http://money.cnn.com/2018/01/24/technology/self-driving-car-safety/index.html

It's about time.
:)

http://money.cnn.com/2018/01/24/technology/self-driving-car-safety/index.html

It's about time.
:)


I don't care what others may drive, but as for me, a 4 or 5 speed manual is a must.  If I wanted someone (or something) else to drive I'd call a cab

This will free up so much time, and will reduce the number of deaths on the road. One of the most exciting technologies on the horizon, along with affordable electric cars.

I don't care what others may drive, but as for me, a 4 or 5 speed manual is a must.  If I wanted someone (or something) else to drive I'd call a cab


Ditto.

Now here is my beef with the autonomous vehicle industry. They have put out this false narrative that somehow an autonomous vehicle is "safe" if there is also a human at the wheel. This is nonsense and I am fairly sure that they know it.

My experience in manufacturing... with inspectors... is that if you want to ruin an operation and see quality decline, put on TWO inspectors. It is a guarantee for trouble. The reason is... each guy figures the other one will find the problems. And inevitably, when a problem occurs, you have two guys, each saying "I thought that the other guy was looking for that."

Either a human is driving a car or he is not. There's no in-between and so the concept of a "human supervised autonomous vehicle" is pure BS. I am waiting for this concept to get shredded in a courtroom for the inevitable fatality involving a human supervised autonomous vehicle.

http://money.cnn.com/2018/01/24/technology/self-driving-car-safety/index.html

It's about time.
:)


Will these self-driving cars include a GPS? ???

I have mixed feeling about it. As someone who hasn't driven a car in over a decade, the thought of not having to rely on a "chauffeur" sounds nice. But, having to rely on a machine to ensure my safety sounds VERY scary.



Cat

But, having to rely on a machine to ensure my safety sounds VERY scary.


AI-driven cars don't have to do much to be safer than human-driven cars.

It's good, I am looking forward to it. It will solve a lot of problems.

AI-driven cars don't have to do much to be safer than human-driven cars.


Seriously. 95%+ of accidents are caused by humans not paying attention, not because of unfortunate circumstances. I'm sick to death of hearing about 6 year olds dying in car accidents. Just this epidemic of texting and driving tells me that self-driving cars can't come soon enough. When I sit at the back of the bus, I can see into other people's cars. I swear, I passed by 6 cars IN A ROW at an intersection where the people on the driver's seat were on their phones!

There's a yin and a yang to everything!  :P

Ditto.

Now here is my beef with the autonomous vehicle industry. They have put out this false narrative that somehow an autonomous vehicle is "safe" if there is also a human at the wheel. This is nonsense and I am fairly sure that they know it.

My experience in manufacturing... with inspectors... is that if you want to ruin an operation and see quality decline, put on TWO inspectors. It is a guarantee for trouble. The reason is... each guy figures the other one will find the problems. And inevitably, when a problem occurs, you have two guys, each saying "I thought that the other guy was looking for that."

Either a human is driving a car or he is not. There's no in-between and so the concept of a "human supervised autonomous vehicle" is pure BS. I am waiting for this concept to get shredded in a courtroom for the inevitable fatality involving a human supervised autonomous vehicle.


Car design is hideous today. And it hasn't changed one bit since the late 2000s.
I can't wait for something new to come along and put the hideous 2015 SUV six feet under.
I have a feeling that once car design changes, pop culture changes. I don't want to be stuck in the same 2015 rut until the day I die. Nonetheless, the people today are vain, superficial, stuck-up, soulless and act like they're billionaire CEOs even though they reside in a crummy little apartment with their beer-swilling redneck daddy at the age of 25.
I'll lose it one day if I have to deal with the same #selfie/snapchat/Instagram culture until' I'm old enough to retire. And have to deal with hideous car design to boot. Seriously, I don't want to end up like D-Fens in "Falling Down" or Travis Bickle or Paul Kersey.
Time for a change.

Seriously. 95%+ of accidents are caused by humans not paying attention, not because of unfortunate circumstances. I'm sick to death of hearing about 6 year olds dying in car accidents. Just this epidemic of texting and driving tells me that self-driving cars can't come soon enough. When I sit at the back of the bus, I can see into other people's cars. I swear, I passed by 6 cars IN A ROW at an intersection where the people on the driver's seat were on their phones!


What state do you live in?
I have found that some people are more phone-obsessed than others, depending on your state/location.

There will be car holograms soon too!  :o

I have mixed feeling about it. As someone who hasn't driven a car in over a decade, the thought of not having to rely on a "chauffeur" sounds nice. But, having to rely on a machine to ensure my safety sounds VERY scary.



Cat


and what if the car gets busted for a DUI?

What state do you live in?
I have found that some people are more phone-obsessed than others, depending on your state/location.


Ontario, Canada. Do you have the data for that?

Where I live, texting and driving is punishable with a minimum fine of $800. The distracted driving law is very severe here, but people still do it.

Where I live, texting and driving is punishable with a minimum fine of $800. The distracted driving law is very severe here, but people still do it.


