In my opinion. 1990 and 1991 still seemed 80s and 1992 was getting ready for the explosion. 1994 really started the 90's decline with Cobain's suicide, O.J.'s trial, and all that other crap.  1997 is when the 90s turned crappy for me.

1993, would be the year!

In my opinion. 1990 and 1991 still seemed 80s and 1992 was getting ready for the explosion. 1994 really started the 90's decline with Cobain's suicide, O.J.'s trial, and all that other crap.  1997 is when the 90s turned crappy for me.


a decline? with Green Day and Offspring breaking out, My so called life coming out, Notorious B.I.G debut? And man, the 90s turned sour for you back in 1st grade? man that must really stink for your whole growing up experience  ;D

In my opinion. 1990 and 1991 still seemed 80s and 1992 was getting ready for the explosion. 1994 really started the 90's decline with Cobain's suicide, O.J.'s trial, and all that other crap.  1997 is when the 90s turned crappy for me.


The '90s did not start to decline in 1994. The mid '90s, imo, are the best years of the '90s. 94-96 were some great years. There were some really good mid 90s songs. The late '90s weren't bad either, but the mid 90s were better.

a decline? with Green Day and Offspring breaking out, My so called life coming out, Notorious B.I.G debut? And man, the 90s turned sour for you back in 1st grade? man that must really stink for your whole growing up experience  ;D


My life didn't become bad.  The mid-90s I've always seen as a musical void.  I mean the Macarena was the biggest song!

The middle nineties were the last years that felt old school to me.

My life didn't become bad.  The mid-90s I've always seen as a musical void.  I mean the Macarena was the biggest song!

The middle nineties were the last years that felt old school to me.


There were other songs. More pop and r & b, but I kind of like that kinda stuff. Waterfalls- TLC, Creep- TLC, All I wanna do- sheryl crow, Whatta man- En vogue, Gangsta's Paradise- Coolio. 1995 was a big year for R & b.

I think the 90s culture reached a climax in '95. From the end of that year on, there was a slow decline until we reach 99 which is the year the nineties were finally dead to me. That is when commercial music conquered, for good, its place as the be-all-end-all on radio and MTV. There hasn't been a seriously credible band to come out (to my knowledge) since the Queens of the Stone Age debuted in '98. Everything else in New Rock so far has seemed very contrived (with the exception of some recent work of a few older bands/artists).

I think the 90s culture reached a climax in '95. From the end of that year on, there was a slow decline until we reach 99 which is the year the nineties were finally dead to me. That is when commercial music conquered, for good, its place as the be-all-end-all on radio and MTV. There hasn't been a seriously credible band to come out (to my knowledge) since the Queens of the Stone Age debuted in '98. Everything else in New Rock so far has seemed very contrived (with the exception of some recent work of a few older bands/artists).


95 was the climax of the feel to me.  I don't remember the early 90s, in fact I barely remember 1993 at all, but it seems to me the very early 90s were still pretty 80sish.  Late 1997-1999 up to 9/11/01 is the last period of the nineties to me, the crappy end period. 

1993 was like the year early 90s culture hit biggest.  I can't think of another year from 1992-1996 that was as rich in that aspect.

-FHF

95 was the climax of the feel to me.  I don't remember the early 90s, in fact I barely remember 1993 at all, but it seems to me the very early 90s were still pretty 80sish.  Late 1997-1999 up to 9/11/01 is the last period of the nineties to me, the crappy end period. 

1993 was like the year early 90s culture hit biggest.  I can't think of another year from 1992-1996 that was as rich in that aspect.

-FHF


1993 was definitely a big '90s year, there's just something special about it. It kind of has it's own feel compared to other '90s years. There's 1990-1992, then 94-96, the 97-99, and 93 is kind of on it's own because it's unique.

1993 was definitely a big '90s year, there's just something special about it. It kind of has it's own feel compared to other '90s years. There's 1990-1992, then 94-96, the 97-99, and 93 is kind of on it's own because it's unique.


1999 and 2000 really seem like one big year to me.  There's some differences, but they were both pretty much the same in feel.  I bet 79 and 80 and 89 and 90 were like that too.

1993 was definitely a big '90s year, there's just something special about it. It kind of has it's own feel compared to other '90s years. There's 1990-1992, then 94-96, the 97-99, and 93 is kind of on it's own because it's unique.


I can definitely see your point. '93 was a great year for everything.

As for FHF, I remember the early nineties pretty well (I was born in 85), and while I say that 90 had an 80s vibe to it and so did 91... 92 is when things started happening with grunge and what-have-you. I say that by the near-end of '92, the nineties had grabbed it's own identity.

I can definitely see your point. '93 was a great year for everything.

As for FHF, I remember the early nineties pretty well (I was born in 85), and while I say that 90 had an 80s vibe to it and so did 91... 92 is when things started happening with grunge and what-have-you. I say that by the near-end of '92, the nineties had grabbed it's own identity.


I see what you mean about 90 and 91.  It's like in 2000 and '01 you still had Clinton (well in 2000), Friends was still on, some Grunge bands were still around, but nothing like Nirvana or Beavis and Butthead were still around.

I've always imagined 90 and 91 being the same way: No Duran Duran, Square Pegs, Valley Girls, or whatever, but you still had the fashion, many 80s bands like Depeche Mode, and the high school clique deal.

1990 and 1991 still had a 80's apple cause the big hair was still in sholder pads acid wash jeans and such that started to change in 1992 but 1993 was when the 90's truely begun and i still think the 90's truly ended in 2002 cause that's the last  year i rember music still kida sounding 90's and fashion kida stated to change that year but today sucks compaired to the 90's

Besides the blue jays winning the world series in both 92-93, which doesn't matter all that much, the nineties did not resonate so much for me (born in '85). I think everyone is forgetting one major aspect of the nineties that puts it in its place as the great decade of the century: Ren and Stimpy.

Besides the blue jays winning the world series in both 92-93, which doesn't matter all that much, the nineties did not resonate so much for me (born in '85). I think everyone is forgetting one major aspect of the nineties that puts it in its place as the great decade of the century: Ren and Stimpy.


Ren and Stimpy is TERRIBLE!  :P  It's because of THEM that so much violence can be shown on TV.  Well R&S isn't exactly violent, more gross, but before 1993 you could NEVER show stuff like that on TV.  I don't know about other parts of the 90s but today pretty much any violence can be shown.  It's sick  :P

Now Beavis and Butthead, THAT was the show of the 90s  8)

Don't get me wrong, I liked 1993...but the 90s were in full swing by then.

I remember that time period pretty well. I was about 13 by 1990 and all I remember hearing leading up to the 90's was that the 90s would be cool and sooo different from the 80s. I think people grew really tired of hair bands, and silly pop like Debbie Gibson by the final day of the 80s.

The 90s really began in 1991 with "Smells like Teen Spirit", in my opinion. And still to this day when I think of the title to that song, I think of girl's deodorant-Teen Spirit...

Don't get me wrong, I liked 1993...but the 90s were in full swing by then.

I remember that time period pretty well. I was about 13 by 1990 and all I remember hearing leading up to the 90's was that the 90s would be cool and sooo different from the 80s. I think people grew really tired of hair bands, and silly pop like Debbie Gibson by the final day of the 80s.

The 90s really began in 1991 with "Smells like Teen Spirit", in my opinion. And still to this day when I think of the title to that song, I think of girl's deodorant-Teen Spirit...




Thats one thing I DEFINITELY remember about the 90s, was that as a decade, it hyped itself up. It was assumed that the 90s were cool, because, they were the 90s. You had people using the phrase "its the 90s now", and "welcome to the 90s" over and over. I mean, you did have the internet blowing up all of a sudden, 3D video games like the Playstation, CDs replacing cassettes, and all of that other junk. The USSR which had dominated the American political concious for 40 years was now just a relic of the past, we had this unbelivable economic boom, it felt like we were living in the future.

