http://blog.seattlepi.com/hottopics/archives/195075.asp

By now you've probably heard of the violent nutcase in Texas who set his house on fire, stole an airplane, and flew it into the IRS building in Austin.  Now he's dead and he's taken (x) number of innocent lives with him.  This is domestic terrorism. 

Our newly-elected senator Scott Brown (R-MA) didn't see fit to condemn the attack.  He certainly didn't endorse what the late Joseph Stack did, but I would expect a senator to unequivocally denounce a homicidal mania going kamikaze on a federal building in this post 9/11 world. 

From the FOX News Neil Cavuto program --

Brown: Well, yeah, of course it's extreme. You don't know anything about the individual. He could have had other issues, certainly. No one likes paying taxes, obviously. But the way we're trying to deal with things and have been in the past, at least until I got here is, there's such a logjam in Washington. And people want us to do better. They want us to help solve the problems that are affecting Americans in a very real way.

So it's kinda our fault, right?  We ask people to pay taxes because we have to run a country, and some of those taxpayers don't like it. Some taxpayers have grievances with the Internal Revenue Service.  They're mad.  Duh. 

No, Senator Brown, if you take the oath of office to uphold the U.S. Constitution, you must not offer even implicit sympathy for terrorists who execute armed insurrection against the United States government. 

I'm guessing Brown's reaction would have been different if the guy's name was Ali Akbar and he crash bombed the IRS building to protest U.S. support for Israel.  Stack was a middle-aged white businessman who hated the IRS.  Heck, those guys are just like you 'n' me!

Brown also said Stack might have other issues.  You don't say? 

This asshole...I mean Stack...set his own home on fire with his wife and daughter trapped inside!

Congratulations fellow Bay Staters.  You picked a real winner this time!

http://www.inthe00s.com/smile/10/vogel.gif

So it's kinda our fault, right?  We ask people to pay taxes because we have to run a country, and some of those taxpayers don't like it. Some taxpayers have grievances with the Internal Revenue Service.  They're mad.  Duh. 

No, Senator Brown, if you take the oath of office to uphold the U.S. Constitution, you must not offer even implicit sympathy for terrorists who execute armed insurrection against the United States government. 


"There are four boxes to be used in defense of liberty: soap, ballot, jury, and ammo. Please use in that order."
- Ed Howdershelt, ca. 1971.

I've already laughed at The Asshat Who Made Life Just That Much Harder For General Aviation in our political comedy thread.  But to get srs bizniz for a moment, this farktard's mistake is that he forgot about Box #3. 

In his case, Box #3 consisted of hiring a better accountant in the first place, and even if he hadn't, it would have consisted of either paying the thugs when they came to his door, or going to jail.  Civil disobedience is about throwing yourself upon the mercy of the court and hoping for jury nullfication, or about forcing the IRS to throw everyone in jail.  This guy did neither.  From what I can glean of his suicide note - and I say this as a guy who hates taxation with the passion of Ayn Rand herself - he committed tax fraud, got busted, and compounded his error by not filing.  Frack the feds for the ensuing crackdown on general aviation, but doublefrack him in every orifice for causing it.

P.S.:  Yes, it is the beer talking, either that, or it's the fact that AC/DC's Jailbreak (from 1974) came up on the shuffle list.  Wannabee tax-protestors, do it right:  if it's truly "all in the name of liberty", either take the rap and break out in the dead of night, or sneak across the border Sound-of-Music-style with your net worth in gold sewed into your underpants.  If you want a post-WW2 metaphor, go Winfried Freudenberg-style over the Berlin Wall in a hot-air balloon.  But go out in such a manner that even if you get killed in the process, remember that it's only worth it if you go out never having inflicted force upon your fellow citizens.  (And I'm sorry, Chris, Winfried, and others, for sullying your names by linking to it in a thread about some asshat who completely missed the point.  Hope the kickass AC/DC reference makes up for it.  Spotlights.  Sirens.  Rifles firin'.  But you made it out.  And unlike the Asshat from Texas, you not-wannabe-anymore-East German dudes did it right.)

