I often wonder this.  Most of the 80s, 1988 and 1989 being exceptions...were very pre-hip hop culture.  I mean hip hop was around, even earlier then the late 80s but certainly not like it has been since the 90s. 

Many times when I hear people praise or talk about how great the 80s were for them, invariably they say something about rap music and R&B being everywhere since the 90s and how much that just sucks.  So I get the distinct impression that a big reason many people cling to the 80s is because the airwaves were so (I hope I don't offend to many people) White or Anglo so to say. 

Has anyone else picked up on this?

Or am I just seeing something that is not there? 

I believe that the breakdancing, ghettoblasting thing of the early 80s was a part of, or an earlier form of hip-hop culture.

i believe thats the case. a lot of people (white/anglo's) couldn't identify with the trials and tribulations of urban culture. they can't fathom what it's like to be raise poor and black and living in the projects. even the popular black artists sung songs that white people could identify with. lional richie and michael jackson were clean and safe, their music had that urban edge but it was sanitized like so much music from that era.

i believe thats the case. a lot of people (white/anglo's) couldn't identify with the trials and tribulations of urban culture. they can't fathom what it's like to be raise poor and black and living in the projects. even the popular black artists sung songs that white people could identify with. lional richie and michael jackson were clean and safe, their music had that urban edge but it was sanitized like so much music from that era.


Well, sputnik I was very poor in the 80s and lived in a bad part of town. I am white and anglo.

I suppose there are exceptions, eh?  ;)

Well, sputnik I was very poor in the 80s and lived in a bad part of town. I am white and anglo.

I suppose there are exceptions, eh?  ;)


always exceptions. i'm poor too but i can't identify what it's like to be black and living in a heart of a city.

I often wonder this.  Most of the 80s, 1988 and 1989 being exceptions...were very pre-hip hop culture.  I mean hip hop was around, even earlier then the late 80s but certainly not like it has been since the 90s. 

Many times when I hear people praise or talk about how great the 80s were for them, invariably they say something about rap music and R&B being everywhere since the 90s and how much that just sucks.  So I get the distinct impression that a big reason many people cling to the 80s is because the airwaves were so (I hope I don't offend to many people) White or Anglo so to say. 

Has anyone else picked up on this?

Or am I just seeing something that is not there? 


You hit it right on the nail. A lot of people are afraid of diversity of any kind and prefer blandness/conformity. The funny thing is rock and roll in the fifties was treated unfairly in the beginning b/c it was black music. They called it every name in the book. It had to become acceptable (some till this day don't like it). It's a cycle with anything different.

Tanya

Tanya

I believe that the breakdancing, ghettoblasting thing of the early 80s was a part of, or an earlier form of hip-hop culture.


Yes there were indeed many forms of hip hop culture around before the late 80s, but the truth was that it was certainly not as in your face and mainstream as it has been since the 90s.  You had Run DMC around in 1984, but come on those guys were very tailor made to appeal to a suburban White audience.  Mr. T sported his bling bling, but not everyone knew what "bling bling" was.  "Booty call", "da bomb", "diesel", (some of these are outdated 90s phrases I know) were not part of the mainstream language in the 80s. 

The airwaves and chart toppers in the early and mid 80s were dominated by White artists with their rock, New Wave, or metal music.  There was very little rap, and I don't remember too many R&B songs getting play time in the 80s.  Many times when you see someone talk about how great the 80s were, they do mention the fact that urban sound wasn't as predominant and they seem to long for a return to that.

Yes there were indeed many forms of hip hop culture around before the late 80s, but the truth was that it was certainly not as in your face and mainstream as it has been since the 90s.  You had Run DMC around in 1984, but come on those guys were very tailor made to appeal to a suburban White audience.  Mr. T sported his bling bling, but not everyone knew what "bling bling" was.  "Booty call", "da bomb", "diesel", (some of these are outdated 90s phrases I know) were not part of the mainstream language in the 80s. 


I agree. I think music genres evolve though. The things you mentioned weren't as mainstream in the 80s understood but it set the wheels in motion for the 90s. IMO I think the hip-hop culture in general appeals as much to white people today as Run DMC appealed to white people back in 1984. This suggests to me that hip-hop has been watered down and lost it's perspective and sense of meaning it initially had.

I love the 80s and it has nothing to do with racial overtones.  :)

I'm actually into some of the urban culture of the 80's (and yes I'm white).  I think some of that stuff had some good beats since I listen to, and write music that has a lot of breakbeats.  I listen to a bit of Afrika Bambaataa, Grandmaster Flash, Run-DMC, LA Dream Team, and MC Rob Base.  So I like a bit of Electro, Hip-hop, and Rap especially of the 80's and early 90's.  But of course I still like New Wave, Synthpop, New Romantic and so on.

I was very poor in the 80s



We didn't have a lot money either. That's one of the reasons we watched MTV 24-7.

