I've decided it's stupid.

Everyone's always all, oo, the metric system's so smart because everything's divided into multiples of 10 and it makes so much sense and it's totally logical! but it's not. it runs against human nature.

think about it. you go to the store, you buy a jug of milk. it runs out too fast. so you figure next time you go to the store, you buy more milk than you did last time. with the English system it makes sense; if you bought a pint last time, get a quart. if you got a quart, get a half gallon. if you got a half-gallon, get a gallon. but with metric, what? you got a liter, so... get a decaliter? the multiples of ten thing is great but the mind doesn't think that way, it thinks in powers of two. you don't have enough, get twice as much again. have too much? divide it by half. metric sucks at that. when do you ever think, i don't have enough of such and such and therefore i must now buy TEN TIMES AS MUCH OF IT?

and most of it, you don't even use. when's the last time you heard of a plot of land measured in square hectometers? but acres? i'm totally on it.

so, in short: down with metric. i'm gonna have t-shirts made. definitely one of those instances where the USA is right and the entire rest of the world is wrong.

Is it so hard, if you've not got enough buying a litre, to buy two litres?

Metric units only seem odd because you've been brought up with imperial units: by the next generation, they'll all be thinking in metric, and wondering how the oldies ever understood the weirdness of the imperial measures :)

Or maybe not... http://www.mwillett.org/Politics/metric1.htm

Have to say that whatever the measures preferred, I still like my beer by the pint - it's just the right sort of amount to drink.

Is it so hard, if you've not got enough buying a litre, to buy two litres?
well, it's not "hard," exactly, but the metric system is not particularly helpful in that situation. i think it's good in buying something like that to have a different name for an amount that's twice something else. it's useful if a pint's not enough to remember that you actually need a quart, rather than just two pints. in the metric system, what happens if two liters isn't enough? four liters?

and the other thing is, with the power of ten thing, you end up with the same name for units of measure that basically measure entirely different things. you measure totally different things with centimeters than you do with kilometers, and the fact that they're both derived from the "meter" is effectively no help at all. might as well have them have completely different names. inches vs. miles. done.

Have to say that whatever the measures preferred, I still like my beer by the pint - it's just the right sort of amount to drink.


"pint" sounds better than "half-litre" too, at least when ordering a beer.

There are some instances where metric works better, and others (like cooking) where metric is never going to be adopted/accepted.

Ant

The main benefit to converting to the metric system is international standardization of measurement.  The U.S. is one of the only countries not on this system, so due to our market size, this adds unnecessary complications to marketing various products here.

Slowly but surely, we have converted to the metric system on some things (like 2 liters of soft drinks).  I would think that more things will follow in the near future.

I've decided it's stupid.

Everyone's always all, oo, the metric system's so smart because everything's divided into multiples of 10 and it makes so much sense and it's totally logical! but it's not. it runs against human nature.

think about it. you go to the store, you buy a jug of milk. it runs out too fast. so you figure next time you go to the store, you buy more milk than you did last time. with the English system it makes sense; if you bought a pint last time, get a quart. if you got a quart, get a half gallon. if you got a half-gallon, get a gallon. but with metric, what? you got a liter, so... get a decaliter? the multiples of ten thing is great but the mind doesn't think that way, it thinks in powers of two. you don't have enough, get twice as much again. have too much? divide it by half. metric sucks at that. when do you ever think, i don't have enough of such and such and therefore i must now buy TEN TIMES AS MUCH OF IT?

and most of it, you don't even use. when's the last time you heard of a plot of land measured in square hectometers? but acres? i'm totally on it.

so, in short: down with metric. i'm gonna have t-shirts made. definitely one of those instances where the USA is right and the entire rest of the world is wrong.


So what you're really saying is the metric system is not for the stupid. I agree :P

So what you're really saying is the metric system is not for the stupid. I agree :P


Now now, lets play nicely.

Now now, lets play nicely.


He started it >:(

"pint" sounds better than "half-litre" too, at least when ordering a beer.

There are some instances where metric works better, and others (like cooking) where metric is never going to be adopted/accepted.

Ant
seems to me metric is like money currency, it would work pretty well for that. but for consumables, not so much.

The main benefit to converting to the metric system is international standardization of measurement.  The U.S. is one of the only countries not on this system, so due to our market size, this adds unnecessary complications to marketing various products here.

