I understand that this might be an opinion, but honestly this year was awful in general. Too many celebrity deaths. Too many unnecessary attacks and police shootings. The outcome of this election. There was nothing positive aside from a few movies and TV shows.

I understand that this might be an opinion, but honestly this year was awful in general. Too many celebrity deaths. Too many unnecessary attacks and police shootings. The outcome of this election. There was nothing positive aside from a few movies and TV shows.

Everything has been so messed up!

Everything has been so messed up!
I agree so much! I'm hoping this upcoming year will be much better, but because of the circumstances, I'm not even sure yet.

I haven't seen anything good in this year. 

George Michael's death and Carrie Fisher's (Princess Leia) death to close out the year sums up how this year has gone in a nutshell when it comes to major celebrity deaths and sports icon deaths too.

This decade has been really sucky but so far 2016 really tops it off! What a horrible year.

As much as I hate this decade so much, 2016 is like being a Hiroshima survivor. Before this year occurred, I thought 2012 was basically the worst. While I am doing good in my personal life, it's barely enjoyable with all the pop culture going on. I feel like if I have to enjoy something, it would most likely be dead by the next month or so. Vine is a really big example on that.


This decade has been really sucky but so far 2016 really tops it off! What a horrible year.


The 2000s were way better. Even with George W. Bush as our president.

The 2000s were way better. Even with George W. Bush as our president.


Last decade was awful too but at least it started with 3 good years.

The 80's and 90's are the real GOAT. They will be missed. :\'(

Even though 2016 was the best year of my personal life since 2011, it's undoubtedly the worst year for world events in several decades. Not since at least 1968 has there been so much violence, so much crushed hope, so much polarization, and so much else gone wrong during the course of a single year.

Where do I even begin? I'm forced to write up a list of horrible things about this year.

* Music was no less underwhelming than it was during the rest of the mid-2010s.
* Cinema was remarkably subpar outside of animated kid flicks.
* New technology like augmented reality games and VR headsets were little more than teases, at least for the time being.
* Apple removed the headphone ports on their new line of iPhones because they want to be "cutting edge."
* Brexit passed.
* Donald Trump was fraudulently elected 45th President of the United States.
* A 6-year-old kid could have proposed a better cabinet than he did.
* Hate crimes and bigotry are on the rise.
* The European immigration crisis is now so out of control that it's pretty much become a battleground.
* Natural disasters have continued to strike terror.
* Celebrity deaths were possibly more overwhelming than any other year in history.
* SJW's are more PC than ever and the Alt-Right is more arrogantly malicious than ever.

1968 at least had good music, revolutionary sci-fi films, and great fashion. 2016, on the other hand, pretty much summed up everything awful about this decade thus far.

Last decade was awful too but at least it started with 3 good years.

The 80's and 90's are the real GOAT. They will be missed. :\'(


The early and mid 2000s were the real GOAT. They defined the 21st century greatly, and people didn't realize that (at least for the early 2000s part).

The early and mid 2000s were the real GOAT. They defined the 21st century greatly, and people didn't realize that (at least for the early 2000s part).


And most of the 21st century hasn't been very good anyway. I'm more into the late 20th century.


Even though 2016 was the best year of my personal life since 2011, it's undoubtedly the worst year for world events in several decades. Not since at least 1968 has there been so much violence, so much crushed hope, so much polarization, and so much else gone wrong during the course of a single year.

Where do I even begin? I'm forced to write up a list of horrible things about this year.

* Music was no less underwhelming than it was during the rest of the mid-2010s.
* Cinema was remarkably subpar outside of animated kid flicks.
* New technology like augmented reality games and VR headsets were little more than teases, at least for the time being.
* Apple removed the headphone ports on their new line of iPhones because they want to be "cutting edge."
* Brexit passed.
* Donald Trump was fraudulently elected 45th President of the United States.
* A 6-year-old kid could have proposed a better cabinet than he did.
* Hate crimes and bigotry are on the rise.
* The European immigration crisis is now so out of control that it's pretty much become a battleground.
* Natural disasters have continued to strike terror.
* Celebrity deaths were possibly more overwhelming than any other year in history.
* SJW's are more PC than ever and the Alt-Right is more arrogantly malicious than ever.

1968 at least had good music, revolutionary sci-fi films, and great fashion. 2016, on the other hand, pretty much summed up everything awful about this decade thus far.


It's such a big mess. I think I can speak for most people on this board when I say this is the worst political era we've seen in our lifetimes so far.

Oh yeah, there was also YouTube's copyright law changes coming into haunting effect (i.e., demonetization), plus the fact that Putin's Russia is on its way to becoming far too powerful.