P.P.S.: And if you think this was a rant against Asshats With A Plane, you should see the rant from the blogger I cited. 

From the little bits I have read about this dude Stack, it seems like he was nothing more than somebody who thought that he did not have to pay taxes, and then threw his last tantrum when he found out that the IRS doesn't simply lay back when you don't pay taxes.

I am guessing that his latest runin with the Feds had to do with him draining his IRA account, but not paying taxes on the withdrawals, as he said that he had not filed a return "because he had no income".  Unless his IRA was a Roth IRA, then he was gonna have to pay tax on the withdrawals,as well as possibly the 10% early withdrawal penalty.

I am surprised that Fox News wasn't all like....

"This is all Obama's fault! Blame Obama!"

::)

Oh they'll find a way to blame Obama.  In fact, the already have...before Stack decided to play the Red Baron!
::)

Here's one:

"Sadly, though I spent my entire life trying to believe it wasn’t so, but violence not only is the answer, it is the only answer," the note continued. " ... The communist creed: From each according to his ability, to each according to his need. The capitalist creed: From each according to his gullibility, to each according to his greed." 
--Stacko the Whacko

See?  He was a red.  A dirty, filthy red!

He said he started writing that manifesto (in which he referred to "the anals of the IRS") as a form of therapy, but the more he wrote, the angrier he got.  Then maybe it was time to switch off the computer and get a scrip for some Prozac, or talk to his minister, or SOMETHING other than inflaming a murderous rage!

I have issues with debt to the U.S. government I can't pay.  It sucks royally.  You feel oppressed.  You feel helpless.  Sometimes you feel like raging.  BUT crime and violence is not the answer.  I wish Stack had figured that out.  I wish our government WOULD figure that out!

The thing about taxes is we need to have them to keep society going...but everybody in our society has some reason why somebody ELSE should pay the taxes!
::)

Oh they'll find a way to blame Obama.  In fact, the already have...before Stack decided to play the Red Baron!
::)

Here's one:

"Sadly, though I spent my entire life trying to believe it wasn’t so, but violence not only is the answer, it is the only answer," the note continued. " ... The communist creed: From each according to his ability, to each according to his need. The capitalist creed: From each according to his gullibility, to each according to his greed." 
--Stacko the Whacko

See?  He was a red.  A dirty, filthy red!

He said he started writing that manifesto (in which he referred to "the anals of the IRS") as a form of therapy, but the more he wrote, the angrier he got.  Then maybe it was time to switch off the computer and get a scrip for some Prozac, or talk to his minister, or SOMETHING other than inflaming a murderous rage!

I have issues with debt to the U.S. government I can't pay.  It sucks royally.  You feel oppressed.  You feel helpless.  Sometimes you feel like raging.  BUT crime and violence is not the answer.  I wish Stack had figured that out.  I wish our government WOULD figure that out!

The thing about taxes is we need to have them to keep society going...but everybody in our society has some reason why somebody ELSE should pay the taxes!
::)



They're not gonna blame Obama for a guy burning his house down or crashing a plane into the IRS building. I mean come on.

Anyway about Stack he had kids (if I'm not mistaken), a wife, and a job. I mean what else did he want?

I am mad at the government too because politicians are so partisin now its crazy but I don't go blowing up things up or setting things on fire over it.

They're not gonna blame Obama for a guy burning his house down or crashing a plane into the IRS building. I mean come on.

Anyway about Stack he had kids (if I'm not mistaken), a wife, and a job. I mean what else did he want?

I am mad at the government too because politicians are so partisin now its crazy but I don't go blowing up things up or setting things on fire over it.


Oh, trust me, they will find away, they always do.

::)

I'm sure as soon as Brown hears that Stack made a brief reference to supporting socialized medicine in his note, he'll begin the attack....

...but for the wrong reasons....

All those who like to pay taxes raise your hand.

Now all those who pay taxes so that we can have all the stuff that our taxes pay for, from defense to our local schools (as bad as they are) raise your hand.

