It seems like since 2006 began, the 1990s board has flourished.  I guess we're getting to the point where a lot of kids can't remember the '90s, or only barely can.

It seems like since 2006 began, the 1990s board has flourished.  I guess we're getting to the point where a lot of kids can't remember the '90s, or only barely can.


It has been busier lately, maybe.

It has been busier lately, maybe.


2006, for some reason, seems important.  Finally, we feel deeply into the 2000s and 21st Century. 

Maybe it's because so many 20th Century icons passed away in 2004 and '05.

2006, for some reason, seems important.  Finally, we feel deeply into the 2000s and 21st Century. 

Maybe it's because so many 20th Century icons passed away in 2004 and '05.


Yea we are now well into the 2000s heading into the late '00s. People are starting to realize that the '90s are getting older and more people are longing for the '90s the way things are going now.

Yea we are now well into the 2000s heading into the late '00s. People are starting to realize that the '90s are getting older and more people are longing for the '90s the way things are going now.


I never thought I would miss the days of the Backstreet Boys  ;D

I can't believe 1998 was nearly a decade ago.

I never thought I would miss the days of the Backstreet Boys  ;D

I can't believe 1998 was nearly a decade ago.


Yea it is hard to believe, time has really gone fast. The late '90s are now quite a while ago. I remember 1998 like yesterday.

Yea it is hard to believe, time has really gone fast. The late '90s are now quite a while ago. I remember 1998 like yesterday.


Me too.  ;D

Yet, it still doesn't feel much different, except for political events and outlook and like we've discussed the dominance of hip hop over culture, as opposed to simply huge influence over music.

I think it's definitely starting now, even as '80s nostalgia is still really the hot thing. It'll probably be really big by 2010 or so, with grunge and R&B "divas" and '90s sitcom nostalgia. Friends was still on the air until like last year, now it feels like the '90s are really far away since maybe last fall. In the early '00s it basically still felt like the '90s. They may not have been so great, but they're better than this.

I think it's definitely starting now, even as '80s nostalgia is still really the hot thing. It'll probably be really big by 2010 or so, with grunge and R&B "divas" and '90s sitcom nostalgia. Friends was still on the air until like last year, now it feels like the '90s are really far away since maybe last fall. In the early '00s it basically still felt like the '90s. They may not have been so great, but they're better than this.


The "late '90s" vibe went from 1997 to mid 2001.

I think it's definitely starting now, even as '80s nostalgia is still really the hot thing. It'll probably be really big by 2010 or so, with grunge and R&B "divas" and '90s sitcom nostalgia. Friends was still on the air until like last year, now it feels like the '90s are really far away since maybe last fall. In the early '00s it basically still felt like the '90s. They may not have been so great, but they're better than this.


I think nostalgia in media terms is actually more like 25-30 years. The '50s came back in the '80s up till about 1986. The 60s around 1989, and the '70s peaking around 1998 (i.e. That 70s Show with lingering effects today).

Therefore I don't think we'll see 90's nostalgia in the "revived" sense until about 2015 or 2020. You know what, though? I almost wonder if further decades will only be revived in small forms, or by certain people, as opposed to as a whole.

I mean, the '80s are certainly TRYING to come back, have since probably 2003, but the rap culture makes this harder to do. Plus, there aren't as many sweeping cultural changes, and people are being "big kids" longer now, so the '70s might actually be the last truly "retro revitalized" era.


But anyway, I think now we're realizing even 2001 was five years ago, and no one prepubescent can probably remember anything before Y2K or Pokemon. That makes us miss it more, even if the cultural feel isn't that different from 1999, or heck, even 1995/96 in some ways.

I think nostalgia in media terms is actually more like 25-30 years. The '50s came back in the '80s up till about 1986. The 60s around 1989, and the '70s peaking around 1998 (i.e. That 70s Show with lingering effects today).

Therefore I don't think we'll see 90's nostalgia in the "revived" sense until about 2015 or 2020. You know what, though? I almost wonder if further decades will only be revived in small forms, or by certain people, as opposed to as a whole.

I mean, the '80s are certainly TRYING to come back, have since probably 2003, but the rap culture makes this harder to do. Plus, there aren't as many sweeping cultural changes, and people are being "big kids" longer now, so the '70s might actually be the last truly "retro revitalized" era.


But anyway, I think now we're realizing even 2001 was five years ago, and no one prepubescent can probably remember anything before Y2K or Pokemon. That makes us miss it more, even if the cultural feel isn't that different from 1999, or heck, even 1995/96 in some ways.


Yeah, I agree. Most "revivals" of decades are very limited in span; i.e. the '50s returned to the '80s in the form of leather jackets, the '80s are returning into the '00s with hoop earrings, but the '90s were so much like the '70s they actually felt like them in some ways.  When watching That '70s Show, for instance (which probably isn't the best representation of the '70s  ;D), you really feel at home. 

But yeah, it is very sad (but in a way, cool) that nobody until the age of 12 or 13 can remember pre-1999 era stuff.

Yeah, I agree. Most "revivals" of decades are very limited in span; i.e. the '50s returned to the '80s in the form of leather jackets, the '80s are returning into the '00s with hoop earrings, but the '90s were so much like the '70s they actually felt like them in some ways.  When watching That '70s Show, for instance (which probably isn't the best representation of the '70s  ;D), you really feel at home. 

But yeah, it is very sad (but in a way, cool) that nobody until the age of 12 or 13 can remember pre-1999 era stuff.


Yes, I always got the feeling the beginnger '70s (the period from roughly 1971/72-75, and maybe we can throw 1976 in there too) was a very "laid back" time, but different in its own way. It shared alot in common with the '60s, but was also a toned down/more modern feel to it in its own way.

There wasn't any HUGE cultural shift in this time, which is partly why I think it was/is so easy to revive. It really was kinda laid back post-60s/pre '70s.

The '90s (1991-96, and actually even anytime before '99) was alot like this in its own way. 

Yes, I always got the feeling the beginnger '70s (the period from roughly 1971/72-75, and maybe we can throw 1976 in there too) was a very "laid back" time, but different in its own way. It shared alot in common with the '60s, but was also a toned down/more modern feel to it in its own way.

There wasn't any HUGE cultural shift in this time, which is partly why I think it was/is so easy to revive. It really was kinda laid back post-60s/pre '70s.

The '90s (1991-96, and actually even anytime before '99) was alot like this in its own way. 


Yeah.

Have you been like me, and become softer on 1997 and 1998? I mean, even with "South Park" and stuff, they were still pretty cool compared to now.  The technology was high then, but more simplistic than now, and it at least didn't feel like the end of the world like now does, LOL  ;D

Yeah.

Have you been like me, and become softer on 1997 and 1998? I mean, even with "South Park" and stuff, they were still pretty cool compared to now.  The technology was high then, but more simplistic than now, and it at least didn't feel like the end of the world like now does, LOL  ;D


I have too and 1999 as well, I think the late '90s were great in a lot of ways.

I have too and 1999 as well, I think the late '90s were great in a lot of ways.


Yeah, even 1999 was alright.  But since a lot of '00s trends started then, it's not quite as good as 1997 and '98 and of course anything prior to that.

Yeah.

Have you been like me, and become softer on 1997 and 1998? I mean, even with "South Park" and stuff, they were still pretty cool compared to now.  The technology was high then, but more simplistic than now, and it at least didn't feel like the end of the world like now does, LOL  ;D


I think around 2003 was when I started to miss 1997/98, but even then it felt slightly closer to it than it does now. For instance, I had only graduated high school three years before, now it's pushing six! Add in another presidential election passed, and alot of celebrities dying in the past year, that makes it feel further away.

Probably the Ipod/Myspace/cameraphone craze around 2004/5, as well as no "kids" being able to remember pre-1999 anymore (or only slightly) has made it more nostalgic to me, even if many things still look almost identical. The Internet and such felt more exciting because it was still relatively new.

I think around 2003 was when I started to miss 1997/98, but even then it felt slightly closer to it than it does now. For instance, I had only graduated high school three years before, now it's pushing six! Add in another presidential election passed, and alot of celebrities dying in the past year, that makes it feel further away.

Probably the Ipod/Myspace/cameraphone craze around 2004/5, as well as no "kids" being able to remember pre-1999 anymore (or only slightly) has made it more nostalgic to me, even if many things still look almost identical. The Internet and such felt more exciting because it was still relatively new.


Yeah.  In a way, 2002 and '03 sort of brought on the 2000s.

Yeah, even 1999 was alright.  But since a lot of '00s trends started then, it's not quite as good as 1997 and '98 and of course anything prior to that.


I have come to miss 1999 a lot, I really think it was a great year for a lot of reasons. I actually miss alot of late '90s pop now, it's actually I hate to say becomming nostalgic to me. The impeachment trial finally ended. The economy was really good, all the talk about the surplus, things seemed so good in 1999. Everybody, including myself was really excited about the new millennium as well.

I have come to miss 1999 a lot, I really think it was a great year for a lot of reasons. I actually miss alot of late '90s pop now, it's actually I hate to say becomming nostalgic to me. The impeachment trial finally ended. The economy was really good, all the talk about the surplus, things seemed so good in 1999. Everybody, including myself was really excited about the new millennium as well.


Yeah.  Plus, even the Britney Spears songs from then weren't complete BS.

Yeah.  Plus, even the Britney Spears songs from then weren't complete BS.


Yea, and they're better than "Grillz". lol.

Yea, and they're better than "Grillz". lol.


;D

Yeah.  Plus, even the Britney Spears songs from then weren't complete BS.


Even though at the time, I kinda dismissed her as a "kiddie" act (even though she's my age) I didn't completely hate her music. I will give her credit that her very first songs are catchy in a guilty pleasure/teenybopper way (i.e. "Sometimes"), although I never would've admitted it. :D

She's a hottie too. Although I do wish she hadn't shifted pop music so sharply into the American Idol/Disney pop obsession. Back then I remember thinking it would be totally an "in the moment" thing that people woule be laughing at by 2003.

Even though at the time, I kinda dismissed her as a "kiddie" act (even though she's my age) I didn't completely hate her music. I will give her credit that her very first songs are catchy in a guilty pleasure/teenybopper way (i.e. "Sometimes"), although I never would've admitted it. :D

She's a hottie too. Although I do wish she hadn't shifted pop music so sharply into the American Idol/Disney pop obsession. Back then I remember thinking it would be totally an "in the moment" thing that people woule be laughing at by 2003.


Yeah.  I actually liked her at first, because my brother thought she was hot.  By 2000, I thought she would be gone ... I guess I was wrong!  Her heyday was more 1999-2005.

Even though at the time, I kinda dismissed her as a "kiddie" act (even though she's my age) I didn't completely hate her music.

I will give her credit that her very first songs are catchy in a guilty pleasure/teenybopper way. She's a hottie too. Although I do wish she hadn't shifted pop music so sharply into the American Idol/Disney pop obsession.

Back then I remember thinking it would be totally an "in the moment" thing that people woule be laughing at by 2003.


At the time I didn't admit to liking a lot of the teen pop stuff but really I did. I actually like a lot of the music from 1999 (No Scrubs, Every Morning, Fly Away, Unpretty, Angel of Mine, If You Had My Love, Save Tonight, Someday, even I Want It That Way and Livin' LaVida Loca, lol)

Yeah.  I actually liked her at first, because my brother thought she was hot.  By 2000, I thought she would be gone ... I guess I was wrong!  Her heyday was more 1999-2005.


I'd say early 1999-2001 for her music, and 2002+ for her celebrity. She'll probably always be a household name, but musically her career kinda ended when she tried to do the "dirty pop" thing around '02. It may have worked if she started off that way, but no one bought it because of her teenybopper image, probably.

I do wonder if one reason the late '90s are seeming further away now is the boybands basically not having much more success. I don't think Justin Timberlake has had a hit since 2003 or so. Backstreet's comeback last year was kinda shortlived, it seems.

At the time I didn't admit to liking a lot of the teen pop stuff but really I did. I actually like a lot of the music from 1999 (No Scrubs, Every Morning, Fly Away, Unpretty, Angel of Mine, If You Had My Love, Save Tonight, Someday, even I Want It That Way and Livin' LaVida Loca, lol)


Come to think of that, doesn't some '90s music almost sound like "oldies" today? Not like Beach Boys oldies, but like "Smooth" by Santana for instance sounds like grocery store music.

I'd say early 1999-2001 for her music, and 2002+ for her celebrity. She'll probably always be a household name, but musically her career kinda ended when she tried to do the "dirty pop" thing around '02. It may have worked if she started off that way, but no one bought it because of her teenybopper image, probably.

I do wonder if one reason the late '90s are seeming further away now is the boybands basically not having much more success. I don't think Justin Timberlake has had a hit since 2003 or so. Backstreet's comeback last year was kinda shortlived, it seems.


Yeah, teen pop is totally dead pretty much.  It's molded into other things, but that is pretty much the same thing as dying out.  The American Idol thing is a little less bubblegum, so isn't quite the same thing.

At the time I didn't admit to liking a lot of the teen pop stuff but really I did. I actually like a lot of the music from 1999 (No Scrubs, Every Morning, Fly Away, Unpretty, Angel of Mine, If You Had My Love, Save Tonight, Someday, even I Want It That Way and Livin' LaVida Loca, lol)


Never liked Ricky Martin or the Latin pop stuff, but most of the other songs I actually do/did like. Even if 1999 music was very "2000s" in many ways, it was more diverse than today IMO. It actually felt more like 1997 and '98 if you know what I mean.

I've said this before, but one thing I dislike is the lack of cheesy "prom styled" pop ballads today. 1999 was probably the last year they were decently popular.

Come to think of that, doesn't some '90s music almost sound like "oldies" today? Not like Beach Boys oldies, but like "Smooth" by Santana for instance sounds like grocery store music.


Yeah some songs do sound different, not so much old but they have a certain style that you don't really see anymore.

Never liked Ricky Martin or the Latin pop stuff, but most of the other songs I actually do/did like. Even if 1999 music was very "2000s" in many ways, it was more diverse than today IMO. It actually felt more like 1997 and '98 if you know what I mean.

I've said this before, but one thing I dislike is the lack of cheesy "prom styled" pop ballads today. 1999 was probably the last year they were decently popular.


I think the Emo bands are kind of bringing that back.  Like "Just The Girl" by Click Five, a terrible song, but kind of likeable and even kind of eighties-like in a way.