Slowly but surely, we have converted to the metric system on some things (like 2 liters of soft drinks).  I would think that more things will follow in the near future.
i think instead we should use our global influence and military might to force the rest of the world into going back to the English system. (Oh, and we're gonna have to go ahead and fix that up by renaming it "the American system.")

well, it's not "hard," exactly, but the metric system is not particularly helpful in that situation. i think it's good in buying something like that to have a different name for an amount that's twice something else.
Surely that's just added confusion?  For that to work, you need to know that a quart=2 pints, a gallon=4 quarts and so on.  While I agree that in many cases you don't need to know the conversion rates (do you need to know there are 8 pints in a gallon if you're only drinking in pints?  and does it matter how many inches to the mile - you never measure the same things in miles as you do in inches?), it sometimes helps when you're trying to land on another planet for everyone to be using the same measures ;)


i think instead we should use our global influence and military might to force the rest of the world into going back to the English system. (Oh, and we're gonna have to go ahead and fix that up by renaming it "the American system.")

Well, we call it "the Imperial system", so you'd probably name it "the Democratic system".. or the "post-regime-change-system" ;)

Surely that's just added confusion?  For that to work, you need to know that a quart=2 pints, a gallon=4 quarts and so on.  While I agree that in many cases you don't need to know the conversion rates (do you need to know there are 8 pints in a gallon if you're only drinking in pints?  and does it matter how many inches to the mile - you never measure the same things in miles as you do in inches?), it sometimes helps when you're trying to land on another planet for everyone to be using the same measures ;)
that's exactly the magic of it! you have a different name for units of measure that you actually use, so you get a pint, you know exactly how much you're gonna get, ditto quarts and gallons. (i'd actually come up with a name for half-pints and half-gallons too, but first we have to achieve victory in the upcoming Metric World War.) the metric system affiliates things that really don't have anything to do with each other, like the unit of measure you use for measuring, say, the dimensions of a room (meters, or cms) vs. a trip you take in the car (kilometers). i think it's useful to have different names for units you use a lot, rather than having to fit everything into a single unit of measure that's applied to everything.

for instance, we measure interplanetary distances with the mile because the mile is the longest unit of distance a human being is really likely to ever grapple with in his/her daily life. but in metric, these distances are measured in meters. (well, kilometers, but that's my point, they're the same thing. meters!) which is goofy because meters are really short.

i dunno, can you tell i'm bored at work?

He started it >:(


He called the system stupid, not those who use it.

Lets face it, any system of measures is an arbitrary but necessary imposition of regularity on nature.  So, if anything is stupid, its trying to impose logic on that which isn't logical and arguing over it.  I lived in Chile for a year and had no problem using the metric system.  They also used it for some things, like gas, in Puerto Rico. 

My point is, this really isn't worth ruffled feathers.

My point is, this really isn't worth ruffled feathers.
i wouldn't worry, carlos, iz and i are pretty tight, i know when she's kidding. i thought it was funny.

He called the system stupid, not those who use it.

Lets face it, any system of measures is an arbitrary but necessary imposition of regularity on nature.  So, if anything is stupid, its trying to impose logic on that which isn't logical and arguing over it.  I lived in Chile for a year and had no problem using the metric system.  They also used it for some things, like gas, in Puerto Rico. 

My point is, this really isn't worth ruffled feathers.


That's 'cause YOU are smart.


i wouldn't worry, carlos, iz and i are pretty tight, i know when she's kidding. i thought it was funny.



No i'm not :P

Sounds like somebody's been watching too much Andy Rooney iffen you ask me!
:P

And another thing, why do they always have to put popsicles on wooden sticks?  When it's all gone, you taste the stick, not the popsicle!  I hate that!

OK, I'll agree about perishables, such as milk.  It helps to be able to consume in the old-fashioned increments.  However, for most other measurements, multiples of 10 are more practical.  As an American, I'm not as familiar with them, that's all.  For instance, my driveway is 14 cubits and a span...

Sounds like somebody's been watching too much Andy Rooney iffen you ask me!
:P
now, is there ever really such a thing as "too much andy rooney"?

