other robots cleaning all of the 'foreign contaminant' from eve. Another robot named Mo quickly becomes agitated when it spots Wall-E and discovers how filthy he is and Wall-E only makes it worse by tracking dirt all over the clean floor, leaving a very long trail for Mo to clean up. After Eve is clean she is transported to the captain's quarters and Wall-E, who unfortunately missed the ride that Eve got, is forced to chase after her all while wreaking a small bit of havoc. He comes in contact with his first human when he knocks a man from his chair. After a quick introduction Wall-E takes of after Eve again and then comes in contact with his second human, a woman who is talking to her friend. He turns off her conversation and asks her to get by so that he can be with Eve on the other side of the woman's chair. She kindly allows and then Wall-E enjoys the rest of the ride to the captains quarters with Eve.
When they get there Wall-e tries his hardest to be inconspicuouse while the captain and the auto-pilot (a steering wheel like that of a pirate ship's) begin the process of awakening Eve for the plant and preparing to head home. However when Eve tries to give them the plant they discover that she no longer has it. While the captain and auto-pilot talk Eve goes on a frantic search around the cabin and finds that Wall-E is there. She then searches through him and asks him for the plant and so he begins searching to. The captain decides that eve is defective and sends her to be repaired and Wall-E to be cleaned. so then they take a trip to the repair place and Wall-e is put behind a barrier forced to watch the shadows of Eve's repairs. However it looks more like torture so he breaks out and into the room that Eve is in, grabs her gun arm and releases all of the defective robots. And then Eve and Wall-E are set running throughout the ship leading them to becoming rogue robots. Eve takes Wall-E to attempt to send him back to earth but they are interrupted by another robot who has the plant. he puts it in a pod  and sets it for earth. Wall-e goes to get the plant while the other robot isn't looking and is then sent off in the pod. Eve chases after him for the plant and as Wall-E tries to stop the pod he turns on the self destruct. Eve sees the explosion from afar and suspects the worst but then Wall-E zooms by using a fire extinguisher and still has the plants so they dance through space blah blah blah. When they get back to the captains quarters it turns out that 700 years ago auto-pilot was told to never go home by a former captain and so they throw the plant down the garbage shoot-- which wall-e just happened to be climbing up at the time (disobeying eve's orders to stay put) After a short little game of a sort of monkey in the middle Wall-E and Eve and the Captain (who his still set on going back to earth) lose the plant. Wall-E gets hurt and is thrown down the garbage shoot with Eve.

thats abut as much as i can tell you because i can't remember everything that happens next exactly. the other female robot is a defective hairdresser and doesn't really have any major role.

When they return to earth Wall-E is hurt and Eve fights to put him back together as fast as possible but when he is fixed it seams he has lost his memory. Then Eve does this little electric robot kiss thing and Wall-E remembers everything and just as u said hearts flowers they rebuild earth from the start blah blah blah.

hope i was of some help.

Ok yes Eve can say something other than Wall-E's name. She can say 'directive' and 'no' that's pretty much it. Other than that it is pretty much just 'Wall-E' but in different tones of voice to show her agitation, annoyance, or sometime affection and joy.