And the 00's..it feels like we are living in a post-apogcalyptic future. All of the hope for the new post-Communist world, the technology, globalism, is gone. And now you just have this cynicism prevailing. Everyone thinks world war 3 is coming, you have the War on Terror, paranoia, and the new technology that was so hyped and revered in the 90s seems to be a source of fear now. Identity theft, hacking, "e-terrorism", and so on.

Does anyone understand what I'm saying? Or am i just rambling aimlessly?

Thats one thing I DEFINITELY remember about the 90s, was that as a decade, it hyped itself up. It was assumed that the 90s were cool, because, they were the 90s. You had people using the phrase "its the 90s now", and "welcome to the 90s" over and over. I mean, you did have the internet blowing up all of a sudden, 3D video games like the Playstation, CDs replacing cassettes, and all of that other junk. The USSR which had dominated the American political concious for 40 years was now just a relic of the past, we had this unbelivable economic boom, it felt like we were living in the future.

And the 00's..it feels like we are living in a post-apogcalyptic future. All of the hope for the new post-Communist world, the technology, globalism, is gone. And now you just have this cynicism prevailing. Everyone thinks world war 3 is coming, you have the War on Terror, paranoia, and the new technology that was so hyped and revered in the 90s seems to be a source of fear now. Identity theft, hacking, "e-terrorism", and so on.

Does anyone understand what I'm saying? Or am i just rambling aimlessly?


Yeah the 90s were a good decade, pop culture wise in 1990-96 and lifestyle/politically in 1997-99.  Yeah like in "Tiny Toons", made around 1990 they said how it was the 90s.  I was only a baby in 1990, but to me it seems by 1989 people were tired of the 80s, but 1991 when the 80s ended because 1990 really was too weak a year culturally to oust the 80s.  I mean Vanilla Ice might be called the first 90s rapper but to me his image is really 80s.  1990 really seemed to close up the 80s and really the 20th century too with the end of the cold war at the fact that it was one of the last years the media couldn't show a lot of explicit stuff.

Yeah I see it this way to sum it up: 1980-1987 was tired out by 1989.  By 1990 a lot of the 80s was uncool but people who were there in the beginning weren't going to give up on their hair metal and new wave without a fight. It wasn't until 1991/92 when Grunge and Rap (I don't mean dancy stuff like MC Hammer I mean gangsta and old school) really gave something significant enough to rid us of hair metal.  New Wave really lost steam around 1987 and has never completely gone away, in fact gaining more popularity with 80s people now in their 20s and 30s.

To sum it up, the 80s really ended in 1991 like Punk Daddy said.

2000 really wasn't as big as it was cracked up to be.  I guess it was because it was a new Millenium and not just a new decade so people weren't as willing to give up their pop culture.  Not that the 2000s are the same as the 1990s, it was just more gradual change.

El,

I hear ya....the 00's weren't hyped as much because everyone feared Y2k..that whole scare must seem surreal to these youngin's-but it was an odd time in 1999 when hope was replaced by fear.

90s definitely overhyped itself. But I think 1989 was such a pivotal year in so many respects from changing from the 80s to 90s....

El,

I hear ya....the 00's weren't hyped as much because everyone feared Y2k..that whole scare must seem surreal to these youngin's-but it was an odd time in 1999 when hope was replaced by fear.

90s definitely overhyped itself. But I think 1989 was such a pivotal year in so many respects from changing from the 80s to 90s....



There's "youngin's" who don't remember 1999? Wow!

There's "youngin's" who don't remember 1999? Wow!


My thoughts exactly. I remember the fears and paranoia of that year quite clearly. The whole Y2K thing, and then add on incidents like Columbine going down, it was a bad year. And it was that year that ushered in the current climate and killed the feeling of hope for the world I think that we generally had in the 1990s.

I think it peaked in 1995.

There's "youngin's" who don't remember 1999? Wow!


Youngin's under 12 barely remember 1999, just think they were born in 1994 or so, so they were around 5, the y2k scare most likely means nothing to them.

My thoughts exactly. I remember the fears and paranoia of that year quite clearly. The whole Y2K thing, and then add on incidents like Columbine going down, it was a bad year. And it was that year that ushered in the current climate and killed the feeling of hope for the world I think that we generally had in the 1990s.


It's so true.  The 90s weren't depressing, they were changeful.  Today is full of paranoia.

It's so true.  The 90s weren't depressing, they were changeful.  Today is full of paranoia.


Yeah, I agree. In the '90s you didn't have to hear about somebody dying in the war or in some terrorist attack like everyday. Terrorism wasn't as much of a fear, there was somewhat of a concern about terrorism, but not at the level it is today.

Yeah, I agree. In the '90s you didn't have to hear about somebody dying in the war or in some terrorist attack like everyday. Terrorism wasn't as much of a fear, there was somewhat of a concern about terrorism, but not at the level it is today.


Yes.  And that's the main thing that ages the 90s.  The 80s are a step older because they were pretty much without Internet, whereas the Internet was big in the 90s from about 1994 up or so.

Yes.  And that's the main thing that ages the 90s.  The 80s are a step older because they were pretty much without Internet, whereas the Internet was big in the 90s from about 1994 up or so.


When I first flew on a plane when I was 10 in 1997, I didn't worry one bit about a hijacking, because it really wasn't a concern at the time, I was just worried it would malfunction and crash, like that one twa flight, I think flight 800.

To me, the 90s ended in 2000 and 2001.  2000 gave us new music and the feel changed a bit, but at the same time politics and lifestyle were still late 1990s.  In the summer of 2000 I was able to get into Canada in 45 minutes. It took a long time but we still got in.  Today, or even 1 1/2 years from then you wouldn't even be considered without a passport.

To me, the 90s ended in 2000 and 2001.  2000 gave us new music and the feel changed a bit, but at the same time politics and lifestyle were still late 1990s.  In the summer of 2000 I was able to get into Canada in 45 minutes. It took a long time but we still got in.  Today, or even 1 1/2 years from then you wouldn't even be considered without a passport.


Well, I went to Canada in 2002 and 2003, and they let us right in. All they asked was are you US citizens, we said yes, they stared at us for about a minute and let us in. Then coming back the US customs didn't even ask us one question they just waved us through, lol.

Well, I went to Canada in 2002 and 2003, and they let us right in. All they asked was are you US citizens, we said yes, they stared at us for about a minute and let us in. Then coming back the US customs didn't even ask us one question they just waved us through, lol.


Maybe out East they're more trusting  ;)

-DR (FHF)  :)

....

I can compare it to what I observed about the late 70's/early 80's. Like before MTV got big (1980-82), the culture was like an extension of the 70's - although only in some ways. Like the popular music -- Chicago, Rick Springfield, Christopher Cross, etc -- had some of the 70's sound mixed with traces of what would become 80's pop.

1990/91 was still like a (smaller) continuation of the 80's. 1992 was the crossroads (which is one reason I like it - kind of an idea what the 90's were like, but still the last real "80s"-like year).

In 1993/94, is about when the 90's culture peaked (some of it I like, some I didn't/don't). Pretty much all traces of the 80's were gone; grunge was at its height, Beavis & Butthead had just started - and was controversial - before it was toned down a little. We were still "hopeful" for the future, Clinton had just been elected. Melrose Place, 90210, and many other sitcoms we associate with the 90's were at their peak.

I would even say that by 1995, the "initial excitement" of the new decade had worn off a bit. I think 9/11 was the real end of the 90's - but the difference from the 80's to the 90's was more significant than the 90's to the 2000's to me at least.

