The riots are more motivated by the anger against the system - those same people support the lockdown, because the lockdown's opponents care more about money.

They loot because they believe the system is rigged against them - black men and women are more likely to go to jail or die than continue to live honest lives anyway, so why bother with a sometimes openly white supremacist police force? I hear too this issue isn't exclusive to America - in Hungary, cops and neo-Nazis regularly work together to fudge over Hungarians who protest the state's fascist tendencies (it has three major political parties, two who are far right).

Personally I too have no faith in the system - if I didn't care so much about ending up in prison, I'd riot too.

I've also found this article: https://edition.cnn.com/2020/06/01/opinions/trump-america-more-like-china-opinion-mackinnon/index.html
Remember the Hanoi summit too when he spoke well of North Korea's leader.

https://hail-lucifina.tumblr.com/post/619388550113263616/
This list of Black people murdered is why Americans at least have next to no faith in the police and the justice system and why they wish to steal from it and try to even destroy it.

America can be in its deepest, darkest moments....superpower or not and I will still be PROUD TO BE AN AMERICAN. That will never change!! ❤


I Love America!

I am glad I don’t live in America.


Where do you live?

This is unlike anything I've ever seen. Feels like you're in a real-life movie.


protests are going on just as we speak.  :o

,
You can understand that George Floyd's death was 100% unjustified and at the same time believe the riots are unjustified too.


George Floyd was a peaceful man and he would not like these riots if he was still alive. Rioting isn't gonna bring justice.


100% agree.

Peaceful protesting? I feel :) about that.

But rioting and violence like it's GTA?  >:( No way.

If you support burning down businesses, burning a homeless man's bed, and destroying buildings because you want "Justice" for George Floyd, you're straight up evil. I don't care what you have to say. There is literally no logical way to justify that.

I know the riots are not representative of BLM. Most of the actual BLM protests are peaceful. But I'm seeing an unbelievable amount of people on my Twitter, Instagram and Facebook supporting the riots. Yet not even that long ago they were all up in arms about a stupid anti-lockdown protest.

You can understand that George Floyd's death was 100% unjustified and at the same time believe the riots are unjustified too.


George Floyd was a peaceful man and he would not like these riots if he was still alive. Rioting isn't gonna bring justice.

https://twitter.com/GOPChairwoman/status/1267526625085870080
This is 100% CORRECT like rainbowz said because we need to be actually attacking the real source like those so called police than just going around destroying cities, because america wont recover acting like were in some video game destroying thing.If your going to protest do it but this might not be the most logical way unless we want america to be unevitable destroyed within a matter of months, but i still love america we just have to get it together and stop letting evil have its way.

Dr. Cornel West articulates the problem that has broiled over to this point perfectly:

hw8v9yIs7CY

At this moment, we need to all come together in solidarity against systematic racism, oppression, injustice, corruption, and power. The people in power want to make this a race war, they want to polarize us on the riots that have taken place, they want us to ultimately remain divided. We cannot allow that to occur. #solidarity

100% agree.

Peaceful protesting? I feel :) about that.

But rioting and violence like it's GTA?  >:( No way.


I posted this on reddit:

https://www.reddit.com/r/seculartalk/comments/gtzb27/tangible_policies_we_should_be_seeking_for_in/

These are examples of tangible policies that we should all be seeking; left, right, liberal, conservative, it doesn't matter. Regardless on how you feel about how some of these protests may have turned out, we should not let that divide us on actually seeking justice, not just for George Floyd, but for every single American that has been wrongly murdered by the hands of our police force. Not to mention completely dismantling and constructing a new criminal justice system that actually works for 'the people, that they swore duty to serve', that includes this:

https://preview.redd.it/u5uofziqt3251.png?width=1226&format=png&auto=webp&s=3ab3ce0f2b33bd4adbfd345e3a60f1293131f713

https://preview.redd.it/xgbgnggst3251.png?width=1214&format=png&auto=webp&s=70f4f482a235056c772fa8c7b0532e43fd834754

Among various other important initiatives.

Dr. Cornel West articulates the problem that has broiled over to this point perfectly:

hw8v9yIs7CY

At this moment, we need to all come together in solidarity against systematic racism, oppression, injustice, corruption, and power. The people in power want to make this a race war, they want to polarize us on the riots that have taken place, they want us to ultimately remain divided. We cannot allow that to occur. #solidarity


Yup, if you mean Donald Trump and his white supremacist supporters.  And yes, we do need to come together against systemic racism, oppression, injustice and corruption, but without power prudently exercised by legitimate authority according to just laws we have chaos and anarchy under which no one is safe

Yup, if you mean Donald Trump and his white supremacist supporters.  And yes, we do need to come together against systemic racism, oppression, injustice and corruption, but without power prudently exercised by legitimate authority according to just laws we have chaos and anarchy under which no one is safe


Welp..... not just him, although he's obviously at the core of what is wrong. However, it's an indictment on the entire system, a system that allowed Trump to rise into power in the first place. But nonetheless, that's water under the bridge. We need to unify more than ever, otherwise we won't have any tools left in our possession to fight this evil off. Trump is flirting with the idea of labelling Antifa as a terrorist organization, that would be a fatal blow to the First Amendment. More than ever, we need to be marching in the streets and pressuring our leaders in working towards new laws.