2016 is an otherworldly year.

David Bowie, Gene Wilder, Leonard Cohen, Alan Rickman, Prince, George Michael, Muhammad Ali, Fidel Castro, Carrie Fisher, and many others have died.

M. Night Shamylan has released a new movie that has a 93% on Rotten Tomatoes.

For the first time, the media discussed Internet memes like Pepe the Frog during the election, when this was practically unheard of during the 2012 election.

George Michael's death and Carrie Fisher's (Princess Leia) death to close out the year sums up how this year has gone in a nutshell when it comes to major celebrity deaths and sports icon deaths too.


It's a sign from God.  :o

Even though 2016 was the best year of my personal life since 2011, it's undoubtedly the worst year for world events in several decades. Not since at least 1968 has there been so much violence, so much crushed hope, so much polarization, and so much else gone wrong during the course of a single year.

Where do I even begin? I'm forced to write up a list of horrible things about this year.

* Music was no less underwhelming than it was during the rest of the mid-2010s.
* Cinema was remarkably subpar outside of animated kid flicks.
* New technology like augmented reality games and VR headsets were little more than teases, at least for the time being.
* Apple removed the headphone ports on their new line of iPhones because they want to be "cutting edge."
* Brexit passed.
* Donald Trump was fraudulently elected 45th President of the United States.
* A 6-year-old kid could have proposed a better cabinet than he did.
* Hate crimes and bigotry are on the rise.
* The European immigration crisis is now so out of control that it's pretty much become a battleground.
* Natural disasters have continued to strike terror.
* Celebrity deaths were possibly more overwhelming than any other year in history.
* SJW's are more PC than ever and the Alt-Right is more arrogantly malicious than ever.

1968 at least had good music, revolutionary sci-fi films, and great fashion. 2016, on the other hand, pretty much summed up everything awful about this decade thus far.


I completely agree with this.

2016 has been better than 2013 or 2014 in my personal life, but it has still not been a good year.  It just seems better in comparison to 2013 and 2014.

In terms of music, 2016 has had some good songs but for the most part it's simply been a continuation of awful mid '10s EDM-teen pop.  I agree with you that at least 1968 brought us some of the best music ever recorded, despite the fact that it seemed like the world was going to hell in a handbasket then.  I wish pop culture would start to reflect the angst of our time again instead of being the manufactured "safe" crap like Ariana Grande.

I am thankful I got to enjoy two good years at the start of this decade (2010 and 2011).  I don't see myself returning to the level of fulfillment and happiness I had during those years any time soon.  I look back at my life in 2011 and that just seems impossible today.

I think we are in for a rocky ride over the next four years.  It's very possible a global war and a recession could become the vomit icing on the turd cake that is the 2010s.

from what I'm reading as far as music,  I should be thankful that I've gone deaf

And most of the 21st century hasn't been very good anyway. I'm more into the late 20th century.


I'm mostly into the 80s and 90s, if we're talking about the 20th century. But I would rather go for the 2000s personally.


Where do I even begin? I'm forced to write up a list of horrible things about this year.
* Music was no less underwhelming than it was during the rest of the mid-2010s.

Most music from this decade was rather trash and made everyone polarized, in my opinion. I don't even know about the mid 2010s, since they're rather different from the early 2010s.

* Cinema was remarkably subpar outside of animated kid flicks.

Uhhh.. I don't know about any movie in this year. Sure, there are a few good ones like The Conjuring 2, but most movies today are either reboots or terribly overrated sequels of existing franchises.

* New technology like augmented reality games and VR headsets were little more than teases, at least for the time being.

They're really fake. What else can anyone tell you?

* Apple removed the headphone ports on their new line of iPhones because they want to be "cutting edge."

In all honesty, I thought Apple would might be okay when Tim Cook was their new CEO. But after they didn't pay attention towards their iMacs, then I really got pissed with them. That's with Tim Cook. A crooked son of a bitch, who thinks that his company should be on the cutting edge, just because his company is making millions. Every time I see somebody mention the iPhone 7, I just imagine Steve Jobs rolling in his grave.

* Brexit passed.

Which is the British version of electing Donald Trump as president, except it doesn't involve leaving a certain union.

* Donald Trump was fraudulently elected 45th President of the United States.

The American version of Brexit.

* A 6-year-old kid could have proposed a better cabinet than he did.

Yeah. I could see them being more educated than Trump. At least if someone simplifies their position for them.

* Hate crimes and bigotry are on the rise.

Yeah... I can't deny this. It's frightening to see that neo-Nazis and other white nationalists see this as a good thing, even though they see racial segregation as a way to "rejuvenate" the Western world.  :-\\

* The European immigration crisis is now so out of control that it's pretty much become a battleground.