It's hard to get caught. On another forum I go on, there was a person that watches Netflix and drives, and he was asking for tips on how to stop because driving is so boring.  ::)

You could watch 'more adult movies' in the car while it's driving itself.  :(  :(  :(

You could watch 'more adult movies' in the car while it's driving itself.  :(  :(  :(

The possibilities are endless.
http://assets.nydailynews.com/polopoly_fs/1.1621560.1392930558!/img/httpImage/image.jpg_gen/derivatives/article_750/image-1-1621560.jpg

You could watch 'more adult movies' in the car while it's driving itself.  :(  :(  :(


Now that's a great idea. ;D

Now that's a great idea. ;D


It will be in full VR.

The possibilities are endless.
http://assets.nydailynews.com/polopoly_fs/1.1621560.1392930558!/img/httpImage/image.jpg_gen/derivatives/article_750/image-1-1621560.jpg


:(  :(  :(

What if you wanted to get something to eat at a drive-in?  ???

What if you wanted to get something to eat at a drive-in?  ???

It would make no difference then. The car would be smart enough to know how to get to the drive-in.

It would make no difference then. The car would be smart enough to know how to get to the drive-in.


I sure hope so.

I'll stick to driving myself thanks.

I'll stick to driving myself thanks.


Well that's just, like, your choice, man.

I heard somewhere that self-driving cars are coming out in 2020 or something? I don't know exactly where it was from, but I do know it was a post made in late 2009.

I heard somewhere that self-driving cars are coming out in 2020 or something? I don't know exactly where it was from, but I do know it was a post made in late 2009.

They are already out. Nobody knows when they will catch on or be accessible to common folks however.

I bet you green money that they will never catch on with most of the market willingly. The idea of a robot controlling your car is simply too creepy for most people. Even if the technology was perfect, there's always that fatal "what if?" IE "what if the computer fails mid-ride?" "What if Russia hacks the AI of the car?" "What if one car's AI fails and crashes into my car?" People don't like to give up freedoms willingly and driving is a freedom. It's a matter of being able to have personal control over one's own fate.

I predict that only 30% of the populace will stick to it, but the government will make manually driven cars harder to come by or more expensive to own and probably by 2040 or so you'll see the number of self-driven AI cars meet or exceed manual cars; By the end of century our great wonderful governments will then step in and make manual cars illegal or only available with very highly specialized and highly regulated operator permits.

And we'll be one step closer to making WALL-E a reality. Yay.

I bet you green money that they will never catch on with most of the market willingly. The idea of a robot controlling your car is simply too creepy for most people. Even if the technology was perfect, there's always that fatal "what if?" IE "what if the computer fails mid-ride?" "What if Russia hacks the AI of the car?" "What if one car's AI fails and crashes into my car?" People don't like to give up freedoms willingly and driving is a freedom. It's a matter of being able to have personal control over one's own fate.

I predict that only 30% of the populace will stick to it, but the government will make manually driven cars harder to come by or more expensive to own and probably by 2040 or so you'll see the number of self-driven AI cars meet or exceed manual cars; By the end of century our great wonderful governments will then step in and make manual cars illegal or only available with very highly specialized and highly regulated operator permits.

And we'll be one step closer to making WALL-E a reality. Yay.

I disagree. In the near future, manual cars will be considered a niche and 80-90% of people will be on self driving cars. Your "what if" example applies way more to humans driving the car. More accidents occur from human error than they would from computer error, far more. Self driving cars would save many lives, prevent accidents, and solve a lot of problems. Given your argument, we wouldn't have planes flying in the sky today because people found flying in the air scary and creepy too....

The only question is "when" not "if". They are already out now...

I myself am starting to warm up to taking the bus

I think self driving cars will kill car ownership because you'll be able to order a self driving car anywhere you are from your smartphone in a matter of minutes. Some people will still own their own cars, but there won't be any need once self driving cars become accessible everywhere. You can order the type of car from your smartphone and the price increases for the more features you want like a movie theatre car, lounge car, limo, etc. People would order and use these everyday to get to work and for daily errands as the cars will arrive instantly (because they will be everywhere, even more than Uber) so it will kill car ownership. Transit may still be around as a cheaper option, but it will be self-driving busses/rail as well and it will fit more people and it will be less needed as self-driving cars will be affordable and efficient enough.

I disagree. In the near future, manual cars will be considered a niche and 80-90% of people will be on self driving cars. Your "what if" example applies way more to humans driving the car. More accidents occur from human error than they would from computer error, far more. Self driving cars would save many lives, prevent accidents, and solve a lot of problems. Given your argument, we wouldn't have planes flying in the sky today because people found flying in the air scary and creepy too....

The only question is "when" not "if". They are already out now...


Your argument falls flat because planes still give the illusion of human control by having a human pilot and co-pilot in the cockpit. Even if the plane is mostly controlled by a computer, do you think your average Joe knows that? No. They know there's a human pilot up front. It's different than there literally being a ghost driving the car.

Yes, manual cars will be eventually niche but not by choice but through insurance rates on manuals being jacked through the roof and the government cracking down on their usage. But I do not predict that it will happen in the 2020s as far as regular, middle class level passenger travel is concerned. You'll see it first in things like trucking/shipping, then either public transportation or taxi services. The general middle class public will be eased into it, and also at the same time regulated and financially squeezed into it. I don't predict manual cars on the consumer passenger level falling below the majority until the late 2030s or 2040s. I also predict that many people, such as those of my generation (Millenials) and older, will be hesitant to give up their manual automobiles and will be grandfathered in in some way.