When she gets the plant sample it is just her on earth with Wall-E taking care of her for a few days and then the ship that dropped her off comes to pick her back up. Wall-E, however doesn't want to let her go alone so he climbs up the side of the and holds on for the entire ride back to 'The Axium' (the 'mother ship' which is either owned or highly sponsored by the company Buy 'N' Large) When they get there they go through a series of events that focus on other robots cleaning all of the 'foreign contaminant' from eve. Another robot named Mo quickly becomes agitated when it spots Wall-E and discovers how filthy he is and Wall-E only makes it worse by tracking dirt all over the clean floor, leaving a very long trail for Mo to clean up. After Eve is clean she is transported to the captain's quarters and Wall-E, who unfortunately missed the ride that Eve got, is forced to chase after her all while wreaking a small bit of havoc. He comes in contact with his first human when he knocks a man from his chair. After a quick introduction Wall-E takes of after Eve again and then comes in contact with his second human, a woman who is talking to her friend. He turns off her conversation and asks her to get by so that he can be with Eve on the other side of the woman's chair. She kindly allows and then Wall-E enjoys the rest of the ride to the captains quarters with Eve.
When they get there Wall-e tries his hardest to be inconspicuouse while the captain and the auto-pilot (a steering wheel like that of a pirate ship's) begin the process of awakening Eve for the plant and preparing to head home. However when Eve tries to give them the plant they discover that she no longer has it. While the captain and auto-pilot talk Eve goes on a frantic search around the cabin and finds that Wall-E is there. She then searches through him and asks him for the plant and so he begins searching to. The captain decides that eve is defective and sends her to be repaired and Wall-E to be cleaned. so then they take a trip to the repair place and Wall-e is put behind a barrier forced to watch the shadows of Eve's repairs. However it looks more like torture so he breaks out and into the room that Eve is in, grabs her gun arm and releases all of the defective robots. And then Eve and Wall-E are set running throughout the ship leading them to becoming rogue robots. Eve takes Wall-E to attempt to send him back to earth but they are interrupted by another robot who has the plant. he puts it in a pod  and sets it for earth. Wall-e goes to get the plant while the other robot isn't looking and is then sent off in the pod. Eve chases after him for the plant and as Wall-E tries to stop the pod he turns on the self destruct. Eve sees the explosion from afar and suspects the worst but then Wall-E zooms by using a fire extinguisher and still has the plants so they dance through space blah blah blah. When they get back to the captains quarters it turns out that 700 years ago auto-pilot was told to never go home by a former captain and so they throw the plant down the garbage shoot-- which wall-e just happened to be climbing up at the time (disobeying eve's orders to stay put) After a short little game of a sort of monkey in the middle Wall-E and Eve and the Captain (who his still set on going back to earth) lose the plant. Wall-E gets hurt and is thrown down the garbage shoot with Eve.

thats abut as much as i can tell you because i can't remember everything that happens next exactly. the other female robot is a defective hairdresser and doesn't really have any major role.

When they return to earth Wall-E is hurt and Eve fights to put him back together as fast as possible but when he is fixed it seams he has lost his memory. Then Eve does this little electric robot kiss thing and Wall-E remembers everything and just as u said hearts flowers they rebuild earth from the start blah blah blah.

hope i was of some help.


that's excellent! between you and Jess I never have to see the film again!  Thanks!  ;) :)

that's excellent! between you and Jess I never have to see the film again!  Thanks!  ;) :)


no problem

Sorry I got here late, Q, but I didn't remember enough about this film to add anything.  

Karma to Jess, though!


no worries... now that I've changed the topic and you have a little girl I wonder what you impression is of the whole teaching girls that prince charming is the only goal worthy chasing  dynamic of disney films?

after the deconstruction I just did on disney let me tell you it will be a long time before I can watch one of their movies!  ;D

The little mermaid bugs me the most because - and you know I saw it once in 1990 so I never gave it much thought but.... Ariel gives up her voice just so she can marry the man of her dreams!   How effed up is that!?!  >:(
No Ariel,  gives up here voice- to walk on land (in order to get her voice back - she has to make Eric kiss her)....  Nothing about marrying the man.  She truly wants to have her voice back, and tries to get Eric to kiss her (sea Hag then messes up her boy relationship, and goes to Eric with ariel's voice, the voice he is enraptured by.)

no worries... now that I've changed the topic and you have a little girl I wonder what you impression is of the whole teaching girls that prince charming is the only goal worthy chasing  dynamic of disney films?


I am not sure that I agree with the idea that prince charming is the only goal in Disney films....  Yes I do not agree with the cleaning and everything domestic... But there are good role models

Mulan (she goes and fights for her country, staying hidden that she is a girl)
Pocahontas (she is strong, races, hunts and tracks - rebels against women roles)
Ariel - again rebels against her father and his ideas of what a "girl" should do. She goes on her own to find a way to get to land...  She is very adventurious - to explore for things from above
Beauty - she leaves her family (brave act - to save them) and then does fall in love with hideous beast...
Esmerelda - Opera singer - does not take much from anyone...