I'd say early 1999-2001 for her music, and 2002+ for her celebrity. She'll probably always be a household name, but musically her career kinda ended when she tried to do the "dirty pop" thing around '02. It may have worked if she started off that way, but no one bought it because of her teenybopper image, probably.

I do wonder if one reason the late '90s are seeming further away now is the boybands basically not having much more success. I don't think Justin Timberlake has had a hit since 2003 or so. Backstreet's comeback last year was kinda shortlived, it seems.


Yeah I haven't heard much from Timberlake since I think "Cry Me a River" in 2003.

Yeah I haven't heard much from Timberlake since I think "Cry Me a River" in 2003.


However his solo album really was more of a R&B album than a pop album.

I think the Emo bands are kind of bringing that back.  Like "Just The Girl" by Click Five, a terrible song, but kind of likeable and even kind of eighties-like in a way.


Never heard that, but I'll try and listen out for songs like that. Was it you who once said a certain genre tends to go "ballad oriented" once it gets older? If that's true, maybe we'll start to be innundated with emo ballads/love songs in the late '00s? The same way we had alternative/teenpop ballads around 1999, and hair metal ballads peaking around 1988.

Never heard that, but I'll try and listen out for songs like that. Was it you who once said a certain genre tends to go "ballad oriented" once it gets older? If that's true, maybe we'll start to be innundated with emo ballads/love songs in the late '00s? The same way we had alternative/teenpop ballads around 1999, and hair metal ballads peaking around 1988.


That was me :)

Maybe we will.  I mean, Simple Plan's "Untitled" isn't quite a ballad, but it's pretty slow and actually a really good song.

However his solo album really was more of a R&B album than a pop album.


True. I always got the feeling the solo members of the boybands tried to make music that would distance themselves from their "teenybopper" image, while the girls tried to do dirty pop. For better or worse, neither really worked. I wonder if that actually kinda led to their demise?

True. I always got the feeling the solo members of the boybands tried to make music that would distance themselves from their "teenybopper" image, while the girls tried to do dirty pop. For better or worse, neither really worked. I wonder if that actually kinda led to their demise?


I think they just wanted to "fill the gaps", that is, not be a popular musician, but be a "figure" and still technically be making music.

As for their demise, I just think their fanbase grew up.  The nine year olds of 1999 liked the Backstreet Boys, the nine year olds of today like Avril Lavigne and Jesse McCartney.

Maybe the "teen pop" has just shifted into the Disney realm and out of the Top 40.  Stuff like Aly & A.J., for instance.

That was me :)

Maybe we will.  I mean, Simple Plan's "Untitled" isn't quite a ballad, but it's pretty slow and actually a really good song.

Never heard it (that I know of), but I like departure songs from these kind of bands. I actually think SP might be slightly more talented than your typical Good Charlotte-type pop punk band.

Of course if I had it my way, "pop" songs would be like "Take On Me" and ballads would be like REO Speedwagon's "Can't Fight this Feeling". Not likely though. ;D

Never heard it (that I know of), but I like departure songs from these kind of bands. I actually think SP might be slightly more talented than your typical Good Charlotte-type pop punk band.

Of course if I had it my way, "pop" songs would be like "Take On Me" and ballads would be like REO Speedwagon's "Can't Fight this Feeling". Not likely though. ;D


I love Take on Me.  Really the song of the eighties, huh?

Yeah, Simple Plan aren't that bad.  I really don't dislike Emo that much, even if the Emo people are complete wusses  ;D
Do you know what song I love?  "I Want To Know What Love Is" by Foreigner.  No man would claim to like it, but every man really does.  '80s music is kind of like masturbation: you don't admit to doing it, but you do when nobody's around and so does everyone else  ;D

I think they just wanted to "fill the gaps", that is, not be a popular musician, but be a "figure" and still technically be making music.

As for their demise, I just think their fanbase grew up.  The nine year olds of 1999 liked the Backstreet Boys, the nine year olds of today like Avril Lavigne and Jesse McCartney.

Maybe the "teen pop" has just shifted into the Disney realm and out of the Top 40.  Stuff like Aly & A.J., for instance.


Yeah, I never thought of that, but I guess Nickelodeon/Disney pop (i.e. Hilary Duff) is actually more of an update of Britney and the Backstreet Boys.

The 10 year old girls of 1999 are 16-17 now, and the 13 year olds are 19-20, so I agree no matter what, that stuff wouldn't have survived very long on its own.

BTW, do you think Avril Lavigne, Michelle Branch and such sound kinda like a "bridge" between 1998-ish teenpop and today's Emo styled pop?

True. I always got the feeling the solo members of the boybands tried to make music that would distance themselves from their "teenybopper" image, while the girls tried to do dirty pop. For better or worse, neither really worked. I wonder if that actually kinda led to their demise?


Yea, I think they were just trying to fit in with the hip-hop image in order to keep their success. It started with Britney's "Britney" album in 2001, which was horrible in my opinion. I didn't mind her 2003 album so much though.

I think they just wanted to "fill the gaps", that is, not be a popular musician, but be a "figure" and still technically be making music.

As for their demise, I just think their fanbase grew up.  The nine year olds of 1999 liked the Backstreet Boys, the nine year olds of today like Avril Lavigne and Jesse McCartney.

Maybe the "teen pop" has just shifted into the Disney realm and out of the Top 40.  Stuff like Aly & A.J., for instance.


I actually kind of like that "Rush" song by those girls, lol.

I love Take on Me.  Really the song of the eighties, huh?

Yeah, Simple Plan aren't that bad.  I really don't dislike Emo that much, even if the Emo people are complete wusses  ;D
Do you know what song I love?  "I Want To Know What Love Is" by Foreigner.  No man would claim to like it, but every man really does.  '80s music is kind of like masturbation: you don't admit to doing it, but you do when nobody's around and so does everyone else  ;D


;D

Actually that makes sense. Even some of the biggest '80s music trashers who say they suck, or claim they were too young (i.e. "only 5 in 1990") actually would listen to it in private.

BTW, "I Wanna Know What Love Is" was one of the first songs I got into. That's why I always considered 1984 and '85 my favorite musical years.

Yeah, I never thought of that, but I guess Nickelodeon/Disney pop (i.e. Hilary Duff) is actually more of an update of Britney and the Backstreet Boys.

The 10 year old girls of 1999 are 16-17 now, and the 13 year olds are 19-20, so I agree no matter what, that stuff wouldn't have survived very long on its own.

BTW, do you think Avril Lavigne, Michelle Branch and such sound kinda like a "bridge" between 1998-ish teenpop and today's Emo styled pop?


Yeah I think so.  Avril is too bubblegum for the '90s, but still kind of has that vibe, if that makes sense.

P.S. do you think a early '90s kid is too young for BSB, Britney, etc.?  I don't, because a lot of 8 and 9 year olds are actually pretty culturally smart.  Even a 1994er wouldn't be unaware of them if they had an older sibling.

Yeah I think so.  Avril is too bubblegum for the '90s, but still kind of has that vibe, if that makes sense.

P.S. do you think a early '90s kid is too young for BSB, Britney, etc.?  I don't, because a lot of 8 and 9 year olds are actually pretty culturally smart.  Even a 1994er wouldn't be unaware of them if they had an older sibling.


No, I know 1992ers that were into the 1999 stuff, though they totally hate it now.

Yeah I think so.  Avril is too bubblegum for the '90s, but still kind of has that vibe, if that makes sense.

P.S. do you think a early '90s kid is too young for BSB, Britney, etc.?  I don't, because a lot of 8 and 9 year olds are actually pretty culturally smart.  Even a 1994er wouldn't be unaware of them if they had an older sibling.


I actually think that probably was the beginning of their main audience. I remember seeing TONS of little kids (i.e. maybe 6-10, some even maybe 5) in 1999 who were singing BSB songs, or I overheard saying something about Britney Spears, etc.

And, to use myself as an example ad nauseum, even if it weren't for my parents listening to the radio and such, I still remember ALOT starting in 1987, so on my own I would've been old enough to like late '80s music.

No, I know 1992ers that were into the 1999 stuff, though they totally hate it now.



Yeah.

Don't you think 1999 is like the quintessential van guard Y year?  2004 is probably more Y, but IMO to truly be Y you have to at least remember something from 1999.

Yeah.

Don't you think 1999 is like the quintessential van guard Y year?  2004 is probably more Y, but IMO to truly be Y you have to at least remember something from 1999.


Oh yea, if you don't remember 1999 at all, you're really not a yer.

Oh yea, if you don't remember 1999 at all, you're really not a yer.


Yeah, which is Y I consider 1994ers, as young as they seem to be true Y.  I mean, at least they remember 1999.  Unlike a 1997er, who would see a VHS tape the way a 1987er would see a vinyl record.

Also, there just aren't as many 9-year olds as there were in 1999, 1997 had a far lower birthrate than 1990, which rivaled alot of baby boom years in babies born that year. I think teens have more of a hold on the market now than they did back then because of the demographic push.

About Britney's celebrity...her music has not been that successful since maybe when I was in 5th grade or so, so I would say her popularity ended around 9/11 for music, and since then she's been tabloid fodder and a household name. Probably she'll have faded out of the spotlight totally except for ridicule by the end of this decade. And there is a lack of cheesy prom-styled ballads, and it's a good point that towards its end a genre goes for slower songs. Like new wave did that, hair metal did that, etc. So probably we'll be seeing emo and indie rock ballads and love songs by the time I'm graduating from high school. Anyway, whenever I show up at a school dance these days, all I hear is glam rap maybe with some '80s, even a few years back you still heard '90s stuff.

I think probably from about 1994 or 1995 on a person wouldn't be aware of how big that whole thing was with teen pop except in a marginal sense. People forget things they're briefly aware of around 5 pretty easily. Like they would've heard it, but it wouldn't mean that much to them. And yeah, Justin Timberlake has a fading career...even though lots of people born in the mid-late 1980s are loathe to admit it, he is not the next "king of pop" or something. By the end of the '00s all these people will be are tabloid fodder.

Yeah, which is Y I consider 1994ers, as young as they seem to be true Y.  I mean, at least they remember 1999.  Unlike a 1997er, who would see a VHS tape the way a 1987er would see a vinyl record.


Yeah, the 1997ers are very boardline, but they are like yz cusp since they will remember and like a lot of the gen y things from the '00s especially mid-late '00s.

But still, I hold to my opinion that '94 on isn't real, genuine Gen Y. Gen Xers born in 1966 remembered boomer culture from the early 1970s, and may even have liked it, but it wasn't really what shaped them, and they aren't considered at all boomer. '94-'96 definitely has alot more Y in it than '97+, but it's still more Gen Z than anything, probably.

Also, there just aren't as many 9-year olds as there were in 1999, 1997 had a far lower birthrate than 1990, which rivaled alot of baby boom years in babies born that year. I think teens have more of a hold on the market now than they did back then because of the demographic push.

About Britney's celebrity...her music has not been that successful since maybe when I was in 5th grade or so, so I would say her popularity ended around 9/11 for music, and since then she's been tabloid fodder and a household name. Probably she'll have faded out of the spotlight totally except for ridicule by the end of this decade. And there is a lack of cheesy prom-styled ballads, and it's a good point that towards its end a genre goes for slower songs. Like new wave did that, hair metal did that, etc. So probably we'll be seeing emo and indie rock ballads and love songs by the time I'm graduating from high school. Anyway, whenever I show up at a school dance these days, all I hear is glam rap maybe with some '80s, even a few years back you still heard '90s stuff.

I think probably from about 1994 or 1995 on a person wouldn't be aware of how big that whole thing was with teen pop except in a marginal sense. People forget things they're briefly aware of around 5 pretty easily. Like they would've heard it, but it wouldn't mean that much to them. And yeah, Justin Timberlake has a fading career...even though lots of people born in the mid-late 1980s are loathe to admit it, he is not the next "king of pop" or something. By the end of the '00s all these people will be are tabloid fodder.


Yeah ... 9/11 kind of set the mood.  2002, for instance, in some ways feel closer to 2006 than to spring of 2001.

As for 1994/95ers, maybe there's kind of a gap in the very middle of the '90s. 1994ers seem quite Y to me, but 1995 I'm not totally sure of.  They probably are Y too, since like Brian said they will be able to remember now just fine, but they will definitely share things in common with Z considerably more than even a '92er or '93er would.

Because really, a 1992er is just like a younger version of a 1987 baby in many ways.

But still, I hold to my opinion that '94 on isn't real, genuine Gen Y. Gen Xers born in 1966 remembered boomer culture from the early 1970s, and may even have liked it, but it wasn't really what shaped them, and they aren't considered at all boomer. '94-'96 definitely has alot more Y in it than '97+, but it's still more Gen Z than anything, probably.


Yeah, I used to take that stance too, but I'm thinking more now that they're the very end of Y.  There's definitely a Z element to those born in 1994 or later though.

Thing is 11 years is not long enough for a generation. 1981-1992 or whatever is just not long enough. Y has to extend to at least about 1995 maybe even as far as 1997. There's just 2 halves of y, there's an older half, and there's the later half. The later half of y has somethings in common with gen z, but I would still include them with gen y. Same thing with those born in the late '70s and very early '80s, they're gen x in my opinion even though they may share some similarites with gen y.

Thing is 11 years is not long enough for a generation. 1981-1992 or whatever is just not long enough. Y has to extend to at least about 1995 maybe even as far as 1997. There's just 2 halves of y, there's an older half, and there's the later half. The later half of y has somethings in common with gen z, but I would still include them with gen y. Same thing with those born in the late '70s and very early '80s, they're gen x in my opinion even though they may share some similarites with gen y.



I totally agree.

Don't you think that 1990-1992 kids are really, for the most part like "little 1987ers"?  I would say a '90er or '91er is more like a '70s baby culturally than a '00s baby.  1993-1996/'97 is where they start to be more like Z than X, but it's still definitely Y. 1998 and 1999 is probably Z.

Yeah ... 9/11 kind of set the mood.  2002, for instance, in some ways feel closer to 2006 than to spring of 2001.

As for 1994/95ers, maybe there's kind of a gap in the very middle of the '90s. 1994ers seem quite Y to me, but 1995 I'm not totally sure of.  They probably are Y too, since like Brian said they will be able to remember now just fine, but they will definitely share things in common with Z considerably more than even a '92er or '93er would.

Because really, a 1992er is just like a younger version of a 1987 baby in many ways.