Welp..... not just him, although he's obviously at the core of what is wrong. However, it's an indictment on the entire system, a system that allowed Trump to rise into power in the first place. But nonetheless, that's water under the bridge. We need to unify more than ever, otherwise we won't have any tools left in our possession to fight this evil off. Trump is flirting with the idea of labelling Antifa as a terrorist organization, that would be a fatal blow to the First Amendment. More than ever, we need to be marching in the streets and pressuring our leaders in working towards new laws.


This could be a step towards becoming a total police state. Especially if Trump gets reelected he might declare anyone who disagrees with him to be treated as a terrorist.

This could be a step towards becoming a total police state. Especially if Trump gets reelected he might declare anyone who disagrees with him to be treated as a terrorist.


This is one of my biggest concerns.

Also, does anyone remember how, 7 or 8 years ago, people started freaking out when Obama revealed that the National Security Agency has been monitoring everyone's Internet activity?

Donald Trump has access to this now. My biggest fear is that, should he win reelection, Trump will order the NSA to dig through everyone's Facebook and Twitter (and all other social media) accounts for any kind of negative comments about him and place anyone who has made those comments on some kind of "enemies list."

I wouldn't be surprised in the least if he's already started doing that.  :o :o :o

This is one of my biggest concerns.

Also, does anyone remember how, 7 or 8 years ago, people started freaking out when Obama revealed that the National Security Agency has been monitoring everyone's Internet activity?

Donald Trump has access to this now. My biggest fear is that, should he win reelection, Trump will order the NSA to dig through everyone's Facebook and Twitter (and all other social media) accounts for any kind of negative comments about him and place anyone who has made those comments on some kind of "enemies list."

I wouldn't be surprised in the least if he's already started doing that.  :o :o :o



I think tRump is too stupid to do something like that. But, Barr on the other hand...


Cat

This is one of my biggest concerns.

Also, does anyone remember how, 7 or 8 years ago, people started freaking out when Obama revealed that the National Security Agency has been monitoring everyone's Internet activity?

Donald Trump has access to this now. My biggest fear is that, should he win reelection, Trump will order the NSA to dig through everyone's Facebook and Twitter (and all other social media) accounts for any kind of negative comments about him and place anyone who has made those comments on some kind of "enemies list."

I wouldn't be surprised in the least if he's already started doing that.  :o :o :o


I have a inkling that Trump's base is so strong, that nothing that he does to some of them is wrong.

I think tRump is too stupid to do something like that. But, Barr on the other hand...


Cat


None of this is new. Richard Nixon had his famed "enemies list".

I have a inkling that Trump's base is so strong, that nothing that he does to some of them is wrong.
Absolutely. According to a recent BBC article, religious fundies still love him and were the only major demographic to approve of Trump's response to COVID-19.

Absolutely. According to a recent BBC article, religious fundies still love him and were the only major demographic to approve of Trump's response to COVID-19.


There are some who think he's the literal Messiah. I wish I was kidding. People put TRUMP in big giant letters across their trucks, decorate their cars with Trump bumper stickers, wear shirts with his face on them, wear his hat etc. it's a full-fledged personality cult. When he dies, there will be grandiose statues, paintings, documentaries and mythologies of him, you can be sure of that. He might even show up on the currency and become the next Andrew Jackson ::)

None of this is new. Richard Nixon had his famed "enemies list".


The difference is that Nixon had brains.


Cat

There are some who think he's the literal Messiah. I wish I was kidding. People put TRUMP in big giant letters across their trucks, decorate their cars with Trump bumper stickers, wear shirts with his face on them, wear his hat etc. it's a full-fledged personality cult. When he dies, there will be grandiose statues, paintings, documentaries and mythologies of him, you can be sure of that. He might even show up on the currency and become the next Andrew Jackson ::)
I've seen some attribute his approval of moving the US Embassy of Israel from Tel Aviv to Jerusalem to him being the second coming of Christ because of some historical event about some guy in Persia.
It only serves to put me off of religion even further.

The difference is that Nixon had brains.


Cat


That's correct. Nixon was actually a member of Mensa. How he used his intelligence is another story altogether.

That's correct. Nixon was actually a member of Mensa. How he used his intelligence is another story altogether.


Nixon also didn't have Fox News, a Senate willing to derogate its duty (granted, Bush had this), a DoJ that serves as the President's personal lawyer rather than the nation's advocate (Reagan had this, and wouldn't ya know it, it's the same guy as last time!), or a Supreme Court willing to serve as a rubber stamp for partisan policies.