But this is not a step forward for the human race, safety aside. This is another dumbing down of human society in the name of convenience and safety, and it is another step on the road to a society of fat, low intelligent, docile farm animals like WALL-E or like the Eloi of the Time Machine.

Your argument falls flat because planes still give the illusion of human control by having a human pilot and co-pilot in the cockpit. Even if the plane is mostly controlled by a computer, do you think your average Joe knows that? No. They know there's a human pilot up front. It's different than there literally being a ghost driving the car.

Yes, manual cars will be eventually niche but not by choice but through insurance rates on manuals being jacked through the roof and the government cracking down on their usage. But I do not predict that it will happen in the 2020s as far as regular, middle class level passenger travel is concerned. You'll see it first in things like trucking/shipping, then either public transportation or taxi services. The general middle class public will be eased into it, and also at the same time regulated and financially squeezed into it. I don't predict manual cars on the consumer passenger level falling below the majority until the late 2030s or 2040s. I also predict that many people, such as those of my generation (Millenials) and older, will be hesitant to give up their manual automobiles and will be grandfathered in in some way.

But this is not a step forward for the human race, safety aside. This is another dumbing down of human society in the name of convenience and safety, and it is another step on the road to a society of fat, low intelligent, docile farm animals like WALL-E or like the Eloi of the Time Machine.

No it is something that is essential so people stop dying in car accidents and an increase in safety... I have no idea why you would be against it but whatever. Also, no a plane flying in the air was a super creepy and scary thought even if people were flying it, way more than automated vehicles. There is also a human inside self driving cars too. There is absolutely no reason for you to be against it or creeped out by it if it would save countless lives and solve many problems. There is no logical reason for it.

I heard somewhere that self-driving cars are coming out in 2020 or something? I don't know exactly where it was from, but I do know it was a post made in late 2009.


That's when the Google self-driving car is slated to come out. But like Slim said, we already have self-driving cars on the road e.g. The Tesla Model 3 which has an autopilot mode. Many cars nowadays come with some assisted driving technology such as automatic parking or automatically pulling the brakes when there's a hazard in front of you.

Your argument falls flat because planes still give the illusion of human control by having a human pilot and co-pilot in the cockpit. Even if the plane is mostly controlled by a computer, do you think your average Joe knows that? No. They know there's a human pilot up front. It's different than there literally being a ghost driving the car.

Yes, manual cars will be eventually niche but not by choice but through insurance rates on manuals being jacked through the roof and the government cracking down on their usage. But I do not predict that it will happen in the 2020s as far as regular, middle class level passenger travel is concerned. You'll see it first in things like trucking/shipping, then either public transportation or taxi services. The general middle class public will be eased into it, and also at the same time regulated and financially squeezed into it. I don't predict manual cars on the consumer passenger level falling below the majority until the late 2030s or 2040s. I also predict that many people, such as those of my generation (Millenials) and older, will be hesitant to give up their manual automobiles and will be grandfathered in in some way.

But this is not a step forward for the human race, safety aside. This is another dumbing down of human society in the name of convenience and safety, and it is another step on the road to a society of fat, low intelligent, docile farm animals like WALL-E or like the Eloi of the Time Machine.


If insurers are offering steep discounts on self-driving cars then that literally means it's safer.

And there's nothing productive or intelligent about driving a car. You don't get skinny by driving lol. You probably burn maybe 2 or 3 more calorie playing Candy Crush than throwing up your finger every now and then in road rage ;D

Nothing is 100% safe. Even machines can crash. :o

I don't care what others may drive, but as for me, a 4 or 5 speed manual is a must.  If I wanted someone (or something) else to drive I'd call a cab


If you can still find them. Only 3% of new cars in the US still have manual transmissions.

https://res.cloudinary.com/teepublic/image/private/s--rpCMPe8O--/t_Preview/b_rgb:262c3a,c_limit,f_jpg,h_630,q_90,w_630/v1460603935/production/designs/477675_1.jpg

Nothing is 100% safe. Even machines can crash. :o


Doesn't mean we shouldn't engage in harm reduction. The world would be a much better place if 20 people/yr were dying from self driving car accidents vs. the tens of thousands that get killed or crippled for life like today.

It's very irrational to be afraid of self driving cars (that have been through serious product testing) and then hop into your human-driven car like you just chose the safe option. It's like the people who are afraid of flying even though there were zero aviation fatalities on commercial passager planes in 2017, but then hop into a car like it's Mario Kart.

I've been in the trucking industry for over 25 years and I keep seeing articles about how all the truck drivers are going to be unemployed in the next 5-10 years because of automation.

I've seen way too many glitches in electronic devices to be able to trust them blindly. I've read story after story about truckers who have driven their trucks into neighborhoods or have destroyed bridges that were rated too low for the trucks weight or have gone down bike paths and the drivers adamantly insist that they did nothing wrong because they were just "following their GPS." And although I rely on Google Maps to navigate around town, I've had more than one occasion where the location I entered ended up being off by distances ranging from a few blocks to a few miles. Yet we're supposed to just relax and trust without question that the same people are going to develop systems that are going to safely guide an 80,000 lb vehicle through the Rocky Mountains in the winter without any trouble.

I'm with 90s Guy. I don't want to live in WALL-E World either.

Doesn't mean we shouldn't engage in harm reduction. The world would be a much better place if 20 people/yr were dying from self driving car accidents vs. the tens of thousands that get killed or crippled for life like today.

