Death Penalty has always been a race issue, and it will continue to be as long as it deflects from the economic issue.  When's the last time they fried a trust fund? 

Death Penalty has always been a race issue, and it will continue to be as long as it deflects from the economic issue.  When's the last time they fried a trust fund? 


Well, that's just it.  There's the race issue and there's the money issue.  I've always said if O.J. Simpson was just Oscar Simpson, a bus driver from South Central, who stabbed his white wife and her white friend to death, he would have gotten the death penalty PDQ.
::)

Death Penalty has always been a race issue, and it will continue to be as long as it deflects from the economic issue.  When's the last time they fried a trust fund? 


It's a class issue then, and NOT a race issue.  Just because blacks are disproportionately poorer doesn't mean they are being executed because they are black.  They're being executed because they can't afford better lawyers.

If whites were disproportionately poorer, then you'd see the same happen with them instead.

Death Penalty has always been a race issue, and it will continue to be as long as it deflects from the economic issue.  When's the last time they fried a trust fund? 


How do you explain the fact that if a black dude is murdered, a white defendant and a black defendant have an equal chance of getting the death penalty?  Are we saying that the only whites who kill blacks are poor?

When I read ther statistics (sparsely presented in this thread as they are) it seems to me that the point of racism in the Death Penalty seems to be regarding the race of the VICTIM.  Kill a white guy and the chances are 2x-3x as high that you are condemned as opposed to killing a black guy.

How do you explain the fact that if a black dude is murdered, a white defendant and a black defendant have an equal chance of getting the death penalty?  Are we saying that the only whites who kill blacks are poor?

When I read ther statistics (sparsely presented in this thread as they are) it seems to me that the point of racism in the Death Penalty seems to be regarding the race of the VICTIM.  Kill a white guy and the chances are 2x-3x as high that you are condemned as opposed to killing a black guy.

er... isn't that saying that the death penalty *is* a race issue?  In effect, it's saying that the judicial process on average thinks that a black man's life is worth less than a white man's... that kind of sounds like a race issue to me.

After reading this, I went googling for something that came up a few years ago: a bit of research that showed that black men were significantly more likely to be convicted than white men on the same standard of evidence - basically that benefit of the (reasonable) doubt is more likely to be given to a white man.  I can remember discussing it (I think it was on this forum), but can't spot the article I was looking for.  I'll have another look when I've got a bit more time, because I believe it is a very pertinent bit of research as a reason behind this sort of act: if the justice system itself is biased in favour of a white majority, any attempt to level that playing field will seem like an attack on them - yet what's the option?  How do you change the system so that all *are* equal in the eyes of the law.

When's the last time they fried a trust fund? 


That was Bernie Madoff's department.  He fried many a trust fund.  ;D

er... isn't that saying that the death penalty *is* a race issue?  In effect, it's saying that the judicial process on average thinks that a black man's life is worth less than a white man's... that kind of sounds like a race issue to me.

After reading this, I went googling for something that came up a few years ago: a bit of research that showed that black men were significantly more likely to be convicted than white men on the same standard of evidence - basically that benefit of the (reasonable) doubt is more likely to be given to a white man.  I can remember discussing it (I think it was on this forum), but can't spot the article I was looking for.  I'll have another look when I've got a bit more time, because I believe it is a very pertinent bit of research as a reason behind this sort of act: if the justice system itself is biased in favour of a white majority, any attempt to level that playing field will seem like an attack on them - yet what's the option?  How do you change the system so that all *are* equal in the eyes of the law.


If you were only allowed to have lawyers provided by the state, there would certainly be more equality in defense representation.

Get rid of the damned medieval death penalty once and for all and nobody has to worry whether it's a racial issue or not!

Sheeeesh!
::)


Absolutely! Americans are such nice people for the most part, but the fact the majority of us are still DP fans ... that saddens me.

Absolutely! Americans are such nice people for the most part, but the fact the majority of us are still DP fans ... that saddens me.


I understand where you're coming from.  I'm only against the death penalty because I distrust the government.  However, I believe that the reason why it's accepted in this society is because of the severity of crime here.

We have far more murders and rapes per capita than most other First World nations.  This is probably because of our significant poverty.  Nevertheless, in an environment where so much violence occurs, it's natural for people to be more supportive of capital punishment.

Nearly all of the other countries in the world with comparable crime to ours (or worse) have the death penalty.

By the same token, nearly all of the countries in the world with less crime than ours don't have it.

I understand where you're coming from.  I'm only against the death penalty because I distrust the government.  However, I believe that the reason why it's accepted in this society is because of the severity of crime here.

We have far more murders and rapes per capita than most other First World nations.  This is probably because of our significant poverty.  Nevertheless, in an environment where so much violence occurs, it's natural for people to be more supportive of capital punishment.

Nearly all of the other countries in the world with comparable crime to ours (or worse) have the death penalty.

By the same token, nearly all of the countries in the world with less crime than ours don't have it.




One way to look at it, is that the death penalty is a response of "good people" anger to "evil people" crime. But what if the support for the death penalty and high crime actually some from the same source - a society that promotes violence?

I think that if we abandoned the death penalty, crime would actually drop, not rise.

One way to look at it, is that the death penalty is a response of "good people" anger to "evil people" crime. But what if the support for the death penalty and high crime actually some from the same source - a society that promotes violence?

I think that if we abandoned the death penalty, crime would actually drop, not rise.


I do nto see the death penalty as either a deterrent or a promoter of crime.

Somewhere along the line, somebody forgot that the primary purpose of punishment for a crime is, well, punishment.

One way to look at it, is that the death penalty is a response of "good people" anger to "evil people" crime. But what if the support for the death penalty and high crime actually some from the same source - a society that promotes violence?

I think that if we abandoned the death penalty, crime would actually drop, not rise.


I disagree.  While I agree with your assumption about our culture promoting violence, I do not believe the death penalty deters or encourages crime.  It simply satisfies the need for vengeance among the public.

Crime will only drop through lowering wealth disparity in America.

I do nto see the death penalty as either a deterrent or a promoter of crime.

Somewhere along the line, somebody forgot that the primary purpose of punishment for a crime is, well, punishment.




I definitely agree with your first statement, although I believe we should have more of a focus on rehabilitation for less serious crimes.