Australia switched to metric in the mid sixties and I am still getting used it. ;)  Strangely, I still describe myself as 6 foot 1 inch (185 cm). I mean, it is hard for me to accurately visualize...say...173cm or 1.73 metres (English spelling) but saying 5' 8" works better in my mind. I'm fairly converted now to metres for longer distances though (100 metres etc). I think the Olympics helped with that one. :D

I have no issues using metric for milk etc. If 1 litre was not enough...next time I will buy the 2 litre bottle etc...

All I wanna know is... How do I order a 40 in a metric-system pub?

;D

All I wanna know is... How do I order a 40 in a metric-system pub?

;D



^ ;D  Strangely..again...we don't use metric for in pubs. We use names for the different size glasses or old measurements. I usually order a pot, schooner or a pint (definitely  not metric). I have no idea what those are in metric but the pot is a 10oz, schooner 15 oz and a pint is ....well...a pint! ;D

for instance, we measure interplanetary distances with the mile because the mile is the longest unit of distance a human being is really likely to ever grapple with in his/her daily life. but in metric, these distances are measured in meters. (well, kilometers, but that's my point, they're the same thing. meters!) which is goofy because meters are really short.


To be fair, interplanetary distances are just as likely to be measured in astronomical units or light years:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Astronomical_unit
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Light-year

i think instead we should use our global influence and military might to force the rest of the world into going back to the English system. (Oh, and we're gonna have to go ahead and fix that up by renaming it "the American system.")


lol...  today is opposite day, I see...

That's 'cause YOU are smart.

No i'm not :P


Feisty today, eh?  ;)

i think instead we should use our global influence and military might to force the rest of the world into going back to the English system. (Oh, and we're gonna have to go ahead and fix that up by renaming it "the American system.")


Oh, good luck there.

The US Military has been useing the metric system for decades.  All maps for the last 4 decades are so are Metric, which makes it much easier to figure out distances.  Your grid square on any map is 1 kilometer.  Weapon ranges are configured by meters (M16A2, maximum range of a point target:  550m, maximum effective range, 800m).

You seem to be on your own here Tia.  About the only thing I use the old Imperial system for is gallons, temperature, and distance in my POV.  I buy my soda in litres, and can't remember the last time I saw a 64 ounce bottle.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3005/2694721372_a98cb38a36.jpg?v=0

Oh, good luck there.

The US Military has been useing the metric system for decades.  All maps for the last 4 decades are so are Metric, which makes it much easier to figure out distances.  Your grid square on any map is 1 kilometer.  Weapon ranges are configured by meters (M16A2, maximum range of a point target:  550m, maximum effective range, 800m).
http://www.fleen.com/uploads/2006/05/fmji9.jpeg

"seven, six, two, millimeter..."

Only two other countries besides America hasn't accepted Metric.

Liberia
Myanmar

I think Metric would be better because it seems simple. America should be multi-systematic when it comes to this.

To be fair, interplanetary distances are just as likely to be measured in astronomical units or light years:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Astronomical_unit
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Light-year
interstellar distances are measured in light years, actually.

http://www.fleen.com/uploads/2006/05/fmji9.jpeg

"seven, six, two, millimeter..."


Karma +1 for Pvt. Pyle, 'cos it's shaping up to be one of those weeks...
:o

that's exactly the magic of it! you have a different name for units of measure that you actually use, so you get a pint, you know exactly how much you're gonna get,


except English pints and American pints are different sizes.

When we first moved here Dai ordered a beer and they asked if he wanted a pint or 20 ounces.  WTF!?

except English pints and American pints are different sizes.

When we first moved here Dai ordered a beer and they asked if he wanted a pint or 20 ounces.  WTF!?

You know what I'd say?  "Both!"
http://www.inthe00s.com/smile/12/drunken_smilie.gif

^ ;D  Strangely..again...we don't use metric for in pubs. We use names for the different size glasses or old measurements. I usually order a pot, schooner or a pint (definitely  not metric). I have no idea what those are in metric but the pot is a 10oz, schooner 15 oz and a pint is ....well...a pint! ;D


I've a dim memory of the size of a measure of shorts changing into something metric from the old sixth of gill.  Maybe 25 ml

I've a dim memory of the size of a measure of shorts changing into something metric from the old sixth of gill.  Maybe 25 ml
the british also have larger tons. american ton is 2000 pounds, british ton is, um, 2240 or something. i remember in 3rd grade i took an IQ test and stumped it because they asked how much a ton is and they were just looking for 2000 pounds and my, correct, answer was, "it depends."

