I've been wondering for quite some time...as heated and divisive as politics are these days, at the end of the day does it really matter to you when it comes to choosing your friends? For those of you who consider yourselves to be liberal (which seems to be the majority of regulars in the P&R boards), do you have friends who are conservative? (And to the conservatives who post here, vice versa?)

I have some friends with whom I butt heads with occasionally (mostly the conservatives, but my sister is very liberal and we also occasionally debate each other as well), but we're still friends. (It's funny, whenever my conservative friends from Nebraska would start going off on a rant about something they obviously heard from Rush, I'd just change the subject to Husker football and that would be the end of that. ;))

I have a pretty diverse group of friends and I generally don't care what their political views are, so long as they aren't complete dicks about it.

Wondering what your takes are on this.

Yeah, I have a lot of liberal friends.  As long as they don't try to force their views on me it's not much different from having friends that are religious (which I'm not).  We usually agree to disagree, on the rare occasion that a political issue comes up. 

Even my husband was going to vote for Obama.  8-P

We just ended up not voting, since our votes would cancel each other out, it would've been a waste of time.

I hang out here, don't I?

Even in real life, off the top of my head, I've got anarchosyndicalists, vegan hippies, liberals, Pagans, secular humanists, atheists, minarchists, Christians, meat-eatin' gun-totin' Goldwaterites, meat-eatin' gun-totin' Cheneyites, the odd Randroid, and a Baptist or two in there.

Sometimes we just shrug and laugh at each other.  Sometimes we actually try to hash stuff out over beers.  

Random example: "OK (old-fundie-dude), what's with the insistence on the 'literally true, every word' Bible thing?  Sure, if you start with the proposition that it's all true, it's easier to believe the important bits, but does it have to all be true?  The answer to the question 'Is Noah and the Ark an accurate description of a historical event, or is it just a cheap ripoff of the Babylonian mythos in the Epic of Gilgamesh?' has no bearing on the truth or falsity of the passages that claim the divinity of Christ..."

The difference between friendly debate and partisan rancor is this:  When friends debate, we're not trying to convince each other - we're trying to understand each other.  

I hang out here, don't I?




I was gonna say that too, except that lately I haven't been hanging out here so it didn't quite work.

Yeah I like debating politics here because people here know how to debate without taking things personally.  Not sure I could say the same for some of my friends, so there are only a few I talk politics with.

I disagree with several inthe00s friends on fundamental issues.  You know who you are.
;)

I have friends who are steadfastly anti-choice.  They're some of the kindest people in the world.  I'm not going to let a disagreement over an issue obstruct my friendship with such good folks. 

Other friends of mine favor the death penalty.  I don't let that stand in the way either.

A close friend of mine often chides me for saying "unpatriotic" things.  What good would it do to call him a sucker for nationalism and walk away?

I don't pretend to believe in convictions I don't hold.  I find common ground with those whom I disagree.  For instance, a Republican friend of mine thought universal health care was a bad idea.  I wasn't going to sway him on an argument for social justice and equality.  Thus, I pointed out instead how America's health care system makes less competitive in business.  That he could agree with.  He still voted for McCain, of course, but the two of us weathered no bitter contention. 
8)

The difference between friendly debate and partisan rancor is this:  When friends debate, we're not trying to convince each other - we're trying to understand each other.  


couldnt have said it better myself. Being in the middle of the political spectrum, I usually can agree with many points people bring up. I have religious friends as well, even tho I'm not.


I find common ground with those whom I disagree.


same here. left or right,  a lot of people want the same thing, just have different ideas on how best to get there.

Ant

I'm related to some people who I don't agree with politically.  :D ;D ;D  Yeah, I do have friends who are VERY conservative including one of my best friends.



Cat

I'm Politically Neutral, so it doesn't bug me...

I can talk about politics to almost anyone, anyone!

I married one of them!

I married one of them!


You can really be at peace with somebody once you agree to disagree.  You have to mean it, though.

I do.  I have a lot of liberal friends and I am very conservative.  We can discuss, but don't that often.  We just agree that we have different opinions on politics and religion.  Heck, my mother is a liberal and an athiest.  We just don't discuss religion and politics.  It could get ugly. ;D 

I think anyone could be friends as long as you can respect their beliefs and they respect yours. 

I do.  I have a lot of liberal friends and I am very conservative.  We can discuss, but don't that often.  We just agree that we have different opinions on politics and religion.  Heck, my mother is a liberal and an athiest.  We just don't discuss religion and politics.  It could get ugly. ;D 

I think anyone could be friends as long as you can respect their beliefs and they respect yours. 


I do have some people who I counted as friends whose opinions became so disrespectful that I finally had to say see you later.  There is a point were it isn't political opinion, it is just plain old stupid sheeshe.

I do.  I have a lot of liberal friends and I am very conservative.  We can discuss, but don't that often.  We just agree that we have different opinions on politics and religion.  Heck, my mother is a liberal and an athiest.  We just don't discuss religion and politics.  It could get ugly. ;D 

I think anyone could be friends as long as you can respect their beliefs and they respect yours. 