As long as there is a modicum of fairness in our tax system, it is a necessary evil that we just have to abide, so for any politician to not disown this "domestic terrorist" is, in my opinion, an act of terrorism.

They're not gonna blame Obama for a guy burning his house down or crashing a plane into the IRS building. I mean come on.

The Republicans are out every day trying to blame Obama for the current financial crisis and thus the resentment individuals are feeling towards our government.  Indirectly, they already have blamed Obama.

Anyway about Stack he had kids (if I'm not mistaken), a wife, and a job. I mean what else did he want?
Well, since the firefighters had to rescue his wife and daughter from the Stack home, which Stack set on fire, I don't think he wanted either of them.  He wanted the IRS to f**k off, that much is clear!
::)

I am mad at the government too because politicians are so partisin now its crazy but I don't go blowing up things up or setting things on fire over it.


Most of us are mad at the government and we don't blow stuff up and set things on fire.  The neo-cons wish there were a lot more guys like Stack out there because it would make it so much easier to erase our civil rights!

The Republicans are out every day trying to blame Obama for the current financial crisis and thus the resentment individuals are feeling towards our government.  Indirectly, they already have blamed Obama.
Well, since the firefighters had to rescue his wife and daughter from the Stack home, which Stack set on fire, I don't think he wanted either of them.  He wanted the IRS to f**k off, that much is clear!
::)

Most of us are mad at the government and we don't blow stuff up and set things on fire.  The neo-cons wish there were a lot more guys like Stack out there because it would make it so much easier to erase our civil rights!
The only thing the Repubicans have blamed Obama on is these job-killing policies(i.e. the current health care bill, cap and trade, and card check.) The resentment on the government? The Dems could have passed anything they wanted on a party-line vote for the last year till Scott Brown elected. Why blame the Republicans? These are all the Dems policys for the last year that didn't need a single Repubican till Brown got elected. As for more of the ill-feelings toward the government did you know about the "Louisiana Purchase" in the Health Care Bill, as well as  "The Cornhusker  Kickback "all done by the Democrats. The Dems are just doing all this bad stuff to themselves.

Oh, trust me, they will find away, they always do.

::)
What the left is already saying that Stack is a right wing extremist right?

The only thing the Repubicans have blamed Obama on is these job-killing policies(i.e. the current health care bill, cap and trade, and card check.) The resentment on the government? The Dems could have passed anything they wanted on a party-line vote for the last year till Scott Brown elected. Why blame the Republicans? These are all the Dems policys for the last year that didn't need a single Repubican till Brown got elected. As for more of the ill-feelings toward the government did you know about the "Louisiana Purchase" in the Health Care Bill, as well as  "The Cornhusker  Kickback "all done by the Democrats. The Dems are just doing all this bad stuff to themselves.


Health care reform is not a job killer.  In fact if we had a national health care system, US employers (are there still any?) would be more competitive and would, therefore, be able to create many more jobs.  Likewise with cap and trade, which would encourage  greater innovation in green technology.  Nor is unionization, in and of itself a job killer.  To suggest that it is is to suggest that workers would like to organize in order to put their employers out of business.  You need to realize that unions do lots more that try to raise wages.

Yes, the Dems had a majority in the senate, but unlike the "party of no" who seem to me to act like a bunch of sheep, the dems are a big tent that lacks the lock step discipline of the repugs.  you also allude to some deals that were made to get some dem senators to support health care.  I too am troubled by them, but politics is the art of the possible, and "log rolling" is an established practice, no matter how we might view it in any particular instance.

But your initial statement is just not accurate.  Obama has been blamed for just about everything, most famously, the Bush recession, and just about everything after.

Health care reform is not a job killer.  In fact if we had a national health care system, US employers (are there still any?) would be more competitive and would, therefore, be able to create many more jobs.  Likewise with cap and trade, which would encourage  greater innovation in green technology.  Nor is unionization, in and of itself a job killer.  To suggest that it is is to suggest that workers would like to organize in order to put their employers out of business.  You need to realize that unions do lots more that try to raise wages.

