Although I'm not a fan of rap I would say that it was more prevailiant because it's culture seemed to spread everywhere during the 90's. As for Rock, Nirvana wasn't the only big time group pf the 90's. I remember that Metallica was just as popular. 

Although I'm not a fan of rap I would say that it was more prevailiant because it's culture seemed to spread everywhere during the 90's. As for Rock, Nirvana wasn't the only big time group pf the 90's. I remember that Metallica was just as popular. 


Don't forget the post-Nirvana breakout of punk/alternative, a la Green Day, Smashing Pumpkins and others. That aside, rap seems to have experienced a steady growth from the late 80's/early 90's on. I remember some classmates debating the merits of 2 Live Crew and the Ghetto Boyz back in '91, an experience that no doubt reflected the growing popularity of rap among the suburban white kids. As for me, I was more of the classic rock bent at the time, so I had no dogs in that race.

Don't forget the post-Nirvana breakout of punk/alternative, a la Green Day, Smashing Pumpkins and others. That aside, rap seems to have experienced a steady growth from the late 80's/early 90's on. I remember some classmates debating the merits of 2 Live Crew and the Ghetto Boyz back in '91, an experience that no doubt reflected the growing popularity of rap among the suburban white kids. As for me, I was more of the classic rock bent at the time, so I had no dogs in that race.



Rap was huge, even in 1990, BUT it was still considered an alternative taste, while rock was totally mainstream (although "rock and roll" was dying). 

I'd say 2001-'02 is when Rap surpassed Rock, but beginning in maybe 1997, perhaps as early as 1995 is when we entered a Hip Hop culture moreso than a Rock one.
The first half of the '90s is more Rock (although still a lot of rap), the latter half is between Rock and Rap culturally.

For instance, remember those late '90s commercials where they'd say "I gotta have my pops"?  Well, even though there was actually little rap in the late '90s, it was by then that hip hop culture really became the prime youth culture, as opposed to rock and roll.  For instance, in the early '90s you still had stuff like "Wayne's World" and Beavis and Butt-head were rockers.

My view of it:
Early 90's: cruddy goofy Hip-Hop ruled.
Mid-90's: Alternative Rock ruled.
Late 90's: cruddy pop ruled.

I'm not taking a position on this topic, but I will say that "Smells Like Teen Spirit" was a top 10 hit (#6). The position you gave is for "Come As You Are."


I'm talking the Billboard Hot 100 chart, for the year end chart of 1992 it was #32.

I'm talking the Billboard Hot 100 chart, for the year end chart of 1992 it was #32.


Didn't it split with 1991 though?  I know songs split between years tend not to do well on year-ends.

Didn't it split with 1991 though?  I know songs split between years tend not to do well on year-ends.


I don't think I saw it on the '91 chart, but I'll have to look it over again. It may have. Alternative/rock doesn't usually do as well on the hot 100, it's more of a r&b/hip-hop chart really even back in the early '90s, but it is considered the main chart. Rock hasn't done too well on the hot 100 since the '80s.

Did a little research, "Smells like Teen Spirit" did peak at #6 on the Hot 100, but was #32 on the year end chart.

I don't think I saw it on the '91 chart, but I'll have to look it over again. It may have. Alternative/rock doesn't usually do as well on the hot 100, it's more of a r&b/hip-hop chart really even back in the early '90s, but it is considered the main chart. Rock hasn't done too well on the hot 100 since the '80s.


That's true, from like 1991/92 on it's more R&B/teen pop/adult contemporary/hip hop focused, but I think that has more to do with the advent of rock stations rather than a decline in the popularity of rock. During the early '90s I believe rap wasn't really understood yet as being here to stay, as big as it was/is. It also has to do with rock becoming less of a mainstream taste with the grunge and alternative movements.  Of course in the late '90s and today rock has declined in popularity but there were probably at least as many rock fans as rap fans throughout the first half of the '90s.   In the '90s rock tended to get its own stations in larger cities, and I think that's partly why it became less about partying and more grungy/alternative. It was mostly R&B, teen pop and dance in the early '90s until 1992/93 when gangsta and old school rap became mainstream.

That's true, from like 1991/92 on it's more R&B/teen pop/adult contemporary/hip hop focused, but I think that has more to do with the advent of rock stations rather than a decline in the popularity of rock. During the early '90s I believe rap wasn't really understood yet as being here to stay, as big as it was/is. It also has to do with rock becoming less of a mainstream taste with the grunge and alternative movements.  Of course in the late '90s and today rock has declined in popularity but there were probably at least as many rock fans as rap fans throughout the first half of the '90s.   In the '90s rock tended to get its own stations in larger cities, and I think that's partly why it became less about partying and more grungy/alternative. It was mostly R&B, teen pop and dance in the early '90s until 1992/93 when gangsta and old school rap became mainstream.


Yea, In the '80s and very early '90s the Hot 100 was filled with rock, it's like hip-hop takes up a lot of the chart today. It seems that way till about 1993 or so when R&B started filling up the chart, and by 1995 r&b along with some rap dominated the hot 100.

Yea, In the '80s and very early '90s the Hot 100 was filled with rock, it's like hip-hop takes up a lot of the chart today. It seems that way till about 1993 or so when R&B started filling up the chart, and by 1995 r&b along with some rap dominated the hot 100.


Yeah early '90s seemed to be more R&B, dance, and whatever was left of late '80s teen pop.  It wasn't really until "The Chronic" that rap really began to take over pop radio, and it wasn't really at full fruition until 2003.

Yeah early '90s seemed to be more R&B, dance, and whatever was left of late '80s teen pop.  It wasn't really until "The Chronic" that rap really began to take over pop radio, and it wasn't really at full fruition until 2003.