I enjoy the dream of being a strong, independent woman. If one happens to find "prince charming" all the better - hopefully no one settles for anything less than their "prince"

no worries... now that I've changed the topic and you have a little girl I wonder what you impression is of the whole teaching girls that prince charming is the only goal worthy chasing  dynamic of disney films?



Naturally, the whole perfect ending thing is misleading and I always wonder why there has to be a love story.  Why can't they just tell a tale of a girl succeeding? That would be a good lesson in itself, so yes, I do agree that the whole dynamic sucks.  I have to say though, that my biggest problem with Disney is that 99% of their female characters are orphans or have no mother.  What's up with that?  I've always maintained that while Disney films may be entertaining, they certainly aren't very educational.

I should also add that from a very early age, my daughter disliked ALL Disney movies, especially princess movies.  She's such a concrete thinker that  she did not like the fact that the "bad guy" was just sent away and never redeemed themselves or saw the error of their ways.  She used to nightmare about Ursula from the Little Mermaid because, as she explained it: "they only chased her away to go be bad somewhere else.  She wasn't even sorry!"  She has a problem with the whole good vs bad formula, in general, I think. 

Naturally, the whole perfect ending thing is misleading and I always wonder why there has to be a love story.  Why can't they just tell a tale of a girl succeeding? That would be a good lesson in itself, so yes, I do agree that the whole dynamic sucks.  I have to say though, that my biggest problem with Disney is that 99% of their female characters are orphans or have no mother.  What's up with that?  I've always maintained that while Disney films may be entertaining, they certainly aren't very educational.

I should also add that from a very early age, my daughter disliked ALL Disney movies, especially princess movies.  She's such a concrete thinker that  she did not like the fact that the "bad guy" was just sent away and never redeemed themselves or saw the error of their ways.  She used to nightmare about Ursula from the Little Mermaid because, as she explained it: "they only chased her away to go be bad somewhere else.  She wasn't even sorry!"  She has a problem with the whole good vs bad formula, in general, I think. 




smart girl she is!! :)

No Ariel,  gives up here voice- to walk on land (in order to get her voice back - she has to make Eric kiss her)....  Nothing about marrying the man.  She truly wants to have her voice back, and tries to get Eric to kiss her (sea Hag then messes up her boy relationship, and goes to Eric with ariel's voice, the voice he is enraptured by.)





okay so the story isn't about her wanting to marry him but she's not happy with her world and wants to experience the riches of the world above.
who is the first human she meets? Eric- when she saves him- she falls for him then- but wants him to see her as human therefore she sacrifices her voice to meet a man and to experience "the good life" 

also, Titan had the power to let her walk all along but because he wants to retain control of her below he forces her to go seek alternate means...

and what about the fact that she didn't have to make the deal with ursula? She should know that nothing is more important than retaining you voice... not sacraficing it and hoping to get it back after you snag the man....aka getting the kiss.....

I am not sure that I agree with the idea that prince charming is the only goal in Disney films....  Yes I do not agree with the cleaning and everything domestic... But there are good role models

Mulan (she goes and fights for her country, staying hidden that she is a girl)
Pocahontas (she is strong, races, hunts and tracks - rebels against women roles)
Ariel - again rebels against her father and his ideas of what a "girl" should do. She goes on her own to find a way to get to land...  She is very adventurious - to explore for things from above
Beauty - she leaves her family (brave act - to save them) and then does fall in love with hideous beast...
Esmerelda - Opera singer - does not take much from anyone...

I enjoy the dream of being a strong, independent woman. If one happens to find "prince charming" all the better - hopefully no one settles for anything less than their "prince"




While mulan is defying gender roles by passing as a man not to defend her country but to keep her father from having to endure the mandatory service - she also spends a lot of time pining for her "fellow" soldier.