I think tRump is too stupid to do something like that. But, Barr on the other hand...


Cat


I don't think he's nearly as dumb as he lets on. If anything, I think he knows exactly what he's doing and he's just good at playing dumb to make himself seem more appealing to "common folk" and to try and bait the left into underestimating and hating him as much as possible.


There are some who think he's the literal Messiah. I wish I was kidding. People put TRUMP in big giant letters across their trucks, decorate their cars with Trump bumper stickers, wear shirts with his face on them, wear his hat etc. it's a full-fledged personality cult.

On Interstate 80 between Omaha and Lincoln there's a big red barn just off the side of the road that has a huge TRUMP sign on it. I'll have to see if I can get a picture of it and post it here sometime.

When he dies, there will be grandiose statues, paintings, documentaries and mythologies of him, you can be sure of that. He might even show up on the currency and become the next Andrew Jackson ::)


This all depends upon whether or not he wins reelection. An oft-repeated phrase is that the history books are written by the winners. Should he lose in November and actually leave office peacefully next January, you can rest assured that lots of things will come out about Trump as government files on him are declassified and leaked to the press and he very well could get indicted somewhere down the road. Tellingly, there are no US Navy vessels named after Richard Nixon, and should Donald Trump's name get tarnished in a similar way then you probably won't see any monuments to Trump except for maybe a few made by some remaining fanatical diehards.

Should he win, however, all bets are off. If that happens, Trump could have his face added to Mount Rushmore for all we know.  :o :o :o

On Interstate 80 between Omaha and Lincoln there's a big red barn just off the side of the road that has a huge TRUMP sign on it. I'll have to see if I can get a picture of it and post it here sometime.

Looking on Google Maps, I see that stretch of the Interstate 80 is around 60 miles, so it could take all day in locating it using that method, but is this the barn?

https://static.politico.com/dims4/default/2b549ce/2147483647/resize/1160x/quality/90/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fstatic.politico.com%2F38%2F05%2F3501c79f493daf13e7fd6758a975%2F180725-farmers-ap-1160.jpg

Looking on Google Maps, I see that stretch of the Interstate 80 is around 60 miles, so it could take all day in locating it using that method, but is this the barn?

https://static.politico.com/dims4/default/2b549ce/2147483647/resize/1160x/quality/90/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fstatic.politico.com%2F38%2F05%2F3501c79f493daf13e7fd6758a975%2F180725-farmers-ap-1160.jpg


Yes, that's it.

Yes, that's it.
O0

That is good.

My Internet skills are still with me!

I don't think he's nearly as dumb as he lets on. If anything, I think he knows exactly what he's doing and he's just good at playing dumb to make himself seem more appealing to "common folk" and to try and bait the left into underestimating and hating him as much as possible.

On Interstate 80 between Omaha and Lincoln there's a big red barn just off the side of the road that has a huge TRUMP sign on it. I'll have to see if I can get a picture of it and post it here sometime.

This all depends upon whether or not he wins reelection. An oft-repeated phrase is that the history books are written by the winners. Should he lose in November and actually leave office peacefully next January, you can rest assured that lots of things will come out about Trump as government files on him are declassified and leaked to the press and he very well could get indicted somewhere down the road. Tellingly, there are no US Navy vessels named after Richard Nixon, and should Donald Trump's name get tarnished in a similar way then you probably won't see any monuments to Trump except for maybe a few made by some remaining fanatical diehards.

Should he win, however, all bets are off. If that happens, Trump could have his face added to Mount Rushmore for all we know. :o :o :o


God I hope that doesn't happen.

Should he win, however, all bets are off. If that happens, Trump could have his face added to Mount Rushmore for all we know.  :o :o :o
...and how will the Election be achieved if social distancing still has to take place?

Vote by mail, hopefully. Although from what I’ve seen, there are plenty of Wisconsinites and Michiganders willing to risk disease and death to retake their country.

There are some who think he's the literal Messiah. I wish I was kidding. People put TRUMP in big giant letters across their trucks, decorate their cars with Trump bumper stickers, wear shirts with his face on them, wear his hat etc. it's a full-fledged personality cult. When he dies, there will be grandiose statues, paintings, documentaries and mythologies of him, you can be sure of that. He might even show up on the currency and become the next Andrew Jackson ::)


People say is the savior of our country, who saved us from the devil that was Obama. If people in my church said something like that then I will withdraw my membership and find another one, even if they so much as try to convince people to vote for Trump.

People say is the savior of our country, who saved us from the devil that was Obama. If people in my church said something like that then I will withdraw my membership and find another one, even if they so much as try to convince people to vote for Trump.


We were living in the US in 2008 and in the run up to the election a woman at the gym I went to said she thought Obama was the AntiChrist  ::) I had to walk out. Never spoke to her again

I don't think he's nearly as dumb as he lets on. If anything, I think he knows exactly what he's doing and he's just good at playing dumb to make himself seem more appealing to "common folk" and to try and bait the left into underestimating and hating him as much as possible.