I couldn't have said it better, myself. It really bothers me when people think that their beliefs are the ONLY right ones. It maybe right for them but not right for me. I always say, my beliefs are just that: MINE!!! Not yours, not his or hers but MINE!!!  It is like shoes-there isn't a one size fits all. They come in many different sizes and many colors & shapes.



Cat

I don't mind the arguments.  Things go okay for me, win or lose.  I just don't like the discussion to get personal.  I don't like it to be ABOUT the debaters, I want it to be about the debate.

I know I'm about to open up a major can of worms by saying this, but quite a few of my friends are racists. (Could have something to do with the fact that Missouri was a predominantly Confederate state during the Civil War, and that Kansas City went through some really bad racial turmoil in the late 1960's.) And it bugs me and I feel torn by it from time to time. I mean, these are people who I can trust, who took me in and made me feel welcome when I was a stranger in a new town, and who would gladly give me the shirt off their backs if I was ever in need (and I'd do the same for them). I mean really, it's almost a Southern kind of thing.

Yet so many of them are also racist as hell. I mean sure it'd be easy for you to say, "Well, why don't you just quit being friends with them?" But if I did that then I wouldn't have any friends at all. Occasionally I'll call them on it, I've even gotten up in some of their faces about it, but it's one of those things I just kind of put up with, and I've come to the realization that all I can do is just strengthen my resolve to not let their attitudes infect me.

I really like KC and the people for the most part have been great to me but it is also a very racially divided city, and I meet so many people who otherwise seem good yet have these ugly, deep-seated prejudices and it really messes with my mind sometimes.

I'm not trying to defend them or anything like that and I'll probably get some heat for it, but I figure I should at least get it out there and let you all know what's going on.

Al, I don't think it's anything you have to feel bad about or feel responsible for.  (I'm assuming you mean they don't like to associate with people of other races, and not that they discriminate against or bother them in any way)

Would you have a problem being friends with a Palestinian-American who didn't like Jews?  I wouldn't, and I partly come from Jewish/Israeli ancestry.

People are entitled to their thoughts and opinions.  As long as they aren't inflicting any grief on opposite races, I'd agree to disagree. 

Our thoughts and beliefs are about all that is left that nobody's figured out how to control.... yet...

I know I'm about to open up a major can of worms by saying this, but quite a few of my friends are racists. (Could have something to do with the fact that Missouri was a predominantly Confederate state during the Civil War, and that Kansas City went through some really bad racial turmoil in the late 1960's.) And it bugs me and I feel torn by it from time to time. I mean, these are people who I can trust, who took me in and made me feel welcome when I was a stranger in a new town, and who would gladly give me the shirt off their backs if I was ever in need (and I'd do the same for them). I mean really, it's almost a Southern kind of thing.

Yet so many of them are also racist as hell. I mean sure it'd be easy for you to say, "Well, why don't you just quit being friends with them?" But if I did that then I wouldn't have any friends at all. Occasionally I'll call them on it, I've even gotten up in some of their faces about it, but it's one of those things I just kind of put up with, and I've come to the realization that all I can do is just strengthen my resolve to not let their attitudes infect me.

I really like KC and the people for the most part have been great to me but it is also a very racially divided city, and I meet so many people who otherwise seem good yet have these ugly, deep-seated prejudices and it really messes with my mind sometimes.

I'm not trying to defend them or anything like that and I'll probably get some heat for it, but I figure I should at least get it out there and let you all know what's going on.




That's what happened to my sister with a lot of her friends.  A friend of hers would say something my sister would take exception to, then she couldn't let it go, and had to respond.  I lost a lot of friends that way too.  If you're mad, just go ahead and be mad, but keep your yap shut.  Keep all statements neutral.  If your friend doesn't want talk about his or her feelings, let that be, and don't drive your friend off.  Better to leave space to heal things up.  Still, my sister lashes out, and I can't do a thing about it.
::) 

The difference between friendly debate and partisan rancor is this:  When friends debate, we're not trying to convince each other - we're trying to understand each other. 

You do have a good way with words at times...

Politics over here is nothing like as gut-wrenchingly partisan as it frequently is on that side of the pond, so yes, I have a lot of friends with different political views.  I'm more likely to argue over non-party-political issues (e.g. monarchy vs republicanism, democracy vs anything else, drugs policy.. *especially* drugs policy) than party politics as I've never felt that closely aligned with any particular party.

Religion's more fun in that respect, though most of my Christian friends are barely religious (sometimes the CofE seems more like a social than a religious organization).  You can't argue with them, as by and large there is no argument to be had: they only believe what they do from years/decades of never really considering any alternative.

I know I'm about to open up a major can of worms by saying this, but quite a few of my friends are racists. (Could have something to do with the fact that Missouri was a predominantly Confederate state during the Civil War, and that Kansas City went through some really bad racial turmoil in the late 1960's.) And it bugs me and I feel torn by it from time to time. I mean, these are people who I can trust, who took me in and made me feel welcome when I was a stranger in a new town, and who would gladly give me the shirt off their backs if I was ever in need (and I'd do the same for them). I mean really, it's almost a Southern kind of thing.