Pochohantas I haven't seen so I can't speak to it.

Ariel I just posted about

Beauty- Is a whole another issue... you're right she doesn't go to Beast because she wants to marry a prince but because she has to fulfill her father's "plea bargain"  You know these dads are mighty free with their daughter's futures... anyway- she doesn't marry the beast like she's supposed to. they become friends but at night she dreams of a handsome prince....sure its the real persona of the beast but she doesn't know that... eventually he lets her go home but when she doesn't return as promised he dies. she cries over the loss and says she loves him but --- was she "in love" with him? no- I do however think she cared about him.  anyway- it isn't until he's handsome again that she actually commits to him.

Esmerelda wouldn't look twice at Quasimodo because she was all hot for that soldier guy Phobo or something.

Naturally, the whole perfect ending thing is misleading and I always wonder why there has to be a love story.  Why can't they just tell a tale of a girl succeeding? That would be a good lesson in itself, so yes, I do agree that the whole dynamic sucks.  I have to say though, that my biggest problem with Disney is that 99% of their female characters are orphans or have no mother.  What's up with that?  I've always maintained that while Disney films may be entertaining, they certainly aren't very educational.

I should also add that from a very early age, my daughter disliked ALL Disney movies, especially princess movies.  She's such a concrete thinker that  she did not like the fact that the "bad guy" was just sent away and never redeemed themselves or saw the error of their ways.  She used to nightmare about Ursula from the Little Mermaid because, as she explained it: "they only chased her away to go be bad somewhere else.  She wasn't even sorry!"  She has a problem with the whole good vs bad formula, in general, I think. 


your daughter is brilliant!!!!

Its about time Pixar made a film with a female lead. they've had what? 9, 10 films- but not one of them centers on a female.... Incredibles comes closest with the incredible women having fairly significant parts but in the end its not really their story.

As for old Disney theatrical shorts, the crows from "Dumbo",  and  "Song of the South" (which I own a soundtrack), I tend to look past the stereotypes and is aware that stereotypes and caricatures were very common place in the early/mid 20th century and also (unfortunately) still around today like on movies, tv, music videos, etc. Not to mention Comedy Central, "Family Guy" (which tries too hard with the shock factor), and movies like "Bruno" & "Soul Plane".

The crows from Dumbo were positive characters that gave the baby elephant a boost of confidence and as a kid I just saw them as birds rather than humans. Also I've seen worse like the Warner Bros. cartoon "Angel Puss"  and Lantz "Scrub Me Mama with A Boogie Beat" (though the only positive aspect is the song of that title). Thogh the theaterical cartoons were mostly aimed towards adults, which aired between newsreels and the feature film.

A thread about cartoons that are considered politically incorrect by today's standards from the early/mid 20th century

As for old Disney theatrical shorts, the crows from "Dumbo",  and  "Song of the South" (which I own a soundtrack), I tend to look past the stereotypes and is aware that stereotypes and caricatures were very common place in the early/mid 20th century and also (unfortunately) still around today like on movies, tv, music videos, etc. Not to mention Comedy Central, "Family Guy" (which tries too hard with the shock factor), and movies like "Bruno" & "Soul Plane".

The crows from Dumbo were positive characters that gave the baby elephant a boost of confidence and as a kid I just saw them as birds rather than humans. Also I've seen worse like the Warner Bros. cartoon "Angel Puss"  and Lantz "Scrub Me Mama with A Boogie Beat" (though the only positive aspect is the song of that title). Thogh the theaterical cartoons were mostly aimed towards adults, which aired between newsreels and the feature film.

A thread about cartoons that are considered politically incorrect by today's standards from the early/mid 20th century











one of the reasons I chose Disney.... and I'm trying to keep this about Disney only- is because of the image that goes along with the Disney Corporation name.

The way they sanitize virtually everything they touch.