This is what made 2016 look like a pile of crap. All because Europe (especially Germany) didn't see of how there were too many Middle Eastern refugees (mostly from Syria) that could be a threat to them. Now thanks to that, it made white nationalists more loyal to anything in the political world nowadays.

* Natural disasters have continued to strike terror.

If it's natural, I'm pretty sure it's rather typical to see something like that.

* Celebrity deaths were possibly more overwhelming than any other year in history.
* SJW's are more PC than ever and the Alt-Right is more arrogantly malicious than ever.


http://25.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_mbnnza7zod1rqql3po1_400.gif

I completely agree with this.

2016 has been better than 2013 or 2014 in my personal life, but it has still not been a good year.  It just seems better in comparison to 2013 and 2014.

In terms of music, 2016 has had some good songs but for the most part it's simply been a continuation of awful mid '10s EDM-teen pop.  I agree with you that at least 1968 brought us some of the best music ever recorded, despite the fact that it seemed like the world was going to hell in a handbasket then.  I wish pop culture would start to reflect the angst of our time again instead of being the manufactured "safe" crap like Ariana Grande.

I am thankful I got to enjoy two good years at the start of this decade (2010 and 2011).  I don't see myself returning to the level of fulfillment and happiness I had during those years any time soon.  I look back at my life in 2011 and that just seems impossible today.

I think we are in for a rocky ride over the next four years.  It's very possible a global war and a recession could become the vomit icing on the turd cake that is the 2010s.


This.

Trump truly scares me.

Bad thing is, there is no hope of things improving.

Conservatives will never accept that white fundamentalist Christians no longer dominate the culture in America.  However, the genie is out of the bottle now and its not going back in.  Any attempt to force it is only going to spark further tension and unrest.

My one hope is that we can make it through these next four years without nuclear weapons being used.

It's a sign from God.  :o


... No it's not. Having celebrities dying is a sign of psychosis, since we're already going through so much. Even though you were joking.


Conservatives will never accept that white fundamentalist Christians no longer dominate the culture in America.  However, the genie is out of the bottle now and its not going back in.  Any attempt to force it is only going to spark further tension and unrest.


Not all conservatives are extremely religious, but for the fact that they're dumb enough to enact Trump as the Republican candidate makes me feel sad for America in general.  :\'(


My one hope is that we can make it through these next four years without nuclear weapons being used.


Let's just hope somebody doesn't have him pushing all the buttons that send nukes.

Everything has been so messed up!


2016 was a messed up year.

... No it's not. Having celebrities dying is a sign of psychosis, since we're already going through so much. Even though you were joking.

Not all conservatives are extremely religious, but for the fact that they're dumb enough to enact Trump as the Republican candidate makes me feel sad for America in general.  :\'(

Let's just hope somebody doesn't have him pushing all the buttons that send nukes.


I wasn't joking. I believe hard times are ahead.

from what I'm reading as far as music,  I should be thankful that I've gone deaf


Music has gone really down the past 15 years, or so.

This decade has been really sucky but so far 2016 really tops it off! What a horrible year.



We got another few more days before they close out 2016.

I wasn't joking. I believe hard times are ahead.


Wow. That's the first serious post that I've ever replied from you. But still, having people dying (especially celebrities) is rather natural, even if they have terrible illnesses or organ failures.

Music has gone really down the past 15 years, or so.


Britney Spears was great throughout the entire 2000s, and she started to get popular between 1999 to 2001.

Personally, this has been a good year. Nationally/globally, it really has been a VERY sucky year!


Cat

Personally, this has been a good year. Nationally/globally, it really has been a VERY sucky year!


Cat


I think maybe we isolated ourselves from the election, that it made our personal lives better at least.

I'm just hoping that another 9/11 doesn't occur in the next few years.

I'm just hoping that another 9/11 doesn't occur in the next few years.


We haven't had an attack similar to 9/11 for over 15 years.

I echo some others thought in that personally in retrospect 2016 really wasn't that bad. I reunited with much of my family this year which was a great thing. I was able to buy a new car which I'm thankful for. When it comes to world events and politics obviously it was awful. Many legendary celebrities died this year, many of them far too early too. The political environment completely boiled over and is as toxic as ever with the hatred between the left and right rising ever more. The next few years will undoubtedly be difficult politically as the fight against ISIS continues, Trump assumes the US Presidency and the UK leaves the EU. I went to midnight mass on Christmas and truly prayed for the world more than anything because these are trying times and things could get very ugly.