On Interstate 80 between Omaha and Lincoln there's a big red barn just off the side of the road that has a huge TRUMP sign on it. I'll have to see if I can get a picture of it and post it here sometime.

This all depends upon whether or not he wins reelection. An oft-repeated phrase is that the history books are written by the winners. Should he lose in November and actually leave office peacefully next January, you can rest assured that lots of things will come out about Trump as government files on him are declassified and leaked to the press and he very well could get indicted somewhere down the road. Tellingly, there are no US Navy vessels named after Richard Nixon, and should Donald Trump's name get tarnished in a similar way then you probably won't see any monuments to Trump except for maybe a few made by some remaining fanatical diehards.

Should he win, however, all bets are off. If that happens, Trump could have his face added to Mount Rushmore for all we know.  :o :o :o


If he wins, the United States as we know it will cease to exist.


Cat

The difference is that Nixon had brains.


Cat


Hence why he was very dangerous :(. Heck, the 'War on Drugs' still rages on to this day.

Do you think it’s possible for Trump to win this year’s election if he still loses the popular vote, like it happened in 2016?

The U.S. police force has a long history of subliminally declaring war on the black community. As a whole, they are a disgrace to this country, the world is finally opening its eyes.

Do you think it’s possible for Trump to win this year’s election if he still loses the popular vote, like it happened in 2016?
It is, because the electoral college still exists. Even Trump wanted it abolished, but he got in anyway and has since remained silent on the matter.

Vote by mail, hopefully. Although from what I’ve seen, there are plenty of Wisconsinites and Michiganders willing to risk disease and death to retake their country.


That's what our family have been doing.

Vote by mail, hopefully. Although from what I’ve seen, there are plenty of Wisconsinites and Michiganders willing to risk disease and death to retake their country.
Can voting by mail be more open to fraud?

The U.S. police force has a long history of subliminally declaring war on the black community. As a whole, they are a disgrace to this country, the world is finally opening its eyes.


Oh hey Millennium! It's been awhile, and yeah, what's happened in our country the past week or so. We're sick and tired of being sick and tired! As an African American male I shouldn't have to be worried or feel like I'm in danger whenever I walk by myself in my neighborhood, but here we are. The entire police force has been corrupt for years and decades.

The U.S. police force has a long history of subliminally declaring war on the black community. As a whole, they are a disgrace to this country, the world is finally opening its eyes.


I wholly disagree. More whites get killed by the police than blacks on average, with 370 whites being killed and 235 blacks being killed in 2019 according to a Statista report. (https://www.statista.com/statistics/585152/people-shot-to-death-by-us-police-by-race/)

Plus, a 77-year-old African-American retired police chief by the name of David Dorn was murdered by looters who stole TVs as he was trying to protect his friend's pawn shop. Doesn't his life matter, too?

https://media.ksdk.com/assets/KSDK/images/3383ea2f-5457-41fb-8afd-ace1b9a7b23c/3383ea2f-5457-41fb-8afd-ace1b9a7b23c_1920x1080.jpg

Don't get me wrong, George Floyd should've never been murdered. But I won't paint him as a martyr/hero as well. The dude was a long-time criminal as he spent five years in prison for a 2009 assault of a pregnant woman as he broke inside her home and put a gun into her stomach and demanded money. He also had past charges of firearm theft and cocaine possession.

I wholly disagree. More whites get killed by the police than blacks on average, with 370 whites being killed and 235 blacks being killed in 2019 according to a Statista report. (https://www.statista.com/statistics/585152/people-shot-to-death-by-us-police-by-race/)

Plus, a 77-year-old African-American retired police chief by the name of David Dorn was murdered by looters who stole TVs as he was trying to protect his friend's pawn shop. Doesn't his life matter, too?

https://media.ksdk.com/assets/KSDK/images/3383ea2f-5457-41fb-8afd-ace1b9a7b23c/3383ea2f-5457-41fb-8afd-ace1b9a7b23c_1920x1080.jpg

Don't get me wrong, George Floyd should've never been murdered. But I won't paint him as a martyr/hero as well. The dude was a long-time criminal as he spent five years in prison for a 2009 assault of a pregnant woman as he broke inside her home and put a gun into her stomach and demanded money. He also had past charges of firearm theft and cocaine possession.
The point is, people are seeing issues with the police as an institution, and the state and capitalism. Even if more white people get murdered than black people, black people are less likely to be taken seriously by the legal system than white people - white people can typically afford to get justice for a victim of a murder or some other crime while black people have almost nothing for themselves. It's all been rigged since America's founding.
Protestors are frustrated with a white supremacist regime where black people have long been denied any meaningful liberation and solutions to combat their problems have been incremental at best. Looters do want free stuff, but some want it because the system will still screw them over and they can't wait or be bothered with trying to get stuff legitimately.
Depending on the individual some people may oppose black cops too. The police have openly hired and in some cases worked with white supremacists and neo-Nazis.

