The 90s seemed to be a very feminist decade from the start. Wilson Phillips had an 80s sound but a 90s look on feminism, and as Celine Dion proves, you didn't have to be pretty in the 90s to be a popular singer, unlike now.

Hey, Celine Dion is pretty, just in a unique way.

I think the '90s was more open to women who were Lesbians than in previous decades, and so it brought forth more feminist singers. There was that concert called Lilliath Faire. I am not sure if it still exists, but it brought together many famous female artists of the time.

back then, it was more about REAL equality, and actual fair treatment. Now, feminism has been reduced to nothing more than man-hating, ego boosting crap, with a touch of entitlement. I mean, the whole point before was that women could be AS GOOD as men at anything. Now, its all about how feminists think they're BETTER, not just EQUAL. I have as much problem with that as anything.

As to were the 90's more woman friendly, yes. There was a balance where a woman COULD get a job/career, but didn't HAVE to. Now, women are chastised if they DONT have a career, or if they decide to stay home because family is more important...

You went with music but I am gonna go with TV... there were far more roles for women... less stereotypical ones to.

The 70s introduced Women's lib with shows like Mary Tyler Moore

The 80s practiced it:
Cagney & Lacey
Kate & Allie

The 90s perfected it with 80s shows that carried on into the 90s
Designing Women
Murphy Brown
China Beach

Women seem to get stronger and more independent as time goes on.

The 90s seemed to be a very feminist decade from the start. Wilson Phillips had an 80s sound but a 90s look on feminism, and as Celine Dion proves, you didn't have to be pretty in the 90s to be a popular singer, unlike now.

The reason why Celine Dion was popular in the 90's was because she has an incredible voice. The 90's was also good for Alanis Moressette and Shania Twain.
I would have to say that the 90's were 'Canadian women friendly'.

Wilson Phillips had an 80s sound but a 90s look on feminism,


Wait... what?

My only exposure to them was due to working in an office full of AM top-40 listeners. I had to grit my teeth through their execreble "Hold On" at least once every hour for an entire summer.  That song was practically an endorsement of battered wife syndrome.

Q: "How do you tell a DJ to play something other than top 40?"
A: Don't you know?  Things can change?  Things can go your way if you Hoooooold on, for one more day-SCRAAAAAAAAAATCH*bzzzzzzzzzzzt". Thanks, listeners, I only had to open the request line twice!

back then, it was more about REAL equality, and actual fair treatment. Now, feminism has been reduced to nothing more than man-hating, ego boosting crap, with a touch of entitlement. I mean, the whole point before was that women could be AS GOOD as men at anything. Now, its all about how feminists think they're BETTER, not just EQUAL. I have as much problem with that as anything.

As to were the 90's more woman friendly, yes. There was a balance where a woman COULD get a job/career, but didn't HAVE to. Now, women are chastised if they DONT have a career, or if they decide to stay home because family is more important...


In some ways, I think this is true. The '90s had alot of noticeably feminist thinking and movements (which was reflected in pop culture, especially music), although I think you can trace it back to, say 1981.

Women in the workplace at Nine to Five jobs as opposed to being stay at home moms or housewives, became really common in the '80s, which was a good thing. This eqality just didn't totally permeate society until the '90s, and I think there were women demanding that this be heard. There were lots of female artists who did the same kinds of music or talked about the same things with male artists did. Everyone from indie rockers like Courtney Love or Liz Phair, to pop/rock like Sheryl Crow, but alot of it was female empowered in one way or another. The decade had a very laid back, casual attitude towards alot of things. It was also fairly common for women to kinda be "one of the guys" in everything from fashion styles or who they hung out with and how they acted. Elaine from Seinfeld is a really good example of this. Like someone who was feminine in a causal sense, just with traits that fit in with guys as well. I think that's a perfect mix.

For the record, I consider myself something of a feminist, yet I also think a balance is the best thing (i.e. equality and not superiority). Being at either end of the extreme isn't good with almost anything. I personally agree with the early-mid '90s ideaology of feminism. I don't necesarilly think it has declined now, but it's been around for long enough now that it's sort of a standard, so people don't pay as much attention to it anymore.

Wait... what?

My only exposure to them was due to working in an office full of AM top-40 listeners. I had to grit my teeth through their execreble "Hold On" at least once every hour for an entire summer.  That song was practically an endorsement of battered wife syndrome.

Q: "How do you tell a DJ to play something other than top 40?"
A: Don't you know?  Things can change?  Things can go your way if you Hoooooold on, for one more day-SCRAAAAAAAAAATCH*bzzzzzzzzzzzt". Thanks, listeners, I only had to open the request line twice!


I always thought of it as an anti-suicide song...

I always thought of it as an anti-suicide song...


That's probably what the songwriter originally intended.

Then again, I'm the guy that walked into the same office, saw Margaret Mead's quoted under a motivational poster for "Teamwork: Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed people can change the world. Indeed, it is the only thing that ever has." (with a picture of four hands clasped together in a cross), and the first thing to cross my mind was that the same could have been said for the Nazis.  "So, Boss, was this Mead chick at Nuremburg?  And whose side was she arguing for?"

That's probably what the songwriter originally intended.

Then again, I'm the guy that walked into the same office, saw Margaret Mead's quoted under a motivational poster for "Teamwork: Never doubt that a small group of thoughtful, committed people can change the world. Indeed, it is the only thing that ever has." (with a picture of four hands clasped together in a cross), and the first thing to cross my mind was that the same could have been said for the Nazis.  "So, Boss, was this Mead chick at Nuremburg?  And whose side was she arguing for?"


now that is a unique perspective.  I like it tho we need people like you or else we all become complacent.

I always thought of it as an anti-suicide song...


I always thought it a perfect commercial for feminine hygiene products:

"I know this pain" = PMS
"Why do lock yourself up in these chains?" = "Don't use your mother's tampon - Try New StayFree"
"Is it really fair to feel this way inside?" = Monistat 7 or Summer's Eve
"Or are you comfortable with the pain?" = Pamprin
"You got yourself into your own mess" = "Spotting IS your fault. Try new Maxi pads, the only ones with extra large wings AND a propeller!"

The video is very "fresh", too.

Sorry, but like Foo Bar, I heard this song about 12 gajiliion times in 1990 alone, thus my disdain for it.

Ant

I always thought it a perfect commercial for feminine hygiene products:

"I know this pain" = PMS
"Why do lock yourself up in these chains?" = "Don't use your mother's tampon - Try New StayFree"
"Is it really fair to feel this way inside?" = Monistat 7 or Summer's Eve
"Or are you comfortable with the pain?" = Pamprin
"You got yourself into your own mess" = "Spotting IS your fault. Try new Maxi pads, the only ones with extra large wings AND a propeller!"

The video is very "fresh", too.

Sorry, but like Foo Bar, I heard this song about 12 gajiliion times in 1990 alone, thus my disdain for it.

Ant



;D ;D ;D  ;D ;D ;D ;D  I usually follow this much laughter with karma

I love "Hold On", both for the song, lyrics and video. VH1 used to play it constantly back then. :)

Even if that electric guitar solo is kinda '80slike (as well as the slick production), I think it's more stripped down and Nineties, both the lyrics and the sound. The message seems to be just about someone who's been through a troubled relationship and harder times in life, and she's telling him or her as a friend to wait for the right one. I don't think it's about depression or suicide, although that's an interesting perspective. I think the "chains" they were talking about were referring to the person's heart, since they were shutting out love up till that point, probably from lousy experiences.