"Smells Like Teen Spirit" was probably more popular than the year-end chart shows, it may have been spilt over 2 years even if it didn't make the 1991 year-end hot 100. I was doing some looking around and "Lose Yourself" by Eminem which was extremely popular and was no. 1 for 12 weeks, but was #62 on 2002 year end, and #28 on the 2003 year end.

i listened to rap since about 1995 and onwards, i know in the late nineties all the pop and boybands etc. were popular, and in the early nineties it was all about the grunge, it was everywhere... although i should say that the rap music then and the rap music now are entirely different, the rap in the nineties was gangsta with the whole east coast / west coast thing etc. and the rap nowadays is so mainstream it is pathetic, I dont know why people even like it (they will probably look back on it in 20 years and be like "whoa, i actually liked that cruddy music?"....

i listened to rap since about 1995 and onwards, i know in the late nineties all the pop and boybands etc. were popular, and in the early nineties it was all about the grunge, it was everywhere... although i should say that the rap music then and the rap music now are entirely different, the rap in the nineties was gangsta with the whole east coast / west coast thing etc. and the rap nowadays is so mainstream it is pathetic, I dont know why people even like it (they will probably look back on it in 20 years and be like "whoa, i actually liked that cruddy music?"....


More like 5 years from now.  I think the 2000s will be one of those decades that instantly dates themself, like the '80s.

That's true, from like 1991/92 on it's more R&B/teen pop/adult contemporary/hip hop focused, but I think that has more to do with the advent of rock stations rather than a decline in the popularity of rock. During the early '90s I believe rap wasn't really understood yet as being here to stay, as big as it was/is. It also has to do with rock becoming less of a mainstream taste with the grunge and alternative movements.  Of course in the late '90s and today rock has declined in popularity but there were probably at least as many rock fans as rap fans throughout the first half of the '90s.   In the '90s rock tended to get its own stations in larger cities, and I think that's partly why it became less about partying and more grungy/alternative. It was mostly R&B, teen pop and dance in the early '90s until 1992/93 when gangsta and old school rap became mainstream.


Yeah, even though rap is synonymous with the 90's, if we looked at it circa 1991, I bet there were people thinking it was another cheesy 80's thing! Especially the Will Smith/MC Hammer type pop/rap.

Interesting. Are you saying the "big city" influence is partly what pushed alternative rock to the forefront around 1993-ish? That makes sense, because I always sensed a real "suburban" vibe about 80's arena rock. It's like teenage party music with a backdrop in a John Hughes movie, or for hanging out at the mall (although new wave seems like perfect "mall" music to me!).

In fact, the 80's themselves were very a suburban atmosphere in general, whereas in the 90's and even moreso today, there seems to be a trend back toward city life. Malls have become slightly less popular than they were in 1985.

Grunge and rap, now that you mention it, sort of have more of that "inner city" feel about them (well, grunge is more like disaffected suburban kids, but you get the idea!). Take a movie like Singles, or Reality Bites, and that seems more like an accurate snapshot of 90's rock life.

Yeah, even though rap is synonymous with the 90's, if we looked at it circa 1991, I bet there were people thinking it was another cheesy 80's thing! Especially the Will Smith/MC Hammer type pop/rap.

Interesting. Are you saying the "big city" influence is partly what pushed alternative rock to the forefront around 1993-ish? That makes sense, because I always sensed a real "suburban" vibe about 80's arena rock. It's like teenage party music with a backdrop in a John Hughes movie, or for hanging out at the mall (although new wave seems like perfect "mall" music to me!).

In fact, the 80's themselves were very a suburban atmosphere in general, whereas in the 90's and even moreso today, there seems to be a trend back toward city life. Malls have become slightly less popular than they were in 1985.

Grunge and rap, now that you mention it, sort of have more of that "inner city" feel about them (well, grunge is more like disaffected suburban kids, but you get the idea!). Take a movie like Singles, or Reality Bites, and that seems more like an accurate snapshot of 90's rock life.


Yeah, the '80s had a very "suburban" feel to them.  The '90s was kind of a mix of suburban and urban, but the '00s are a totally urban sort of atmosphere.

I don't know if the '90s are synonomous with Rap, of course rap was huge then but it's even bigger now.  Rap makes up maybe 30% of the '90s "musical credit".  Today, it's more like 60%.  The '00s are synonomous with Rap, Nu Metal, "Dirrrty pop" and Emo, the '90s are synonomous with Rap, Grunge, Alternative Rock, R&B, Boy bands/girl groups (hate to say it), Britpop, etc. 

P.S. Do you notice a '90s atmosphere?  It's hard to explain, but it's a different atmosphere than the '00s.  The '90s atmosphere seems sort of cluttered, but bleak too, whereas the '00s atmosphere seems more open and bare.  I'm talking primarily about inside houses and buildings. 

I may have a slightly different perspective on the whole rock vs. rap in the 90s discussion.

As I've stated here and elsewhere, I was a classic rock (and to a lesser extent) alternative fan in the early/mid 90s, so the insurgence of rap was foreign to me...but not to many of my peers. I began high school in 1991, and many people I knew were into Naughty By Nature and the like, which I didn't hate, but I honestly didn't "get" it. I recall a recent interview with Jack White of the White Stripes saying something similar of his formative years.

Looking back now, I realize that there are probably some parallels to be drawn between the rap revolution among white kids and the early days of rock and roll, when British guys like Mick Jagger wanted to sound like the black bluesmasters of the Mississippi Delta.  It's all about the "soul" of the music that grabs people, no matter what the genre.  :)