Before Disney got its hands on it Pretty Woman was dark film about a crack addicted prostitute who wants to earn money to take a trip to disney land.... now don't get me wrong- I love the version of PW we have now but we are talking about two very different tones-  they took from a harsh look at class systems to a fairy tale romance.


I've only seen Dumbo once.... well I saw half of Dumbo- I turned it off somewhere before the midway point because it bored me to tears...

Well, I was stoked when I heard they were going to actually make a Black princess film, but after reading Wiki's description of it and how it was going to be and how it is NOW, I think I'll take a pass. :P

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Princess_and_the_Frog

Well, I was stoked when I heard they were going to actually make a Black princess film, but after reading Wiki's description of it and how it was going to be and how it is NOW, I think I'll take a pass. :P

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Princess_and_the_Frog



Why's the girl gotta be turned into a frog too?  ::)

one of the reasons I chose Disney.... and I'm trying to keep this about Disney only- is because of the image that goes along with the Disney Corporation name.

The way they sanitize virtually everything they touch.


Disney is well known for doing that.  And many times, they pretty much have to do that.

In the original material for Song Of The South, Uncle Remus was a slave.  And spoke with a much thicker accent and dialect.  The setting was changed to post-Civil War, and the dialog cleaned up.

In The Hunchback Of Notre Dame, the changes were many.  The brother of Claude Frollo was removed, and along with it his death.  Esmeralda's marriage to a poet is removed, along with her rape by Phoebus.  The attack of Phoebus by Claude Frollo and framing Esmeralda for the murder and her subsequent execution were removed.  Also the choice her "husband" made, choosing to let her die while saving her goat was not in the movie.  In fact, in the original story, pretty much everybody dies but Quasimodo.

The stories based on Fairy Tales are all changed.  Anybody that has read the original versions written by the Brothers Grimm and Hans Christian Anderson will understand why.  Cinderella's sisters mutilate themselves to make the slipper fit, then are killed when she becomes queen. 

The second half of the Sleeping Beauty stories is removed, which includes cannibalism.

In Snow White, Snow White is fairly foolish, with 3 attempts on her life (a corset that constricts her, a poison comb, finally an apple).  And instead of turning into a dragon and fighting the Prince, the step-mother is summoned to the wedding and discovers who the new queen is.  Snow White takes her revenge, putting on her step-mother hot iron shoes, then being forced to dance until she dies.  Also left out is the fact that Snow White and the Prince are half-siblings.

Rapunzel is being made now.  But do not expect her to become pregnant, like in the original story.

In Beauty And The Beast, the evil sister that wants Beast to tear Belle apart is removed (along with another vain sister).

In the remake of The Frog Prince, expect the traditional kiss to end the spell, instead of the original where the girl tries to kill the frog by dashing it against a wall.

The Little Mermaid is drastically changed.  In the original, the legs she gors are horribly painful, and walking causes her pain like walking on broken glass, and bleeding.  The prince also marries somebody else, causing her to kill herself by jumping into the ocean.

In Pinocchio, his killing of the cricket with a hammer is removed, as well as his antics landing Gepetto in jail.  Gepetto is also known in his neighborhood for his dislike of children.

In Peter Pan, his boastfull and abusive nature is tuned down.

In The Three Little Pigs, 2 of the pigs are eaten.  And the wolf is cooked when he falls into the pot, then eaten by the last surviving pig.

Aladdin is changed from being Chinese to an Arab.  The second djin is never mentioned, and the story is vastly changed (instead of loosing the lamp, he marries the princess who gives it away to a pedler).

Even The Fox And The Hound is different.  Copper and Todd were never friends, but life-long enemies.  And at the end, Todd is chased by Copper in a hunt until he dies.

In The Jungle Book, Mowgli's killing and skinning of Shere Kahn is never mentioned, as well as his expulsion from the human villiage for witchcraft.

In Mary Poppins, the nanny in the stories is vain, short tempered, and very stern.