Yet so many of them are also racist as hell. I mean sure it'd be easy for you to say, "Well, why don't you just quit being friends with them?" But if I did that then I wouldn't have any friends at all. Occasionally I'll call them on it, I've even gotten up in some of their faces about it, but it's one of those things I just kind of put up with, and I've come to the realization that all I can do is just strengthen my resolve to not let their attitudes infect me.

I really like KC and the people for the most part have been great to me but it is also a very racially divided city, and I meet so many people who otherwise seem good yet have these ugly, deep-seated prejudices and it really messes with my mind sometimes.

I'm not trying to defend them or anything like that and I'll probably get some heat for it, but I figure I should at least get it out there and let you all know what's going on.





I hear what you are saying. As long as you are firm in your beliefs, no let ANYONE sway you from them. And don't let anyone make you "guilty by association."



Cat

I know I'm about to open up a major can of worms by saying this, but quite a few of my friends are racists. (Could have something to do with the fact that Missouri was a predominantly Confederate state during the Civil War, and that Kansas City went through some really bad racial turmoil in the late 1960's.) And it bugs me and I feel torn by it from time to time. I mean, these are people who I can trust, who took me in and made me feel welcome when I was a stranger in a new town, and who would gladly give me the shirt off their backs if I was ever in need (and I'd do the same for them). I mean really, it's almost a Southern kind of thing.

Yet so many of them are also racist as hell. I mean sure it'd be easy for you to say, "Well, why don't you just quit being friends with them?" But if I did that then I wouldn't have any friends at all. Occasionally I'll call them on it, I've even gotten up in some of their faces about it, but it's one of those things I just kind of put up with, and I've come to the realization that all I can do is just strengthen my resolve to not let their attitudes infect me.

I really like KC and the people for the most part have been great to me but it is also a very racially divided city, and I meet so many people who otherwise seem good yet have these ugly, deep-seated prejudices and it really messes with my mind sometimes.

I'm not trying to defend them or anything like that and I'll probably get some heat for it, but I figure I should at least get it out there and let you all know what's going on.




You know, it's interesting that you just posted this, because I"m going through something very similar myself.

To address the thread, I will just say that I'm a liberal that lives in Utah.  If I chose not to be friends with people who had different beliefs than me, I wouldn't have very many friends at all.  But I've been noticing lately that some of my friends are exhibiting racist tendenceies that I had never noticed before.  Especially since Obama was elected.  Honestly, it kills me.  Generally speaking, I am not one to keep my mouth shut - I will more often than not call people out on something that I feel is offensive, and I find racism very offensive.  But it seems like it's ok to be racist now that we have a black president, and I'm just totally blown away by this.  (I'm realizing that this might need to be a separate thread, but for now I will keep it here.)  Has anyone else noticed this?  The emails and jokes that go around that call Obama the N-word - stuff like that?  I'm appalled at them, and especially appalled by the people that send them.  And I don't know how to handle it.  I haven't outright broken up with anyone that's sent me this kind of stuff, but I've certainly let them have it, and there's been some serious tension.  I did post a thread about a fight I had with someone I worked with that forwarded a really messed up email.  But man...it's just crazy to me how people are so openly racist these days.  Is anyone else going through this sort of thing? 

I hear what you are saying. As long as you are firm in your beliefs, no let ANYONE sway you from them. And don't let anyone make you "guilty by association."


And if anyone has a problem with that, tell them you got the idea from Captain America himself.

(RIP, Captain.)

You know, it's interesting that you just posted this, because I"m going through something very similar myself.

To address the thread, I will just say that I'm a liberal that lives in Utah.  If I chose not to be friends with people who had different beliefs than me, I wouldn't have very many friends at all.  But I've been noticing lately that some of my friends are exhibiting racist tendenceies that I had never noticed before.  Especially since Obama was elected.  Honestly, it kills me.  Generally speaking, I am not one to keep my mouth shut - I will more often than not call people out on something that I feel is offensive, and I find racism very offensive.  But it seems like it's ok to be racist now that we have a black president, and I'm just totally blown away by this.  (I'm realizing that this might need to be a separate thread, but for now I will keep it here.)  Has anyone else noticed this?  The emails and jokes that go around that call Obama the N-word - stuff like that?  I'm appalled at them, and especially appalled by the people that send them.  And I don't know how to handle it.  I haven't outright broken up with anyone that's sent me this kind of stuff, but I've certainly let them have it, and there's been some serious tension.  I did post a thread about a fight I had with someone I worked with that forwarded a really messed up email.  But man...it's just crazy to me how people are so openly racist these days.  Is anyone else going through this sort of thing? 




No, but *Ash*...

Ever get heat from Mormons?

It's wrong to be prejudice, but I'll say something that I may regret...aren't we all prejudicial? I know I can be...with people from the Indian Subcontinent.... :-[

You can be prejudice about anything...ANYTHING!

Okay, I said enough! :-X