I wholly disagree. More whites get killed by the police than blacks on average, with 370 whites being killed and 235 blacks being killed in 2019 according to a Statista report. (https://www.statista.com/statistics/585152/people-shot-to-death-by-us-police-by-race/)
If we compare to the US demographics, 12% of the population is black and 72% is white. Yet in 2019, 30% of police brutality against known ethnicities was committed to black people (twice more than Hispanics despite outnumbering black people) compared white's 50%.
Statistically that is very unbalanced and something is indeed fishy.

Do you think it’s possible for Trump to win this year’s election if he still loses the popular vote, like it happened in 2016?



Unfortunately, it can happen. Last year, someone (I can't recall who) was saying that Trump could win with a larger deficient of the popular vote than he did in 2016. But, that was last year. Who knows what else is going to happen between now and Nov.



Can voting by mail be more open to fraud?


That is the argument they want to use to prevent voting by mail. Here are some statistics. http://voterfraudfacts.com/voter-fraud-statistics/ Unfortunately, they don't say WHEN this article was written.

To me, the most voter fraud happens when people who are registered are not allowed to vote. Or when they did vote but their votes weren't counted for whatever reason. In 2018, there was a major voter fraud case in North Carolina involving someone who went around (illegally) telling people they could vote absentee and they filled out some paperwork. So those people believed they had already voted (which they didn't).

https://www.gq.com/story/north-carolina-ninth-district-fraud


BTW, Carlos & I just voted in mail-in ballot for a special election our town is having this Tuesday (for the school budget). Instead of spending on the postage, Carlos took it over to our town office (which I can see the building from where I am sitting right now).


Cat

I wholly disagree. More whites get killed by the police than blacks on average, with 370 whites being killed and 235 blacks being killed in 2019 according to a Statista report. (https://www.statista.com/statistics/585152/people-shot-to-death-by-us-police-by-race/)

Plus, a 77-year-old African-American retired police chief by the name of David Dorn was murdered by looters who stole TVs as he was trying to protect his friend's pawn shop. Doesn't his life matter, too?

https://media.ksdk.com/assets/KSDK/images/3383ea2f-5457-41fb-8afd-ace1b9a7b23c/3383ea2f-5457-41fb-8afd-ace1b9a7b23c_1920x1080.jpg

Don't get me wrong, George Floyd should've never been murdered. But I won't paint him as a martyr/hero as well. The dude was a long-time criminal as he spent five years in prison for a 2009 assault of a pregnant woman as he broke inside her home and put a gun into her stomach and demanded money. He also had past charges of firearm theft and cocaine possession.


All because he passed a counterfeit 20 dollar bill, could it have been by accident maybe? Didn't he have another real 20 dollar bill in his wallet?  ???

All because he passed a counterfeit 20 dollar bill, could it have been by accident maybe? Didn't he have another real 20 dollar bill in his wallet?  ???


But should the death penalty be used for passing a $20 counterfeit bill?


Cat

That is the argument they want to use to prevent voting by mail. Here are some statistics. http://voterfraudfacts.com/voter-fraud-statistics/ Unfortunately, they don't say WHEN this article was written.

To me, the most voter fraud happens when people who are registered are not allowed to vote. Or when they did vote but their votes weren't counted for whatever reason. In 2018, there was a major voter fraud case in North Carolina involving someone who went around (illegally) telling people they could vote absentee and they filled out some paperwork. So those people believed they had already voted (which they didn't).

https://www.gq.com/story/north-carolina-ninth-district-fraud


BTW, Carlos & I just voted in mail-in ballot for a special election our town is having this Tuesday (for the school budget). Instead of spending on the postage, Carlos took it over to our town office (which I can see the building from where I am sitting right now).


Cat
Slightly off topic but involves voting fraud, there is a story whether it is true or not I do not know, but I like it. In the Philippines, during the Marcus reign there was an election and the area of Turtle Islands returned around 4,000 votes from a voting population of 800, it is said the turtles came out to vote.

But should the death penalty be used for passing a $20 counterfeit bill?


Cat


I'm sure it could've been by accident, I mean how many counterfeits have people passed in their lifetime? A true story, I went to buy some lunch at Popeye's a couple of months ago and I didn't know one of the bills I gave them was a counterfeit bill so I apologized, stepped out and left.

Slightly off topic but involves voting fraud, there is a story whether it is true or not I do not know, but I like it. In the Philippines, during the Marcus reign there was an election and the area of Turtle Islands returned around 4,000 votes from a voting population of 800, it is said the turtles came out to vote.



I also heard stories that in the 2004 election, Bush had more votes than the population in some towns. Again, don't know how true it was.


Cat

I'm sure it could've been by accident, I mean how many counterfeits have people passed in their lifetime? A true story, I went to buy some lunch at Popeye's a couple of months ago and I didn't know one of the bills I gave them was a counterfeit bill so I apologized, stepped out and left.