....

I can compare it to what I observed about the late 70's/early 80's. Like before MTV got big (1980-82), the culture was like an extension of the 70's - although only in some ways. Like the popular music -- Chicago, Rick Springfield, Christopher Cross, etc -- had some of the 70's sound mixed with traces of what would become 80's pop.

1990/91 was still like a (smaller) continuation of the 80's. 1992 was the crossroads (which is one reason I like it - kind of an idea what the 90's were like, but still the last real "80s"-like year).

In 1993/94, is about when the 90's culture peaked (some of it I like, some I didn't/don't). Pretty much all traces of the 80's were gone; grunge was at its height, Beavis & Butthead had just started - and was controversial - before it was toned down a little. We were still "hopeful" for the future, Clinton had just been elected. Melrose Place, 90210, and many other sitcoms we associate with the 90's were at their peak.

I would even say that by 1995, the "initial excitement" of the new decade had worn off a bit. I think 9/11 was the real end of the 90's - but the difference from the 80's to the 90's was more significant than the 90's to the 2000's to me at least.


I'd agree with just about everything you said.  How controversial was Beavis and Butthead?  I mean there was a lot of potty humor and d*ck jokes but I don't remember much violence and really not too much language.  It's nothing compared to "South Park" from what I remember.  Someone please tell me how controversial B&B was.  I think the 80s to 90s difference will be a lot more obvious to future gens than 90s to 2000s, if you weren't around in both the 90s and 2000s you'd probably view 1996-2004 as pretty much the same, and 1990-95 as "80esque", whereas with the 80s and 90s really only 1990 and 1991 can get lumped in with 1980-1989.  To people that were actually around in both the 90s and 2000s the difference is really pretty obvious although you might not care.  From late 2000 to 9/11 the atmosphere really changed a lot.

Did the 70s spill into the 80s more than the 80s did into the 90s?

I'd agree with just about everything you said.  How controversial was Beavis and Butthead?  I mean there was a lot of potty humor and d*ck jokes but I don't remember much violence and really not too much language.  It's nothing compared to "South Park" from what I remember.  Someone please tell me how controversial B&B was.  I think the 80s to 90s difference will be a lot more obvious to future gens than 90s to 2000s, if you weren't around in both the 90s and 2000s you'd probably view 1996-2004 as pretty much the same, and 1990-95 as "80esque", whereas with the 80s and 90s really only 1990 and 1991 can get lumped in with 1980-1989.  To people that were actually around in both the 90s and 2000s the difference is really pretty obvious although you might not care.  From late 2000 to 9/11 the atmosphere really changed a lot.

Did the 70s spill into the 80s more than the 80s did into the 90s?


I don't remember beavis and butthead being that controversial, it's nothing compared to south park. Yes, I agree on the 80s to 90s difference being greater than the 90s and 00s difference. There were threats in the '90s as well though, I can remember the Oklahoma City Bombing and how the federal bulding was closed here for like a week or something and they really jacked up security there, and how one time I had to go there with my dad and I was kind of scared because of what happened in Oklahome City, then there were the embassy bombings in 1998, which increased our fears of al-qaeda. I remember when we shot some missles into Iraq in 1998. Put it this way, I remember hearing Saddam, Osama, and Al-qaeda a whole lot in the '90s. The threat was there, of course it got much more apparent on 9/11/01.

I don't remember beavis and butthead being that controversial, it's nothing compared to south park. Yes, I agree on the 80s to 90s difference being greater than the 90s and 00s difference. There were threats in the '90s as well though, I can remember the Oklahoma City Bombing and how the federal bulding was closed here for like a week or something and they really jacked up security there, and how one time I had to go there with my dad and I was kind of scared because of what happened in Oklahome City, then there were the embassy bombings in 1998, which increased our fears of al-qaeda. I remember when we shot some missles into Iraq in 1998. Put it this way, I remember hearing Saddam, Osama, and Al-qaeda a whole lot in the '90s. The threat was there, of course it got much more apparent on 9/11/01.


Yeah, today's problems are pretty much 90s problems to a much higher magnitude.  I'd heard of Saddam but not Al-qaeda. 

I'd agree with just about everything you said.  How controversial was Beavis and Butthead?  I mean there was a lot of potty humor and d*ck jokes but I don't remember much violence and really not too much language.  It's nothing compared to "South Park" from what I remember.  Someone please tell me how controversial B&B was.  I think the 80s to 90s difference will be a lot more obvious to future gens than 90s to 2000s, if you weren't around in both the 90s and 2000s you'd probably view 1996-2004 as pretty much the same, and 1990-95 as "80esque", whereas with the 80s and 90s really only 1990 and 1991 can get lumped in with 1980-1989.  To people that were actually around in both the 90s and 2000s the difference is really pretty obvious although you might not care.  From late 2000 to 9/11 the atmosphere really changed a lot.

Did the 70s spill into the 80s more than the 80s did into the 90s?


I actually barely watched B & BH until 1995 or 96 (just before the movie came out, in fact), and by then, it was basically fine. I do somewhat remember in the early days, when Beavis had his "Fire fire fire!" chant, apparently a little kid somewhere was left alone in his trailer and used matches to set it on fire after seeing that episode, so I think that was the biggest controversy. That's why they cut out all the "Fire" stuff from the episodes later (including on the home videos).

But yeah, anything about that show was pretty much like Mr. Rogers compared to South Park.

I'd even agree that, someone in 2020 who wasn't around now, looking back at the 80's, 90's and 2000's would see even today as basically being an extension of the 90's. The music in particular -- I was just thinking, look at Avril. Sounds basically like Sheryl Crow's little sister (and she's been around since 1993/94). The nu metal on the radio (Incubus, Puddle of Mudd, etc) is like Post Grunge.

PS: I'd compare the 90's spilling into the 2000's as how the 70's did into the 80's (maybe even more). Alot of the 70's artists continued having hits into the 80's -- in fact, that was how I was intoduced to alot of 'em.

Maybe it's an "every other decade" thing.

The 50's culture was around until the Beatles, from what I've seen. Like 1960-63 still looks/feels the same. The 60's into the 70's was more sudden (the hippie culture was more or less dead by 1970/71). Then the 70's into the 80's was more gradual. 80's to the 90's was jarring again, then the 90's into the 2000's is gradual.

I bet in about 2010-13, some other big cultural change will happen.

I actually barely watched B & BH until 1995 or 96 (just before the movie came out, in fact), and by then, it was basically fine. I do somewhat remember in the early days, when Beavis had his "Fire fire fire!" chant, apparently a little kid somewhere was left alone in his trailer and used matches to set it on fire after seeing that episode, so I think that was the biggest controversy. That's why they cut out all the "Fire" stuff from the episodes later (including on the home videos).

But yeah, anything about that show was pretty much like Mr. Rogers compared to South Park.

I'd even agree that, someone in 2020 who wasn't around now, looking back at the 80's, 90's and 2000's would see even today as basically being an extension of the 90's. The music in particular -- I was just thinking, look at Avril. Sounds basically like Sheryl Crow's little sister (and she's been around since 1993/94). The nu metal on the radio (Incubus, Puddle of Mudd, etc) is like Post Grunge.

PS: I'd compare the 90's spilling into the 2000's as how the 70's did into the 80's (maybe even more). Alot of the 70's artists continued having hits into the 80's -- in fact, that was how I was intoduced to alot of 'em.

Maybe it's an "every other decade" thing.

The 50's culture was around until the Beatles, from what I've seen. Like 1960-63 still looks/feels the same. The 60's into the 70's was more sudden (the hippie culture was more or less dead by 1970/71). Then the 70's into the 80's was more gradual. 80's to the 90's was jarring again, then the 90's into the 2000's is gradual.