In addition to all the celebrity deaths, I've had 3 deaths in my family this year, and two of them has been in the same week.


I completely agree with this.

2016 has been better than 2013 or 2014 in my personal life, but it has still not been a good year.  It just seems better in comparison to 2013 and 2014.

In terms of music, 2016 has had some good songs but for the most part it's simply been a continuation of awful mid '10s EDM-teen pop.  I agree with you that at least 1968 brought us some of the best music ever recorded, despite the fact that it seemed like the world was going to hell in a handbasket then.  I wish pop culture would start to reflect the angst of our time again instead of being the manufactured "safe" crap like Ariana Grande.

I am thankful I got to enjoy two good years at the start of this decade (2010 and 2011).  I don't see myself returning to the level of fulfillment and happiness I had during those years any time soon.  I look back at my life in 2011 and that just seems impossible today.

I think we are in for a rocky ride over the next four years.  It's very possible a global war and a recession could become the vomit icing on the turd cake that is the 2010s.


I feel the same way. I don't know which is worse: how f***ed up 2016 was, or how it was still one of my better years of my life recently. Late 2013 and 2014 were horrible years for me personally and do not have a lot of good memories. The first half of 2016 had a lot of great memories. I did a lot of traveling and things at work were going better. September and November was when the DITF's happened.

I am not optimistic that 2017 is going to better. I know work wise it will be miserable. I think in our society and culture it's going to get worse before it gets better (maybe 2020 will be the first good year we've had in awhile). It's not necessary because of Trump. It was 8 years of Obama's failing policies that got us to where we are now, and caused the social issues such as race wars and overly PC SJW's vs. the Alt Right, which is why the elections were polarized extremes. 2016 was the boiling point of the heat that got turned on in late 2012, and really started to heat up in 2014.

In addition to all the celebrity deaths, I've had 3 deaths in my family this year, and two of them has been in the same week.

I feel the same way. I don't know which is worse: how f***ed up 2016 was, or how it was still one of my better years of my life recently. Late 2013 and 2014 were horrible years for me personally and do not have a lot of good memories. The first half of 2016 had a lot of great memories. I did a lot of traveling and things at work were going better. September and November was when the DITF's happened.

I am not optimistic that 2017 is going to better. I know work wise it will be miserable. I think in our society and culture it's going to get worse before it gets better (maybe 2020 will be the first good year we've had in awhile). It's not necessary because of Trump. It was 8 years of Obama's failing policies that got us to where we are now, and caused the social issues such as race wars and overly PC SJW's vs. the Alt Right, which is why the elections were polarized extremes. 2016 was the boiling point of the heat that got turned on in late 2012, and really started to heat up in 2014.


Yeah the whole Trump thing is multi dimensional. First of all honestly I think most Trump voters are not really racist nazis like the left likes to cast them, they're just angry at the current situation and Trump was the ultimate vote against the system in their eyes. I almost did it but I know this guy is a con man and ultimately refused to vote for him despite frustration with the left and media. Trump isn't stupid, he's an egomaniac and he knew exactly what he was doing, he knew the more controversy he generated it would get him more attention and more people wanting to buck the system by casting a Trump vote. I think he only ran for more publicity and the title of President so he can stroke his ego, to him it's like a trophy, but he's probably going to regret taking this job once he gets in there. The President is always the fall man for everything that goes wrong and now everything will blamed on Trump and he hates any and all criticism.

2016 sucks but it's not as bad as 2012 and 2011.

2016 sucks but it's not as bad as 2012 and 2011.


Not really. At least 2012 didn't have a crap ton of shootings, celebrity deaths, and a bunch of other disturbing stuff. I only hated 2012 because of my personal life, especially when I despised my autism diagnosis and thought it ruined my life.

Not really. At least 2012 didn't have a crap ton of shootings, celebrity deaths, and a bunch of other disturbing stuff. I only hated 2012 because of my personal life, especially when I despised my autism diagnosis and thought it ruined my life.

Nah man 2012 was the worst year. Even 2016 was better.

Look at the bright side: at least it won't be as bad as 2017!

Look at the bright side: at least it won't be as bad as 2017!

Why would 2017 be worse?

Nah man 2012 was the worst year. Even 2016 was better. The year 2010 was only slightly better better than 2016. But 2016 was far worse than 2013-2015 for sure.


What kind of stuff made 2016 better than 2012? I didn't have to fear for a bunch of BLM-related protests that lead to cops brutalizing innocent people back in 2012. I didn't have to fear about hate crimes related to neo-Nazis and far-right Trump supporters back in 2012. I didn't even have to worry about Donald Trump being our next president back in 2012.


Why would 2017 be worse?