"pint" sounds better than "half-litre" too, at least when ordering a beer.

There are some instances where metric works better, and others (like cooking) where metric is never going to be adopted/accepted.

Ant


Metric is used in real cooking. You will never find a master pastry chef, for example, who doesn't measure all solid ingredients by weight, liquid by volume and all in grams and litres. It is the best, most accurate and fastest way to cook.   

It's actually the best way to do anything. As a child I tried hard to learn all the customary units, but I struggled because of all the memorisation. To this day, I can't pick up something and tell you how much it weighs in pounds.

One day I decided to just abandon all that crap and put myself to just using metric, a system I had learned in math and science classes, and one I could remember. See, that's the key. All you need to do to 'learn' metric is to be familiarised with the decimal principle, remember the names of the basic units, get used to the prefixes (easy), and then just start using it and NOT converting.

The US failed to convert to metric because they 1. chose to make conversion optional, and 2. they wanted people to learn a simple system in the hardest way: conversions. Screw conversion, just flip your ruler over and start measuring in centimetres! You'll get the hang of it in like a week or two.

I use metric for everything. It helps to live in a metric country, but even in Canada we haven't gotten the Imperial system entirely out of our systems. Australia is the best example of Imperial to Metric conversion. One day, they just switched everything and forced everyone to get used to it. Wild success.

As for the rest of the world learning US customary and/or Imperial units, you can forget it. Not only is it one of the things a lot of countries hate about the US, but almost no one knows anything about pounds, ounces, fluid ounces etc... And why should they? They already use a system with all the advantages: simplicity and universality.

As for the rest of the world learning US customary and/or Imperial units, you can forget it. Not only is it one of the things a lot of countries hate about the US, but almost no one knows anything about pounds, ounces, fluid ounces etc... And why should they? They already use a system with all the advantages: simplicity and universality.


and inability to divide or multiply by two.

face it, some things metric does well, some things not so well. base 10 is excellent for military and monetary applications, which might have a lot to do with how it's caught on so well with historically warlike civilizations like those in western europe (and obviously the extremely warlike modern US has made major allowances to the metric system for that purpose), but imo the psyche thinks in powers of 2, not powers of 10, that's why imperial units are better for real-life applications like cooking and calculating traveling distance.

on the other hand, notice how currency divisions that operate base 2 tend to fade away whereas base 10 you've got no problems? 2 dollar bill, dead in the water. i have yet to figure out why we need a 5 dollar AND 10 dollar bill. currency works very well base 10. (occasionally dividing by 4 or 5. quarters and 20 dollar bills are keepers, but any time you divide by 2 in currency you're likely to run into trouble or end up with an obsolete currency no one uses.)

i think this is because currency is very separate from lived human experience. you think in terms of abstract quantities, if i want something that costs four dollars i'm more than happy to shovel out singles until i'm paid up but something costs 10 dollars i want a separate bill, a ten dollar bill, to keep me from having to count out the money. counting of that sort is a totally abstract experience, separate from genuine lived reality. it's indicative of a negotiation involving a number in the mind of the seller versus a number in the mind of the buyer, but separate by and large from the genuine value of the good being exchanged.

but if i eat something and it's not enough, i want twice as much. if i eat something and it's too much, i want to divide it in half. visceral bodily experience is much more of that sort, it's in multiples and divisors of two. and the "imperial" system, as it's called, is much more friendly to that.

i think mushroom actually explained it rather well. militaries all over have found that the metric system is much more efficient to bend to the task of claiming human life. base 10 is exceptional for precise measurement over areas that you don't understand viscerally -- understanding the targeting map of a country you've never visited, for instance, but which you'd like to bomb -- but a base 2 system is much more accessible for street-level calculations, the calculations you feel in your spirit and in your gut.