I bet in about 2010-13, some other big cultural change will happen.


Agreed.  Today's music is like pseudo-90s only without any spark of creativity.  Of course, anybody born before 1993 or 94 would know the difference.  I do think though that it wouldn't mean a thing to anybody born after 1996 and they would think the 90s spanned from 1993 to 2005+.
But today feels different from the 90s.  If I was born a decade earlier I wouldn't be typing on this messageboard, for instance.  If I was it would be the old one with totally different people. 

Yeah the "60s" stereotype is really more 1964 to 1973 than it is 1960-1969, from what I understand, peaking at about 1967 or 1968.  McFly, here's my opinion on the decades, correct what I got wrong:

1950-1963 - The 50s
1964-1972 - The 60s
1973-1981 - The 70s
1982-1990 - The 80s
1991-2001 - The 90s
2002-2005+ - The 2000s

On a last note, I hope the children of the 2020s (when I'm in my 30s) stereotype the 90s for 1992-96 and not 1997-2003.

^ I'd agree with all of that (including the years).

Music is just more boring these days because the trends are coasting off everything big in the 90's, and after 12 years (I'd say the 90's began in 1992/93), how much more creativity can you pull out of the same general sounds? ;)

I've often said I was born at the absolutely weirdest cultural time known to man -- especially concerning my early teen years -- the end of 1981, which means I was 10 in 1991/92 and became a teen at the end of '94. This was at the height of the 80's culture giving way to the 90's.

Now because I paid attention early, I still consider my "home" to be more the 80's than the 90's (though I like both to a degree), but concerning my peers, I'm just as likely to have someone who remembers the 80's as someone who would say "Huh?" when I mentioned Billy Idol, LOL!

1993 was a great year.  '93 was a turning point year, much like 1999 was.

It does seem like '93 was the 90s year of the 90s for some reason.  I guess it's because that year more then any other is probably when stuff like Pearl Jam and Nirvana were at their peak of popularity. 

1993 was a great year.  '93 was a turning point year, much like 1999 was.

It does seem like '93 was the 90s year of the 90s for some reason.  I guess it's because that year more then any other is probably when stuff like Pearl Jam and Nirvana were at their peak of popularity. 


The 90s culture period was pretty short, really only 1992-96.  1997-2005 is more Milleniumish with some 90s aspects and 1990-91 seems still pretty 80s.  Nobody really cared that the 2000s was a different decade so the 90s to 00s transition was slow.

I guess people remember 1993 because that was a year things became really different.  Bill Clinton was President now.  Grunge and gangsta rap was everywhere on the radio.  Starbucks coffee houses became REALLY popular around 1992 and 1993.   The X-Files were on TV and Jurassic Park was in the theaters.  The world wide web and email were starting to become popular phrases, not like what it skyrockted into in 1995, but it was already in the vocabulary in 1993.

Even though other 90s stuff like Friends, Clueless, and My So Called Life were still a year or two away, 1993 was different enough from the late 80s that people noticed it.  It was so weird how things had changed so fast from what was thought of as cool in 1989.  The 80s died a very quick death.  You could not wear any clothes from 1989 in 1993, because it would really stand out.  It's not like today, where you can get away with dressing 1997 or 2001 and people don't care.    

I guess people remember 1993 because that was a year things became really different.  Bill Clinton was President now.  Grunge and gangsta rap was everywhere on the radio.  Starbucks coffee houses became REALLY popular around 1992 and 1993.   The X-Files were on TV and Jurassic Park was in the theaters.  The world wide web and email were starting to become popular phrases, not like what it skyrockted into in 1995, but it was already in the vocabulary in 1993.

Even though other 90s stuff like Friends, Clueless, and My So Called Life were still a year or two away, 1993 was different enough from the late 80s that people noticed it.  It was so weird how things had changed so fast from what was thought of as cool in 1989.  The 80s died a very quick death.   


Today, in 2005, the 90s aren't so much uncool as forgotten. I mean there isn't a lot of hate for the 90s, it's just youth are so clueless on what was big then save for a few things.

The good thing about fashions changing so slow these days is that you can keep the same shirt and jeans around for 7 or 8 years and not look that outdated.  It saves money that's for sure.  (if you're already grown that is)

I remember it was impossible and unthinkable to wear anything more then 2 or 3 years out of date back in the pre-late 90s days.  A lot of times you couldn't even wear something from a year out of date back in the day.

Devo, you HAVE TO ADMIT that the fashions from 2004 and early '05 are still very similar to the late 90s and even perhaps 1996 too.  Come on man.  Baggy pants, baggy shorts, sandals, platform shoes on women, that whole retro 70ish look,...very little has changed in fashion from the late 90s.  That is why people keep calling this the 90s. 

Today, in 2005, the 90s aren't so much uncool as forgotten. I mean there isn't a lot of hate for the 90s, it's just youth are so clueless on what was big then save for a few things.


I try to tell my 12 yr old nephew about how great the '90s were but he doesn't really care, it goes in one ear and comes out the other.

The good thing about fashions changing so slow these days is that you can keep the same shirt and jeans around for 7 or 8 years and not look that outdated.  It saves money that's for sure.  (if you're already grown that is)

I remember it was impossible and unthinkable to wear anything more then 2 or 3 years out of date back in the pre-late 90s days.  A lot of times you couldn't even wear something from a year out of date back in the day.

Devo, you HAVE TO ADMIT that the fashions from 2004 and early '05 are still very similar to the late 90s and even perhaps 1996 too.  Come on man.  Baggy pants, baggy shorts, sandals, platform shoes on women, that whole retro 70ish look,...very little has changed in fashion from the late 90s.   That is why people keep calling this the 90s. 


Yes, fashion hasn't changed much since 1996.  Except sunglasses don't seem to be as cool today.  In most other ways, though, today is not the 90s.  Well maybe it's still 1999, but definitely not 1994 or 1996.

Marty McFly said he noticed a shift between 1996 and 1997.  That is so true.  In one episode of "South Park" from 1999 they were joking about 1996 being nostalgic.  Even though it was meant in jest, just the fact that they could pick out differences shows that there was a shift then.  2001 is when things became about the exact same as today, 1998 and 99, and to a lesser extent 1997 is pretty much but not quite the same, pop-culture wise. 

The reason culture change is so slow now is mostly because of the music and the fact that there aren't as many music videos.

Yes, fashion hasn't changed much since 1996.  Except sunglasses don't seem to be as cool today.  In most other ways, though, today is not the 90s.  Well maybe it's still 1999, but definitely not 1994 or 1996.

Marty McFly said he noticed a shift between 1996 and 1997.  That is so true.  In one episode of "South Park" from 1999 they were joking about 1996 being nostalgic.  Even though it was meant in jest, just the fact that they could pick out differences shows that there was a shift then.  2001 is when things became about the exact same as today, 1998 and 99, and to a lesser extent 1997 is pretty much but not quite the same, pop-culture wise. 

The reason culture change is so slow now is mostly because of the music and the fact that there aren't as many music videos.


I noticed a shift as well between '96 and '97, you can say between '97 and '98 as well, but a lot of change occurred from 1995-1998. 1998 still seems modern, whereas 1995 kinda has a more dated feel. I don't really dress different today than I did in 1996 or 97, there aren't any big differences, now 1994 and earlier there are. One thing I do notice though is that there weren't all these preppy clothes in the '90s, like Abercrombie, PacSun, Aeropostale, everybody wears that stuff now (I don't though), there was stuff like GAP, BUM, Guess, that some stuff that I used to wear, though, but that was different than today's preppy clothes.

