R.I.P

And within a hundred years or so, Earth will be the new Venus. I would like to thank all the fundies and Republicans!

I don't think environmentalism is dead...but environmentalism is, IMO, too little, too late.  Even if human civilization stopped emitting carbon tomorrow (I mean altogether, Twilight Zone style), global temperatures would still continue to rise for the next seven decades.  If CO2 concentration rises to 700 ppm, we're as good as dead.
::)

I don't think environmentalism is dead...but environmentalism is, IMO, too little, too late.  Even if human civilization stopped emitting carbon tomorrow (I mean altogether, Twilight Zone style), global temperatures would still continue to rise for the next seven decades.  If CO2 concentration rises to 700 ppm, we're as good as dead.
::)


You'd think Republicans would realize this and actively want to partake in environmentalism rather than painting it all as a Communist myth.

You'd think Republicans would realize this and actively want to partake in environmentalism rather than painting it all as a Communist myth.


It's beyond partisan.  We're riding the back of the tiger.  We don't know how to stop.  Buying a Prias and going vegan are nice gestures, but it's still too late.

It's beyond partisan.  We're riding the back of the tiger.  We don't know how to stop.  Buying a Prias and going vegan are nice gestures, but it's still too late.


Perhaps a step into totalitarian is needed for this.

Perhaps a step into totalitarian is needed for this.



That's already happening in America.  

You can vote for tweedle-dum or you can vote for tweedle-dee, but if the moneyed interests say tweedle-dee not tweedle-dum, tweedle-dee it shall be.

What the Bush v. Gore did was steal your bicycle, return it broken, and laughed at you when you tried to ride it home again!

http://www.inthe00s.com/smile/12/evil5.gif

You let them do that, Grampy, you just let them do that?
I don't want to talk about it right now, Billy.
::)

I go with George Carlin's opinion of Environmentalism....

eScDfYzMEEw

That's already happening in America. 

You can vote for tweedle-dum or you can vote for tweedle-dee, but if the moneyed interests say tweedle-dee not tweedle-dum, tweedle-dee it shall be.

What the Bush v. Gore did was steal your bicycle, return it broken, and laughed at you when you tried to ride it home again!

http://www.inthe00s.com/smile/12/evil5.gif

You let them do that, Grampy, you just let them do that?
I don't wan to talk about it right now, Billy.
::)


Don't you mean dweedle dumb and ttweedle dumber?

Well, it is a self-solving problem eventually.

If we're too stupid and weak to band together and stop the actions that eventually lead to a much less inhabitable planet, then nature will quite literally take its course and kill most of us off.

Then again...  I question if that's a bad thing....

We wouldn't be the first species to go extinct by overgrazing.  We would be the first to go extinct so quick and leave such a godawful mess!
                                                                                                                                                                              8-P

I go with George Carlin's opinion of Environmentalism....

eScDfYzMEEw


That's one of Carlin's best routines.  It's main fault is in the beginning.  People do make other animals go extinct.  Man is the one with the fallen nature.  However, Carlin was an atheist, so he didn't believe that. 

Carlin has the yuppie environmentalists nailed.  I live among them.  I don't like them for the same reason I don't like people who march around preaching temperance and chastity.  Get out of my face!
>:(

I go with George Carlin's opinion of Environmentalism....

eScDfYzMEEw


Absolutely brilliant.

To answer, Maxwell Smart. I agree man has made a significant contribution to endangering/killing off animal species but I am wondering if Carlin was referring to animal extinction before mankind (dinosaurs being an example).

I'm not sure this is correct but I was told that scientists have resigned themselves to the idea that human carbon emissions that we have ever produced have pale in comparison to volcanic energy, smoke and gas that enter the atmosphere. I may need to look on the net to clarify/deny this. Also, I have read cow's methane contributes greatly to the carbon dioxide increase. So the answer is to find a way to plug up volcanoes and cows backsides?  ;D

Modified to add: Just found this. Apparently, the volcanic co2 increase in comparison to human carbon emissions is a myth?

http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn11638-climate-myths-human-cosub2sub-emissions-are-too-tiny-to-matter.html

Also, I have read cow's methane contributes greatly to the carbon dioxide increase. So the answer is to find a way to plug up volcanoes and cows backsides?


And what apex predator is responsible for the existence of an overwhelming majority of the cows on this planet? 

The volcanoes were always there and always will be.  It's the hairless apes that burn fossil fuels and raise cattle that are adding new supplies of greenhouse gases that weren't there 300 years ago.