My point was that whether it was an accident or not, it certainly didn't deserve the death penalty. Especially without a trial.


Cat

I'm sure it could've been by accident, I mean how many counterfeits have people passed in their lifetime? A true story, I went to buy some lunch at Popeye's a couple of months ago and I didn't know one of the bills I gave them was a counterfeit bill so I apologized, stepped out and left.


I would have no idea if I was passing a phony bill. But I carry so little cash that I could probably tell you exactly where I got it.

I wholly disagree. More whites get killed by the police than blacks on average, with 370 whites being killed and 235 blacks being killed in 2019 according to a Statista report. (https://www.statista.com/statistics/585152/people-shot-to-death-by-us-police-by-race/)

Plus, a 77-year-old African-American retired police chief by the name of David Dorn was murdered by looters who stole TVs as he was trying to protect his friend's pawn shop. Doesn't his life matter, too?

https://media.ksdk.com/assets/KSDK/images/3383ea2f-5457-41fb-8afd-ace1b9a7b23c/3383ea2f-5457-41fb-8afd-ace1b9a7b23c_1920x1080.jpg

Don't get me wrong, George Floyd should've never been murdered. But I won't paint him as a martyr/hero as well. The dude was a long-time criminal as he spent five years in prison for a 2009 assault of a pregnant woman as he broke inside her home and put a gun into her stomach and demanded money. He also had past charges of firearm theft and cocaine possession.

These are nothing but the typical right-wing/centrist talking head points. I have heard the "white Americans are killed more by the police than Black Americans" rebuttal one too many times. Quite frankly, I am tired of responding to it. Black Americans make up only 13% of the American population, white Americans make up a much greater percentage than that (over 70%). That means that more white people are going to have encounters with the police. That does not mean that white people are being killed at a higher rate than blacks, the opposite is true.
Blacks are killed at least a 23% rate, while white are killed at 8%. That is 235 blacks killed out of a population of 13% and 370 whites out of a population of 70%. The two do not compare, period.

You are also overlooking key components, including the long history of the U.S. police officials and the black community, the ways in which laws are bias towards white criminals so that they have the ability to receive less severe sentences, how prejudice leads to more aggressive behavior when dealing with black suspects, and other factors.

Who asked anyone to paint him as a hero or martyr? No one is doing that, his death is being used  as symbolism for police brutality within the  black community all across the world. That is not equal to painting him as a hero. Heros and martyr are individuals who are upheld for their nobility or who are murdered for their beliefs/fight for social justice. Protesters who are out here putting their lives on the line everyday are the martyrs.

Lastly, what does that officer being killed have to do with what I posted?  Don't try to use another black person against me to gain sympathy, because I do not care if an officer is black or white. I literally said, the police force as a whole have declared war the black community for decades. They train their officers to think a certain way and be apathetic. Something that has been seen throughout this entire ordeal. The truth is in the videos online for the world to see now.

On the subject of numbers:

https://i.imgur.com/R435g7h.jpg

My point was that whether it was an accident or not, it certainly didn't deserve the death penalty. Especially without a trial.


Cat


Maybe he went to buy something to eat and he didn't know the bill was a phony, but you're right he didn't deserve to die.

I would have no idea if I was passing a phony bill. But I carry so little cash that I could probably tell you exactly where I got it.


I'm not sure where mine came from.

If we compare to the US demographics, 12% of the population is black and 72% is white. Yet in 2019, 30% of police brutality against known ethnicities was committed to black people (twice more than Hispanics despite outnumbering black people) compared white's 50%.
Statistically that is very unbalanced and something is indeed fishy.


I was about to say that. You can't conflate the numbers, as Blacks are only 12% of the population. Another similar statistic is drug usage. Blacks and Whites both use marijuana at similar rates, but Blacks are four times more likely to be charged and convicted for using it, compared to whites.

There is no question that our criminal justice system is replete with systemic racism, and no wonder, our whole society is replete with systemic racism.  Our country was built on the enslavement of one race and the extermination of another

Sinclair Lewis said "when fascism comes to America it will be wrapped in the flag and carrying a cross".  See Trump's photo op at St John's church.  But the military is in revolt against using troops against civilian protesters.  So maybe that day isn't as near as I feared

I find it laughable that there are people out there that think Trump is a friend of the common people.

All he did to get more money growing up was inherit money from his already-billionaire parents, then gambled billions of  it to only occasionally get more money than he put in.

Somebody who has lived a life as effortless as that is not somebody I want controlling anything.

Sinclair Lewis said "when fascism comes to America it will be wrapped in the flag and carrying a cross".  See Trump's photo op at St John's church.  But the military is in revolt against using troops against civilian protesters.  So maybe that day isn't as near as I feared


If Trump gets reelected I can imagine a society so dystopian that it will make even 2020 look like the "good 'ol days" by comparison. Think "1984" meets "A Handmaid's Tale".