Abercrombie is a designer that is more popular in the '00s then before, that is true.  Strange, because Abercrombie has been around since the 1800s (look it up, the company has been around since the 19th century), but it is more popular now then ever before. 

Though I don't consider what they put out to be some new kind of "style", they are just a brand name that is suddenly popular in the '00s.  They still seem like late 90s styles, but instead of Tommy Hilfiger, GAP, or B.U.M (many of these were brands very popular in the 80s too)  it's Abercrombie.

When the fashions (not a designer brand name) NOTICEABLY change, that is when you know the pop culture has changed.  That's how 1993 seperated itself from what was around before. 

Abercrombie is a designer that is more popular in the '00s then before, that is true.  Strange, because Abercrombie has been around since the 1800s (look it up, the company has been around since the 19th century), but it is more popular now then ever before. 

Though I don't consider what they put out to be some new kind of "style", they are just a brand name that is suddenly popular in the '00s.  They still seem like late 90s styles, but instead of Tommy Hilfiger, GAP, or B.U.M (many of these were brands very popular in the 80s too)  it's Abercrombie.

When the fashions (not a designer brand name) NOTICEABLY change, that is when you know the pop culture has changed.  That's how 1993 seperated itself from what was around before. 


Wasn't Abercrombie big in the eighties?  Today is like a corporate 90s with Preppie attitudes.

I agree about preppy clothes being more "in" in the last few years.

Same with music videos. I didn't quite realize it simply 'cause I don't watch MTV/VH1 much anymore, but that's very true. Like, 20 years ago, when Thriller came out, everyone was glued to their TV's, and (from all I've heard) likewise, when MJ, Springsteen or Prince had a new video out, it was almost like an event, but now they're so common, it's almost taken for granted or nothing special anymore.

I've also noticed the volume of videos made by new or still-popular artists is declining. Just as an example, Weird Al (one of my heroes!), who was always known for making them, didn't do any for his latest CD, Poodle Hat (and it was a big seller, so that's not the reason! Actually, he was going to do one for "Couch Potato", but Eminem didn't want him to - however, he didn't do any others for the remaining songs).


The good thing about fashions changing so slow these days is that you can keep the same shirt and jeans around for 7 or 8 years and not look that outdated.  It saves money that's for sure.  (if you're already grown that is). 


Good point as well. I still have a ton of clothes I bought in the summer of '99 (I was 17, so I haven't much grown or changed since) which I still wear. I've also noticed plaid shirts are common today and in the last several years -- which is a good thing 'cause I've got several I wouldn't wanna throw out, LOL!

I agree about preppy clothes being more "in" in the last few years.

Same with music videos. I didn't quite realize it simply 'cause I don't watch MTV/VH1 much anymore, but that's very true. Like, 20 years ago, when Thriller came out, everyone was glued to their TV's, and (from all I've heard) likewise, when MJ, Springsteen or Prince had a new video out, it was almost like an event, but now they're so common, it's almost taken for granted or nothing special anymore.

I've also noticed the volume of videos made by new or still-popular artists is declining. Just as an example, Weird Al (one of my heroes!), who was always known for making them, didn't do any for his latest CD, Poodle Hat (and it was a big seller, so that's not the reason! Actually, he was going to do one for "Couch Potato", but Eminem didn't want him to - however, he didn't do any others for the remaining songs).

Good point as well. I still have a ton of clothes I bought in the summer of '99 (I was 17, so I haven't much grown or changed since) which I still wear. I've also noticed plaid shirts are common today and in the last several years -- which is a good thing 'cause I've got several I wouldn't wanna throw out, LOL!


Plaid? You mean like flannel?  Wow, fashion really hasn't changed in a long time!  Mind, there are some differences between today and say, 1996:

More preppy clothing
sluttier dress
less sunglasses
Even more tattoos

People today don't seem to care about fashion, that's why it hasn't changed much in the past 8 or 9 yrs.  The early 90s had some fashion similarities to today but there seemed to be way more flannel c. 1992 than now and some 80s hair and clothes were still around.  In fact I think you could make a good case for saying the early 90s is MORE cheesy than the 80s.

Last night I was thinking about if some 16-year-old from 1996 (b. 1980) was warped 9 years to today and how long it would take him to note the change w/out some sign of date.  I think the music would take a bit, but not too long to realize.  He'd hear Snoop Dogg's new song and be content, then hear a Linkin Park song. Wow, LP are pretty unique.  Once he heard more numetal he would be really suspicious and boy bands would cut it.  Of course, watching at least 20 seconds of the news would wake him/her up to the fact it was 2005 and not 1996.  Music today is a lot different from 1996, but it might take a bit to realize the different vibes the music carries, that is the 96er would at first just think they were new bands or something they hadn't heard of.  At first.

^ Good point. Heck, like I was saying before, even taking someone from 1996 to '98 they would notice a difference. Although more with the music and slang, than with fashion. A "1996 native" would still more or less blend in today with typical fashion and clothes (assuming he was wearing something cutting-edge at the time and not, say 2-year-old clothes from 1994).

I never thought about the decline of sunglasses, but I have a tendency to agree with that. I see way less people wearing them in the last 5-6 years then, say in the early to mid 90's. Heck, I almost tend to think they're becoming not cool -- I remember wearing a pair to class in 2001 (which would basically be the same as today) and got some weird looks.

I do think if someone from 1999 (maybe '98, but that's stretching it) or more recent was taken to today, it would be awhile before they noticed a difference.

^ Good point. Heck, like I was saying before, even taking someone from 1996 to '98 they would notice a difference. Although more with the music and slang, than with fashion. A "1996 native" would still more or less blend in today with typical fashion and clothes (assuming he was wearing something cutting-edge at the time and not, say 2-year-old clothes from 1994).

I never thought about the decline of sunglasses, but I have a tendency to agree with that. I see way less people wearing them in the last 5-6 years then, say in the early to mid 90's. Heck, I almost tend to think they're becoming not cool -- I remember wearing a pair to class in 2001 (which would basically be the same as today) and got some weird looks.

I do think if someone from 1999 (maybe '98, but that's stretching it) or more recent was taken to today, it would be awhile before they noticed a difference.


I doubt they'd notice the music difference at first sight, but the movies would be more obvious.  And of course the news would just blow it in their face.  You could make a good argument that 1998 was more like 2005 than like 1995.  Sunglasses aren't too cool today, and also in the 90s it was the dopest sh*t to wear your cap backwards.  Today people wear them in random directions.

Plaid? You mean like flannel?  Wow, fashion really hasn't changed in a long time!  Mind, there are some differences between today and say, 1996:

More preppy clothing
sluttier dress
less sunglasses
Even more tattoos

People today don't seem to care about fashion, that's why it hasn't changed much in the past 8 or 9 yrs.  The early 90s had some fashion similarities to today but there seemed to be way more flannel c. 1992 than now and some 80s hair and clothes were still around.  In fact I think you could make a good case for saying the early 90s is MORE cheesy than the 80s.

Last night I was thinking about if some 16-year-old from 1996 (b. 1980) was warped 9 years to today and how long it would take him to note the change w/out some sign of date.  I think the music would take a bit, but not too long to realize.  He'd hear Snoop Dogg's new song and be content, then hear a Linkin Park song. Wow, LP are pretty unique.  Once he heard more numetal he would be really suspicious and boy bands would cut it.  Of course, watching at least 20 seconds of the news would wake him/her up to the fact it was 2005 and not 1996.  Music today is a lot different from 1996, but it might take a bit to realize the different vibes the music carries, that is the 96er would at first just think they were new bands or something they hadn't heard of.  At first.