I just get so tired of it after a while. Everybody is supposedly a pimp or a gangsta, and much like any group (goths, preps) they all look the same. How about some individuality here. Its really quite sad, because you see these little kids walking around looking like thugs, when in fact they just look like a carbon copy of all the other playas. And all these rap videos are basically the same, the guy thugged out waving his hands at the screen with a bunch of scantily clad women bouncing around. Man I miss the 80s. It can't be a coincedence that just about everything I like is from that decade.

I just get so tired of it after a while. Everybody is supposedly a pimp or a gangsta, and much like any group (goths, preps) they all look the same. How about some individuality here. Its really quite sad, because you see these little kids walking around looking like thugs, when in fact they just look like a carbon copy of all the other playas. And all these rap videos are basically the same, the guy thugged out waving his hands at the screen with a bunch of scantily clad women bouncing around. Man I miss the 80s. It can't be a coincedence that just about everything I like is from that decade.


I wasn't socially conscious in the 90s (except 1999), but even the 90s didn't have as much hip hop as today.  Today's MAINSTREAM sucks. I've made posts about Underground rap but few here seem to be interested. 

In the early 90s concious hip hop was cool.  In the mid and late 90s rap died down except for the east/west coast thing and since 2001 or so it's everywhere. 

Somebody older than me correct me if I'm wrong please.

p.s. I like Rap and New Wave but I'm more into synthy sounds than bassy sounds.

I don't really think the 80's black singers were particularly geared toward the whites.  I could be wrong since I only can relate to what was going on in my city, but when I was a kid, the blacks and whites dressed the same, talked the same and listened to the same music.  (I'm talking about during the Michael Jackson/Culture Club/Madonna era)

My problems with hip-hop and rap are:  (and there are exceptions)

I don't see any talent.  Anyone could wear pants 10 sizes too big, wave their arms around and shout obscenities.  I haven't heard alot of rap, but most of the tunes I have heard were "stolen" from talented performers.  I think that started with Ice Ice Baby using Queen's music.  Many times the "chorus" of a rap is copied too.  I've even heard a rap of "It's A Hard Knock Life", believe it or not.

Does anyone remember the hip-hop-ish song from the late 80's called "Push It" by Salt & Pepa? That kind of music is just "noise" to me.

I realize that the rappers are trying to show things from a different perspective and I can respect that.  But why don't they sing it, and why don't they write their own music?

I don't really think the 80's black singers were particularly geared toward the whites.  I could be wrong since I only can relate to what was going on in my city, but when I was a kid, the blacks and whites dressed the same, talked the same and listened to the same music.  (I'm talking about during the Michael Jackson/Culture Club/Madonna era)

My problems with hip-hop and rap are:  (and there are exceptions)

I don't see any talent.   Anyone could wear pants 10 sizes too big, wave their arms around and shout obscenities.   I haven't heard alot of rap, but most of the tunes I have heard were "stolen" from talented performers.  I think that started with Ice Ice Baby using Queen's music.  Many times the "chorus" of a rap is copied too.  I've even heard a rap of "It's A Hard Knock Life", believe it or not.

Does anyone remember the hip-hop-ish song from the late 80's called "Push It" by Salt & Pepa? That kind of music is just "noise" to me.

I realize that the rappers are trying to show things from a different perspective and I can respect that.  But why don't they sing it, and why don't they write their own music?


If the rappers give props and get permission from the people they sample and tweak it enough it can be a creative piece of art.  Real music doesn't equal a singer and a guitar.

Mainstream rap sucks, and aside from some Old School I bet that's all you hear.  The underground and Old School have real talent.  And yes, Ice Ice Baby's beat is a blatant ripoff.  :D

If the rappers give props and get permission from the people they sample and tweak it enough it can be a creative piece of art.  Real music doesn't equal a singer and a guitar.

Mainstream rap sucks, and aside from some Old School I bet that's all you hear.  The underground and Old School have real talent.  And yes, Ice Ice Baby's beat is a blatant ripoff.  :D


I used to work with some younger people who liked rap - and from listening to they way they would talk about different rappers, it seems like whether the rapper was talented or not was irrelevant as long as it had lots of violence and obscenity...

Remember when Metallica was so big and Guns 'n' Roses was treated like a "wanna-be" rock band and not really accepted into the genre?  It seems rap fans are the same way whenever a rapper comes up with a non-violent/drugs/sex rap.

I used to work with some younger people who liked rap - and from listening to they way they would talk about different rappers, it seems like whether the rapper was talented or not was irrelevant as long as it had lots of violence and obscenity...

Remember when Metallica was so big and Guns 'n' Roses was treated like a "wanna-be" rock band and not really accepted into the genre?  It seems rap fans are the same way whenever a rapper comes up with a non-violent/drugs/sex rap.


I used to have that attitude also, but I don't anymore.  I love the Underground.  I pretty much like whatever has a good beat, and Rap usually doesn't sound good the way New Wave does.  I do like gangsta rap if it's jokey, just not the hardcore stuff.

We didn't have a lot money either. That's one of the reasons we watched MTV 24-7.