Um... it would be the first Trump would be the United States' president?

Um... it would be the first Trump would be the United States' president?

What does Donald Trump being president have anything to do with how good a year will be? That's totally irrelevant.

What kind of stuff made 2016 better than 2012? I didn't have to fear for a bunch of BLM-related protests that lead to cops brutalizing innocent people back in 2012. I didn't have to fear about hate crimes related to neo-Nazis and far-right Trump supporters back in 2012. I didn't even have to worry about Donald Trump being our next president back in 2012.


I was severely depressed in 2012 but I am not in 2016. Music, technology, and pop culture is better in 2016 too. In 2012 and 2011 all these things were bad. And there was still violence in 2012 you just didn't hear about it as much. I distinctly remember an elementary school mass shooting in late 2012.

Not all conservatives are extremely religious, but for the fact that they're dumb enough to enact Trump as the Republican candidate makes me feel sad for America in general.  :\'(


Believe or not, MORE Christians favored Trump over Hillary. It was hard for me to accept this as a Christian myself, but I understood why after Hillary was enforcing the transgender stuff, gay marriage, and abortions throughout her campaign. It goes much more deeper than this too.

I was severely depressed in 2012 but I am not in 2016. Music, technology, and pop culture is better in 2016 too. In 2012 and 2011 all these things were bad. And there was still violence in 2012 you just didn't hear about it as much. I distinctly remember an elementary school mass shooting in late 2012.


The elementary school shooting, the movie shooting, and Trevon Martin being shot innocently by Zimmerman was just the beginning. What 2015 & 2016 have offered in terms of shootings, riots, ISIS/terrorist attacks, and violence were a lot more dark, serious and dangerous than 2012, and it happened right around this stupid election we went through this year.

Believe or not, MORE Christians favored Trump over Hillary. It was hard for me to accept this as a Christian myself, but I understood why after Hillary was enforcing the transgender stuff, gay marriage, and abortions throughout her campaign. It goes much more deeper than this too.


Too much focusing on transgender stuff and extreme pro abortion for a lot of us. That kind of stuff just isn't quite acceptable in middle America. Gay marriage I don't care that much about not that pro not that against. Should have been left to the States to be honest. Our life really does begin once the egg is fertilized, even if that embryo isn't developed like a baby yet it's still ultimately very early human life. On the other hand a transgender "woman" or "man" is NOT the same as being born a man or woman, sorry liberals it's science. And the left claims they're the side of science? I do have sympathy for them but it is NOT THE SAME. Not that Trump really cares about those issues in reality but the Democratic Party has alienated the midwest with far left social policies and they lost partially because of that. I know I'm gonna get some liberals mad by saying this but this is how I see it as a moderate.

Too much focusing on transgender stuff and extreme pro abortion for a lot of us. That kind of stuff just isn't quite acceptable in middle America. Gay marriage I don't care that much about not that pro not that against. Should have been left to the States to be honest. Our life really does begin once the egg is fertilized, even if that embryo isn't developed like a baby yet it's still ultimately very early human life. On the other hand a transgender "woman" or "man" is NOT the same as being born a man or woman, sorry liberals it's science. And the left claims they're the side of science? I do have sympathy for them but it is NOT THE SAME. Not that Trump really cares about those issues in reality but the Democratic Party has alienated the midwest with far left social policies and they lost partially because of that. I know I'm gonna get some liberals mad by saying this but this is how I see it as a moderate.


https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/appeal-to-nature

Never mind the blatant naturalistic fallacy here (just because someone is born a man doesn't mean they shouldn't be allowed to live as a woman), you saying the existence of transgenderism is not backed by science is also false.

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/is-there-something-unique-about-the-transgender-brain/

Christians want to shove their religion down everyone's throat. This was true before Hillary Clinton, with Hillary Clinton, and will be true after Hillary Clinton. People don't want Christianity,  because there's no evidence to prove that it's true,  so they have to force it on people.

Also just because you're moderate doesn't mean you're right. In fact, if your views are simply based entirely on appearing moderate, then you're more likely to be wrong than extremists who came to their conclusions based on evidence and reason.

https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/appeal-to-nature

Never mind the blatant naturalistic fallacy here (just because someone is born a man doesn't mean they shouldn't be allowed to live as a woman), you saying the existence of transgenderism is not backed by science is also false.

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/is-there-something-unique-about-the-transgender-brain/

Christians want to shove their religion down everyone's throat. This was true before Hillary Clinton, with Hillary Clinton, and will be true after Hillary Clinton. People don't want Christianity,  because there's no evidence to prove that it's true,  so they have to force it on people.