In 101 Dalmations, Mr. Dearly was a financial wizard, not a song writer.  The dogs were manipulative, Cruella had a husband that made fur coats, and she hated and abused all animals, including her cat (who's kittens she would drown). 

In Who Framed Roger Rabbit, Roger was murdered early in the story.  Most of the cartoons were 1930's comics (like Dick Tracy).  Jessica was very amoral, and was estranged from Roger.  Baby Herman is also murdered in the book.  ANd instead of working for jovial R. K. Maroon, Roger and Herman work for sleezy producers known as the DeGreasey brothers.

And of course, anybody that knows history knows that Pocahontas was really married to John Rolfe, not John Smith.  There is no mention of her being kidnapped by the English settlers, or her rape at the hands of the English.

Of course, none of these would normally be considered as plots for good "Family Movies".

smart girl she is!! :)


Thanks  :)  She's a very old soul.

your daughter is brilliant!!!!


Well, she gets it from her mother  ;D ;D

Word on the street is that Disney bought out marvel for 4 billion buckaroos. What could this mean for any future comic movies for marvel characters.

And of course, anybody that knows history knows that Pocahontas was really married to John Rolfe, not John Smith.  There is no mention of her being kidnapped by the English settlers, or her rape at the hands of the English.

They also left out the fact that when John Smith came here she was like 11.  A little girl as compared to the teenager/early adult in the movie.

They also left out the fact that when John Smith came here she was like 11.  A little girl as compared to the teenager/early adult in the movie.


too be fair her life span was way shorter so she was probably like 28 in terms of longevity  :D

They also left out the fact that when John Smith came here she was like 11.  A little girl as compared to the teenager/early adult in the movie.


That is true.

John Smith was a notorious liar, and most people in his era never believed him.  In fact, he had told very similar stories years earlier about being saved by a Turkish Princess from her father the Sultan after a visit to the Middle East.

In reality, they had about as much reality in them as most of Jim Bridger's stories had.

This thread started out as plea for help with some info about Wall-E for a paper I was writing for my Children's Film class but it put some serious thought into my head about the roles of women, and to some extent men, and also racial depictions in Disney and Pixar films.

there has been serious study going around this issue for decades but this is the first time I even bothered to think about it.... your thoughts?


I actually noticed this the other day when watching... I don't even remember what I watched. Maybe it hit me while I was in Disneyland a couple of months ago.

All the girls are "beautiful" damsels in distresses while then dudes are big and strong and really enforce how one should act according to their sex in little kids.

I have even thought to myself that if I'm ever a dad, I might be extra selective about Disney films.

I actually noticed this the other day when watching... I don't even remember what I watched. Maybe it hit me while I was in Disneyland a couple of months ago.

All the girls are "beautiful" damsels in distresses while then dudes are big and strong and really enforce how one should act according to their sex in little kids.

I have even thought to myself that if I'm ever a dad, I might be extra selective about Disney films.


That is nothing special.  Almost all dolls and toys are the exact same.

Look at a classic GI Joe and compare it to a Barbie.  Even look at the recent remake of the Star Wars action figures.  In the newest incarnation, Princess Lea would have hooters that would make Dolly Paton look small.  And Luke Skywalker had a muscular chest that would make Hulk Hogan look like a 98 pound weakling.

And I would not worry to much, almost all things aimed at kids are like this.  If you want to give them more real life, feel free to read the Brothers Grimm to them.  8)

That is nothing special.  Almost all dolls and toys are the exact same.

Look at a classic GI Joe and compare it to a Barbie.  Even look at the recent remake of the Star Wars action figures.  In the newest incarnation, Princess Lea would have hooters that would make Dolly Paton look small.  And Luke Skywalker had a muscular chest that would make Hulk Hogan look like a 98 pound weakling.

And I would not worry to much, almost all things aimed at kids are like this.  If you want to give them more real life, feel free to read the Brothers Grimm to them.   8)


Argh! Those toys too!