I'm sorry to hear that. I remember watching a programme on music videos but I'm not sure if it was one and the same.

I think I'm alot more tolerant of most forms of rap now than I was 10 years ago. I'm not a fan per se, but I've gotten alot more used to it from constant exposure.

However, I admit, it was weird being a little kid (say 1988) and it was pretty much unknown to me. Then 5 years later, it was huge and made alot of the '80s and early '90s pop music that I knew, cheesy almost instantly! That said, I do like the more lite/pop styled rap such as Will Smith and Hammer. I'm fine with rap in general, but I never liked the gangsta stuff much.

I think the 80s was more "rap".  Suger Hill Gang,Whodini,Kurtis Blow,Grandmaster Flash and  Run DMC were definitive 80s artist.  Public Enemy, NWA and Ice T started the "gangster movement"  That was all before the hip hoppin,Be-otch slapping,rump shakin' money makin' 90s and 00s.  Whats next?  Crunk?  I just dont see it. I must be getting old.  Peace out!!!!

I think the 80s was more "rap".  Suger Hill Gang,Whodini,Kurtis Blow,Grandmaster Flash and  Run DMC were definitive 80s artist.  Public Enemy, NWA and Ice T started the "gangster movement"  That was all before the hip hoppin,Be-otch slapping,rump shakin' money makin' 90s and 00s.  Whats next?  Crunk?  I just dont see it. I must be getting old.  Peace out!!!!


I wouldn't put the (whole) 90s into that category.  There was some pop-rap in the early-mid 90s but it wasn't as big as now and there was still smart rap then that wasn't relegated to Indie status.  The 80s really were partly about rap.  Today it's all holla stuff. 90s was more in between.

I don't really think the 80's black singers were particularly geared toward the whites.  I could be wrong since I only can relate to what was going on in my city, but when I was a kid, the blacks and whites dressed the same, talked the same and listened to the same music.  (I'm talking about during the Michael Jackson/Culture Club/Madonna era)

I know what you are talking about regarding this statement.  This is something I remember too and I have often wondered about this as well.  It did seem like that before 1988 or so, that Blacks, Whites, and Hispanics, tended to dress the same and listen to roughly the same type of music.  You had Goths, Punks and all kinds of other genres out there, but I don't remember a "Black" way to dress before the late 80s.  There were thugs around, and the thugish lifestyle, but it was not a fashion statement to purposefully dress like a thug unless you really were one.  It was only in the late 80s (when I was in middle school and just starting high school at the end of '89) that I started to notice a change in this. 

Then again, perhaps we are remembering it wrong because we were so young back then.  I know I was just a child in elementary school during most of the 80s, so it's not like I was a teenager, young adult or some kind of old dude back in 1984 or 1986.  During elementary school years, kids tend to be a bit more "same" (dress similar, listen to similar music) then compared to the middle school and high school years.  So we do need to factor that into the equation.  We could very well be remembering all this slightly wrong from the way it really happened.   

I know what you are talking about regarding this statement.  This is something I remember too and I have often wondered about this as well.  It did seem like that before 1988 or so, that Blacks, Whites, and Hispanics, tended to dress the same and listen to roughly the same type of music.  You had Goths, Punks and all kinds of other genres out there, but I don't remember a "Black" way to dress before the late 80s.  There were thugs around, and the thugish lifestyle, but it was not a fashion statement to purposefully dress like a thug unless you really were one.  It was only in the late 80s that I started to notice a change in this. 

Then again, perhaps we are remembering it wrong because we were so young back then.  I know I was just a child in elementary school during most of the 80s, so it's not like I was a teenager, young adult or some kind of old dude back in 1984 or 1986.  During elementary school years, kids tend to be a bit more "same" (dress similar, listen to similar music) then compared to the middle school and high school years.  So we do need to factor that into the equation.  We could very well be remembering all this slightly wrong from the way it really happened.   


I get the feeling that people acted pretty much the same in the 80s.  Maybe a bit less mature, but that's partly a good thing imo.

^Not sure I follow you.  What do you mean?


And keep in mind our perspecitve (those of us from mid 20s to early 30s) ---elementary school life during most of the 80s.  We were DEFINATELY there, I certainly was, but even I'm not probaby the best resource for everything 80s.  Even today, kids tend to dress and act the same during their elementary school years.  When I noticed a change in this, the late 80s, dovetails with when I moved into middle school.  

^Not sure I follow you.  What do you mean?   


Well in the 80s, and maybe part of the 90s too, it seems like there was more potty humor and acting childish and goofy was cool. Today it's a "grow up" attitude. 

^Tell that to Ashton Kutcher and his Punk'd TV show.  They always act stupid and immature on there.

^Tell that to Ashton Kutcher and his Punk'd TV show.  They always act stupid and immature on there.


True  ;D

In the 80s and first 2/3 or so of the 90s Rap didn't permeate every aspect of culture like today.  It was for "hipsters", not preppie slobs.