Yes, the Dems had a majority in the senate, but unlike the "party of no" who seem to me to act like a bunch of sheep, the dems are a big tent that lacks the lock step discipline of the repugs.  you also allude to some deals that were made to get some dem senators to support health care.  I too am troubled by them, but politics is the art of the possible, and "log rolling" is an established practice, no matter how we might view it in any particular instance.

But your initial statement is just not accurate.  Obama has been blamed for just about everything, most famously, the Bush recession, and just about everything after.


Agreed.  Karma.


What the left is already saying that Stack is a right wing extremist right?


What I'm saying is if this assclown had been a Muslim instead of a white guy bellyaching about taxes, Scott Brown would be singing a whole different song.

Yeah we all know how great the economy was during the George W. Bush years.  ::) They had 8 years and they drove this country into the toilet, of course the wussy Dems aren't helping now either so we're screwed either way.  ::) An easy way to reduce the deficit is to end the damn wars and the fake war on terror. Anytime somebody wants to put OUR money into the USA the neocon thugs cry foul, but funnel all the money you want into the wars. Taxes should be used to for the greater good society instead of waging war. The reality is there is only one party in this country and it's called the Corporate Party and they give us this fake choice between Democrat and Republican. The only way we can get our country back is to stop voting for the Corporate Party's two wings and vote third party.

Yeah we all know how great the economy was during the George W. Bush years.  ::) They had 8 years and they drove this country into the toilet, of course the wussy Dems aren't helping now either so we're screwed either way.  ::) An easy way to reduce the deficit is to end the damn wars and the fake war on terror. Anytime somebody wants to put OUR money into the USA the neocon thugs cry foul, but funnel all the money you want into the wars. Taxes should be used to for the greater good society instead of waging war. The reality is there is only one party in this country and it's called the Corporate Party and they give us this fake choice between Democrat and Republican. The only way we can get our country back is to stop voting for the Corporate Party's two wings and vote third party.


So true! KARMA.

"Stack Attack"...

Sort of reminds me of the "Big Mac Attack" in San Ysindro CA back in 1984, when some guy walked into a McDonald's and murdered 21 people.  :-\\

"Stack Attack"...

Sort of reminds me of the "Big Mac Attack" in San Ysindro CA back in 1984, when some guy walked into a McDonald's and murdered 21 people.   :-\\


The Luby's Cafeteria massacre in Killeen, TX, back in 1991 topped that with 23 casualties!
:o

I see the danger of Stack in the fact that there are more Stacks out there.  The big lie known as supply side economics is what's really going down in a flaming wreck.  It's not gonna stop until it grinds itself into powder, and grinds most of us up in the process.  Unfortunately, a few will respond like Joe Stack and get murderous.  Ten Joe Stacks and our politicians hand out press releases to the chattering classes making a case for internal passports, random searches of persons and homes, and Soviet-style snitching programs.  Say goodbye to your civil liberties in that case, including your precious  Second Amendment.  Don't worry, it'll only be "temporary" until we get the whackos under control, then you can have your guns back.  Scout's honor.  The government would never lie about that!
http://www.inthe00s.com/smile/10/spider.gif

The Luby's Cafeteria massacre in Killeen, TX, back in 1991 topped that with 23 casualties!
:o

I see the danger of Stack in the fact that there are more Stacks out there.  The big lie known as supply side economics is what's really going down in a flaming wreck.  It's not gonna stop until it grinds itself into powder, and grinds most of us up in the process.  Unfortunately, a few will respond like Joe Stack and get murderous.  Ten Joe Stacks and our politicians hand out press releases to the chattering classes making a case for internal passports, random searches of persons and homes, and Soviet-style snitching programs.  Say goodbye to your civil liberties in that case, including your precious  Second Amendment.  Don't worry, it'll only be "temporary" until we get the whackos under control, then you can have your guns back.  Scout's honor.  The government would never lie about that!
http://www.inthe00s.com/smile/10/spider.gif



While I think this is a bit extreme, and I doubt it will come to that, the danger is real.  I'm not sure who it was but but someone said that fascism would come to the US wrapped in the flag.