Yeah, that last part is true. But then and again, remembrance isn't the same thing as seeing or participating. Generation Xers born in 1964 definitely remembered the '60s, but lord, they were most definitely not baby boomers. And they weren't that different from people born in the 1960s, but I think people born in the mid-90s will be pretty different than the core late '80s group of Y. They won't remember accurately a world before the dot-com boom, and they won't be part of the current teen culture as much, graduating HS in 2012. Remembrance is different than experience. I think '94 will sort of either be the last year of Z or the first of Y, and '95 will be basically Z.

IMO, Gen X is 1964-1976 for pure Gen X. Most Gen Xers I've talked to disagree with the late 1970s being included at all, they're pretty defensive of their generational stature. Late 1970s, from talking to people in their late '20s, is either, they don't really think of themselves as belonging to anything except maybe the '90s generation. Early '80s to early '90s is Real Y.

I just really don't think people born in the mid-1990s are sharing or will share the same general experiences as people born in the early 1990s, by and large. Different generation, IMO.

I totally agree.

Don't you think that 1990-1992 kids are really, for the most part like "little 1987ers"?  I would say a '90er or '91er is more like a '70s baby culturally than a '00s baby.  1993-1996/'97 is where they start to be more like Z than X, but it's still definitely Y. 1998 and 1999 is probably Z.


Yea in ways they are, the 1992 kids still seem kinda like little kids even at 13/14 that seems quite young to me now, but we're pretty similiar culturally. But the 84ers and 85ers seem closer to my age now though.

Yeah, that last part is true. But then and again, remembrance isn't the same thing as seeing or participating. Generation Xers born in 1964 definitely remembered the '60s, but lord, they were most definitely not baby boomers. And they weren't that different from people born in the 1960s, but I think people born in the mid-90s will be pretty different than the core late '80s group of Y. They won't remember accurately a world before the dot-com boom, and they won't be part of the current teen culture as much, graduating HS in 2012. Remembrance is different than experience. I think '94 will sort of either be the last year of Z or the first of Y, and '95 will be basically Z.

IMO, Gen X is 1964-1976 for pure Gen X. Most Gen Xers I've talked to disagree with the late 1970s being included at all, they're pretty defensive of their generational stature. Late 1970s, from talking to people in their late '20s, is either, they don't really think of themselves as belonging to anything except maybe the '90s generation. Early '80s to early '90s is Real Y.

I just really don't think people born in the mid-1990s are sharing or will share the same general experiences as people born in the early 1990s, by and large. Different generation, IMO.


You do make some valid points.  The main problem, though is that a generation can't be just 12 or 13 years.  It's gotta be at least fifteen, and maybe even twenty years.   It doesn't really make sense to have 13 years of X (1964-1976) and 18 years of Y (1977-1994).

Yea in ways they are, the 1992 kids still seem kinda like little kids even at 13/14 that seems quite young to me now, but we're pretty similiar culturally. But the 84ers and 85ers seem closer to my age now though.


But you'd say they're probably closer to an '87er than say a '97er, right?

Yeah, that last part is true. But then and again, remembrance isn't the same thing as seeing or participating. Generation Xers born in 1964 definitely remembered the '60s, but lord, they were most definitely not baby boomers. And they weren't that different from people born in the 1960s, but I think people born in the mid-90s will be pretty different than the core late '80s group of Y. They won't remember accurately a world before the dot-com boom, and they won't be part of the current teen culture as much, graduating HS in 2012. Remembrance is different than experience. I think '94 will sort of either be the last year of Z or the first of Y, and '95 will be basically Z.

IMO, Gen X is 1964-1976 for pure Gen X. Most Gen Xers I've talked to disagree with the late 1970s being included at all, they're pretty defensive of their generational stature. Late 1970s, from talking to people in their late '20s, is either, they don't really think of themselves as belonging to anything except maybe the '90s generation. Early '80s to early '90s is Real Y.

I just really don't think people born in the mid-1990s are sharing or will share the same general experiences as people born in the early 1990s, by and large. Different generation, IMO.


Yes, some people around the Brat Pack age do come off a little "protective" at times of their generation. Thinking for instance, unless you were a 15 year old sneaking into a girl's house to watch "Thriller" in 1983, there's no way you whippersnappers could remember or experience the '80s! ;D

They probably feel this way about people born after 1977 ('77 to '78 feels like a big shift to me, in terms of relation to the '80s). I think more '78er are prone to dissing the '80s than a '77er, who seems almost like a "little '80s teen" in a way. Think DJ from Full House.

Heck, if you apply that theory, could you consider 1978 people to be VERY early Gen Y? It seems kinda too old, but at the same time, they were still 16 in 1994 when the Internet was starting to become talked about, and only 20 in 1998.

But you'd say they're probably closer to an '87er than say a '97er, right?


Oh Yea.

Yes, some people around the Brat Pack age do come off a little "protective" at times of their own generation. Thinking for instance, unless you were a 15 year old sneaking into a girl's house to watch the "Thriller" video in 1983, there's no way a whippersnapper like you could remember or experience the '80s.

They probably feel this way about people born after 1977 ('77 to '78 feels like a big shift to me, in terms of relation to the '80s).

Heck, if you apply that theory, could you consider 1978 people to be VERY early Gen Y? It seems kinda too old, but at the same time, they were still 16 in 1994 when the Internet was starting to become talked about, and only 20 in 1998.


The late '70s kids are analogous to the mid '90s kids.  They're barely X, but cross into Y territory quite often. Early '90s kids are like to Y what mid '70s kids are to X.  Solidly in the generation, but on the younger side.

Not necessarily in the cultural sense, the baby boomers threw off everything. I'm talking more about a generation as a group of people who shared similar experiences and times in their formative years, not as much as a demographic thing. And yeah...Gen X brat packers are pretty damn protective of their generation and the '80s, because they hate baby boomers, a much larger and more influential group of people. People born around 1970 will get shocked if you even suggest they are a baby boomer or have anything to do with them. Yeah, Donnie, I agree with your last post, except I think mid-90s is more Z.

Not necessarily in the cultural sense, the baby boomers threw off everything. I'm talking more about a generation as a group of people who shared similar experiences and times in their formative years, not as much as a demographic thing. And yeah...Gen X brat packers are pretty damn protective of their generation and the '80s, because they hate baby boomers, a much larger and more influential group of people. People born around 1970 will get shocked if you even suggest they are a baby boomer or have anything to do with them. Yeah, Donnie, I agree with your last post, except I think mid-90s is more Z.


Sweet.  I'll agree to disagree on mid-90s kids :)

Not necessarily in the cultural sense, the baby boomers threw off everything. I'm talking more about a generation as a group of people who shared similar experiences and times in their formative years, not as much as a demographic thing. And yeah...Gen X brat packers are pretty damn protective of their generation and the '80s, because they hate baby boomers, a much larger and more influential group of people. People born around 1970 will get shocked if you even suggest they are a baby boomer or have anything to do with them. Yeah, Donnie, I agree with your last post, except I think mid-90s is more Z.


I've never understood why a 1969-er for instance, seems to hate Baby Boomers so much.

Heck, it almost seems like resentment from both sides (the post 1977-ers are just whippersnapper kids, and anyone before, say 1958 is an evil SOB who we're supposed to rebel against).

BTW I do mean that slightly tongue in cheek. Of course it's not true for everyone, and I also like so much of what a typical 1969 or 70-er did in their teen years.

I've never understood why a 1969-er for instance, seems to hate Baby Boomers so much.

Heck, it almost seems like resentment from both sides (the post 1977-ers are just whippersnapper kids, and anyone before, say 1958 is an evil SOB who we're supposed to rebel against).

BTW I do mean that slightly tongue in cheek. Of course it's not true for everyone, and I also like so much of what a typical 1969 or 70-er did in their teen years.


I think they envy the Baby Boomer's significance.  They don't "hate" them, I mean they're only a demographic, but they feel left out kind of and are bitter about it, as a group.

Okay, we'll agree to disagree... :). But we do both agree they're mixed, at least.

Baby boomers can also get very, very protective of their generation. Once, I suggested the boomers ended in 1963 because most 1964 born have more in common with Generation X, and he got pretty defensive, and he's not usually a stickler for that sort of thing.

Generation X had a huge amount of resentment in their teen years towards the people in say, their 30s in the '80s, who the entire world was focused upon. They thought the baby boomers took everything and all the cultural attention, and also experienced the finer side of things with the culture of the 1960s and 1970s.

I think they envy the Baby Boomer's significance.  They don't "hate" them, I mean they're only a demographic, but they feel left out kind of and are bitter about it, as a group.


Yea that's definitely a big part of it. I think they think the boomers are too powerful.

I think they envy the Baby Boomer's significance.  They don't "hate" them, I mean they're only a demographic, but they feel left out kind of and are bitter about it, as a group.


Well, your typical Baby Boomer (1946-53, and I even think 1943-45ers are on the cusp) is influential in so many ways. They created - and were a part of - the '60s hippie/Woodstock culture. Maybe a 1970-er just wants to feel as significant as that, so I kinda understand.

BTW, on a sidenote, would you consider me to be a X or Y? I think purely datewise, probably a teeny bit more X, certainly more X in pop culture tastes, but more Y with experiences and tech skills. I also graduated HS in 2000 with the typical '82-ers.

Well, your typical Baby Boomer (1946-53, and I even think 1943-45ers are on the cusp) is influential in so many ways. They created - and were a part of - the '60s hippie/Woodstock culture. Maybe a 1970-er just wants to feel as significant as that, so I kinda understand.

BTW, on a sidenote, would you consider me to be a X or Y? I think purely datewise, probably a teeny bit more X, certainly more X in pop culture tastes, but more Y with experiences and tech skills. I also graduated HS in 2000 with the typical '82-ers.


Oh, you're tail-end X.  Definitely.  But like a 1994er could cross into Z, you can cross into Y too.  That is, if you wanted to be, you could be a Y.  1977-1985ers kind of have a choice.

Okay, we'll agree to disagree... :). But we do both agree they're mixed, at least.

Baby boomers can also get very, very protective of their generation. Once, I suggested the boomers ended in 1963 because most 1964 born have more in common with Generation X, and he got pretty defensive, and he's not usually a stickler for that sort of thing.

Generation X had a huge amount of resentment in their teen years towards the people in say, their 30s in the '80s, who the entire world was focused upon. They thought the baby boomers took everything and all the cultural attention, and also experienced the finer side of things with the culture of the 1960s and 1970s.


My dad and mom are baby boomers and they seem to not care at all about generations or nostalgia. My mom born in 1949, a pure boomer, seems to like a lot of '80s songs however, so I don't know lol.

My dad and mom are baby boomers and they seem to not care at all about generations or nostalgia. My mom born in 1949, a pure boomer, seems to like a lot of '80s songs however, so I don't know lol.


Didn't 30-somethings seem old in the eighties?  Today, they just seem like older young adults.  It's the fortysomethings that seem "old".

I've talked to a fair number of Gen Xers about this. One person I talked to, born in 1966, says it was because "they had so much to care about, and we were looking for things to care about in the '80s, and we wanted to change the world." Gen Xers lamented their lack of cultural heroes, they were sad they didn't experience the tumultuous times of the Vietnam War. They also lament not being unified like the baby boomers are, though they're probably still a fairly unified generation with some cultural heroes. I think it's because they feel like they missed the train. Also, boomers basically controlled America beginning in the 1980s, and the Gen Xers saw all these boomers controlling a very corporate world they were too young to be a part of. Gen Xers are envious of missing out on pre-AIDS casual sex and drug use, also, not like they were so great or anything. I think you're probably XYish, more leaning on the X. I'm too young to be XY, but I want to be. So I guess I'm more "anti-Y."

My parents are both pure boomers who liked some '80s music, but they were born in 1955 and were in their mid-late '20s in the early MTV era. Still, I think their awareness of new music froze about the time they got married in 1986, or even earlier.

Oh, you're tail-end X.  Definitely.  But like a 1994er could cross into Z, you can cross into Y too.  That is, if you wanted to be, you could be a Y.  1977-1985ers kind of have a choice.


I really disagree about the 1982-85ers, they don't have a choice, they're y, lol. If you graduated in the '00s, you're gen y.

Oh, you're tail-end X.  Definitely.  But like a 1994er could cross into Z, you can cross into Y too.  That is, if you wanted to be, you could be a Y.  1977-1985ers kind of have a choice.


True. I mean, I could probably enjoy hours on end of a 1970-ers music and movie collection, or their stories from high school. But I'm more apt to disagree with them on mindset or points of view, for instance.

Would you also agree there's a big jump between 1977 and '78? There's just a huge change I've always noticed, judging by those I've known in real life. A 78er is likely to diss the '80s as being "old school" even if they loved it as a 9 year old or a 12 year old.

Beavis & Butthead were '79ers I think, too. Of course this changed as the series did, since they stayed the same age, but they seem like an accurate (well, VERY exaggerated) portrayal of a late '70s baby. They knew a good deal about the '80s, but ragged on those videos too. ;D

I really disagree about the 1982-85ers, they don't have a choice, they're y, lol. If you graduated in the '00s, you're gen y.


That's true.  Maybe 1977-1981 is more the cusp.  Although I think 1982 can just barely fit in.

I really disagree about the 1982-85ers, they don't have a choice, they're y, lol. If you graduated in the '00s, you're gen y.


Yeah, I agree with you. I also agree that there was a late '70s jump from 77 to 78 in terms of being more Y, and '79 is alot more like Y than X in alot of ways. Like they obviously know the '80s, but they weren't '80s people. Bart and Lisa from the Simpsons are pretty accurate portrayals of somebody about your age, Marty McFly...of course, now they should be born in '96 and '98, but they were originally supposed to be '80 and '82.

That's true.  Maybe 1977-1981 is more the cusp.  Although I think 1982 can just barely fit in.


Yea, 1982 is debateable, but they're probably more y.

True. I mean, I could probably enjoy hours on end of a 1970-ers music and movie collection, or their stories from high school. But I'm more apt to disagree with them on mindset or points of view, for instance.

Would you also agree there's a big jump between 1977 and '78? There's just a huge change I've always noticed, judging by those I've known in real life. A 78er is likely to diss the '80s as being "old school" even if they loved it as a 9 year old or a 12 year old.

Beavis & Butthead were '79ers I think, too. Of course this changed as the series did, since they stayed the same age, but they seem like an accurate (well, VERY exaggerated) portrayal of a late '70s baby. They knew a good deal about the '80s, but ragged on those videos too. ;D


Yeah, there's definitely a '77 to '78 difference.  Maybe it's because a '77er would turn 13 in 1990, which like I've said seems to fit in more with 1988 and 1989 than with 1992 and 1993, whereas a '78er would know the '80s plenty well, but would be turning 13 right around the time Grunge killed off the eighties culture.  But, they're not Gen Y.