It's very irrational to be afraid of self driving cars (that have been through serious product testing) and then hop into your human-driven car like you just chose the safe option. It's like the people who are afraid of flying even though there were zero aviation fatalities on commercial passager planes in 2017, but then hop into a car like it's Mario Kart.


You have great points, I was just pointing out that nothing's 100% secure! Yeah, I agree with a lot of what you said.

I've been in the trucking industry for over 25 years and I keep seeing articles about how all the truck drivers are going to be unemployed in the next 5-10 years because of automation.

I've seen way too many glitches in electronic devices to be able to trust them blindly. I've read story after story about truckers who have driven their trucks into neighborhoods or have destroyed bridges that were rated too low for the trucks weight or have gone down bike paths and the drivers adamantly insist that they did nothing wrong because they were just "following their GPS." And although I rely on Google Maps to navigate around town, I've had more than one occasion where the location I entered ended up being off by distances ranging from a few blocks to a few miles. Yet we're supposed to just relax and trust without question that the same people are going to develop systems that are going to safely guide an 80,000 lb vehicle through the Rocky Mountains in the winter without any trouble.

I'm with 90s Guy. I don't want to live in WALL-E World either.

So you would prefer more accidents to happen on the road due to human error just because because of past experience that has nothing to do with automotive vehicles?  ??? Well at any rate, even if you don't feel comfortable with them they are coming and very soon regardless. A couple people not wanting positive change to happen that can save numerous lives and improve fatality rates such as yourself and 90s Guy won't stop it from happening anyway.

how do we know how positive of a change this could be? How would we know if these things wont cause crashes. 


How about if more people took buses and stuff so there would be less stuff to crash into?

how do we know how positive of a change this could be? How would we know if these things wont cause crashes. 


How about if more people took buses and stuff so there would be less stuff to crash into?

Because of the statistics. Most crashes are caused by human error such as distracted driving. Computers are a lot more advanced than humans in terms of driving so there would be less accidents. Can there be a glitch here and there? Of course. But it won't can't compare to the frequency in the human "glitch" that occurs every day on the road.

Why don't we just have machines do EVERYTHING for us since they're so perfect, then? I don't get the desire for the world to be like WALL-E. Oh well, I'm 27 now, I'll probably be in my 40s or 50s when these stupid robot cars become mainstream and by then I'll be able to hold onto MY car.

Why don't we just have machines do EVERYTHING for us since they're so perfect, then? I don't get the desire for the world to be like WALL-E. Oh well, I'm 27 now, I'll probably be in my 40s or 50s when these stupid robot cars become mainstream and by then I'll be able to hold onto MY car.


That's the point. Have machines do the tedious so we can concentrate on things that actually matter to us.

There's nothing monumental about putting your foot on a pedal. I wonder if there were people in the 1890s talking about how lazy and stupid car drivers are, compared to pedestrians. The things you're saying are completely ridiculous.

If you can still find them. Only 3% of new cars in the US still have manual transmissions.

https://res.cloudinary.com/teepublic/image/private/s--rpCMPe8O--/t_Preview/b_rgb:262c3a,c_limit,f_jpg,h_630,q_90,w_630/v1460603935/production/designs/477675_1.jpg


True enough, although last year, when I bought my 6 speed Honda Civic, we found a few choices.  My guess is that high end "sports cars" with manuals will be available, although for big bucks

Nothing is 100% safe. Even machines can crash. :o


Yep, they sure can.

Why don't we just have machines do EVERYTHING for us since they're so perfect, then? I don't get the desire for the world to be like WALL-E. Oh well, I'm 27 now, I'll probably be in my 40s or 50s when these stupid robot cars become mainstream and by then I'll be able to hold onto MY car.


That's what the world will be like, living in a world where computers and robots will do all the work for you.

I don't care what others may drive, but as for me, a 4 or 5 speed manual is a must.  If I wanted someone (or something) else to drive I'd call a cab
I'm all for 6 speed gear boxes. When I hit 50km/h (~30mph) I can shift to 5th in my car. When I go 130 km/h (~80mph) on the Autobahn I'm still in 5th. ::)

That's what the world will be like, living in a world where computers and robots will do all the work for you.


And why would anyone other than a completely lazy person want that? Work and effort are part of the enjoyment of life. Simply existing while everyone is done for you isn't healthy.

And the comparison with automobiles at the town of the century is stupid. There was still a human involved. Cars were just motorized carriages and carriages driven by horses had been the norm for around 300 years. But even with those, there was a human steering the horse, or the car.

I would rather be in a horse drawn carriage than a self-driving car. I want the freedom to do what the hell I want as far as travel. Not have some soulless machine do it for me.

I think self driving cars will kill car ownership because you'll be able to order a self driving car anywhere you are from your smartphone in a matter of minutes. Some people will still own their own cars, but there won't be any need once self driving cars become accessible everywhere. You can order the type of car from your smartphone and the price increases for the more features you want like a movie theatre car, lounge car, limo, etc. People would order and use these everyday to get to work and for daily errands as the cars will arrive instantly (because they will be everywhere, even more than Uber) so it will kill car ownership. Transit may still be around as a cheaper option, but it will be self-driving busses/rail as well and it will fit more people and it will be less needed as self-driving cars will be affordable and efficient enough.