I'd say clothes were plainer in the early-mid '90s, not all these preppy clothes with crazy designs on them. You didn't see as many 9, 10 year old dressing like sluts like they do now. If I were to come from 1996 to today, I'd say the technology would shock me the most. You can really make your own cds?, omg, how cool is that!

I'd say clothes were plainer in the early-mid '90s, not all these preppy clothes with crazy designs on them. You didn't see as many 9, 10 year old dressing like sluts like they do now. If I were to come from 1996 to today, I'd say the technology would shock me the most. You can really make your own cds?, omg, how cool is that!


Yeah the tech would be a bit shocking. Especially DVDS and the new game consoles.

Do you ever get the feeling your stuck living in the past? I definitely have a hard time moving forward, maybe that's why I read this board every day.

DevoRule, you've posted some really good insights about the 90s, but if you were born in 1990, how exactly did you experience Beavis and Butt, much less most of the nineties culture?

I find my experiences and perspective on the decade are probably a lot closer to Marty McFly, who was only born a year before me.

The nineties definetely had their own look. But the eighties could still be seen in fashion, hairstyles, telivision, even music the first four or five years of the decade. Do you think grunge and gangsta rap just completely took over? Yeah, it took over, but there was still plenty of innocent rap/hiphop (kriss Kross, Mc Hammer, Arrested Developement, Vanilla Ice, Marky Mark,TLC, SaltnPepper,Montell Jordan), cheesy early techno (Ace of Base, Real McCoy, Haddaway, Amber), great female singers (Mellisa Etheridge, Amy Grant, Jann Arden, Alanis, Annie Lennox, K.D. Lang, Indigo Girls), holdovers from the eighties (Paula Abdul, New Kids On the Block, Michael Jackson), and syrupy R&B groups (KC&JoJo,All4One,Boys2Men).

The nineties really saw the rise of techno and dance music, alternative rock, the women of Lillith Fair, and R&B super groups. And for those of you who thought the late nineties didn't have any good music I say to you: Savage Garden, 3rd Eye Blind, Radiohead, Garbage, Daft Punk, Chemical Brothers, Prodigy, the Verve, and a hell of a lot more.

Do you ever get the feeling your stuck living in the past? I definitely have a hard time moving forward, maybe that's why I read this board every day.

DevoRule, you've posted some really good insights about the 90s, but if you were born in 1990, how exactly did you experience Beavis and Butt, much less most of the nineties culture?

I find my experiences and perspective on the decade are probably a lot closer to Marty McFly, who was only born a year before me.

The nineties definetely had their own look. But the eighties could still be seen in fashion, hairstyles, telivision, even music the first four or five years of the decade. Do you think grunge and gangsta rap just completely took over? Yeah, it took over, but there was still plenty of innocent rap/hiphop (kriss Kross, Mc Hammer, Arrested Developement, Vanilla Ice, Marky Mark,TLC, SaltnPepper,Montell Jordan), cheesy early techno (Ace of Base, Real McCoy, Haddaway, Amber), great female singers (Mellisa Etheridge, Amy Grant, Jann Arden, Alanis, Annie Lennox, K.D. Lang, Indigo Girls), holdovers from the eighties (Paula Abdul, New Kids On the Block, Michael Jackson), and syrupy R&B groups (KC&JoJo,All4One,Boys2Men).

The nineties really saw the rise of techno and dance music, alternative rock, the women of Lillith Fair, and R&B super groups. And for those of you who thought the late nineties didn't have any good music I say to you: Savage Garden, 3rd Eye Blind, Radiohead, Garbage, Daft Punk, Chemical Brothers, Prodigy, the Verve, and a hell of a lot more.


Good post and I agree.  I'm really more repeating what I've learned later, although a bit is from direct experience.  When I was 5 I wasn't socially conscious but I was smart enough to know the feel.  It felt simpler and more old school then (c. 1995-1996). Beavis and Butthead was more a few odd memories and some recent viewing.

The late 90s and even today have plenty of good music, but easy listening sucks now.  Mainstream rap has become so terrible in the past 3-5 years I long for boy bands. Yes I do, it's that bad.  It's more the kid stuff I know firsthand, I didn't know what music was current until 1999 or even 2000.

Good post and I agree.  I'm really more repeating what I've learned later, although a bit is from direct experience.  When I was 5 I wasn't socially conscious but I was smart enough to know the feel.  It felt simpler and more old school then (c. 1995-1996). Beavis and Butthead was more a few odd memories and some recent viewing.

The late 90s and even today have plenty of good music, but easy listening sucks now.  Mainstream rap has become so terrible in the past 3-5 years I long for boy bands. Yes I do, it's that bad.  It's more the kid stuff I know firsthand, I didn't know what music was current until 1999 or even 2000.


I just looked and Beavis and Butthead do america (the movie) came out in 1996, darn I didn't think it was that long ago, I remember that movie coming out very well. I didn't watch Beavis and Butthead that much, but I was very much aware of it. Yeah and like I said before grunge music doesn't define the '90s, imo, jwsisliving has a good list of some of the non-grunge '90s hits.

I just looked and Beavis and Butthead do america (the movie) came out in 1996, darn I didn't think it was that long ago, I remember that movie coming out very well. I didn't watch Beavis and Butthead that much, but I was very much aware of it. Yeah and like I said before grunge music doesn't define the '90s, imo, jwsisliving has a good list of some of the non-grunge '90s hits.


That is true. Grunge is more anti-80s than 90s.  But Nirvana will always be the end of 80s music.

From 1 to 10 this is my rating of each 90s year in how definitive of the 90s it was:

1990: 3
1991: 5
1992: 7
1993: 9
1994: 8
1995: 8
1996: 7
1997: 5
1998: 4
1999: 3

If you charted these numbers there would be a hill going from 1992 to 1996 and "plains" in 1990-1991 and 1998-99.

Speaking of '93...does anyone remember what the intro/theme song was to MTV's "The Grind" that year?  I remember it had good house-esque beat to it and I've been trying to find it to add to a dance music playlist of mine.

Thanks...

Good post and I agree.  I'm really more repeating what I've learned later, although a bit is from direct experience.  When I was 5 I wasn't socially conscious but I was smart enough to know the feel.  It felt simpler and more old school then (c. 1995-1996). Beavis and Butthead was more a few odd memories and some recent viewing.

The late 90s and even today have plenty of good music, but easy listening sucks now.  Mainstream rap has become so terrible in the past 3-5 years I long for boy bands. Yes I do, it's that bad.  It's more the kid stuff I know firsthand, I didn't know what music was current until 1999 or even 2000.


I'm the same way. Not that I ever liked it that much in itself, but if we compare, say BSB's "As Long as You Love Me" to the average pop/rap/R&B song of that style today, the former is heaven, especially in comparison.

"Soft rock" songs today seem either whiny or extremely dull/boring, whereas the 80's and actually alot of the 90's had some good songs in that style. In fact, now that I think about it, pop ballads in general have kind of disappeared from the radio. Now they're basically slowed-down hip hop jams - to me at least, LOL. Maybe the ballads in the 90's were a slight leftover from the 80's.

I also just watched a bunch of Beavis & Butthead episodes I have taped (reading about it these past few days made me want to get into it again!), and I think the end of that show was one of the main endings of 90's culture. The early shows, especially, before the animation and the voices got good, were alot closer to how skater/dumb kids sometimes acted in circa 1993/94 (well, exagerrated obviously, LOL). In fact, I would almost go so far as to say the early B & BH were a bit "smarter" than the more famous versions. Later on, they became more refined, but also a little "goofier".