For every message board thread, there exists at least one XKCD strip.

http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/converting_to_metric.png

  - XKCD #526, Converting to Metric, from some time last week.

and inability to divide or multiply by two.

face it, some things metric does well, some things not so well. base 10 is excellent for military and monetary applications, which might have a lot to do with how it's caught on so well with historically warlike civilizations like those in western europe (and obviously the extremely warlike modern US has made major allowances to the metric system for that purpose), but imo the psyche thinks in powers of 2, not powers of 10, that's why imperial units are better for real-life applications like cooking and calculating traveling distance.

on the other hand, notice how currency divisions that operate base 2 tend to fade away whereas base 10 you've got no problems? 2 dollar bill, dead in the water. i have yet to figure out why we need a 5 dollar AND 10 dollar bill. currency works very well base 10. (occasionally dividing by 4 or 5. quarters and 20 dollar bills are keepers, but any time you divide by 2 in currency you're likely to run into trouble or end up with an obsolete currency no one uses.)

i think this is because currency is very separate from lived human experience. you think in terms of abstract quantities, if i want something that costs four dollars i'm more than happy to shovel out singles until i'm paid up but something costs 10 dollars i want a separate bill, a ten dollar bill, to keep me from having to count out the money. counting of that sort is a totally abstract experience, separate from genuine lived reality. it's indicative of a negotiation involving a number in the mind of the seller versus a number in the mind of the buyer, but separate by and large from the genuine value of the good being exchanged.

but if i eat something and it's not enough, i want twice as much. if i eat something and it's too much, i want to divide it in half. visceral bodily experience is much more of that sort, it's in multiples and divisors of two. and the "imperial" system, as it's called, is much more friendly to that.

i think mushroom actually explained it rather well. militaries all over have found that the metric system is much more efficient to bend to the task of claiming human life. base 10 is exceptional for precise measurement over areas that you don't understand viscerally -- understanding the targeting map of a country you've never visited, for instance, but which you'd like to bomb -- but a base 2 system is much more accessible for street-level calculations, the calculations you feel in your spirit and in your gut.


I fail to see how this explanation demonstrates, in any way whatsoever, the superiority of Imperial in any theatre. Did you know that even your customary units are legally defined in metric? A mile my be 5280 ft. within the system, but the inch is legally defined as 25.4mm.

Give me any example of any kind of measurement that metric cannot cope with. You want to guess how far away that stop sign on your street is? Metric is perfect. There is no human predisposition to saying 'about a yard' rather than 'about a metre'. All that is conditioning. I understand that to you, the old system seems somehow more human and visceral, but that's only because it's the system you grew up with. Billions of other people around the world, you will find, show no such affinity for the English system.

If it feels better to order a pint, then fine - let's define a pint as 500ml (US) or 600ml (UK) and get it over with. Order pints til the cows come home, you'll still be getting a half-litre. If you wanna call it a pint, be my guest. 

In science and in lab, I deal exclusively in metric.

When talking about the weather, driving across the country, or my height or weight, it's all about the old skool units 8)

Oddly enough, most Canadians talk distance in kilometres, weather in degrees Celsius, pretty much all commercial liquids (milk, gas, etc...) in litres, but they tend to give their weight in pounds and height in feet. It's sort of weird, but also explainable. While conversion in the 60's, 70's and 80's took place at school and in public, mums still measured and weighed the kids at home in Imperial, so naturally one learns to think of his weight and height in the same way.

I fail to see how this explanation demonstrates, in any way whatsoever, the superiority of Imperial in any theatre. Did you know that even your customary units are legally defined in metric? A mile my be 5280 ft. within the system, but the inch is legally defined as 25.4mm.

Give me any example of any kind of measurement that metric cannot cope with. You want to guess how far away that stop sign on your street is? Metric is perfect. There is no human predisposition to saying 'about a yard' rather than 'about a metre'. All that is conditioning. I understand that to you, the old system seems somehow more human and visceral, but that's only because it's the system you grew up with. Billions of other people around the world, you will find, show no such affinity for the English system.

If it feels better to order a pint, then fine - let's define a pint as 500ml (US) or 600ml (UK) and get it over with. Order pints til the cows come home, you'll still be getting a half-litre. If you wanna call it a pint, be my guest. 
yeah, i think  you missed my point entirely. i guess all i can say is read it again. i'm not necessarily saying imperial is inherently superior to metric, just that it's more, if you will, "street level." metric is superior for some things, imperial for others, but the things that metric is better at are more clinical, less organic. great for carpet bombing, not so great for casual cooking. until you talk about base 10 versus base 2 we're talking past each other because that's the essence of the distinction i'm trying to draw here.