Also just because you're moderate doesn't mean you're right. In fact, if your views are simply based entirely on appearing moderate, then you're more likely to be wrong than extremists who came to their conclusions based on evidence and reason.


And far left atheists want to shove atheism down our throat.  ::)

Also, feeling like a different gender in your mind is not the same as physically being that gender and it never will.

And far left atheists want to shove atheism down our throat.  ::)

Also, feeling like a different gender in your mind is not the same as physically being that gender and it never will.


Drats, you've figured out my plot to enslave all the straights and force them to gay marry me and breed children for me  :\'(

Err, is the brain not an organ as much as your dick? Who decided one is more important than the other?

Think I'm getting sick

Drats, you've figured out my plot to enslave all the straights and force them to gay marry me and breed children for me  :\'(

Err, is the brain not an organ as much as your dick? Who decided one is more important than the other?


Because the penis and vagina are the reproductive sex organs and your sex is determined by which of those you possess. If there's a disconnect between which one you have and your brain well like I said that's an issue and I have sympathy for that. It doesn't mean you are the same as being born a man or woman though, obviously it's not. A man is a man and a woman is a woman.

and the purpose of a man is to love a woman and the purpose of a woman is to love a man 

Because the penis and vagina are the reproductive sex organs and your sex is determined by which of those you possess. If there's a disconnect between which one you have and your brain well like I said that's an issue and I have sympathy for that. It doesn't mean you are the same as being born a man or woman though, obviously it's not. A man is a man and a woman is a woman.


Well hence the distinction between sex (your penis or vagina) and gender (male/female/non-binary), and why it's called transgender nowadays instead of transsexuel. Just because you aren't born a man/woman doesn't mean you should be treated like dirt. How is that fair?

and the purpose of a man is to love a woman and the purpose of a woman is to love a man


The purpose of straights is gay for pay porn and giving birth to beautiful gays.

Well hence the distinction between sex (your penis or vagina) and gender (male/female/non-binary), and why it's called transgender nowadays instead of transsexuel. Just because you aren't born a man/woman doesn't mean you should be treated like dirt. How is that fair?


No and I wouldn't treat them like "dirt". I don't agree with them being the same as a person born physically male or female like the left wing preaches. They have a mental issue and I have feelings for them. But I still believe in telling like it is in regards to their actual sex.

I'm gonna leave and walk away  the game of sludge (slude) sludge (sludge) ha ha ha ha ha ha

No and I wouldn't treat them like "dirt". I don't agree with them being the same as a person born physically male or female like the left wing preaches. They have a mental issue and I have feelings for them. But I still believe in telling like it is in regards to their actual sex.


What are you implying when you say they're not the "same" as someone born male or female? ???

And you know sex can be changed right (and gender can't)? Sex change opérations.  Why does it even matter what private parts someone has? Like why should that change day to day living?

I'm gonna leave and walk away  the game of sludge (slude) sludge (sludge) ha ha ha ha ha ha


This is honestly an issue that left and right will never agree on. I side more with the right on the basic principles but realistically I'm not exactly worried about <1% of the population that is transgender. In the scheme of things this is not the most important issue and transgender people are not exactly a dangerous threat so I don't care.

What are you implying when you say they're not the "same" as someone born male or female? ???

And you know sex can be changed right (and gender can't)? Sex change opérations.  Why does it even matter what private parts someone has? Like why should that change day to day living?


LOL that's still not the same. Sex change operations are just a cosmetic surgery that makes your sex organs look like the other sex, it doesn't truly change your sex. I'm done arguing about this.  ::)

Also just because you're moderate doesn't mean you're right. In fact, if your views are simply based entirely on appearing moderate, then you're more likely to be wrong than extremists who came to their conclusions based on evidence and reason.


I never said it was anyway, we all have our opinions left, right and different mixtures of both. Just because you are liberal and atheist doesn't make you right either. It's all kind of relative anyway. Compared to you you'd probably consider me pretty right wing. I'm moderate for America but in Europe would be pretty right wing for example.

I was severely depressed in 2012 but I am not in 2016. Music, technology, and pop culture is better in 2016 too. In 2012 and 2011 all these things were bad. And there was still violence in 2012 you just didn't hear about it as much. I distinctly remember an elementary school mass shooting in late 2012.


I was mildly depressed back in 2012, so I could technically sympathize with you. But I didn't think that any other year was worse. I thought 2012 was the year in which I'll never mention in my life, nor would I think of it positively. That year usually gives me very negative memories, but 2016 makes me wish we didn't obsess over social media so much.