What I'm saying is if this assclown had been a Muslim instead of a white guy bellyaching about taxes, Scott Brown would be singing a whole different song.


On a brighter note, if the assclown had been a Muslim, at least six TSA goons would be posted beside every privately-owned plane at every podunk airport in the country.  Instead, the guy's suicide note ensured that he'd be quickly swept out of the news cycle to prevent copycatters.  He didn't even inspire the crackdown he wrote about. 

Sometimes an asshat will manage to sneak a fast one by you - you take the punch, keep calm, and carry on.

The only thing the Repubicans have blamed Obama on is these job-killing policies(i.e. the current health care bill, cap and trade, and card check.)
??? You serious?  They were blaming Obama for the state of the economy before he'd even taken over.  What I was reading a few thousand miles away was so ridiculous I even wrote a song about it.


I see the danger of Stack in the fact that there are more Stacks out there.

Yeah... a whole st.. er, pile of 'em

??? You serious?  They were blaming Obama for the state of the economy before he'd even taken over.  What I was reading a few thousand miles away was so ridiculous I even wrote a song about it.
Yeah... a whole st.. er, pile of 'em


What Republican Senators or House Reps are blaming Obama for the recession? I never heard of this.

Health care reform is not a job killer.  In fact if we had a national health care system, US employers (are there still any?) would be more competitive and would, therefore, be able to create many more jobs.  Likewise with cap and trade, which would encourage  greater innovation in green technology.  Nor is unionization, in and of itself a job killer.  To suggest that it is is to suggest that workers would like to organize in order to put their employers out of business.  You need to realize that unions do lots more that try to raise wages.

Yes, the Dems had a majority in the senate, but unlike the "party of no" who seem to me to act like a bunch of sheep, the dems are a big tent that lacks the lock step discipline of the repugs.  you also allude to some deals that were made to get some dem senators to support health care.  I too am troubled by them, but politics is the art of the possible, and "log rolling" is an established practice, no matter how we might view it in any particular instance.

But your initial statement is just not accurate.  Obama has been blamed for just about everything, most famously, the Bush recession, and just about everything after.
Carlos, I agree Health Care Reform should not be a job killer but this 2,074 page bill is I think anyway. I mean forcing employers too pay fines of they don;t offer their employees health care. I mean Obama's policy's like Card Check, Cap & Trade, and this infamous health care bill prevent employers from hiriing workers in a bad economic time.

As far as Unions go I just think of "GM" and the "UAW" when I l think about unions sometimes and thats a bad thing. I realize they are good unions like the "Steelworkers Union". Forget it if Card Check happens Toyota and Honda will go down the road of GM soon I'm afraid. The UAW is a greedy union to me. I am not a fan of card check itself either because say I worked with you Carlos. Why would I want to know if you voted for the union or not? That would be your own personal business on you voted.

Cap & Trade- Electrical Bills will go up for homes and business's you could see Employees pay getting cut, employees getting laid off, and prevents hiring currently.

I realize they are good unions like the "Steelworkers Union".

;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

The Steelworkers are a "good union"?  Let me remind you that in 1977, the Steelworkers Union, along with the management of various steel companies, had to be dragged into federal court and was essentially forced to sign a consent decree which put an end to rampant discrimination against blacks and women in the industry.  In my home town steel mill, blacks got all the sh*tty jobs and this was due to an organized and agreed-to scheme developed and encouraged by both the USWA and the company.

Now on to LTV Steel...  In 1999/2000/2001, LTV was in bankruptcy and various proposals were made to the USWA to save the company.  They refused, and the company completely shut down.  After the company was bought by ISG Steel, all USWA workers were fired and essentially had to be re-hired.  The contract terms were more or less as dictated by ISG, and were far more onerous than anything that LTV had proposed, and with far fewer workers.

Take a look at the sad history of what was once "Wheeling Pittsburgh Steel" over the past 6 years or so and see what the USWA's meddling caused.  (Mind you, Wheeling Pitt was a basket case with or without the USWA, but the USWA simply made things even worse).