Yeah, most kids think very gender-oriented, too, what with all the girls and their cooties and boys and their grossness.
On the other hand, would this happen if we didn't reinforce it with these toys/movies/ideals?

On the subject of toys, they market certain toys specifically to girls or boys. You can tell by the aisle they're in at the local store. There would be one pink aisle, Barbies, etc, one primarily blue aisle, Hot Wheels, etc, and then there were the 'any-gender' aisles, with both action figures and My Little Ponies.

Personally, I didn't like any of those aisles. I much preferred the giant metal rack with the huge bouncing balls in it.

Disney's "Mickey's Christmas Carol" is different than the original versio (never read). Though I like the animated version for the animation, mixture of drama & comedy, character cameos, and nostalgia reasons.

Not sure about the recent CGI flick, though not thinking of watching since the characters are creepy.

Disney is well known for doing that.  And many times, they pretty much have to do that.

In the original material for Song Of The South, Uncle Remus was a slave.  And spoke with a much thicker accent and dialect.  The setting was changed to post-Civil War, and the dialog cleaned up.

In The Hunchback Of Notre Dame, the changes were many.  The brother of Claude Frollo was removed, and along with it his death.  Esmeralda's marriage to a poet is removed, along with her rape by Phoebus.  The attack of Phoebus by Claude Frollo and framing Esmeralda for the murder and her subsequent execution were removed.  Also the choice her "husband" made, choosing to let her die while saving her goat was not in the movie.  In fact, in the original story, pretty much everybody dies but Quasimodo.

The stories based on Fairy Tales are all changed.  Anybody that has read the original versions written by the Brothers Grimm and Hans Christian Anderson will understand why.  Cinderella's sisters mutilate themselves to make the slipper fit, then are killed when she becomes queen. 

The second half of the Sleeping Beauty stories is removed, which includes cannibalism.

In Snow White, Snow White is fairly foolish, with 3 attempts on her life (a corset that constricts her, a poison comb, finally an apple).  And instead of turning into a dragon and fighting the Prince, the step-mother is summoned to the wedding and discovers who the new queen is.  Snow White takes her revenge, putting on her step-mother hot iron shoes, then being forced to dance until she dies.  Also left out is the fact that Snow White and the Prince are half-siblings.

Rapunzel is being made now.  But do not expect her to become pregnant, like in the original story.

In Beauty And The Beast, the evil sister that wants Beast to tear Belle apart is removed (along with another vain sister).

In the remake of The Frog Prince, expect the traditional kiss to end the spell, instead of the original where the girl tries to kill the frog by dashing it against a wall.

The Little Mermaid is drastically changed.  In the original, the legs she gors are horribly painful, and walking causes her pain like walking on broken glass, and bleeding.  The prince also marries somebody else, causing her to kill herself by jumping into the ocean.

In Pinocchio, his killing of the cricket with a hammer is removed, as well as his antics landing Gepetto in jail.  Gepetto is also known in his neighborhood for his dislike of children.

In Peter Pan, his boastfull and abusive nature is tuned down.

In The Three Little Pigs, 2 of the pigs are eaten.  And the wolf is cooked when he falls into the pot, then eaten by the last surviving pig.

Aladdin is changed from being Chinese to an Arab.  The second djin is never mentioned, and the story is vastly changed (instead of loosing the lamp, he marries the princess who gives it away to a pedler).

Even The Fox And The Hound is different.  Copper and Todd were never friends, but life-long enemies.  And at the end, Todd is chased by Copper in a hunt until he dies.

In The Jungle Book, Mowgli's killing and skinning of Shere Kahn is never mentioned, as well as his expulsion from the human villiage for witchcraft.

In Mary Poppins, the nanny in the stories is vain, short tempered, and very stern.

In 101 Dalmations, Mr. Dearly was a financial wizard, not a song writer.  The dogs were manipulative, Cruella had a husband that made fur coats, and she hated and abused all animals, including her cat (who's kittens she would drown). 