Only if you live in or near a major metropolitan area. Once you get into the more rural and remote areas of this country, people are just spread out too far for ride sharing to be feasible. I don't think that a farmer or rancher in the rural Midwest would be too keen about the idea of having to order an autonomous vehicle and then wait an hour or two for it to show up.


So you would prefer more accidents to happen on the road due to human error just because because of past experience that has nothing to do with automotive vehicles?  ???

I'd prefer to keep my livelihood and my pension. As I mentioned earlier, I've been in the trucking industry for over 25 years. And I'll readily admit that I've seen some really awful things out there on the road that no one should ever have to see. Admittedly my occupation can be a hazardous one yet I accept the risks that go along with it, along with the great responsibility I have to the public to do my job as safely and professionally as I possibly can because I don't know if I could live with myself if I ever injured someone or worse.

I'll also readily admit that there has been a lapse of the quality of training of new drivers over the last decade or so, and I do see a lot of people out there driving commercial vehicles that have no business doing so. However, the company I work for has stricter requirements for hiring drivers than most other companies and has a greater than average safety record. If you were to say that it's far too easy to obtain a driver's license in this country and that the requirements and training should be increased then I'd agree with you wholeheartedly. However, I'm very good at what I do and I take great pride in it and I don't think I should have to lose my good-paying job and my quality of life because of the actions of a few irresponsible people.

Well at any rate, even if you don't feel comfortable with them they are coming and very soon regardless. A couple people not wanting positive change to happen that can save numerous lives and improve fatality rates such as yourself and 90s Guy won't stop it from happening anyway.


I can see where an automated vehicle could have its advantages, such as if I was to take a road trip longer than 200 miles (in ideal weather conditions), or if I wanted to go out and tie one on, or when I reach the age where my reflexes and cognitive abilities deteriorate to the point where I can no longer safely operate a motor vehicle.

But I don't think I could ever be comfortable traveling in a vehicle that at least doesn't have some form of manual override. I feel that I ultimately have to have the ability to take over control my vehicle in case the computer systems have some form of malfunction, or get hacked, or in poor weather conditions. Again, going back to my initial statement about trucks making wrong turns and going into places where they shouldn't, this is because of people putting too much trust in technology and following it blindly, which I think is foolish. 


That's the point. Have machines do the tedious so we can concentrate on things that actually matter to us.

Just because something is tedious to you doesn't mean that it's tedious to everyone. I enjoy driving and there are still countless people out there who are passionate about automobiles and working on them. And I find the idea of sitting inside in a cubicle and typing code into a computer for hours on end to be mind-numbingly boring.

There's nothing monumental about putting your foot on a pedal.


I humbly recommend that some weekend you go out and rent a 400 HP Mustang or Camaro or Challenger, mash on the pedal a few times and lay some rubber, and then come back and tell me you didn't find that experience to be monumental.  ;)

And why would anyone other than a completely lazy person want that? Work and effort are part of the enjoyment of life. Simply existing while everyone is done for you isn't healthy.

And the comparison with automobiles at the town of the century is stupid. There was still a human involved. Cars were just motorized carriages and carriages driven by horses had been the norm for around 300 years. But even with those, there was a human steering the horse, or the car.

I would rather be in a horse drawn carriage than a self-driving car. I want the freedom to do what the hell I want as far as travel. Not have some soulless machine do it for me.


We just want to do minimal work, We got The Roomba to take care of the vacuuming, U-Scan machines to take care of self serve checkouts at supermarkets and kiosks at fast food restaurants just to name a few.

Al-B, I totally agree with you.  Driving my little Honda civic 6 speed over Vermont country roads is a blast, regardless of speed (I do have a heavy foot).  It's just a kick.  Long live the manual gear box

Al-B, I totally agree with you.  Driving my little Honda civic 6 speed over Vermont country roads is a blast, regardless of speed (I do have a heavy foot).  It's just a kick.  Long live the manual gear box


Man that sounds like fun. My own car isn't exactly a high performance one, it's a Chevy Malibu with an automatic (I couldn't get one with a manual) and we don't have very many twisty roads here in Nebraska, but I like to get out of town every now and then and drive for a few hours and explore the small towns here and in Iowa, I find that it's a great way to unwind.

I don't do all that much driving at my job anymore, most of my work is done at the terminal now, but a few times a week they'll send me out to do pick ups around the city. Most of our tractors are Macks with 10 speed manual and I still get a kick of driving around and ripping through the gears. (My company stopped buying new tractors with manuals a few years back and they'll eventually disappear from our fleet altogether, so I know I'll have to enjoy it while it lasts.)

We just want to do minimal work, We got The Roomba to take care of the vacuuming, U-Scan machines to take care of self serve checkouts at supermarkets and kiosks at fast food restaurants just to name a few.


See I can't grasp that mindset at all. I enjoy vacuuming and doing the dishes. When I look at my floor and it's clean, or my dishes are nice and shining because I did them, I feel a sense of pride, ownership and accomplishment - this is my handiwork. It's a great feeling. Listlessness and having nothing to do brings out the worst in people. A WALL-E society will see an even bigger Heroin epidemic than what we have now.