But, even a completely "90's" show like that had a few faint traces of the 80's in it. AC/DC (on ButtHead's shirt) have actually been around since the mid 70's, and there were some 80's videos they watched. Plus, just the idea that it was a much more "rock" mentality in that show does date it to the early/mid 90's. They did watch a few rap videos toward the end of the show's run, which does show them slowly changing with the times, but it still seemed less natural. For all I know, the changing of times -- coinciding with Mike Judge doing King of the Hill -- could've been partly why B&BH went off the air when it did.

For me the best years of the nineties were 1992--the end of summer 1997.

I'm the same way. Not that I ever liked it that much in itself, but if we compare, say BSB's "As Long as You Love Me" to the average pop/rap/R&B song of that style today, the former is heaven, especially in comparison.

"Soft rock" songs today seem either whiny or extremely dull/boring, whereas the 80's and actually alot of the 90's had some good songs in that style. In fact, now that I think about it, pop ballads in general have kind of disappeared from the radio. Now they're basically slowed-down hip hop jams - to me at least, LOL. Maybe the ballads in the 90's were a slight leftover from the 80's.

I also just watched a bunch of Beavis & Butthead episodes I have taped (reading about it these past few days made me want to get into it again!), and I think the end of that show was one of the main endings of 90's culture. The early shows, especially, before the animation and the voices got good, were alot closer to how skater/dumb kids sometimes acted in circa 1993/94 (well, exagerrated obviously, LOL). In fact, I would almost go so far as to say the early B & BH were a bit "smarter" than the more famous versions. Later on, they became more refined, but also a little "goofier".

But, even a completely "90's" show like that had a few faint traces of the 80's in it. AC/DC (on ButtHead's shirt) have actually been around since the mid 70's, and there were some 80's videos they watched. Plus, just the idea that it was a much more "rock" mentality in that show does date it to the early/mid 90's. They did watch a few rap videos toward the end of the show's run, which does show them slowly changing with the times, but it still seemed less natural. For all I know, the changing of times -- coinciding with Mike Judge doing King of the Hill -- could've been partly why B&BH went off the air when it did.






Agreed McFly.  1997 really ended the bulk of the 90s for me.  1990-96 was really the sequel to the 80s whearas 1997-1999 is the prequal to today.  To be honest, I think the real 90s are a largely forgotten decade.  Even the 80s people here seem to think 1990-1999 is all exactly the same as 1998.  The 90s were more diverse than pretty much any decade imo. 

1995 and 1996 were pretty cuturally void but they were the last years that felt old school. I guess 1997 did too to a lesser extent.

Devo, what are you talking about man?

The 90's were 1990-1999.

That's what they were.

I've said this before but leading up to the 90s people were so happy to get out of the 80s. When 1/1/90 finally came it was the 90s.

1995 culturally void? Are you kidding me????


10 years from now are they going to say 2005 was culturally void?

^That's what I've tried to tell this kid too.  Devo, you're an intelligent guy and you've got a keen mind on you.  You assess certain things about the 80s and 90s with pretty good accuracy (despite being way too young or not even alive back then).  But then there are many, many other things about the 80s and 90s that you are just WAY off on.  Granted, you are not alone.  A lot of people born from 1982 and onwards tend to have warped views of the 80s.  And many people born from the mid 80s and on still have rather age-centric vews of the 1990s.  You yourself are only 15 and born in 1990. 

There is probably only a 2-5% difference between the world of 1984 and the world of 2005.  5% at the very MOST in my opinion.  It's probably like 3% honestly.  That small percentage of difference is stuff like fashion, music, movies, TV shows and some atttitudes held by people in America and the Western world.  Ofcourse technological differences are there, (regarding digital tech like computers, cell phones) even compared to 5 years ago.  But the general way people in America acted was the same.   Trust me on this, everything else regarding human life was the SAME.  People still acted the same.  We are not talking about the 1780s or 1790s, we are talking about the two recent decades of the 80s and 90s.  People in the Western world still got up everyday and got in their cars and went to school or work.  Kids had problems at school and all the daily stuff of life.  We had cars, computers, those funky flying machines called aero-planes and video games.  But the technological differences from 1985 or 1995 is not so freakin' different that the culture is a world away.  We don't have rocket backpacks or flying cars around yet.  

And life was no less gritty or without an edge back then compared to today.  You can't look at what the FCC or MPAA allowed on the airwaves or in the theaters as a complete judgement of how people were during a certain time.  For instance there are probably more people in America that think that Janet Jackson's breast baring wardrobe malfunction wasn't a big deal at all right?  Most people I know blow it off.  But the FCC, being the lapdogs of the fundamentilst Christian Right has really overreacted to the thing and consequently the media has too.  Now let's say some nerdy kid 10 years from now, or 15 years from now in 2020 looks at the 2004 Superbowl incident.  He sees how the FCC reacted and how certain Bible Belt folks reacted.  He pulls up tons of articles about it from the internet, probably doing some paper on it for school.  Then this kid in 2015 or 2020 passes a random judgement of "dang, they really made a big deal about that 1.2 second shot of Janet Jackson's breasts back in 2004.  The people back in those days must have been so uptight, immature and stupid back then".  He's going totally by how the FCC and certain overly loud groups in 2004 reacted.

See what I'm talking about?  Does that example I gave you finally open your mind to what I'm talking about?  You keep comparing some movie from 1985 or 1995 to today and then coming away thinking that things were so incredibly different back in those days and people were so super moral and perfect because there was seemingly less profanity, gratuitious nuidty, and violence around on American TV, music videos, and/or movies.   

^That's what I've tried to tell this kid too.  Devo, you're an intelligent guy and you've got a keen mind on you.  You assess certain things about the 80s and 90s with pretty good accuracy (despite being way too young or not even alive back then).  But then there are many, many other things about the 80s and 90s that you are just WAY off on.  Granted, you are not alone.  A lot of people born from 1982 and onwards tend to have warped views of the 80s.  And many people born from the mid 80s and on still have rather age-centric vews of the 1990s.  You yourself are only 15 and born in 1990. 

There is probably only a 2-5% difference between the world of 1984 and the world of 2005.  5% at the very MOST in my opinion.  It's probably like 3% honestly.  That small percentage of difference is stuff like fashion, music, movies, TV shows and some atttitudes held by people in America and the Western world.  Ofcourse technological differences are there, (regarding digital tech like computers, cell phones) even compared to 5 years ago.  But the general way people in America acted was the same.   Trust me on this, everything else regarding human life was the SAME.  People still acted the same.  We are not talking about the 1780s or 1790s, we are talking about the two recent decades of the 80s and 90s.  People in the Western world still got up everyday and got in their cars and went to school or work.  Kids had problems at school and all the daily stuff of life.  We had cars, computers, those funky flying machines called aero-planes and video games.  But the technological differences from 1985 or 1995 is not so freakin' different that the culture is a world away.  We don't have rocket backpacks or flying cars around yet.  

And life was no less gritty or without an edge back then compared to today.  You can't look at what the FCC or MPAA allowed on the airwaves or in the theaters as a complete judgement of how people were during a certain time.  For instance there are probably more people in America that think that Janet Jackson's breast baring wardrobe malfunction wasn't a big deal at all right?  Most people I know blow it off.  But the FCC, being the lapdogs of the fundamentilst Christian Right has really overreacted to the thing and consequently the media has too.  Now let's say some nerdy kid 10 years from now, or 15 years from now in 2020 looks at the 2004 Superbowl incident.  He sees how the FCC reacted and how certain Bible Belt folks reacted.  He pulls up tons of articles about it from the internet, probably doing some paper on it for school.  Then this kid in 2015 or 2020 passes a random judgement of "dang, they really made a big deal about that 1.2 second shot of Janet Jackson's breasts back in 2004.  The people back in those days must have been so uptight, immature and stupid back then".  He's going totally by how the FCC and certain overly loud groups in 2004 reacted.