Do you think the 2010s will be a mix of Y and Z, rather than pure Z, like the '90s were an XY mix? That's what I'm thinking.

Yeah, there's definitely a '77 to '78 difference.  Maybe it's because a '77er would turn 13 in 1990, which like I've said seems to fit in more with 1988 and 1989 than with 1992 and 1993, whereas a '78er would know the '80s plenty well, but would be turning 13 right around the time Grunge killed off the eighties culture.  But, they're not Gen Y.

Do you think the 2010s will be a mix of Y and Z, rather than pure Z, like the '90s were an XY mix? That's what I'm thinking.


Yea probably the early '10s will be more for the young yers, and z will probably take over by the mid '10s.

My parents are both pure boomers who liked some '80s music, but they were born in 1955 and were in their mid-late '20s in the early MTV era. Still, I think their awareness of new music froze about the time they got married in 1986, or even earlier.


It's ironic that alot of the '80s music stars were about this age. Actually many of them were born in the late '40s (i.e. Daryl Hall & John Oates, Journey, Sammy Hagar) and yet their peers in the everyday world are kinda iffy on whether or not they'll be a fan or not.

BTW, my mom is about the same age as yours (1954) and loved alot of 80's music (mainly pop/rock) circa 1985. I think this started with "average" people around 1950. Jay Leno is that age and he always struck me as pretty "hip" for his age. Well, he's an entertainer and a comedian, so he kinda has to stay current, but you get the feeling he knows what he's talking about and likes at least some of the popular culture out there.

Yeah, there's definitely a '77 to '78 difference.  Maybe it's because a '77er would turn 13 in 1990, which like I've said seems to fit in more with 1988 and 1989 than with 1992 and 1993, whereas a '78er would know the '80s plenty well, but would be turning 13 right around the time Grunge killed off the eighties culture.  But, they're not Gen Y.

Do you think the 2010s will be a mix of Y and Z, rather than pure Z, like the '90s were an XY mix? That's what I'm thinking.


I think they'll be a mix of that...it'll be dominated by late Yers who won't be too crazy about the '00s, though, the same way the peak '90s was dominated by Xers who weren't too crazy about the '80s but knw them pretty well.  However, I think Z domination will probably start by 2012, when it's mostly 1994+ in high school...or YZ cusp, or whatever  ;).

It's ironic that alot of the '80s music stars were about this age. Actually many of them were born in the late '40s (i.e. Daryl Hall & John Oates, Journey, Sammy Hagar) and yet their peers in the everyday world are kinda iffy on whether or not they'll be a fan or not.

BTW, my mom is about the same age as yours (1954) and loved alot of 80's music (mainly pop/rock) circa 1985. I think this started with "average" people around 1950. Jay Leno is that age and he always struck me as pretty "hip" for his age. Well, he's an entertainer and a comedian, so he kinda has to stay current, but you get the feeling he knows what he's talking about and likes at least some of the popular culture out there.


Yea that's how my mom is. She likes a lot of early-mid '80s music and she was born in 1949. She even likes current music a lot too, "Stickwitu" was on the radio today, and she's like "I like that song". She likes Usher too.

My mom likes early '80s MTV pop like "Video Killed the Radio Star." Most of what she likes is '60s pop and punk-pop, and those fun pop songs fit in pretty well with the sensibility of that.

It's ironic that alot of the '80s music stars were about this age. Actually many of them were born in the late '40s (i.e. Daryl Hall & John Oates, Journey, Sammy Hagar) and yet their peers in the everyday world are kinda iffy on whether or not they'll be a fan or not.

BTW, my mom is about the same age as yours (1954) and loved alot of 80's music (mainly pop/rock) circa 1985. I think this started with "average" people around 1950. Jay Leno is that age and he always struck me as pretty "hip" for his age. Well, he's an entertainer and a comedian, so he kinda has to stay current, but you get the feeling he knows what he's talking about and likes at least some of the popular culture out there.


Yeah that's weird, isn't it?  I mean, your "'80s person" is like 23-45 age now, but your "'80s celebrity" is like 32-60 now!  That's a lot older!  ;D

Yea that's how my mom is. She likes a lot of early-mid '80s music and she was born in 1949. She even likes current music a lot too, "Stickwitu" was on the radio today, and she's like "I like that song". She likes Usher too.


You know, I was also thinking about this, but do you think women are slightly more accepting/liking of pop culture more than men are? I know I got (slightly) nostalgic by age 12 and felt old by age 19 on many things.

Also, my dad pretty much doesn't like anything at all after the late '80s, whereas my mom still likes some new stuff.

You know, I was also thinking about this, but do you think women are slightly more accepting/liking of pop culture more than men are? I know I got (slightly) nostalgic by age 12 and felt old by age 19 on many things.

Also, my dad pretty much doesn't like anything at all after the late '80s, whereas my mom still likes some new stuff.


Definitely.  Women are more "trendy" than men. 

You know what's funny too?  I've heard older Gen Xers, born in like 1963-1975ish territory say they like some of today's music, or at least tolerate it before.

You know, I was also thinking about this, but do you think women are slightly more accepting/liking of pop culture more than men are? I know I got (slightly) nostalgic by age 12 and felt old by age 19 on many things.

Also, my dad pretty much doesn't like anything at all after the late '80s, whereas my mom still likes some new stuff.


Yea I think so too, my dad really could care less about pop culture. He's too worried about his retirement, bad back, job to care about pop culture. Though he knows a lot of the current music because of me, lol. He knows "Grillz", "My Humps", "Hollaback Girl", lol.

Definitely.  Women are more "trendy" than men. 

You know what's funny too?  I've heard older Gen Xers, born in like 1963-1975ish territory say they like some of today's music, or at least tolerate it before.


They do, my sister born in 1972 is actually very into today's stuff. Her husband though isn't. So that tells you a lot there.

They do, my sister born in 1972 is actually very into today's stuff. Her husband though isn't. So that tells you a lot there.


You know why?

Because I think a "cultural" generation is actually a half of a biological one.  In a way, Gen X and Y are one biological gen, and the Silents and Boomers are also a one-ness.

Yeah, my dad honestly could've cared less about music since the 1960s, while my mom was keeping up ith new music slightly and watching MTV through the late '90s. Some Gen Xers have definitely gotten into the new "indie rock" or "indie emo" stuff like The Decembrists, since their original scene is so over, the Pixies/Liz Phair/Nirvana scene.

Donnie, you hit it right on the head!

They do, my sister born in 1972 is actually very into today's stuff. Her husband though isn't. So that tells you a lot there.


You know how, if you're wearing a horribly out of date outfit, you're much more likely to have a female friend tell you, "Like, ohmigod, that's so five years ago!" than a guy. ;D

I think that same sense of "current-ness" stays with them, so they're more willing to change with the times. Possibly (and I admit, this is really stretching it) it has to do with more women pay attention/care about their "look" than guys do. Part of music is fashion-oriented, so that makes sense.

Of course it all depends on the person, though.

You know how, if you're wearing a horribly out of date outfit, you're much more likely to have a female friend tell you, "Like, ohmigod, that's so five years ago!" than a guy. ;D

I think that same sense of "current-ness" stays with them, so they're more willing to change with the times. Possibly (and I admit, this is really stretching it) it has to do with more women pay attention/care about their "look" than guys do. Part of music is fashion-oriented, so that makes sense.

Of course it all depends on the person, though.


My sister is very hip, always likes nice expensive clothes, she likes to party. She listens to the top 40 station, while her husband listens to rock of course. And she loves reality tv, that's like all she watches.

You know how, if you're wearing a horribly out of date outfit, you're much more likely to have a female friend tell you, "Like, ohmigod, that's so five years ago!" than a guy. ;D

I think that same sense of "current-ness" stays with them, so they're more willing to change with the times. Possibly (and I admit, this is really stretching it) it has to do with more women pay attention/care about their "look" than guys do. Part of music is fashion-oriented, so that makes sense.

Of course it all depends on the person, though.


I think so too.  Not to sound sexist, but women tend to care about their "image" more than men, both of their body and personality.  But, as the sexes become more and more alike this is changing.

I think so too.  Not to sound sexist, but women tend to care about their "image" more than men, both of their body and personality.  But, as the sexes become more and more alike this is changing.


This is true...but the media would like you to believe metrosexuality is more common than it actually is. It's mostly confined to urban areas...and men over 30 in NY/NJ have always cared about their image, if in weird, perverse ways  ;).

I've been retro for the 90's for about a year now and I miss the 90's so much. I've even created a movie triology about the 90's based on Back to the Future. My friend from 2004 is sent 10 years into the past to the year 1994. If anyone wants to read the scripts, let me know.

I've been retro for the 90's for about a year now and I miss the 90's so much. I've even created a movie triology about the 90's based on Back to the Future. My friend from 2004 is sent 10 years into the past to the year 1994. If anyone wants to read the scripts, let me know.


Sure!  I'd love to!

Yeah ... 9/11 kind of set the mood.  2002, for instance, in some ways feel closer to 2006 than to spring of 2001.

As for 1994/95ers, maybe there's kind of a gap in the very middle of the '90s. 1994ers seem quite Y to me, but 1995 I'm not totally sure of.  They probably are Y too, since like Brian said they will be able to remember now just fine, but they will definitely share things in common with Z considerably more than even a '92er or '93er would.

Because really, a 1992er is just like a younger version of a 1987 baby in many ways.


I am of the opinion the "core" of Generation Y are those born 1985-1995. I think that those born 1980-1984 are technically Y, but they still have some X in them. Its a cusp. Those born 1996-1997 I'd consider to be the cusp between Y and Z. I'd say that those born in 1998 or later are definitely Z, because they aren't really able to remember when 9/11 happened. I'd say that if you were 4 or 5, you most likely remember it. And if you were 6 or older you definitely remember it. So I'd say anyone who was 6 or older at the time is a true Gen Yer. 9/11 is what I consider the "generation-defining event" for us.

To be more clear though, I'd say if you were 6 up through 16 years old when 9/11 happened, you are true Y. If you were 17-21, you're on the cusp between Y and X. If you were 4 or 5 you are on the cusp between Y and Z.

I am of the opinion the "core" of Generation Y are those born 1985-1995. I think that those born 1980-1984 are technically Y, but they still have some X in them. Its a cusp. Those born 1996-1997 I'd consider to be the cusp between Y and Z. I'd say that those born in 1998 or later are definitely Z, because they aren't really able to remember when 9/11 happened. I'd say that if you were 4 or 5, you most likely remember it. And if you were 6 or older you definitely remember it. So I'd say anyone who was 6 or older at the time is a true Gen Yer. 9/11 is what I consider the "generation-defining event" for us.


That makes sense.

So would you say the most typical, Emo kid/Myspacer is a 1990 or 1991er, or would you say late eighties is slightly more significant?

I think 1985-mid 1989 and late 1989-1992 are equally Y, but in slightly different ways.  The ones most into the culture are the late eighties ones, whereas the early nineties Yers have similar taste, but tend to have a higher population of "anti-Yers".  But, being anti-Y is in a way a very Gen Y sort of thing.

I am of the opinion the "core" of Generation Y are those born 1985-1995. I think that those born 1980-1984 are technically Y, but they still have some X in them. Its a cusp. Those born 1996-1997 I'd consider to be the cusp between Y and Z. I'd say that those born in 1998 or later are definitely Z, because they aren't really able to remember when 9/11 happened. I'd say that if you were 4 or 5, you most likely remember it. And if you were 6 or older you definitely remember it. So I'd say anyone who was 6 or older at the time is a true Gen Yer. 9/11 is what I consider the "generation-defining event" for us.


That's pretty accurate, I'd agree that 1998 and later is definitely gen z. I think most 1997ers will be able to barely remember 9/11 since it was such a huge event even at 4 years old they should have some memory.

I think that the late '80s group is probably the most significant. But, remember, about remembering events-lots of Generation Xers remembered the moon landing, but they're still not baby boomers. Somebody born in 1995 wouldn't be able to experience it with as much of the cultural significance as somebody born even in 1993. They would just remember it as a bad day, maybe. IMO, 1994+ is still more Gen Z than anything.

That makes sense.

So would you say the most typical, Emo kid/Myspacer is a 1990 or 1991er, or would you say late eighties is slightly more significant?

I think 1985-mid 1989 and late 1989-1992 are equally Y, but in slightly different ways.  The ones most into the culture are the late eighties ones, whereas the early nineties Yers have similar taste, but tend to have a higher population of "anti-Yers".  But, being anti-Y is in a way a very Gen Y sort of thing.


I'd say the "most Y" part are those born 1987-1992. If you are old enough to remember when the Monica Lewinksy scandal was going on, but young enough to not really remember the Gulf War, then you you're pure Echo boomer, baby lol

Most y in my opinion is around 1985-1990.

Most y in my opinion is around 1985-1990.


Yeah, I agree with that. 1991-1993 are a bit more anti-Y, by and large.

I think that the late '80s group is probably the most significant. But, remember, about remembering events-lots of Generation Xers remembered the moon landing, but they're still not baby boomers. Somebody born in 1995 wouldn't be able to experience it with as much of the cultural significance as somebody born even in 1993. They would just remember it as a bad day, maybe. IMO, 1994+ is still more Gen Z than anything.


Not too many gen xers would remember the 1969 moon landing considering the first gen x year is 1965. The boomer years are pretty much 1946-1964 everywhere I've seen.

Not too many gen xers would remember the 1969 moon landing considering the first gen x year is 1965. The boomer years are pretty much 1946-1964 everywhere I've seen.


There is a growing consensus towards 1964 being the first year culturally. A Gen Xer remembering the moon landing is like a '96er or '95er's remembrance of 9/11...it isn't exactly a major part of their existence, even if they remember it.

There is a growing consensus towards 1964 being the first year culturally. A Gen Xer remembering the moon landing is like a '96er or '95er's remembrance of 9/11...it isn't exactly a major part of their existence, even if they remember it.


I still say it's 1965 since that's what I've always seen, but we're talking 1 year so it's not worth arguing over. Thing is the 95ers and 96ers are participating in mid '00s gen y culture, they're definitely part of it. The gen y culture era will last till the end of the decade at least so those kids will have participated and loved a good deal of the '00s culture, at least mid-late '00s. They remember 9/11, and participated in a lot of the '00s gen y culture, I think that's enough to be considered gen y.