Believe or not, MORE Christians favored Trump over Hillary. It was hard for me to accept this as a Christian myself, but I understood why after Hillary was enforcing the transgender stuff, gay marriage, and abortions throughout her campaign. It goes much more deeper than this too.

Well, Trump was good enough to get those people to vote for him. Especially when Hillary wasn't the best candidate to choose from the Democrat Party.

Any year or decade is good when you are blessed with being alive.

Any year or decade is good when you are blessed with being alive.


Very true considering all the early celebrity deaths this year, this is an important statement for everybody to remember.

LOL that's still not the same. Sex change operations are just a cosmetic surgery that makes your sex organs look like the other sex, it doesn't truly change your sex. I'm done arguing about this.  ::)

How doesn't it change your sex? Taking hormones and changing your genitals does exactly that...

How doesn't it change your sex? Taking hormones and changing your genitals does exactly that...


Can a post op transgender "woman" give birth to a baby? No. Can a post op transgender "man" actually impregnate a woman? No. It changes their appearance that's it, but it still doesn't give them actual fully functioning sex organs of the other sex.

There was some strange time in which a mama had a chicken and a cow and their dad was proud.  I 'm probably off topic now.

LOL that's still not the same. Sex change operations are just a cosmetic surgery that makes your sex organs look like the other sex, it doesn't truly change your sex. I'm done arguing about this.  ::)


It's not just a cosmetic surgery, there are hormone therapies as well.

Like really, you claim that you're on the side of science, so where is your proof that a transgender person who's undergone sex change therapy is any less of a man or a woman?

The truth is, the state of public K-12 science education in your country is pitiful. You're competing with third world countries like Vietnam and India in science. And it's not equal throughout the country, the more religious and Republican a state is, the more it is like Gambia and the less religious and Democratic a state is, the more it is like Canada or Finland (the countries with the top marks in science). It's not a coincidence. I read an article about this German girl who was an exchange student for a year in rural Minnesota. She talked about how a student was allowed to literally cross off all the questions in the science exam, and write religious questions in their place and answer those instead, and she got 100%. It was the most American thing I've ever heard.  This appeal to religion instead of logic and reason is the reason Rome fell and it can be the reason your country will fall too.

I mean, just look at this thread, you claim to be on the side of science yet you've not sourced one scientific source. When you stated that things are this and that, and your beliefs were challenged and scrutinized, which is literally the ENTIRE point and process of the scientific method,  all you've done is back out. If I gave up every time my conclusions were criticized, I would have flunked put of my Physics degree. The whole point of science is to explain and understand the world. If all you're looking for is for your preconceived notions to be confirmed, you won't get very far.

Can a post op transgender "woman" give birth to a baby? No. Can a post op transgender "man" actually impregnate a woman? No. It changes their appearance that's it, but it still doesn't give them actual fully functioning sex organs of the other sex.


Can an infertile man or woman do any of that? Are they not their sex anymore?

It's not just a cosmetic surgery, there are hormone therapies as well.

Like really, you claim that you're on the side of science, so where is your proof that a transgender person who's undergone sex change therapy is any less of a man or a woman?

The truth is, the state of public K-12 science education in your country is pitiful. You're competing with third world countries like Vietnam and India in science. And it's not equal throughout the country, the more religious and Republican a state is, the more it is like Gambia and the less religious and Democratic a state is, the more it is like Canada or Finland (the countries with the top marks in science). It's not a coincidence. I read an article about this German girl who was an exchange student for a year in rural Minnesota. She talked about how a student was allowed to literally cross off all the questions in the science exam, and write religious questions in their place and answer those instead, and she got 100%. It was the most American thing I've ever heard.  This appeal to religion instead of logic and reason is the reason Rome fell and it can be the reason your country will fall too.

I mean, just look at this thread, you claim to be on the side of science yet you've not sourced one scientific source. When you stated that things are this and that, and your beliefs were challenged and scrutinized, which is literally the ENTIRE point and process of the scientific method,  all you've done is back out. If I gave up every time my conclusions were criticized, I would have flunked put of my Physics degree. The whole point of science is to explain and understand the world. If all you're looking for is for your preconceived notions to be confirmed, you won't get very far.