~tinfoil~ Ever notice how Kyoto was about handcuffing the Western democracies to low-growth plays, while countries like China, as a then-emerging-power, was just fine, even though it was dumping more CO2 into the atmosphere via fires in its coal mines than America's automobies?  Funny, those watermelons :) ~/tinfoil~

I believe AGW is real.  I believe the hype over it is overblown - if the oceans rise by a few dozen feet on timescales measured in decades, New York will look like New Orleans (surrounded by dikes), and so what if Bangladesh is inundated -- the country doesn't produce anything anybody needs, and its people can migrate to higher ground.  For every farmer in the Great Plains that's eliminated by drought, there'll be a farmer in the chilly wastes of Saskatchewan who finds that his worthless tundra has turned into an enormous peat bog.  For every Zin/Pinot grower on the CA central coast who gets baked out, there'll be a marginal Zin grower in WA or OR who'll start turning out something awesome.  (And for every Cab grower in WA/OR who turns his vineyards over to Zin or Pinot, there'll be a marginal Cab producer in BC who'll start turning out something awesome.)

The planet will be fine.  Individuals and families will adapt.  And as long as the changes take years/decades to take effect, the global economy won't even blink.

If the sea level rises 12 feet even over 30 year, I see terrifying geopolitical unrest.  One hundred million Bangladeshis migrating north are going to meet with fierce resistance from India, Nepal, Tibet, and China.  War, famine, and plagues shall ensue.  Cities such as New York and London might survive, but they would have to be rebuilt due to flooding. 

What are you going to do, water seal the first 10 floors of the Empire State Building? 

If farmers in Kansas are SOL and northern Saskatchewan is arable, wouldn't the Canadian government give preference to Canadian farmers for the new northern fields long before they'd give Americans a crack at them? I guess we could invade Canada...but it wouldn't do us much good in 2100 when Hudson Bay is turning into a subtropical swamp!  If they could turn the taiga forests into wheat fields, that would be great, but it would not make up for the loss of the vast "bread basket" in the North American prairies, which will turn to desert.  Same goes for Asia.  In other words, there would not be enough food to feed 9 billion people.  Perhaps a billion or 2 billion humans could survive the outcome of a worst-case scenario for 21st century AGW.
:o

If the sea level rises 12 feet even over 30 year, I see terrifying geopolitical unrest.  One hundred million Bangladeshis migrating north are going to meet with fierce resistance from India, Nepal, Tibet, and China. 


And who will defend them when the machine guns open up?  More to the point, who will even notice, since the more likely scenario is they just get wiped out by a hurricane?


What are you going to do, water seal the first 10 floors of the Empire State Building? 


That's assuming a good 100-foot rise, not a 20-30-foot rise which is IMO the most likely scenario.  In any event, the Netherlands did it, so can we... if we care to.  If we don't, it'll be the people living on land that's 50-100 feet above sea level who find themselves the new owners of multigazillion-dollar oceanfront property.  For everyone who loses a $10M home in Malibu, there'll be someone with a $100K home a few miles inland whose great-grandchildren will find themselves sitting on a gold mine.


If farmers in Kansas are SOL and northern Saskatchewan is arable, wouldn't the Canadian government give preference to Canadian farmers for the new northern fields long before they'd give Americans a crack at them?


Canadians, Americans.  It's almost like wheat and corn can't be traded on the CBOE and that Potash Corp. of Saskatchewan (NYSE:POT) isn't being taken over by either BHP or the Chinese in the next 3-6 months.  Countries don't matter.  The companies that own the farns are transnational.  If you've got 50 years to move the planet's breadbasket north by about 10 degrees of latitude, individual farmers are going to notice, but the total amount of food output isn't going to change materially.

(NYSE:POT)


Sounds good to me!
http://www.inthe00s.com/smile/15/toothy9.gif

Okay, it's not much of a reply, but it's late and I'm sleeeeepy!

Sounds good to me!
http://www.inthe00s.com/smile/15/toothy9.gif
Okay, it's not much of a reply, but it's late and I'm sleeeeepy!


Wait a couple of months.  CA passes Prop 19, and the pending takeover of Potash Corp. frees up the symbol, and just watch Philip Morri*cough*Altria do a stock spinoff :)

Wait a couple of months.  CA passes Prop 19, and the pending takeover of Potash Corp. frees up the symbol, and just watch Philip Morri*cough*Altria do a stock spinoff :)


California seems like it's trading tobacco for pot! (CA doesn't sell tobacco...they made it illegal...or so I Heard).