I find it laughable that there are people out there that think Trump is a friend of the common people.

All he did to get more money growing up was inherit money from his already-billionaire parents, then gambled billions of  it to only occasionally get more money than he put in.

Somebody who has lived a life as effortless as that is not somebody I want controlling anything.


I've known people thought he would be great for the economy since he's a businessman and good at handling money.

If Trump gets reelected I can imagine a society so dystopian that it will make even 2020 look like the "good 'ol days" by comparison. Think "1984" meets "A Handmaid's Tale".

I've known people thought he would be great for the economy since he's a businessman and good at handling money.


Yeah, he was such a good businessman that he had to file bankruptcy SIX TIMES!!!!   Now, it looks like he is bankrupting the U.S.


Cat

I find it laughable that there are people out there that think Trump is a friend of the common people.

All he did to get more money growing up was inherit money from his already-billionaire parents, then gambled billions of  it to only occasionally get more money than he put in.

Somebody who has lived a life as effortless as that is not somebody I want controlling anything.


So how is he making America great?  ::)

dddd K-Pop fans flooding fascist hashtags like #Trump2020 with K-Pop videos.

We stan queens, not has-beens!

https://i.gifer.com/ToKa.gif

So how is he making America great?  ::)


HAHAHA yeah!

So how is he making America great?  ::)
Bringing it back two centuries when unions were brutally suppressed, women lived like shadows compared to men, gays were forced to be cured, racism was accepted etc.

I'm actually hoping the states will become independent nations, like the former Soviet Union did. I love Georgia but I just wish it wasn't a part of America. I feel like no matter where I go in the country it's the same BS.


There is already another country called Georgia.

HAHAHA yeah!


He has made friends with evil dictators such as Kim Jong Un and Vladimir Putin.  ::)

I’ve been feeling really pessimistic lately. I honestly don’t know if I’m catastrophizing things or if they really are as bad as they seem. I just feel like something really, really bad is around the corner. Anyone else feel this? I am scared, especially after reading this article:

https://eand.co/this-is-americas-fascist-collapse-c830c1d2271a

Everything seems so hopeless.

I’ve been feeling really pessimistic lately. I honestly don’t know if I’m catastrophizing things or if they really are as bad as they seem. I just feel like something really, really bad is around the corner. Anyone else feel this? I am scared, especially after reading this article:

https://eand.co/this-is-americas-fascist-collapse-c830c1d2271a

Everything seems so hopeless.


"Catastrophizing". An interesting word.

Bringing it back two centuries when unions were brutally suppressed, women lived like shadows compared to men, gays were forced to be cured, racism was accepted etc.


He's making America for Americans only. No immigrants allowed. My own wife might get deported.


There is already another country called Georgia.


Georgia will have to change its name to avoid confusion. Maybe it can be named after Kemp, lol.


I’ve been feeling really pessimistic lately. I honestly don’t know if I’m catastrophizing things or if they really are as bad as they seem. I just feel like something really, really bad is around the corner. Anyone else feel this? I am scared, especially after reading this article:

https://eand.co/this-is-americas-fascist-collapse-c830c1d2271a

Everything seems so hopeless.


Like I've been saying, 2020 might be a good year compared to what's to follow. I've been inspired to write a book about a dystopian America in the future with a future president that makes Trump look like Mister Rogers, but now it might be too much like reality.

He's making America for Americans only. No immigrants allowed. My own wife might get deported.
Essentially only white people, and once they got that sorted out, only white Christians (or white people who conform to conservative Christian norms irrespective of religion).

He's making America for Americans only. No immigrants allowed. My own wife might get deported.


Okay, well, that's a reach. My stepmom immigrated here from Liberia through legal documentation last year, so she was definitely allowed.

I don't think you and your wife have anything to worry about as well. People who are undocumented in the U.S. have things to worry about.

Plus, this should be in the Politics thread.

Essentially only white people, and once they got that sorted out, only white Christians (or white people who conform to conservative Christian norms irrespective of religion).


I'm glad you clarified. There's a huge difference between people who actually follow Christ and His teachings in the Bible and those who call themselves Christians just because they attend church every Sunday but their actions completely contradict the Bible. For the latter group it seems like you just have to be pro-life and anti-gay and whatever else conforms to their cult of personality and they will turn a blind eye to everything else. I refuse to attend a church that tries to make it mandatory to vote Republican. I used to go to one and it made me miserable.


Okay, well, that's a reach. My stepmom immigrated here from Liberia through legal documentation last year, so she was definitely allowed.

I don't think you and your wife have anything to worry about as well. People who are undocumented in the U.S. have things to worry about.

Plus, this should be in the Politics thread.


My wife is Ukrainian and we are worried, because she already got denied once. We have refiled. They have suspected our marriage is fraudulent.