I still say it's 1965 since that's what I've always seen, but we're talking 1 year so it's not worth arguing over. Thing is the 95ers and 96ers are participating in mid '00s gen y culture, they're definitely part of it. The gen y culture era will last till the end of the decade at least so those kids will have participated and loved a good deal of the '00s culture, at least mid-late '00s. They remember 9/11, and participated in a lot of the '00s gen y culture, I think that's enough to be considered gen y.


Alot of Gen Xers participated in boomer culture in the '70s, but they're not considered baby boomers.

I still say it's 1965 since that's what I've always seen, but we're talking 1 year so it's not worth arguing over. Thing is the 95ers and 96ers are participating in mid '00s gen y culture, they're definitely part of it. The gen y culture era will last till the end of the decade at least so those kids will have participated and loved a good deal of the '00s culture, at least mid-late '00s. They remember 9/11, and participated in a lot of the '00s gen y culture, I think that's enough to be considered gen y.


Like I said, I think even the early 2010s will be Y.  Even the late 1990s were kind of transitional from X.

Alot of Gen Xers participated in boomer culture in the '70s, but they're not considered baby boomers.


Yea I know. I still don't think 11-12 years is enough for a generation, at the least gen y is around 1981-1995. We'll just agree to disagree, it's only a couple years I'm not gonna get too worked up about it, lol.  :)

Yea I know. I still don't think 11-12 years enough for a generation, at the least gen y is around 1981-1995. We'll just agree to disagree, it's only a couple years I'm not gonna get too worked up about it, lol.  :)


Yeah, of course.

Plus, a gen is really just whatever you make it out to be.  They're very blurred.

Alot of Gen Xers participated in boomer culture in the '70s, but they're not considered baby boomers.


To add to this: Lots of Gen Xers remembered Watergate and the moon landing, boomer events, but they're still not considered boomers. I think the culture of the early 2010s will be what defines the 1994+ group more. Part of the criteria for the cultural baby boomers is being defined by culture from 1960-1980, alot of what defines the Gen X group culturally (including 1964) is being defined by culture from 1981-1996 about. 1997-2010 will probably be the Y cultural defining period.

Also, I like what Donnie Darko said: a cultural gen is half a biological gen. The Gen X and Y are one, basically, as a biological generation. A cultural gen is usually only 10-15 years.

Like I said, I think even the early 2010s will be Y.  Even the late 1990s were kind of transitional from X.


Maybe 1997 was, but I think 1998 and 1999 are pure gen y.

Maybe 1997 was, but I think 1998 and 1999 are pure gen y.


Yeah, I'd agree on that.  But still, 1990-early 1997 is three-quarters of the nineties.  I think everything up to the end of the world craze in 2012 will be Y, then Z will take off in 2013 when a 2000er is 13.

Sorry if I'm getting too worked up over the generations thing. It's just a personal interest of mine, really...the fact is, only time will tell how people born in the mid-90s will define themselves, it's just pretty probable that coming of age in a different decade will define them more as Z. Also, I think people thought of Gen X's boundaries differently before they actually fully came of age, even including the early '60s culturally, especially in Canada.

Sorry if I'm getting too worked up over the generations thing. It's just a personal interest of mine, really...the fact is, only time will tell how people born in the mid-90s will define themselves, it's just pretty probable that coming of age in a different decade will define them more as Z. Also, I think people thought of Gen X's boundaries differently before they actually fully came of age, even including the early '60s culturally, especially in Canada.


Hey dude, it's fine.  I mean, you at least respect our opinion.  There's nothing wrong with refusing to conform to ours :)

Sorry if I'm getting too worked up over the generations thing. It's just a personal interest of mine, really...the fact is, only time will tell how people born in the mid-90s will define themselves, it's just pretty probable that coming of age in a different decade will define them more as Z. Also, I think people thought of Gen X's boundaries differently before they actually fully came of age, even including the early '60s culturally, especially in Canada.


You're right mid '90s born kids are still really to young to judge yet. I don't think we'll know any real definitive boundaries for gen y until probably the middle of the next decade.

You're right mid '90s born kids are still really to young to judge yet. I don't think we'll know any real definitive boundaries for gen y until probably the middle of the next decade.


Yeah, like I don't think people really knew what Gen X was exactly, or they had decided, until the mid-late '80s. I think now Gen Xers want it to be 1964 as the beginning, because those people graduated HS in 1982, which was more the start of the real '80s.

You're right mid '90s born kids are still really to young to judge yet. I don't think we'll know any real definitive boundaries for gen y until probably the middle of the next decade.


Agreed.

I mean, 1994ers sometimes seem like another generation, but when I think about it they're probably more tail-end Y than early Z.  But who knows, velvetoneo's opinion is as valid as mine or yours is.

Agreed.

I mean, 1994ers sometimes seem like another generation, but when I think about it they're probably more tail-end Y than early Z.  But who knows, velvetoneo's opinion is as valid as mine or yours is.


Probably they're more of an in-between group. That's something we all can agree on  :) .

Probably they're more of an in-between group. That's something we all can agree on  :) .


Yes :)

I call them the Echo Busters.  1993/'94 to 2001 is their approximate span. 

Probably they're more of an in-between group. That's something we all can agree on  :) .


Yea I'd agree.

I think of 1964-1969 as the baby busters, the transitional group of Gen Xers who were old enough to remember at least some pivotal '60s and '70s events but felt left out of them and like a separate generation from the baby boomers.

I think of 1964-1969 as the baby busters, the transitional group of Gen Xers who were old enough to remember at least some pivotal '60s and '70s events but felt left out of them and like a separate generation from the baby boomers.


I think of that as more 1958-1969, because those born in '58 and onwards were still pretty young in the '80s and even relatively young in the nineties.

I think of that as more 1958-1969, because those born in '58 and onwards were still pretty young in the '80s and even relatively young in the nineties.


Maybe, but there's something about the sixties that sort of defines people if they remember them at all. Like my parents were far more defined by the '60s than the '70s, though they are teens of the '70s. I would say the average age for a parent of a child in my grade is about '58, they're still more boomers who don't feel the sense of alienation experienced by those starting in 1964.

Maybe, but there's something about the sixties that sort of defines people if they remember them at all. Like my parents were far more defined by the '60s than the '70s, though they are teens of the '70s. I would say the average age for a parent of a child in my grade is about '58, they're still more boomers who don't feel the sense of alienation experienced by those starting in 1964.


Yeah, that's true.  I mean a '63er won't see the sixties as before their time, but a '64er would.

Yeah, that's the logic for the '63-'64 split. I think a good logical reason for a '93-'94 split of some sort is that a '93er would probably not see the 1990s and the 20th century as that much before their time, but a '94er probably would, even if they remember 1999.

Probably they're more of an in-between group. That's something we all can agree on  :) .


If we're talking about transitional spans, would you agree on the following:

1941-45: Baby Boomer/Silent cusp. They would've still been under 30 up till 1971 (the last really "60s" year) and probably enjoy some BB things from the '60s and '70s. Possibly even some earlier '80s.

1958-66: Boomer/Gen X Cusp. Too young to be teens in the '60s, though way old enough to remember them. Definitely young enough to enjoy/be a part of '80s culture, though slightly too old to be Brat Pack-types.

1978-83: Gen X/Y cusp. Remember the '80s with detail (*raises hand*) some considering it their generation (raises hand again! :D ), but were more Beavis & Butthead-generation in their earlier teen years, and had some influence of the '90s and maybe today too.

1995-01: Y/Z cusp. Old enough to vaguely remember 9/11 and Y2K, but not really an Emo kid either.

If we're talking about transitional spans, would you agree on the following:

1941-45: Baby Boomer/Silent cusp. They would've still been under 30 up till 1971 (the last really "60s" year) and probably enjoy some BB things from the '60s and '70s. Possibly even some earlier '80s.

1958-66: Boomer/Gen X Cusp. Too young to be teens in the '60s, though way old enough to remember them. Definitely young enough to enjoy/be a part of '80s culture, though slightly too old to be Brat Pack-types.

1978-83: Gen X/Y cusp. Remember the '80s with detail (*raises hand*) some considering it their generation (raises hand again! :D ), but were more Beavis & Butthead-generation in their earlier teen years, and had some influence of the '90s and maybe today too.

1995-01: Y/Z cusp. Old enough to vaguely remember 9/11 and Y2K, but not really an Emo kid either.


I totally agree :)

If we're talking about transitional spans, would you agree on the following:

1941-45: Baby Boomer/Silent cusp. They would've still been under 30 up till 1971 (the last really "60s" year) and probably enjoy some BB things from the '60s and '70s. Possibly even some earlier '80s.

1958-66: Boomer/Gen X Cusp. Too young to be teens in the '60s, though way old enough to remember them. Definitely young enough to enjoy/be a part of '80s culture, though slightly too old to be Brat Pack-types.

1978-83: Gen X/Y cusp. Remember the '80s with detail (*raises hand*) some considering it their generation (raises hand again! :D ), but were more Beavis & Butthead-generation in their earlier teen years, and had some influence of the '90s and maybe today too.

1995-01: Y/Z cusp. Old enough to vaguely remember 9/11 and Y2K, but not really an Emo kid either.


I agree with the Silent-Boomer cusp. However, I think the cusps are more:

1958-1963: Late '70s teens. Too young to really have had anything to do with the '60s for the most part, but consider them in their grasp and influenced by them and certainly "way old enough to remember them", as you put it. Older than the brat pack types but alot of them were '80s people. Not really Gen Xers culturally, identify more with baby boomers in worldview and outlook, being pretty '70s-influenced and having alot of the '60s in their grasp.

1978-1980: Came of age mostly in the mid-90s, after the peak of Gen X culture but before Gen Y culture really took off. I think of Bart Simpson and Beavis and Butthead as these. Graduated HS before Gen Y was a big deal, but after Gen X's peak. You can also include yourself, Marty McFly, in the early '80s people who identified more with the '80s, who are also sort of cuspy. This one is a bit short and could definitely go to '82 or so, but by that point more heavily leaning on the Y for most people.

1994-1996: The YZ Cusp. Too young to have been into Britney and the Backstreet Boys, old enough to remember the Y2K era and 9/11 but not enough to grasp it fully or have impacted their lives in ways they remembered at the time. No perception of pre-digitalized world, really. Still share alot of '00s culture which they might have been into as younger teens and preteens and the '00s are certainly well within their grasp, but too young to be part of '00s culture in its prime and will identify more with '09+ pop culture.

I agree with the Silent-Boomer cusp. However, I think the cusps are more:

1958-1963: Late '70s teens. Too young to really have had anything to do with the '60s for the most part, but consider them in their grasp and influenced by them and certainly "way old enough to remember them", as you put it. Older than the brat pack types but alot of them were '80s people. Not really Gen Xers culturally, identify more with baby boomers in worldview and outlook, being pretty '70s-influenced and having alot of the '60s in their grasp.

1978-1980: Came of age mostly in the mid-90s, after the peak of Gen X culture but before Gen Y culture really took off. I think of Bart Simpson and Beavis and Butthead as these. Graduated HS before Gen Y was a big deal, but after Gen X's peak. You can also include yourself, Marty McFly, in the early '80s people who identified more with the '80s, who are also sort of cuspy. This one is a bit short and could definitely go to '82 or so, but by that point more heavily leaning on the Y for most people.

1994-1996: The YZ Cusp. Too young to have been into Britney and the Backstreet Boys, old enough to remember the Y2K era and 9/11 but not enough to grasp it fully or have impacted their lives in ways they remembered at the time. No perception of pre-digitalized world, really. Still share alot of '00s culture which they might have been into as younger teens and preteens and the '00s are certainly well within their grasp, but too young to be part of '00s culture in its prime and will identify more with '09+ pop culture.


I agree with this.

Now that I think about it, there's actually a difference between what you most identify with, and what your time of influence is. Like I said, the '80s and early '90s are my "identify with" time. That's home to me.

On the other hand, I was influenced heavily enough by 1995+ and even today in a sense (i.e. I still want to be somewhat cool) even if it's not what I'd call "my" time as much.

It's alot like how someone born in 1944 or 45, particularly a younger-minded one (take Bill Clinton for example) could dig some '80s music, but wouldn't dream of picking it to listen to over the early Beatles, ya know?

I agree with this.

Now that I think about it, there's actually a difference between what you most identify with, and what your time of influence is. Like I said, the '80s and early '90s are my "identify with" time. That's home to me.

On the other hand, I was influenced heavily enough by 1995+ and even today in a sense (i.e. I still want to be somewhat cool) even if it's not what I'd call "my" time as much.

It's alot like how someone born in 1944 or 45, particularly a younger-minded one (take Bill Clinton for example) could dig some '80s music, but wouldn't dream of picking it to listen to over the early Beatles, ya know?


Yeah, I'd agree about the 1994-1996 thing. IMO, they're Gen Y, but cross into Z alot more easily, you know?  For instance, a 1990er or even a 1992er is probably more like an 1970er than a 2000er in many ways, but a 1994er would be a lot more like the 2000er, while still sort of being a "little 1988er", if that makes sense.  From 1994 on, you could safely say that they were "born under a computer", at least if they're from a western country.

I agree with this.

Now that I think about it, there's actually a difference between what you most identify with, and what your time of influence is. Like I said, the '80s and early '90s are my "identify with" time. That's home to me.

On the other hand, I was influenced heavily enough by 1995+ and even today in a sense (i.e. I still want to be somewhat cool) even if it's not what I'd call "my" time as much.

It's alot like how someone born in 1944 or 45, particularly a younger-minded one (take Bill Clinton for example) could dig some '80s music, but wouldn't dream of picking it to listen to over the early Beatles, ya know?


Yeah, that is totally true. I identify most with 1965-1995 pop culture, heavily with the time between the mid '70s and early '90s, and yet I'm influenced only by the mid-'90s plus time period. That's like my parents, I suppose. They're both born in 1955, and like some '80s music like Madonna, The Bangles, Joan Jett, Dexy's Midnight Runners, Boy George, The Talking Heads, The Clash, etc. and even like Nirvana, Tori Amos, and Liz Phair a bit. But they would still never choose that stuff over the  Beatles, the Rolling Stones, and Motown.

Yeah, I'd agree about the 1994-1996 thing. IMO, they're Gen Y, but cross into Z alot more easily, you know?  For instance, a 1990er or even a 1992er is probably more like an 1970er than a 2000er in many ways, but a 1994er would be a lot more like the 2000er, while still sort of being a "little 1988er", if that makes sense.  From 1994 on, you could safely say that they were "born under a computer", at least if they're from a western country.