Can an infertile man or woman do any of that? Are they not their sex anymore?


sex chromosome | genetics | Britannica.com
https://www.britannica.com/science/sex-chromosome
Jul 20, 1998 - In humans the sex chromosomes comprise one pair of the total of 23 pairs of chromosomes. The other 22 pairs of chromosomes are called autosomes. Individuals having two X chromosomes (XX) are female; individuals having one X chromosome and one Y chromosome (XY) are male.

sex chromosome | genetics | Britannica.com
https://www.britannica.com/science/sex-chromosome
Jul 20, 1998 - In humans the sex chromosomes comprise one pair of the total of 23 pairs of chromosomes. The other 22 pairs of chromosomes are called autosomes. Individuals having two X chromosomes (XX) are female; individuals having one X chromosome and one Y chromosome (XY) are male.


https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/XY_gonadal_dysgenesis

When such a gene is defective, the indifferent gonads fail to differentiate into testes in an XY (genetically male) fetus. Without testes, no testosterone or antimüllerian hormone (AMH) is produced. Without testosterone, the wolffian ducts fail to develop, so no internal male organs are formed. Also, the lack of testosterone means that no dihydrotestosterone is formed and consequently the external genitalia fail to virilize, resulting in normal female genitalia. Without AMH, the Müllerian ducts develop into normal internal female organs (uterus, fallopian tubes, cervix, vagina).

A baby who is externally a girl is born and is normal in all anatomic respects except that the child has nonfunctional streak gonads instead of ovaries or testes. As girls' ovaries normally produce no important body changes before puberty, a defect of the reproductive system typically remains unsuspected until puberty fails to occur in people with Swyer syndrome. They appear to be normal girls and are generally considered so.

An XY chromosome person with a veritable vagina.  That's some people's fetish.

Can a post op transgender "woman" give birth to a baby? No. Can a post op transgender "man" actually impregnate a woman? No. It changes their appearance that's it, but it still doesn't give them actual fully functioning sex organs of the other sex.


So am I still a "man" even though I just had reassignment surgery and nobody ever generally perceives me as anything other than a woman? I know I still technically have XY chromosomes, can't get pregnant, and lack ovaries, but is that really a sufficient argument to call me a man in social situations? Far and large, I still look, function, present, and come off as a woman in public, so focusing so rigidly on a few fundamentally scientific details is absurd not just to me, but to pretty much everybody I casually come across. We really live in an age in which your specific genetic code is irrelevant to how you define yourself as an individual compared to your actions, sense of taste, and, to be fair, external presentation. As someone who identifies strongly as a woman and has taken genuine steps towards effectively presenting as such, I really don't draw much attention to my chromosomes and infertility because that's not relevant to how I conduct my life.

I'm gonna leave and walk away  the game of sludge (slude) sludge (sludge) ha ha ha ha ha ha


I made a few facetious jokes here and there (and you guys claim us SJWs are so PC!), but I've not thrown sludge or ad hominems. If you want to point that out I'll be ready to apologize.

I never said it was anyway, we all have our opinions left, right and different mixtures of both. Just because you are liberal and atheist doesn't make you right either. It's all kind of relative anyway. Compared to you you'd probably consider me pretty right wing. I'm moderate for America but in Europe would be pretty right wing for example.


It's just something I've noticed on this forum, it's not only you. A lot of people seem to insist that they're centrist or moderate as some sort of defence mechanism, almost as if they're apologizing for holding that view, or to imply that they're "above"/more enlightened than more consistent left/right wingers. I mean, I'm a social liberal but I'm not writing that in every other post ;D (except a few angsty times I put "social justice warrior" as my signature).

It's even weirder once you consider that social liberalism and conservatism are actual belief systems with a set of thought processes and views of the world. "Centrism" on the other hand is not a tangible thing or a consistent belief system. Like you said, it means different things to different people.

Also another funny thing I noticed is that every time someone insisted they're centrist, they go on to post something obscenely right wing, never the other way around. ;D

Also another funny thing I noticed is that every time someone insisted they're centrist, they go on to post something obscenely right wing, never the other way around. ;D


Does that include me? :-[

It's just something I've noticed on this forum, it's not only you. A lot of people seem to insist that they're centrist or moderate as some sort of defence mechanism, almost as if they're apologizing for holding that view, or to imply that they're "above"/more enlightened than more consistent left/right wingers. I mean, I'm a social liberal but I'm not writing that in every other post ;D (except a few angsty times I put "social justice warrior" as my signature).

It's even weirder once you consider that social liberalism and conservatism are actual belief systems with a set of thought processes and views of the world. "Centrism" on the other hand is not a tangible thing or a consistent belief system. Like you said, it means different things to different people.

Also another funny thing I noticed is that every time someone insisted they're centrist, they go on to post something obscenely right wing, never the other way around. ;D


Damn right I'm better than you. >:(

Right wing, right wing, hear us roar! Trumper Army set the score!!! >:( >:( >:( >:(

I'm a centrist. ;) :P

I'm just hoping that another 9/11 doesn't occur in the next few years.


I hope not.

Why would 2017 be worse?


nobody knows if 2017 will be worse, you just to wait and find out.