On a personal note, when I was managing a department in a USWA-represented shop, I worked side-by-side with the Union Steward to get the company to put up nearly $2,000,000 for a safety improvement that was very much needed, but which previous managers had fought.  Once I got the money approved, the UNION THEN HELD UP THE PROJECT FOR A YEAR over irrelevant work rules, a grievance which, by the way, they ultimately lost.  But their perception of "power" took precedence over worker safety.

Oh as to the "Employee Free Choice Act"... About 3 years ago, the independent steel workers union at AK Steel in Middletown decided to throw out their independent union, and instead voted to instead affiliate with the International Machinists Union by a card-check (the USWA was another option in that card tally).  This was not a vote to "unionize" as they already were unionized; instead they simply chard-check-voted to change which union represented them, and it was a landslide for the IAM.

The USWA (who lost that card check by a landslide as well) then filed an NLRB case, demanding that a SECRET BALLOT be held.  So much for their support of the "card check" process.  OF course in the subsequent secret ballot, the USWA lost by an even bigger margin, because the workers could clearly see that the USWA did not have their interests in mind.

The USWA is no more "good" or "bad" than any other union. And, by the way, their current president is not even an American citizen.

;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D

The Steelworkers are a "good union"?  Let me remind you that in 1977, the Steelworkers Union, along with the management of various steel companies, had to be dragged into federal court and was essentially forced to sign a consent decree which put an end to rampant discrimination against blacks and women in the industry.  In my home town steel mill, blacks got all the sh*tty jobs and this was due to an organized and agreed-to scheme developed and encouraged by both the USWA and the company.

Now on to LTV Steel...  In 1999/2000/2001, LTV was in bankruptcy and various proposals were made to the USWA to save the company.  They refused, and the company completely shut down.  After the company was bought by ISG Steel, all USWA workers were fired and essentially had to be re-hired.  The contract terms were more or less as dictated by ISG, and were far more onerous than anything that LTV had proposed, and with far fewer workers.

Take a look at the sad history of what was once "Wheeling Pittsburgh Steel" over the past 6 years or so and see what the USWA's meddling caused.  (Mind you, Wheeling Pitt was a basket case with or without the USWA, but the USWA simply made things even worse).

On a personal note, when I was managing a department in a USWA-represented shop, I worked side-by-side with the Union Steward to get the company to put up nearly $2,000,000 for a safety improvement that was very much needed, but whi

ch previous managers had fought.  Once I got the money approved, the UNION THEN HELD UP THE PROJECT FOR A YEAR over irrelevant work rules, a grievance which, by the way, they ultimately lost.  But their perception of "power" took precedence over worker safety.

Oh as to the "Employee Free Choice Act"... About 3 years ago, the independent steel workers union at AK Steel in Middletown decided to throw out their independent union, and instead voted to instead affiliate with the International Machinists Union by a card-check (the USWA was another option in that card tally).  This was not a vote to "unionize" as they already were unionized; instead they simply chard-check-voted to change which union represented them, and it was a landslide for the IAM.

The USWA (who lost that card check by a landslide as well) then filed an NLRB case, demanding that a SECRET BALLOT be held.  So much for their support of the "card check" process.  OF course in the subsequent secret ballot, the USWA lost by an even bigger margin, because the workers could clearly see that the USWA did not have their interests in mind.

The USWA is no more "good" or "bad" than any other union. And, by the way, their current president is not even an American citizen.


Yeah, I'm sure there are a bunch rotten eggs in the steel union, but I don't want the steel union running health care any more than Blue Cross Avalanche, or whatever they're called.

Single payer.  No bullsh*t insurance companies.  Look, they just want to collect premiums from people never make claims.  That's just not the reality of health care.  They ought to get out if they don't like it, and run Internet porn sites if they want to operate like that.
8)

What Republican Senators or House Reps are blaming Obama for the recession? I never heard of this.


Did I say anything about senators/house reps?  Possibly because I was replying to what you wrote:


The only thing the Repubicans have blamed Obama on is these job-killing policies(i.e. the current health care bill, cap and trade, and card check.)

..which doesn't, either.