I'd say 1998 is when the Internet became fairly reliable and "near household/essential". By 2000 or early '01, it was all the way there. So anyone who, say, was under 6 in 2000 would pretty much always remember the 'Net. That would make it roughly a 1994/95er.

However, I think partly because pop culture/music slowed down noticeably after 1999, that's why a 10 year old in 2004 won't really have tastes THAT different from their big sister who was a 10 year old in 1997 when Hanson and the Spice Girls broke out.

I'd say 1998 is when the Internet became fairly reliable and "near household/essential". By 2000 or early '01, it was all the way there. So anyone who, say, was under 6 in 2000 would pretty much always remember the 'Net. That would make it roughly a 1994/95er.

However, I think partly because pop culture/music slowed down noticeably after 1999, that's why a 10 year old in 2004 won't really have tastes THAT different from their big sister who was a 10 year old in 1997 when Hanson and the Spice Girls broke out.


What would the tastes of most ten year old bratpackers have been, out of curiosity, in say 1978?

I'd say 1998 is when the Internet became fairly reliable and "near household/essential". By 2000 or early '01, it was all the way there. So anyone who, say, was under 6 in 2000 would pretty much always remember the 'Net. That would make it roughly a 1994/95er.

However, I think partly because pop culture/music slowed down noticeably after 1999, that's why a 10 year old in 2004 won't really have tastes THAT different from their big sister who was a 10 year old in 1997 when Hanson and the Spice Girls broke out.


I think I'd agree on 1998, the internet had reached the essential point by then. When I first went online back in late 1995, the internet was pretty simple and there really wasn't a lot of webpages yet, I had a provider called eworld, they were run by apple, they were actually an online service like AOL. Most of the content in 1995 and 1996, you would actually get from an online service like this instead of the true world wide web, though you did of course have access to the web as well.

What would the tastes of most ten year old bratpackers have been, out of curiosity, in say 1978?


Good point. I've thought about this too. A 1968er is way old enough to like the '70s, but it seems many of them dissed the hell out of that era, almost to wanting to believe it never existed (maybe not today, but as a 16 year old in 1984 they sure would have!).

The same Brat Packers who'd like new wave, Journey, Phil Collins and Bon Jovi as teens probably liked, say The Rolling Stones' "Miss You", or Kiss songs. Perhaps on the pop side, a few disco songs. Blondie perhaps? "Car Wash"?

Good point. I've thought about this too. A 1968er is way old enough to like the '70s, but it seems many of them dissed the hell out of that era, almost to wanting to believe it never existed (maybe not today, but as a 16 year old in 1984 they sure would have!).

The same Brat Packers who'd like new wave, Journey, Phil Collins and Bon Jovi as teens probably liked, say The Rolling Stones' "Miss You", or Kiss songs. Perhaps on the pop side, a few disco songs. Blondie perhaps? "Car Wash"?


Maybe Van Halen, ELO. I think this is what's equivalent to what might happen with people born in say 1995 with the pre-'09 culture, they will have liked say Good Charlotte and Saves the Day but wouldn't admit to it and might diss the hell out of the whole era by the early '00s.

Maybe Van Halen, ELO. I think this is what's equivalent to what might happen with people born in say 1995 with the pre-'09 culture, they will have liked say Good Charlotte and Saves the Day but wouldn't admit to it and might diss the hell out of the whole era by the early '00s.


Oh yeah, definitely Van Halen. Them, as well as the Cars, Foreigner and Journey were other bands who started in the '70s but worked their way into the '80s seemlessly (while keeping their overall sound intact).

I think alot of 1993 and '94 kids probably liked Britney Spears and NSync in 1999 but wouldn't admit it now.

Oh yeah, definitely Van Halen. Them, as well as the Cars, Foreigner and Journey were other bands who started in the '70s but worked their way into the '80s seemlessly (while keeping their overall sound intact).

I think alot of 1993 and '94 kids probably liked Britney Spears and NSync in 1999 but wouldn't admit it now.


I think that stands for most people born from about 1987+, they wouldn't admit it or are vaguely ashamed of their former musical tastes. Mid-80s people who were into them aren't really ashamed of it, the ones who were were teenagers. But I do think what the '94-'96ers will be like is rejecting or not admitting they liked emo and crunk rap in the 2010s, while most people born in the early '90s will be proud of it.

I think that stands for most people born from about 1987+, they wouldn't admit it or are vaguely ashamed of their former musical tastes. Mid-80s people who were into them aren't really ashamed of it, the ones who were were teenagers. But I do think what the '94-'96ers will be like is rejecting or not admitting they liked emo and crunk rap in the 2010s, while most people born in the early '90s will be proud of it.


Yeah. Would you also say that's akin to people around my age (i.e. 1978-84 born) really liking the '80s in 1989 at age 9, but dissing it by 1994 at age 14?

Yeah. Would you also say that's akin to people around my age (i.e. 1978-84 born) really liking the '80s in 1989 at age 9, but dissing it by 1994 at age 14?


I would.

Would you say the "boyband" backlash, and a numetal one is a form of '90s backlash, even if only to the 1997-2000 part?

Yeah. Would you also say that's akin to people around my age (i.e. 1978-84 born) really liking the '80s in 1989 at age 9, but dissing it by 1994 at age 14?


Yeah, definitely. People tend to diss what they like as preteenagers by the time they turn 13 or so, or even 14. Like the emo/hipster kids in my school who used to love pop-punk like Green Day or shock rock '90s goth like Marilyn Manson and Insane Clown Posse back before 2003 or so. Weren't alot of 1982ers pretty big on grunge in middle school? I also think of 1982ers as having alot of nu metal fans, probably.

Yeah, definitely. People tend to diss what they like as preteenagers by the time they turn 13 or so, or even 14. Like the emo/hipster kids in my school who used to love pop-punk like Green Day or shock rock '90s goth like Marilyn Manson and Insane Clown Posse back before 2003 or so. Weren't alot of 1982ers pretty big on grunge in middle school? I also think of 1982ers as having alot of nu metal fans, probably.


I remember it being very mixed, which is why I was still a little "unsure" about it, even back then. In other words, out of the 12 and 13 year olds in 1994, there were some who dug "old school" Rolling Stones-ish bands, some who only seemed to like grunge, rappers. There were still some '80s fans besides myself even at that point, but it was more the "toned down" '80s (i.e. U2, Prince or Van Halen).

BTW I recall a few buddies at age 17 or 18 in 1999/2000 liking Limp Bizkit, which I found totally weird/bizarre (a typical fan of Korn and all that seems more 1984-87ish). Just in a friendly, joking way, I told them it would be silly to anyone by 2004, but they didn't seem to care.

Now it's probably just as ridiculous as Disco was in 1983. Not because of what it is, as much as it being "older". In other words, if a brand new band came out sounding exactly like the 2000-ish nu metal, kids would probably like it. But because they're no longer relevant, they're uncool.

I remember it being very mixed, which is why I was still a little "unsure" about it, even back then. In other words, out of the 12 and 13 year olds in 1994, there were some who dug "old school" Rolling Stones-ish bands, some who only seemed to like grunge, rappers. There were still some '80s fans besides myself even at that point, but it was more the "toned down" '80s (i.e. U2, Prince or Van Halen).

BTW I recall a few buddies at age 17 or 18 in 1999/2000 liking Limp Bizkit, which I found totally weird/bizarre (a typical fan of Korn and all that seems more 1984-87ish). Just in a friendly, joking way, I told them it would be silly to anyone by 2004, but they didn't seem to care.

Now it's probably just as ridiculous as Disco was in 1983. Not because of what it is, as much as it being "older". In other words, if a brand new band came out sounding exactly like the 2000-ish nu metal, kids would probably like it. But because they're no longer relevant, they're uncool.


Who were the crowd who were really into stuff like Mariah Carey and Boyz II Men? Yeah, nu metal passed pretty quickly, I think by 2002 it was pretty declasse and passe.

Who were the crowd who were really into stuff like Mariah Carey and Boyz II Men? Yeah, nu metal passed pretty quickly, I think by 2002 it was pretty declasse and passe.


That was like the '90s (circa 1991/92-95) equivalent of people who liked Lionel Richie and Journey in the '80s - the pop/slightly ballad oriented crowd. One thing I always liked about that era was, despite all the more "tough" music prevalent, there was still cheesy pop around.

That was like the '90s (circa 1991/92-95) equivalent of people who liked Lionel Richie and Journey in the '80s - the pop/slightly ballad oriented crowd. One thing I always liked about that era was, despite all the more "tough" music prevalent, there was still cheesy pop around.


I agree. For instance, Michael Bolton, Whitney Houston, etc. was huge in the nineties.  That stuff is almost oldies today.

I agree. For instance, Michael Bolton, Whitney Houston, etc. was huge in the nineties.  That stuff is almost oldies today.


"Diva" type music was big in the '90s, like cheesy ballads by people like Whitney Houston, Mariah Carey, Toni Braxton, Anita Baker, Sade, Chaka Khan, TLC's slower stuff, Celine Dion, etc. Now that stuff basically is oldies it's so passe...I'm expecting by 2009 there will be "'90s Ballad Hours" on the radio.

I agree. For instance, Michael Bolton, Whitney Houston, etc. was huge in the nineties.  That stuff is almost oldies today.


I think it's because that stuff was actually the only "80s" or at least 80s/older-influenced music that was able to survive the transition into the '90s. So it wasn't really new and hip, but still marginally cool enough to be popular, ya know?

It was less "cheesy" than hair metal, arena rock or even new wave, because ballad type music is more toned down, I'd guess. Other examples off the top of my head are Sting, Bryan Adams, the lighter side of Aerosmith, Rod Stewart and Phil Collins.

I think it's because that stuff was actually the only "80s" or at least 80s/older-influenced music that was able to survive the transition into the '90s. So it wasn't really new and hip, but still marginally cool enough to be popular, ya know?

It was less "cheesy" than hair metal, arena rock or even new wave, because ballad type music is more toned down, I'd guess. Other examples off the top of my head are Sting, Bryan Adams, the lighter side of Aerosmith, Rod Stewart and Phil Collins.


Yeah, I see what you mean.

You know what's funny?  The genres that are considered the most "nineties"; i.e. grunge, teen pop, gangsta rap, etc. are the ones that survive the most today.  The only real "nineties" genre that's considered really cheesy today and that did die for the most part around 2000 is the early nineties dance stuff, which I guess is kinda 1989ish so maybe it died because people see it as an "eighties" thing.

Yeah, I see what you mean.

You know what's funny?  The genres that are considered the most "nineties"; i.e. grunge, teen pop, gangsta rap, etc. are the ones that survive the most today.   The only real "nineties" genre that's considered really cheesy today and that did die for the most part around 2000 is the early nineties dance stuff, which I guess is kinda 1989ish so maybe it died because people see it as an "eighties" thing.


Yeah, even if those "main genres" have died (as well as the bands who made them popular in the first place), their overall sound/influence is still very much around. Nu metal and post grunge is almost more grungy than Nirvana and Soundgarden.

Do you mean stuff like "Unbelievable" by EMF? Yeah, that's 1989/90ish more than true '90s, even if at the time it seemed very cutting edge. Kinda like how Blondie's "Call Me" or Queen's "Another one Bites the Dust" sounded pretty hip and "80s" for 1980 and '81, though they were still actually a bit '70s compared to what would follow by, say 1984.

Do you mean stuff like "Unbelievable" by EMF? Yeah, that's 1989/90ish more than true '90s, even if at the time it seemed very cutting edge. Kinda like how Blondie's "Call Me" or Queen's "Another one Bites the Dust" sounded pretty hip and "80s" for 1980 and '81, though they were still actually a bit '70s compared to what would follow by, say 1984.



Yeah, exactly.  An even better example would be C&C Music Factory.  Both are kind of nineties, but sort of became "eighties" as the real nineties happened in 1992, if you know what I mean.  Sort of like G&R were very "1990ish" and cutting edge at the time, but became "eighties" when the real nineties roared in.

Yeah, exactly.  An even better example would be C&C Music Factory.  Both are kind of nineties, but sort of became "eighties" as the real nineties happened in 1992, if you know what I mean.  Sort of like G&R were very "1990ish" and cutting edge at the time, but became "eighties" when the real nineties roared in.


I think without grunge having hit in late 1991, G&R and their harder metal sound would've become the big sound of the '90s, and that sort of dance music would've stayed popular, like Jody Wattley. Another comparison you could make, this one to the '00s is The White Stripes, they sounded very cutting-edge a few years back around 2001/2002, but by 2004 were not exactly a big deal anymore. They're more "2001ish", really. Or Jennifer Lopez, at the time I think she was sort of cutting-edge, but emo and crunk rap cut into the popularity of that type of '90s dance pop. Now she's "2000ish." Techno is another '90s music trend that's dead now, and rave.

Can the same thing be said for numetal for this decade?

Can the same thing be said for numetal for this decade?


I think numetal is from primarily the 1998-2004 period.  It's more a '90s/'00s fringe genre IMO.

I think numetal is from primarily the 1998-2004 period.  It's more a '90s/'00s fringe genre IMO.



It's peak IMO was from 1998-2001 because Korn,Linkin Park,Limp Bizkit,Papa Roach,P.O.D,etc. all had huge hits during that peroid. It was still huge after '01 but I think it's been coutinually dying down since then.

There is nothing worth noting.  Why be nostalgic for the most uncreative decade?  (sorry, class of '95.)

There is nothing worth noting.  Why be nostalgic for the most uncreative decade?  (sorry, class of '95.)


The '00s are less creative.  At least the '90s weren't a carbon copy of the previous decade  ;D

The '90s was the '70s without the gratuitous sex, and instead of Nixon we had Clinton getting a blowjob. The '00s is the '80s as it would've happened after the '90s with no fun other than golden tooth appliques and no originality.

There is nothing worth noting.  Why be nostalgic for the most uncreative decade?  (sorry, class of '95.)



The 90's was a good decade but so are the 2000's. No decade is without its flaws but I think overall there's alot to be nostalgic about with the 90's(but those were my childhood years so I'm biased)

i think will is just my opinion is that the 00's arent that good and really different from the 90's beacuase 911 happend , we got a lame president, we go to war, death probably this is a dark decade compared to all of the decades we lived in and probably we see the 90's as a colorful, bright new, fresh, hip,peaceful decade , but again thats just my opinion

i think will is just my opinion is that the 00's arent that good and really different from the 90's beacuase 911 happend , we got a lame president, we go to war, death probably this is a dark decade compared to all of the decades we lived in and probably we see the 90's as a colorful, bright new, fresh, hip,peaceful decade , but again thats just my opinion



No doubt the 90's are better than this decade but I think the 00's are a bit better than people give them credit for.