In Who Framed Roger Rabbit, Roger was murdered early in the story.  Most of the cartoons were 1930's comics (like Dick Tracy).  Jessica was very amoral, and was estranged from Roger.  Baby Herman is also murdered in the book.  ANd instead of working for jovial R. K. Maroon, Roger and Herman work for sleezy producers known as the DeGreasey brothers.

And of course, anybody that knows history knows that Pocahontas was really married to John Rolfe, not John Smith.  There is no mention of her being kidnapped by the English settlers, or her rape at the hands of the English.

Of course, none of these would normally be considered as plots for good "Family Movies".


Wow, didn't know that about Cinderella.(multilation and execution, yee...)

I read that even Quasimodo died in the original, it was in a Toons magazine which was covering cartoon facts. They had a section about Disney adaptations of novels, although it could have been a brain fart that made them say Quasimodo died.(Since errors do happen)

Wow, didn't know that about Cinderella.(multilation and execution, yee...)

I read that even Quasimodo died in the original, it was in a Toons magazine which was covering cartoon facts. They had a section about Disney adaptations of novels, although it could have been a brain fart that made them say Quasimodo died.(Since errors do happen)


Oh yes, some of the real classics (Sleeping Beauty, Snow White, etc) had the worst endings.  They were often morality tales, where the "evil" characters meet horrible endings (torture and mutilation were common).

In the original Hunchback, Quasimodo was actually a Gypsie child, who is swapped for a girl baby.  The girl's mother discovers the disfigured boy baby, and places it in front of the monestary and places herself in a seclusion cell in Paris, and constantly raves about the evil Gypsies.  The girl child that was taken grows up to be Elmerelda.

When things go bad towards the end, she is the one that riles up the crowd against Esmerelda, only to discover as they are taking her to be executed that she is her own daughter.  Esmerelda is hung and Quasimodo mourns for her, then vanishes.  In the epilogue, they talk about years later opening the crypt where executed criminals are placed, and finding the body of a teen girl, and a mis-shapen male body clinging to her.

Quite morbid, like most of Victor Hugo's work.  The good people die, the bad people live.  Even some necrophilia thrown in.

So yes, you can say that Quasimodo died in the original, but only after the end of the actual story.  His death was presumed in the epilogue, and happened out of frame.

I don't really have anything to add, other than I've always noticed that there is very rarely a mother in Disney movies.  And if there is a mother figure, it is normally an evil step mother.  I always found that a little disturbing.

Anyway, this thread has been very educational and interesting to read, especially Mushroom's info on fairy tales.  I didn't know a lot of the real stories and it makes me want to go out and read them!  Karma to everyone.

Oh yes, some of the real classics (Sleeping Beauty, Snow White, etc) had the worst endings.  They were often morality tales, where the "evil" characters meet horrible endings (torture and mutilation were common).

In the original Hunchback, Quasimodo was actually a Gypsie child, who is swapped for a girl baby.  The girl's mother discovers the disfigured boy baby, and places it in front of the monestary and places herself in a seclusion cell in Paris, and constantly raves about the evil Gypsies.  The girl child that was taken grows up to be Elmerelda.

When things go bad towards the end, she is the one that riles up the crowd against Esmerelda, only to discover as they are taking her to be executed that she is her own daughter.  Esmerelda is hung and Quasimodo mourns for her, then vanishes.  In the epilogue, they talk about years later opening the crypt where executed criminals are placed, and finding the body of a teen girl, and a mis-shapen male body clinging to her.

Quite morbid, like most of Victor Hugo's work.  The good people die, the bad people live.  Even some necrophilia thrown in.

So yes, you can say that Quasimodo died in the original, but only after the end of the actual story.  His death was presumed in the epilogue, and happened out of frame.


I read that he had apparently died of starvation, which is what you said happened out of frame.

I remember when they re-issued "Song of the South" back in 1981.  No protests.  Of course, I grew up in a 99% white area of New Hampshire.  Still, if they tried to reissue that movie in 1991, there would have been protests even up there.  Just goes to show how the culture can change in a decade.