See what I'm talking about?  Does that example I gave you finally open your mind to what I'm talking about?  You keep comparing some movie from 1985 or 1995 to today and then coming away thinking that things were so incredibly different back in those days and people were so super moral and perfect because there was seemingly less profanity, gratuitious nuidty, and violence around on American TV, music videos, and/or movies.   


I agree. There is very little difference between 1995 or 1996 and today outside of politics and of course technology. Life hasn't changed, people do the same things. Cars from 1995, 96 are still modern looking to me. Style has changed little. I have a few videos that I made in 1996, and if the date wasn't on the video, you'd could say they occurred in 2004 or 2005 easily. Devo is trying to classify everything in the '90s according to his personal feelings, and chop it up into a million different little pieces, like he thinks the real '90s ended in 1996, you just can't say that, then he tried to create millennium decade from 1997-2003, 1990-1999 are the real '90s. Devo I told you before, 1994-1996 were like the best years of the '90s and definitely weren't "culturally void". The late '90s weren't as bad as you think either.

^That's what I've tried to tell this kid too.  Devo, you're an intelligent guy and you've got a keen mind on you.  You assess certain things about the 80s and 90s with pretty good accuracy (despite being way too young or not even alive back then).  But then there are many, many other things about the 80s and 90s that you are just WAY off on.  Granted, you are not alone.  A lot of people born from 1982 and onwards tend to have warped views of the 80s.  And many people born from the mid 80s and on still have rather age-centric vews of the 1990s.  You yourself are only 15 and born in 1990. 

There is probably only a 2-5% difference between the world of 1984 and the world of 2005.  5% at the very MOST in my opinion.  It's probably like 3% honestly.  That small percentage of difference is stuff like fashion, music, movies, TV shows and some atttitudes held by people in America and the Western world.  Ofcourse technological differences are there, (regarding digital tech like computers, cell phones) even compared to 5 years ago.  But the general way people in America acted was the same.   Trust me on this, everything else regarding human life was the SAME.  People still acted the same.  We are not talking about the 1780s or 1790s, we are talking about the two recent decades of the 80s and 90s.  People in the Western world still got up everyday and got in their cars and went to school or work.  Kids had problems at school and all the daily stuff of life.  We had cars, computers, those funky flying machines called aero-planes and video games.  But the technological differences from 1985 or 1995 is not so freakin' different that the culture is a world away.  We don't have rocket backpacks or flying cars around yet.  

And life was no less gritty or without an edge back then compared to today.  You can't look at what the FCC or MPAA allowed on the airwaves or in the theaters as a complete judgement of how people were during a certain time.  For instance there are probably more people in America that think that Janet Jackson's breast baring wardrobe malfunction wasn't a big deal at all right?  Most people I know blow it off.  But the FCC, being the lapdogs of the fundamentilst Christian Right has really overreacted to the thing and consequently the media has too.  Now let's say some nerdy kid 10 years from now, or 15 years from now in 2020 looks at the 2004 Superbowl incident.  He sees how the FCC reacted and how certain Bible Belt folks reacted.  He pulls up tons of articles about it from the internet, probably doing some paper on it for school.  Then this kid in 2015 or 2020 passes a random judgement of "dang, they really made a big deal about that 1.2 second shot of Janet Jackson's breasts back in 2004.  The people back in those days must have been so uptight, immature and stupid back then".  He's going totally by how the FCC and certain overly loud groups in 2004 reacted.

See what I'm talking about?  Does that example I gave you finally open your mind to what I'm talking about?  You keep comparing some movie from 1985 or 1995 to today and then coming away thinking that things were so incredibly different back in those days and people were so super moral and perfect because there was seemingly less profanity, gratuitious nuidty, and violence around on American TV, music videos, and/or movies.   


You are correct, I believe you since you remember most of the 1980-1999 period and I only remember 1994 on with any clarity. :) 

I've said before I don't think people were nicer than, and I'm tired of people on this board slandering my generation as a bunch of gun-baring, disrespectful brats and then saying how holy and Godlike Gen X and moreso the Baby Boomers were. 

Pop culture was a lot different then (in the 80s and most of the 90s).  But yes, it wasn't a drastic difference in lifesytle. 1996 is probably about 2% different from today.  Breastgate wasn't much a big deal. 

Speaking as someone who's between the ages of Chris & Devo, I actually can see pieces of what both of you guys are talking about:

When Devo says that 1996 was the last real year of the 90's, he's just saying that about the 2% of the world that is different from 2005. True, if George Washington came in a time machine from the 18th Century and spent a week in the future - to him, 1995 and 2005 would be absolutely indiscernable from each other. ;)

I do think when we talk about the shift over to "modern" culture, we're doing it in more the nitpicky way -- and that 2% change did start in 1997, and basically was fully completed by 1999. Like I said before, if the "me" from 1999 came to 2005, he probably wouldn't even notice a change for awhile.

And as for what gets censored on TV, etc. that will probably always happen, no matter how far along we go. But, on the other hand, in the 50's, from all I've observed and heard, Elvis was thought of as dirty and an awful influence because of his dancing and the like (he had to be filmed above the waist, LOL). Rock & Roll was considered "noise" by practically all parents and adults over, say 30.

Now, that seems ridiculous even 20 years later, let alone 50, but in theory -- for its time -- I guess it's no different than a rapper who's considered controversial today.

It still takes a person the same amount of time to clean their house in 2005 as it did in 1995 and 1985.

;)


Devo, you are a smart guy.  You do assess a lot of stuff about the 80s and 90s with remarkable accuracy, despite not being old enough or not even alive.  But as many things as you get right, you are also way off on a ton of other things. There ARE a bunch of things different with today compared to either the 80s and 90s.  That is true, no doub that is true.  But that old saying "the more things change, the more they stay the same" is very, very true. 

Then again, I'm 29 1/2 years old....so maybey I'm just turning into an old timer.  Getting older has humbled me.  I understand a lot of things about life a lot better then I did before.  For one thing, babies grow up, get out of diapers and get older.  The babies during my high school years in the early 1990s are people like you Devo.  We're all just moving through this life, moving into different stages of life and never staying in one for too long.  It's all humbled me.  I actually feel like "one of the adults" for the first time in my life, probably because I do understand this and ofcourse my age.  It kinda goes over your head when you are younger.

If only I was an agless Autobot or Decepticon, I could spend a couple of million years on Cybertron and nothing would change.  Ahh, I'm nearly too old to be trust anymore!     :D 

I agree. There is very little difference between 1995 or 1996 and today outside of politics and of course technology. Life hasn't changed, people do the same things. Cars from 1995, 96 are still modern looking to me. Style has changed little. I have a few videos that I made in 1996, and if the date wasn't on the video, you'd could say they occurred in 2004 or 2005 easily. Devo is trying to classify everything in the '90s according to his personal feelings, and chop it up into a million different little pieces, like he thinks the real '90s ended in 1996, you just can't say that, then he tried to create millennium decade from 1997-2003, 1990-1999 are the real '90s. Devo I told you before, 1994-1996 were like the best years of the '90s and definitely weren't "culturally void". The late '90s weren't as bad as you think either.


I guess I'm being silly  :-[  1995 and 1996 style isn't too much different from now but the culture and music is.  The feel, too at least to me felt a bit older, but still modern.  1995 and 1996 is when things began to look like they do now.

People today for the most part aren't as "trendy" when it comes to style, and that's why things filmed after 1994 don't look obviously dated.  That's probably a good thing.  1999 was the real 90s but I say it isn't the "core 90s" because it feels more like today then it does like 1993, 95 or even 96. 

Grunge was practically dead by the end of 1995 and by 1996 I say that the 90s were giving way to the 00s.