This thread is turning into a Seinfeld script!
:P

how come metric doesn't have base 10 time units? i wonder what a metric system clock/calendar would look like.

how come metric doesn't have base 10 time units? i wonder what a metric system clock/calendar would look like.


See, that's a job for Kramer and Mr. Costanza.
:D

To hell with both systems.  I'm going to use the Ancient Egyptian units of measurements.  It's all royal cubits and hands and feet now! :D

To hell with both systems.  I'm going to use the Ancient Egyptian units of measurements.  It's all royal cubits and hands and feet now! :D
cubits rule! that's the forearm one, right? what could be a better unit of measure than the forearm.

i think we should also have the sheesh-load. when you have a whole lot of something, you have exactly one sheesh-load.

i'm not necessarily saying imperial is inherently superior to metric, just that it's more, if you will, "street level." metric is superior for some things, imperial for others, but the things that metric is better at are more clinical, less organic. great for carpet bombing, not so great for casual cooking. until you talk about base 10 versus base 2 we're talking past each other because that's the essence of the distinction i'm trying to draw here.


Base 10, base 2... in terms of usability and practicality, base 10 has the advantage because it is easy to convert smaller units into larger ones and vice versa. Sure, it is easy when you say there are two cups in a pint, two pints in a quart, four quarts in a gallon etc... But when you have to say how many cups are in a gallon, well then you have to do a bit of mental math (I can imagine ... 'oh, now let me see, so there are two cups in a... so that makes'). If you're light enough on your feet, you'll get to 16 cups soon enough. But in any case, this problem never arises in metric. The prefixes guide you smoothly. How many milimetres in a kilometre? 1000 x 1000 = 1,000,000. 

What you have pointed out earlier, that it sounds better to say a gallon of milk instead of 4 litres... does not at all demonstrate a better usability for imperial more than it just cites a sentimental, linguistic attachment many people may have for their customary units. 

Imperial/US are only 'street level' for US-minded people, and only because that is the customary system there. Can you not imagine that someone from anywhere else might think in metric, and could rattle off street measurements (whether it be pointing out a landmark 40 metres away or buying a kilo of carrots) just as instinctively as you could say 40 yards or 2 pounds?

Allow me to take your example of casual cooking. How is Imperial measure better? I imagine you saying that it's more practical to grab a cup of flour than to have to weigh however many grams of flour you need. Two cups of milk instead of 500ml. etc... But the point I am making is that A. that isn't necessarily true and that, B. one would only think that because one has cooked one's whole life that way, and cannot imagine getting a scale and weighing out dry goods. However, people who have done just that their whole lives don't find it the least bit strange, difficult or impractical.

Cooking casually or professionally in metric is faster and more accurate, so its practicality in that arena is unquestionable. You have a kitchen scale, you put your mixing bowl on the scale and reset to zero, add flour until the scale reads your required weight, press reset, add your sugar, press reset, instead of measuring out two cups of milk, you turn the measuring cup to the other side and measure 500ml. Done. And get this... people who have done this their whole lives barely even have to use a scale to measure out most basic ingredients. They know what 100g of flour looks like. They know what 2 decilitres of any liquid looks like. So for someone who has not, like yourself, spent his whole life in the United States cooking in US customary units, you can probably imagine how they might not agree that imperial or US is superior to metric in the kitchen.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1JwYu-197nU

another protester against the metric system. i sense a movement coming on.  8)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1JwYu-197nU

another protester against the metric system. i sense a movement coming on.  8)


I prefer some of this guy's other videos, such as RFK or JFK, what's the best assasination? . Also If I were Satan. You can't buy that kind of funny.

now here's another one, from a totally unrelated messageboard i go to sometimes.

http://www.uspoliticsonline.com/science-technology/50822-why-use-base-10-a.html

i'm tellin' ya, it's catching on! down with the hegemony of base 10!

funny looking over that thread, it never occurred to me that hexidecimal would be a definite better system for things that are measured in metric now, like distances, creating map grids, stuff like that. you can work powers and square roots like a base 2 (because 16 is a power of two, but ten isn't) but add up large numbers like a base 10. we should get on that.