See I can't grasp that mindset at all. I enjoy vacuuming and doing the dishes. When I look at my floor and it's clean, or my dishes are nice and shining because I did them, I feel a sense of pride, ownership and accomplishment - this is my handiwork. It's a great feeling. Listlessness and having nothing to do brings out the worst in people. A WALL-E society will see an even bigger Heroin epidemic than what we have now.


https://img.buzzfeed.com/buzzfeed-static/static/2015-01/29/12/enhanced/webdr09/anigif_enhanced-6732-1422551428-2.gif?downsize=715:*&output-format=auto&output-quality=auto

I throw my dishes in the dishwasher hit WASH and call it a day while not wasting water. ;D


Just because something is tedious to you doesn't mean that it's tedious to everyone. I enjoy driving and there are still countless people out there who are passionate about automobiles and working on them. And I find the idea of sitting inside in a cubicle and typing code into a computer for hours on end to be mind-numbingly boring.

I humbly recommend that some weekend you go out and rent a 400 HP Mustang or Camaro or Challenger, mash on the pedal a few times and lay some rubber, and then come back and tell me you didn't find that experience to be monumental.  ;)


Not you dragging what I do 50 hrs/week ;D

While I can see the thrill on rural stretches of road, living in a bit city where the average commute time is fast approaching 2 hours/day (and no matter how beautiful your commute is it's going to get boring eventually), I see a lot to be gained in no longer having people suffer through driving in stop and go traffic. 2 hours a day, 10 hours a week, 500 hours a year. Imagine what they could do with that extra time. Even if they're just sleeping for an extra 2 hours a day (and we could all use that), that's way more productive than what they're doing now.

Hey I also like doing things the traditional way and definitely see a place for it especially if certain tech and inventions are useless. I just think autonomous vehicles are absolutely necessary and useful. I doubt anyone would be forced to switch and if you wanted to drive yourself you could, but manual driving would definitely be a niche in the future. I can see self-driving cars solving a lot of problems and being a very good invention for humanity.

Only if you live in or near a major metropolitan area. Once you get into the more rural and remote areas of this country, people are just spread out too far for ride sharing to be feasible. I don't think that a farmer or rancher in the rural Midwest would be too keen about the idea of having to order an autonomous vehicle and then wait an hour or two for it to show up.

I guess so. Maybe they will make some available in rural areas too in the future.

We just want to do minimal work, We got The Roomba to take care of the vacuuming, U-Scan machines to take care of self serve checkouts at supermarkets and kiosks at fast food restaurants just to name a few.


All things of value are the creation of human labor.  Our labor, and what we make is what defines us as human.  In fact, making things was probably the force that led to our evolution from our ape-like ancestors into humans.  There's a thread on this forum that asks "show us what you have made".  Give up  that human trait and what do we become?

All things of value are the creation of human labor.  Our labor, and what we make is what defines us as human.  In fact, making things was probably the force that led to our evolution from our ape-like ancestors into humans.  There's a thread on this forum that asks "show us what you have made".  Give up  that human trait and what do we become?

Driving a car isn't too much labour. People can still cook, clean, etc.

All things of value are the creation of human labor.  Our labor, and what we make is what defines us as human.  In fact, making things was probably the force that led to our evolution from our ape-like ancestors into humans.  There's a thread on this forum that asks "show us what you have made".  Give up  that human trait and what do we become?


But that's the point: automate these tasks so we can focus on things that matter to us. Should we go back to spending hours washing our clothes in the bathtub? Or isn't the fact we can just throw it in the washing machine and spend those thirty minutes drawing a wonderful painting the truly beautiful thing?

I became obsessed with programming not long ago in 2015. What made me cross from the "It would be nice to know how to code" mindset to "I want to do this for the rest my life" was exactly when I started writing scripts that automated so many of my daily tasks, and freed up so much time and energy and allowed me to do the things I wanted to do.

As an example, one of my hobbies is learning languages. The way I learn languages is say, I'm reading a book, and I come across a word I don't know, I look the word up in the dictionary, then I make an electronic flashcard out of the sentence I saw the word in, and write the dictionary definition of the unknown word on the other side. Now imagine doing that for every new word you come across, imagine there are 20-30 words per page that were completely new. It would take old (young) me hours to finish just that one page of a 300 page book. It would be tedious and not very enjoyable. But in 2015, once I gained the proper skillz, I wrote a script where I can simply highlight the word, paste it into the script, and this would auto-generate the flash card with the sentence and dictionary definitions. Suddenly, I could trail-blaze through that page in almost 1/5th the time I used to before. Instead of going to bed learning only 20 new words and feeling completely burnt out that day, I was cramming in 100-200 words a day into my brain with time left over to play video games. I did the "stupid and lazy" thing and automated the entire flashcard-making process, so I could concentrate on what I actually cared about (learning the language).

It wasn't even just that, my flashcards themselves were much more high quality, which to me is analogous to self-driving cars being much better drivers than humans. Before, I'd look up the English translation of the word, and I'd pick one or two words that meant something similar, and that's all I'd write on the flashcard. After I automated the process, I had the entire French dictionary definition, and I would have all possible English translations (behind spoiler cards) and I'd also have a picture image of the word retrieved from Google (so la banane would have a picture of a banana), if applicable.