Maybe the '00s are a bit better than I give them credit for-Madonna came out with her first decent song in over five years, but it was only one song. The movies are decent and I like all the special edition DVDs alot, though some of them don't try hard enough.

Maybe the '00s are a bit better than I give them credit for-Madonna came out with her first decent song in over five years, but it was only one song. The movies are decent and I like all the special edition DVDs alot, though some of them don't try hard enough.



Yeah, dont get me wrong I dont think this decade is the best thing since sliced bread or anything like that but there have been some great stuff out there in the past 6 years.

The '00s are less creative.  At least the '90s weren't a carbon copy of the previous decade  ;D


True- point taken/

Yeah, dont get me wrong I dont think this decade is the best thing since sliced bread or anything like that but there have been some great stuff out there in the past 6 years.


The movies have by and large been pretty high quality, except really colorful "gay" cinema hasn't been there as much. There've been some great books. I think the main thing lacking is music...and the TV has largely been meh with the exceptions of Six Feet Under and a few other shows that are amazing guilty pleasures like Desperate Housewives and Boston Public.

The movies have by and large been pretty high quality, except really colorful "gay" cinema hasn't been there as much. There've been some great books. I think the main thing lacking is music...and the TV has largely been meh with the exceptions of Six Feet Under and a few other shows that are amazing guilty pleasures like Desperate Housewives and Boston Public.



Yeah the t.v of this decade has been pretty horrible especially network t.v which is the reason I dont watch much of it. As far as music goes some of it is really bad(Grillz anyone ;D) but I think that the main flaw of this decade's music is it's unoriginality. I mean does every song have to sound exactly the same?

Yeah the t.v of this decade has been pretty horrible especially network t.v which is the reason I dont watch much of it. As far as music goes some of it is really bad(Grillz anyone ;D) but I think that the main flaw of this decade's music is it's unoriginality. I mean does every song have to sound exactly the same?


The main problem with '00s music is all the 1990s genres it upholds and bastardizes.  And "Grillz", actually anything Nelly's done.  And Paul Wall, wtf?  ;D

The main problem with '00s music is all the 1990s genres it upholds and bastardizes.  And "Grillz", actually anything Nelly's done.  And Paul Wall, wtf?  ;D



OMG I cant help but laugh everytime I hear(or read) Paul Wall's name. Everytime I do the video for Grillz pops into my head and that would make anyone laugh ;D

OMG I cant help but laugh everytime I hear(or read) Paul Wall's name. Everytime I do the video for Grillz pops into my head and that would make anyone laugh ;D


;D

Paul Wall?  That's so freaking stupid.  Almost as dumb as "Grillz".  ;D

Do you remember Nelly's song "Pimp Juice" from like '02 I think?  That was almost as bad  ;D

;D

Paul Wall?  That's so freaking stupid.  Almost as dumb as "Grillz".  ;D

Do you remember Nelly's song "Pimp Juice" from like '02 I think?  That was almost as bad  ;D



Reluctantly I do remember that song. Also I know alot of people liked it but I thought "Hot in here" was pretty dumb too.

Reluctantly I do remember that song. Also I know alot of people liked it but I thought "Hot in here" was pretty dumb too.


Nelly hasn't put out a half-good decent album since his debut, Country Grammar (or is that Country Gramerrrr?  ;D)

What's up with the errr thing anyway?  Are you handicapped or something, Chingy?  ;D

Nelly hasn't put out a half-good decent album since his debut, Country Grammar (or is that Country Gramerrrr?  ;D)

What's up with the errr thing anyway?  Are you handicapped or something, Chingy?  ;D



Dont even get me started on Chingy. What is it with all rappers in general. I wish I had a dollar for everytime I saw the title of a rap song spelled wrong. I'd be a millionaire ;D

Dont even get me started on Chingy. What is it with all rappers in general. I wish I had a dollar for everytime I saw the title of a rap song spelled wrong. I'd be a millionaire ;D


You know, my music kind of hip hop-ish (although not your garden-variety MTV crap) and I like some underground and old school, but I'm realizing how much rap in general sucks.  I like melody! 

Although I still adore the Beastie Boys.

Dont even get me started on Chingy. What is it with all rappers in general. I wish I had a dollar for everytime I saw the title of a rap song spelled wrong. I'd be a millionaire ;D


I guess they do it because they think it makes the song look more hip and cooler, lol.

I guess they do it because they think it makes the song look more hip and cooler, lol.


Deliberate illiteracy is exotic to the suburban white preppies that are the target audience of glam rap.

Yep, the main flaw of this decade is its unoriginality...it is a combination of revived '80s influences and "feelings" without capturing what made the '80s special grafted onto a tired '90s base. Every commercial emo and most indie rock songs sound exactly the same, every A/C rock song like "Since U Been Gone" and "How You Remind Me" sounds exactly the same, and nearly every glam rap song sounds exactly the same and says exactly the same thing.

You know, my music kind of hip hop-ish (although not your garden-variety MTV crap) and I like some underground and old school, but I'm realizing how much rap in general sucks.  I like melody! 

Although I still adore the Beastie Boys.



I dont mind rap as a genre. I just dont like the people out there in mainstream rap today.btw the Beastie Boys are the coolest 8)

I dont mind rap as a genre. I just dont like the people out there in mainstream rap today.btw the Beastie Boys are the coolest 8)


True hip hop lives on in the underground.  But of course, they don't really seem to want to supplant the current glam guys  :(

True hip hop lives on in the underground.  But of course, they don't really seem to want to supplant the current glam guys  :(



Just like grunge flourished in the underground under hair metal for years so is underground rap under glam rap these days. But just like before people will eventually get tired of current rap and "alternative" rap will overtake glam rap.

Just like grunge flourished in the underground under hair metal for years so is underground rap under glam rap these days. But just like before people will eventually get tired of current rap and "alternative" rap will overtake glam rap.


I agree.

I also think the "alternative hip hop" boom of the 2010s will be an exact echo of what happened to rock in the '90s.  By 2020, all hip hop will be "alternative" and gangsta will be a thing of the past, only occasionally revived by some daring souls  ;D  Rock will again be King.

I agree.

I also think the "alternative hip hop" boom of the 2010s will be an exact echo of what happened to rock in the '90s.  By 2020, all hip hop will be "alternative" and gangsta will be a thing of the past, only occasionally revived by some daring souls  ;D  Rock will again be King.



But do you think that alternative hip-hop will eventually become like alternative rock is today? You know repetitive and lacking what made it alternative in the first place.

But do you think that alternative hip-hop will eventually become like alternative rock is today? You know repetitive and lacking what made it alternative in the first place.


Probably  ;D

Probably  ;D



Yeah that's what happens when the mainstream gets a hold of something. They squeeze every last dollar out of it until it comes repetive and stale then repeat the process ;D

Yeah that's what happens when the mainstream gets a hold of something. They squeeze every last dollar out of it until it comes repetive and stale then repeat the process ;D


Yup.  Follow the money.  ;D

I'm just wondering what sort of rock will be popular in the 2010s, I'm thinking either more guitar-heavy or folk-heavy '60s-influenced alternative as opposed to emo or some new, dark, hard classic-rock influenced genre.

I'm just wondering what sort of rock will be popular in the 2010s, I'm thinking either more guitar-heavy or folk-heavy '60s-influenced alternative as opposed to emo or some new, dark, hard classic-rock influenced genre.


I'm thinking White-Stripes type stuff.  The Emo stuff is too laughable and whiny to last too much longer.

I'm just wondering what sort of rock will be popular in the 2010s, I'm thinking either more guitar-heavy or folk-heavy '60s-influenced alternative as opposed to emo or some new, dark, hard classic-rock influenced genre.



Yeah I wouln't really be surprised to see a 60's or maybe even 50's rock revival in the 10's.

Yeah I wouln't really be surprised to see a 60's or maybe even 50's rock revival in the 10's.


I think genuinely grassroots, unpretentious rock a la the '50s will become popular again, as you said, at least for a few years in the early '10s, as a reaction to the glam rap and emo, which are so over the top and melodramatic. Also, I think folky type stuff will come back, influenced by the PNW and West Coast indie scenes.

I think genuinely grassroots, unpretentious rock a la the '50s will become popular again, as you said, at least for a few years in the early '10s, as a reaction to the glam rap and emo, which are so over the top and melodramatic. Also, I think folky type stuff will come back, influenced by the PNW and West Coast indie scenes.



If the 00's really are following the path of the 80's then that's exactly what's gonna happen.

If the 00's really are following the path of the 80's then that's exactly what's gonna happen.


I think pop culturally it's sort of following the '80s, not as closely as the '90s followed the '70s, but still pretty close.

I wonder if they'll be a Classical musical revival...ala Clockwork Orange

People will become so tired of modern, synthesised music, they will long for the songs of long ago.

Well, I really don't see the 90's becoming a really trend until 2020! 

A long time ago a wrote a piece called the "retro lag" which pointed out that there is a 30 year lag in retro fashions. That because  teenagers actually honor the youth of their parents when they were teenagers. Here's a rough list.

1950's culture = Late 70's to Late 80's retro: Sha na na, Back to the Future, Happy Days, 50's colors and neon, 
1960's culture = Late 80's to Late 90's retro: Neo Hippies, Woodstock 2's, Dharma and Greg, Austin Powers
1970's culture = Late 90's to Late 00's? That 70's show, Classic Rock revival, 70's fashions
---future trends?
1980's culture = Late 00's to 10's?
1990's culture = Late 10's to Late 20's?

The 90s go bye bye.  i miss them  :\'(

The 90s go bye bye.  i miss them  :\'(

Me too. A lot. :\'( Hopefully, time travel will become possible very soon.

Me too. A lot. :\'( Hopefully, time travel will become possible very soon.


That's scary.

I think the '70s revival was really more the '90s than anything else. The '60s never had a real revival, they're always being revived and they're too revered. The '50s revival lasted from the mid-'70s through the late '80s.

Well, I really don't see the 90's becoming a really trend until 2020! 

A long time ago a wrote a piece called the "retro lag" which pointed out that there is a 30 year lag in retro fashions. That because  teenagers actually honor the youth of their parents when they were teenagers. Here's a rough list.

1950's culture = Late 70's to Late 80's retro: Sha na na, Back to the Future, Happy Days, 50's colors and neon,  
1960's culture = Late 80's to Late 90's retro: Neo Hippies, Woodstock 2's, Dharma and Greg, Austin Powers
1970's culture = Late 90's to Late 00's? That 70's show, Classic Rock revival, 70's fashions
---future trends?
1980's culture = Late 00's to 10's?
1990's culture = Late 10's to Late 20's?


I agree, and I've often said the same thing. Many people say it's 20 years, and they're probably right that it starts being retro then, but it's more like 25-30 years before it fully takes effect.

BTW, I think the '60s retro revival started to pick up steam around 1989. The grunge era was like 60s with some '70s thrown in. But I'd agree 1997-04 or such (with alot of holdovers today) is the height of '70s revival.

I would have to slightly disagree...it's probably 20 years that it begins, but it's 20 years after something goes out of style, usually. Of course, these things vary...sometimes it's 20 years but sometimes it's more like 25 years. The peak of '70s nostalgia was about 1995-2001, but the whole '90s was full of '70s references and nostalgia. The '60s revival peaked in the late '80s and early '90s, though the early-mid '80s was full of late '50s and early '60s influences. The '50s revival lasted from the mid-70s through the late-80s. The '80s revival really started in 2002 with the popularization of indie and emo and I Love The '80s, but it's still gaining steam today, with increasingly '80s-inspired fashions, primetime soaps, and a similar excessively materialistic feel. Of course, everything like this varies. I see the early '90s starting to become popular around 2011 or 2012 for nostalgia, with the early days of hip-hop before gangsta rap and grunge and pre-hipster alt rock being the focus.

Maybe it's more that the underground picks up something beforehand, about 20 years afterwards, and the rest don't catch on until about 25 years later.

I wonder if there will be another '80s nostalgia movie anytime soon.  The Wedding Singer came out in 1998, which is as close to 1990 as it is to now.


We had The Squid and the Whale, and Not Another Teen Movie parodied alot of '80s John Hughes teen movies.

^True.

Isn't it weird how '80s nostalgia as half as old as the actual eighties?

^True.

Isn't it weird how '80s nostalgia as half as old as the actual eighties?


Yes, it is. I know at the time The Wedding Singer was seen as premature '80s nostalgia.

Yes, it is. I know at the time The Wedding Singer was seen as premature '80s nostalgia.


Yeah.  I mean, 1985 was only 13 years ago in 1998.  Old to me, yes, but most people probably saw them as almost yesterday.  That would be like nostalgizing about 1993 right now.

Yeah.  I mean, 1985 was only 13 years ago in 1998.  Old to me, yes, but most people probably saw them as almost yesterday.  That would be like nostalgizing about 1993 right now.


I think '90s nostalgia will probably really start to pick up speed in 2011 or 2012 or so, but it'll be around in the underground from about 2008. By '90s nostalgia, I mean early-mid '90s nostalgia, not teen pop and Ricky Martin late '90s nostalgia.

I think '90s nostalgia will probably really start to pick up speed in 2011 or 2012 or so, but it'll be around in the underground from about 2008. By '90s nostalgia, I mean early-mid '90s nostalgia, not teen pop and Ricky Martin late '90s nostalgia.


Certain facets of 1997-1999 will be included, but yeah it will focus on late 1989-early 1997 I think.

Certain facets of 1997-1999 will be included, but yeah it will focus on late 1989-early 1997 I think.


I think it might really start up when The Simpsons is cancelled after the movie comes out, in 2008 or 2009...

^I agree.

I wonder, is the Simpsons part of the reason certain aspects of the '90s refuse to leave us?

^I agree.

I wonder, is the Simpsons part of the reason certain aspects of the '90s refuse to leave us?


Probably, it is. But I think this year less and less of the '90s seems to be there already. Friends and Will and Grace have been cancelled or are on their way to being cancelled, Mariah Carey disappeared and then had a comeback, TLC and En Vogue aren't big anymore, Destiny's Child split, and the only teen pop star left standing is Britney Spears.