These are nothing but the typical right-wing/centrist talking head points. I have heard the "white Americans are killed more by the police than Black Americans" rebuttal one too many times. Quite frankly, I am tired of responding to it. Black Americans make up only 13% of the American population, white Americans make up a much greater percentage than that (over 70%). That means that more white people are going to have encounters with the police. That does not mean that white people are being killed at a higher rate than blacks, the opposite is true.
Blacks are killed at least a 23% rate, while white are killed at 8%. That is 235 blacks killed out of a population of 13% and 370 whites out of a population of 70%. The two do not compare, period.

You are also overlooking key components, including the long history of the U.S. police officials and the black community, the ways in which laws are bias towards white criminals so that they have the ability to receive less severe sentences, how prejudice leads to more aggressive behavior when dealing with black suspects, and other factors.


Fair enough, and I understand the disproportionate rate of encounters with black people getting killed by police officers with your analysis.

But the amount of unarmed blacks getting shot dead is actually really low. According to the Washington Post, only 10 unarmed black people were shot dead in 2019, and there are over 40 million of us. Like with every other race, black people are killed more by their own race than police officers. From 1976 to 2005, 94% of black victims were killed by other black people (https://www.nationalreview.com/magazine/2019/12/22/the-need-to-discuss-black-on-black-crime/).

If there was a full-on police war against black people in this day and age, then I fail to see it.

"Catastrophizing". An interesting word.


It’s a psychological term

https://psychcentral.com/lib/what-is-catastrophizing/

Fair enough, and I understand the disproportionate rate of encounters with black people getting killed by police officers with your analysis.

But the amount of unarmed blacks getting shot dead is actually really low. According to the Washington Post, only 10 unarmed black people were shot dead in 2019, and there are over 40 million of us. Like with every other race, black people are killed more by their own race than police officers. From 1976 to 2005, 94% of black victims were killed by other black people (https://www.nationalreview.com/magazine/2019/12/22/the-need-to-discuss-black-on-black-crime/).

If there was a full-on police war against black people in this day and age, then I fail to see it.


Lynchings also only killed 50-200 people a year during their heyday (around 60-130 for Black people), and there were 3 lynchings in 1938 when Billie Holiday sang Strange Fruit. Do you think that was overblown too? Would you feel safe if lynching was still around?  ???

https://www.famous-trials.com/sheriffshipp/1084-lynchingsyear

But the amount of unarmed blacks getting shot dead is actually really low. According to the Washington Post, only 10 unarmed black people were shot dead in 2019, and there are over 40 million of us.


The Washington Post only reports individuals who have been shot by police. They do not include suspects killed using other means of force. For example, because officers did not use firearms, even high-profile cases such as George Floyd, Eric Garner, and Freddie Gray are not found in the database; much less low-profile cases.

There are many forms of police brutality outside of gunfire including choking or restraint of the neck, body-pinning, punching, kicking, tasering, macing, and K9 bites among others. According to MappingPoliceViolence, which accounts for killings by police with a firearm or other force; from 2013-19 unarmed black suspects were still 1.3x more likely to be killed than their white counterparts. In 2015, Unarmed blacks were killed at 5x the rate of unarmed whites.

https://mappingpoliceviolence.org]

https://mappingpoliceviolence.org/unarmed


And according to Washington Post, in 2015 they found that of all fatal shootings involving unarmed suspects, 40% were unarmed black men and that black men were less likely to be attacking a police officer before being shot compared to their white counter parts.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/national/study-finds-police-fatally-shoot-unarmed-black-men-at-disproportionate-rates/2016/04/06/e494563e-fa74-11e5-80e4-c381214de1a3_story.html

That number has decreased since 2015 and probably in part to the scrutiny police have been experiencing in the media.

However, this is still only one component of police brutality. There are also instances of excessive, but non-lethal force by an officer, much of which is also under reported. Then there are other factors I listed in my previous post that contribute to the strained relationship between police and the black community.


Like with every other race, black people are killed more by their own race than police officers. From 1976 to 2005, 94% of black victims were killed by other black people (https://www.nationalreview.com/magazine/2019/12/22/the-need-to-discuss-black-on-black-crime/).


A trend that is to be expected if most races live together in concentrated areas. No matter how severely you decrease crime and homicide, this figure will remain true as long as communities are segregated.

Police can be of any race. In the 70s, police departments were required to hire more people of color and in modern times, some cities hire more officers of color as police reform. Sometimes, officers of a certain race are deployed into communities that reflect their race, including black police officers. However, blacks are still disproportionately killed at higher rate even where there are more black police officers. So on a different note, it is not clear if that 94% statistic includes black officers who kill black suspects. I'm not able to determine that from the article. Criticism of police is less about the individual and more about the institution as a whole and it relates to the justice system. 

This is from the movie The Great Debaters-based on a true story. Excellent movie, BTW.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TDw_YXOh8N8&t=4s


Cat

So Merriam Webster is updating their definition of racism to include systemic racism at the instigation of a young black woman - about time