Another one of the hundreds of scripts I wrote was one I posted about here, I believe it was in the "Show Us What You Made" thread. It's a script where you write the name of a song or album, or write the name of an artist into a BASH terminal (like a DOS terminal), and it adds said song/album (or top 5 songs of said artist) into a Spotify playlist. There's a lot of songs that get posted about on inthe00s. According to 90s Guy, I should stop being so "stupid and lazy" and instead add each new song by hand, maybe even head over to the record store and buy those songs too instead of doing everything online. Who's actually going to do that? Instead I could use my script, add the sometimes 20-50+ songs that recommended on here everyday in mere seconds and listen to them on my commute. (One user actually recommended 1500 songs worth of albums to me in one post! ;D) I automated what I didn't care for (searching for the song), so I could instead have more time to do the thing I cared about (listening to new music).

People can say I'm "stupid" or "lazy" for choosing to hop into a self-driving car. But when I can be out with my friends at 11PM, and not worry about being short on sleep because I can sleep on the hour drive back home, and sleep on my hour drive to work, we'll see who actually ends up with the more accomplished life. Instead of driving for two hours, I can actually spend that time on what I care about (spending the time with friends, catching up on well-deserved sleep etc.).

edit: this post ended up being way longer than I intended. And it barely had emoticons! ;D

https://img.buzzfeed.com/buzzfeed-static/static/2015-01/29/12/enhanced/webdr09/anigif_enhanced-6732-1422551428-2.gif?downsize=715:*&output-format=auto&output-quality=auto

I throw my dishes in the dishwasher hit WASH and call it a day while not wasting water. ;D

Not you dragging what I do 50 hrs/week ;D

While I can see the thrill on rural stretches of road, living in a bit city where the average commute time is fast approaching 2 hours/day (and no matter how beautiful your commute is it's going to get boring eventually), I see a lot to be gained in no longer having people suffer through driving in stop and go traffic. 2 hours a day, 10 hours a week, 500 hours a year. Imagine what they could do with that extra time. Even if they're just sleeping for an extra 2 hours a day (and we could all use that), that's way more productive than what they're doing now.


Actually, I don't mind cleaning, washing dishes, and sweeping! It's calming a lot of the time.  :-X  :-X  :-X

Actually, I don't mind cleaning, washing dishes, and sweeping! It's calming a lot of the time.  :-X  :-X  :-X


Waste of time to me, lol.

There are certain things I like and certain things I don't. I don't mind washing the dishes and usually do it manually as it is faster for me and not a burden. However I would prefer a robot to vacuum my floor (didn't get the robot vacuum yet but I do feel like getting one some time).

Sexy, robotic, men. Now that's what I want!  8)

There are certain things I like and certain things I don't. I don't mind washing the dishes and usually do it manually as it is faster for me and not a burden. However I would prefer a robot to vacuum my floor (didn't get the robot vacuum yet but I do feel like getting one some time).


Washing the dishes by hand is very wasteful. Not just by time but also you use almost 5x as much water as the dishwasher. Humans suck at everything, srs.

But that's the point: automate these tasks so we can focus on things that matter to us.

What things? And are you talking about things that matter to everyone, or just things that matter to you?  ???

I became obsessed with programming not long ago in 2015. What made me cross from the "It would be nice to know how to code" mindset to "I want to do this for the rest my life" was exactly when I started writing scripts that automated so many of my daily tasks, and freed up so much time and energy and allowed me to do the things I wanted to do.

As an example, one of my hobbies is learning languages. The way I learn languages is say, I'm reading a book, and I come across a word I don't know, I look the word up in the dictionary, then I make an electronic flashcard out of the sentence I saw the word in, and write the dictionary definition of the unknown word on the other side. Now imagine doing that for every new word you come across, imagine there are 20-30 words per page that were completely new. It would take old (young) me hours to finish just that one page of a 300 page book. It would be tedious and not very enjoyable. But in 2015, once I gained the proper skillz, I wrote a script where I can simply highlight the word, paste it into the script, and this would auto-generate the flash card with the sentence and dictionary definitions. Suddenly, I could trail-blaze through that page in almost 1/5th the time I used to before. Instead of going to bed learning only 20 new words and feeling completely burnt out that day, I was cramming in 100-200 words a day into my brain with time left over to play video games. I did the "stupid and lazy" thing and automated the entire flashcard-making process, so I could concentrate on what I actually cared about (learning the language).

It wasn't even just that, my flashcards themselves were much more high quality, which to me is analogous to self-driving cars being much better drivers than humans. Before, I'd look up the English translation of the word, and I'd pick one or two words that meant something similar, and that's all I'd write on the flashcard. After I automated the process, I had the entire French dictionary definition, and I would have all possible English translations (behind spoiler cards) and I'd also have a picture image of the word retrieved from Google (so la banane would have a picture of a banana), if applicable.

Another one of the hundreds of scripts I wrote was one I posted about here, I believe it was in the "Show Us What You Made" thread. It's a script where you write the name of a song or album, or write the name of an artist into a BASH terminal (like a DOS terminal), and it adds said song/album (or top 5 songs of said artist) into a Spotify playlist. There's a lot of songs that get posted about on inthe00s. According to 90s Guy, I should stop being so "stupid and lazy" and instead add each new song by hand, maybe even head over to the record store and buy those songs too instead of doing everything online. Who's actually going to do that? Instead I could use my script, add the sometimes 20-50+ songs that recommended on here everyday in mere seconds and listen to them on my commute. (One user actually recommended 1500 songs worth of albums to me in one post! ;D) I automated what I didn't care for (searching for the song), so I could instead have more time to do the thing I cared about (listening to new music).