Also, bands like Weezer, Beck, and Radiohead have remained big.

Probably, it is. But I think this year less and less of the '90s seems to be there already. Friends and Will and Grace have been cancelled or are on their way to being cancelled, Mariah Carey disappeared and then had a comeback, TLC and En Vogue aren't big anymore, Destiny's Child split, and the only teen pop star left standing is Britney Spears.

Also, bands like Weezer, Beck, and Radiohead have remained big.


I wonder if Weezer, Beck, Green Day, etc. are actually more '00s things that simply emerged in the '90s.

Okay, maybe not Beck.  Beck is freakin' Mr. Nineties.

I wonder if Weezer, Beck, Green Day, etc. are actually more '00s things that simply emerged in the '90s.

Okay, maybe not Beck.  Beck is freakin' Mr. Nineties.


Green Day was very '90s but became very '00s in 2004 or 2005 or so, though they were precursors to the '00s all along. Weezer was sort of proto-'00s hipster, post-grunge and after hipster music largely stopped being decent.

Probably, it is. But I think this year less and less of the '90s seems to be there already. Friends and Will and Grace have been cancelled or are on their way to being cancelled, Mariah Carey disappeared and then had a comeback, TLC and En Vogue aren't big anymore, Destiny's Child split, and the only teen pop star left standing is Britney Spears.

Also, bands like Weezer, Beck, and Radiohead have remained big.


I agree. Alot of 90's holdovers are starting to fade out in 2006. It wont be much longer and I think the "nineties" will finally be over ;D

Yeah, even 1999 was alright.  But since a lot of '00s trends started then, it's not quite as good as 1997 and '98 and of course anything prior to that.


Yeah, I've become alot softer on the late '90s since emo and glam rap started up. Alot of late '90s trends were fluffy, but at least they were fun-no "Ms. New Booty."

About the whole nostalgia curve thing...

I think it's about approximately 20 years before something becomes approachable again, but nostalgia usually peaks at 25 and then is down by 30 to becoming outre for the next nostalgia. Also, nostalgia doesn't always mean direct reuse, it can mean heavy, pervasive influences on what is popular in culture. For example, I think '50s nostalgia  started in 1974 or so with Happy Days and Grease, and peaked in the early-mid '80s with rockabilly music, Bruce Springsteen, leather jackets, hair ribbons and poofy skirts, and survived in sort of an after-fashion into the late '80s. There was alot more '60s nostalgia in Britain that peaked in the late '80s with twee pop, etc., but the futuristic look of early-mid '60s fashion and interior design and surfer/beach stuff, pastels, electronica, etc., the 3-4 minute pop song of the '60s came back in during the early-mid '80s. There was also alot of direct '60s reappropriation from about 1987-2002 or so.

'70s nostalgia was really big and started at about 1992 or so, I think...the Philadelphia soul influences of Boyz II Men were one sign of it, the revival of classic rock and punk rock/early heavy metal sounds with grunge, the more lo-fi guitar sounds of alt rock, singer-songwriters, techno and rave (compare to disco), bellbottoms, movies and TV about the '70s, etc., really peaked in 1997 or 1998. Also, '70s sitcoms went into heavy rerun. '60s nostalgia probably had wound out by the mid '90s to its end.

'80s nostalgia and a general "'80s" feel, with the excessive vacuosity and materialism, were drafted onto the pop culture of the '90s to create an '80s feel. Also, '00s alt rock, "emo", and indie, and the whole style, borrows like everything from the '80s. There's the depopularization of the sitcom and a repopularization of corn and primetime soaps, etc. The sort of Paris Hilton-type "big money" thing came back in, big hair, excessive makeup, and increasingly '80s styled influences in fashion also came back in (look at the current collections, they look very late '80s.) Also, nostalgia in movies and for the John Hughes teen movies has come back, and there's been more overall interest in the '80s, especially among "hip" types. Alot of the influences are subtle and selective, but they're definitely there. Also, '80s electronica and twee pop are major alt rock influences now. It's more than just hoop earrings. '80s nostalgia will probably really peak around 2007, and be pretty much dead by 2012. I'm guessing '90s nostalgia will peak in the early-mid '10s, and be pretty big because it's such a well-liked decade as a whole, though it'll be more for the early-mid '90s. Also, the '00s will fall even harder than the '80s, most likely.

I'm bumping this so people can see my last post  ;) .

Yeah, decade nostalgia peaks about 17 years after the end of a decade. Basically, people glorify the decade that belongs to the current "young adults" - that is more or less 25 to 45 years of age.

I think when the core teens of a decade turn 35 or so is when real nostalgia starts. Like '70s nostalgia started in the '90s when all the '70s teens turned 35, etc. When say a 1977er turns 35 in 2012 there will start to be alot of '90s nostalgia, though as I've said, I think Gen Z will be leading on that.

Yeah, decade nostalgia peaks about 17 years after the end of a decade. Basically, people glorify the decade that belongs to the current "young adults" - that is more or less 25 to 45 years of age.



I agree. So do you think that now with 1989 being 17 years ago that 2006 will be the peak year of 80's nostalgia?

I agree. So do you think that now with 1989 being 17 years ago that 2006 will be the peak year of 80's nostalgia?


I think that 2006 into 2007 will be the peak of '80s influence on fashion, music, and the general zeitgeist, and probably '80s music and movies will become even more popular.

I agree. So do you think that now with 1989 being 17 years ago that 2006 will be the peak year of 80's nostalgia?


Yeah, I'm thinking 2006-2007.  Although it's sad to think of '80s nostalgia declining already :(

Yeah, I'm thinking 2006-2007.  Although it's sad to think of '80s nostalgia declining already :(



Yeah that is sad. It's weird to think that in just 4 years in the 2010's the 80's will be 30 years ago and they'll be viewed the same way the 70's are now.

Yeah that is sad. It's weird to think that in just 4 years in the 2010's the 80's will be 30 years ago and they'll be viewed the same way the 70's are now.


They'll probably still be more than a bit closer to the 2010s, though, than the '70s were in the '90s, culturally.

Yeah that is sad. It's weird to think that in just 4 years in the 2010's the 80's will be 30 years ago and they'll be viewed the same way the 70's are now.


And for the '90s to be the nostalgia decade of choice! I'm not gonna get used to that.

I wonder if the '90s will be like the '20s and the '00s and '10s like the '30s and '40s, that is, they'll both be similar to the 1990s culturally, but overall much less happy times.  That makes sense too, since the 1920s were the first "real" 20th Century decade and the 1990s are kind of the first 21st Century decade in a way.

And for the '90s to be the nostalgia decade of choice! I'm not gonna get used to that.

I wonder if the '90s will be like the '20s and the '00s and '10s like the '30s and '40s, that is, they'll both be similar to the 1990s culturally, but overall much less happy times.  That makes sense too, since the 1920s were the first "real" 20th Century decade and the 1990s are kind of the first 21st Century decade in a way.



That makes sense if you think the 2020's will be like the 50's in some ways that the 90's,00's,and 10's would parallel the 20's,30's,and 40's in some ways.

I think the late 2020s-early 2030s will be a pretty rebellious, disruptive time, with lots of people rebelling even more against the prevailing social order/class system and tech than in the 2010s.

I think the late 2020s-early 2030s will be a pretty rebellious, disruptive time, with lots of people rebelling even more against the prevailing social order/class system and tech than in the 2010s.


"Meet the new boss/Same as the old boss." Sorry, I couldn't resist. 

I think the late 2020s-early 2030s will be a pretty rebellious, disruptive time, with lots of people rebelling even more against the prevailing social order/class system and tech than in the 2010s.



So do you think that things like the economy,terrorism,poverty will actually be worse then than they are now?

So do you think that things like the economy,terrorism,poverty will actually be worse then than they are now?


I think there'll be some tension again in the late 2020s and early 2030s, but it'll be more of a baby boomer-style youth rebellion against the prevailing Gen Y social order, led by the "Gen AA" children of Y and some Z leaders, who started it in the first place.

I think there'll be some tension again in the late 2020s and early 2030s, but it'll be more of a baby boomer-style youth rebellion against the prevailing Gen Y social order, led by the "Gen AA" children of Y and some Z leaders, who started it in the first place.



Yeah I feel the same way too. By then Gen Y will be the establishment the way Gen X will soon be. Just think in the 2030's we'll probably have our first Gen Y president :o

Yeah I feel the same way too. By then Gen Y will be the establishment the way Gen X will soon be. Just think in the 2030's we'll probably have our first Gen Y president :o


I think Gen Y fills the establishment role pretty well personality-wise, the 2010s and the 2020s will probably become liberal and Gen X dominated as boomers phase out of power. Gen X will never quite be the establishment, they just lack that quality.

I think Gen Y fills the establishment role pretty well personality-wise, the 2010s and the 2020s will probably become liberal and Gen X dominated as boomers phase out of power. Gen X will never quite be the establishment, they just lack that quality.



Yeah I think 2010's will be a very liberal decade and probably the early 2020's as well. But I see the late 2020's and 2030's as being way more conservative.

Yeah I think 2010's will be a very liberal decade and probably the early 2020's as well. But I see the late 2020's and 2030's as being way more conservative.


I think most of the early part of this century will be pretty liberal...the Gen AAers, or "new boomers" (only agreeing with Strauss & Howe on this one thing  ;) will probably be EXTREMELY liberal in the late 2020s and 2030s and then become somewhat more conservative as they ascend the social order in the 2040s to dominance, taking over from aging Yers. I think the 2010s-2030s period will see a big decline in fundie stuff and extreme economic conservatism and "Reaganomics", that's really peaking right now. Generations Z and AA will probably be more liberal than X and Y on whole, or more politically active, and cause alot of societal changes in that period.

Generations Z and AA will probably be more liberal than X and Y on whole, or more politically active, and cause alot of societal changes in that period.



I think the Gen Z will be way more politically active than Gen Y and especially Gen X. Also since IMO Gen Y will be a very conservative generation as a whole then I think the next two gen's will be way more liberal as well as a way to rebel agianst the Gen Y social order.

I think the Gen Z will be way more politically active than Gen Y and especially Gen X. Also since IMO Gen Y will be a very conservative generation as a whole then I think the next two gen's will be way more liberal as well as a way to rebel agianst the Gen Y social order.


Yeah, I think they'll be pretty anti-corporate and liberal, or at least Gen AA will be in their youth. Gen X has never been politically active, they've always cared but they've never done much, IMO. Even the liberals in Gen Y tend to be conservatives at heart without empathy for the working-classes, and VERY materialistic. This is the result of the fact that all we've experienced is Reaganomics and over 15 years of conservatism since he left office.

I just wanted to bump this, so people could see whether they agree or disagree with my opinions from the last post...

Yeah, I think they'll be pretty anti-corporate and liberal, or at least Gen AA will be in their youth. Gen X has never been politically active, they've always cared but they've never done much, IMO. Even the liberals in Gen Y tend to be conservatives at heart without empathy for the working-classes, and VERY materialistic. This is the result of the fact that all we've experienced is Reaganomics and over 15 years of conservatism since he left office.



Yeah Gen Y is a very conservative very corporate generation overall also as you mentioned very materialistic. Gen X did care but also like you said never really voted or got too involved IMO. And yes most modern conservative do still model themselves after Regan all these years later. Gen Z will be much more liberal and Gen "AA" even more than them.

I have to admit, I don't have any particularly affinity to my Generation at all. I know alot of them are materialistic pr*cks, who think are all economics professors. They are all smart-arses...

Yeah Gen Y is a very conservative very corporate generation overall also as you mentioned very materialistic. Gen X did care but also like you said never really voted or got too involved IMO. And yes most modern conservative do still model themselves after Regan all these years later. Gen Z will be much more liberal and Gen "AA" even more than them.


It's like we can't make the connection between our generational materialism and what we want to change about America. Gen X has very activist beliefs but doesn't believe in the possibility of political change.

I just personally despise my own generation, for the most part...

It's like we can't make the connection between our generational materialism and what we want to change about America. Gen X has very activist beliefs but doesn't believe in the possibility of political change.

I just personally despise my own generation, for the most part...



Yeah every generation has its demons but Gen Y is full of them. Gen Yers complain about things all the time but do very little to change things. This is just a generalization of course.

Yeah every generation has its demons but Gen Y is full of them. Gen Yers complain about things all the time but do very little to change things. This is just a generalization of course.


We're just so trapped in American materialism. You're right about every generation having its demons, but we're a pretty troubled, defunct generation...I mean, the baby boom has its sense of entitlement and "me" worship (and it's very self-sure, something Gen Y is not), its fake activism and disillusionment, and its sense of always being right. They might be active in the wrong direction sometimes, but at least they're active. Gen X is haunted by its dislike of the boomers and its feelings of perpetual inadequacy, not being together, and not being able to do very much. Our apathy, emptiness, and materialism put in us from the beginning pretty much beats all.

We're just so trapped in American materialism. You're right about every generation having its demons, but we're a pretty troubled, defunct generation...I mean, the baby boom has its sense of entitlement and "me" worship (and it's very self-sure, something Gen Y is not), its fake activism and disillusionment, and its sense of always being right. They might be active in the wrong direction sometimes, but at least they're active. Gen X is haunted by its dislike of the boomers and its feelings of perpetual inadequacy, not being together, and not being able to do very much. Our apathy, emptiness, and materialism put in us from the beginning pretty much beats all.


I blame our childhood in the careless '90s for this.

I blame our childhood in the careless '90s for this.


I also blame never having seen anything real until we were teenagers and not caring because of glam rap, emo, and reality TV.

I never thought I'd be nostalgic for the 90's, but I am. I also remember hating the year 1995. It felt like a big comedown from 1994. Mainly from a wrestling standpoint. Now, I'm nostalgic for 1995! Probably the best year for mainstream music of the 90's.

What does "AA" stand for?

I also blame never having seen anything real until we were teenagers and not caring because of glam rap, emo, and reality TV.


I agree.


What does "AA" stand for?


The generation after Z, I believe.  I sure hope we don't call them that once they're born  ;D

I agree.

The generation after Z, I believe.  I sure hope we don't call them that once they're born  ;D


Maybe they'll be the new boomers. Or the Alcoholics Anonymous generation.... ;).

Me too.  ;D

Yet, it still doesn't feel much different, except for political events and outlook and like we've discussed the dominance of hip hop over culture, as opposed to simply huge influence over music.


Interesting, it seems people say this a lot now about the 2000s. Truly makes you wonder how people don’t even see the shifts in time coming until it’s already happened