None of that interests me in the least.  However, it's your passion and I totally respect that.

People can say I'm "stupid" or "lazy" for choosing to hop into a self-driving car. But when I can be out with my friends at 11PM, and not worry about being short on sleep because I can sleep on the hour drive back home, and sleep on my hour drive to work, we'll see who actually ends up with the more accomplished life. Instead of driving for two hours, I can actually spend that time on what I care about (spending the time with friends, catching up on well-deserved sleep etc.).

edit: this post ended up being way longer than I intended. And it barely had emoticons! ;D


I don't think you're stupid or lazy for wanting a self-driving car. You just don't like to drive and you view it simply as nothing more than a means to get from Point A to Point B, and I can respect that as well.

But what about those of us who don't want self-driving cars? Do you think of us as somehow being backwards and unenlightened? And just because you don't like to drive, does that mean that, for example, Don Carlos should have his Civic taken away from him and the only way he should be allowed to travel down his scenic Vermont backroads would be to stare blankly through the windshield of an automated Googlemobile while he just sits there twiddling his thumbs? You come across as having this mindset that if you find a certain activity to be uninteresting and mundane then it should be automated and that no one should be allowed to do it.

You're very intelligent, Slowpoke, quite possibly the most intelligent person on these boards. And I wouldn't be terribly surprised if, 20-30 years from now, your dream of a completely automated world comes true and you're one of the people running things behind the scenes.

But I have to ask you this: If indeed the machines do take over and you are one of the people behind the curtain, would you make every effort to ensure that people still had the latitude to pursue their passions and practice their beliefs even though you might not necessarily like or agree with them? Or would you use that power to try and force the world to conform to your sensibilities?

All things of value are the creation of human labor.  Our labor, and what we make is what defines us as human.  In fact, making things was probably the force that led to our evolution from our ape-like ancestors into humans.  There's a thread on this forum that asks "show us what you have made".  Give up  that human trait and what do we become?


To all of you who responded to this, let me point out that I was responding to Howard who said "I just want to do minimal work". 

No, driving  isn't work, but I have loved to drive since I first got behind the wheel, and still find it fun, especially with an manual trans.  And although I am "retired" I still enjoy productive labor

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yesyhQkYrQM


Cat

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yesyhQkYrQM


Cat
It's all doom and gloom!

Waste of time to me, lol.


not for me it isn't.

Bye the way, there are a number of things that I choose to do myself, like baking our own bread.  Maybe not as consistent as store bought, but at least I know what all of the ingredients are, no chemical names like montriasphaultdyaphinate 

Bye the way, there are a number of things that I choose to do myself, like baking our own bread.  Maybe not as consistent as store bought, but at least I know what all of the ingredients are, no chemical names like montriasphaultdyaphinate


And I'll bet it tastes better than any bread that you can buy in a store.

To be more clear, I like self-driving cars. I just like to zoom into different aspects of opinions.  ;D  ;D  ;D

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yesyhQkYrQM


Cat


Also this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uukZgfHZIoc

Also this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uukZgfHZIoc


A fellow RUSH fan. Noice.

A fellow RUSH fan. Noice.


I have a good Rush story that I can share with you later via PM if you're interested.

Also this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uukZgfHZIoc



I was never a big Rush fan but always liked them. (Does that make sense?)


Cat

I was never a big Rush fan but always liked them. (Does that make sense?)


Cat


Yes, it does make sense. I'm not a Janet Jackson fan, but I always found some of her albums (like two) very catchy and great. The two albums I'm talking about is Control (1986) and Rhythm Nation 1814 (1989). Great albums, but I wouldn't call myself a hardcore fan at all!

I'm very picky for what and/or who I consider myself a fan of. Like I'm a A Nightmare on Elm Street movie series fan, but it wasn't until 10 years after watching all the films, like around the early 00's, that I consider myself a fan.

I was never a big Rush fan but always liked them. (Does that make sense?)


Cat


I think I may have met Neal Peart at a truck stop in Colorado but didn't realize it until years later. (I'm almost certain it was him.)

I think I may have met Neal Peart at a truck stop in Colorado but didn't realize it until years later. (I'm almost certain it was him.)


You should have yelled out, "Hey, goofball, why don't you play more like Meg White?!"

You should have yelled out, "Hey, goofball, why don't you play more like Meg White?!"


That would have been rude of me. I should have just grabbed a couple of windshield wiper blades off the rack and asked him if he could play "Wipeout."

You should have yelled out, "Hey, goofball, why don't you play more like Meg White?!"


Tia?  is that you?  Where'v you been all this time?  Welcome back

Tia?  is that you?  Where'v you been all this time?  Welcome back


We really need to get Davey Thrashmister back in here, though I'm not sure this place could handle him now.

Tia?  is that you?  Where'v you been all this time?  Welcome back
hey. yeah, it's me. just thought i'd stroll through for a little Homeland Security check.  ;D

5UBdrMTxsvs

hey. yeah, it's me. just thought i'd stroll through for a little Homeland Security check.  ;D


nice to see you How have you been?  :)

nice to see you How have you been?  :)
I'm doing pretty well, Howard. Thanks for asking.