Austrian admits 24-year abuse of daughter in dungeon

(Source: ABC News)

A 73-year-old Austrian electrical engineer has confessed to holding his daughter captive in a secret, windowless cellar for 24 years and fathering seven children by her, police said on Monday.

Elisabeth Fritzl, 42, had told police on Sunday that her father, Josef Fritzl, lured her into the basement of the plain, grey block where they lived with other families in 1984 and drugged and handcuffed her before imprisoning her.
Three of her children, aged 19, 18 and 5, had been locked up in the basement with her since birth and had never seen sunlight, police said, raising worries about their physical and mental state. The younger two were boys, the eldest a girl.

"(Fritzl) has now said that he locked up his daughter for 24 years and that he alone fathered her seven children and that he locked them up in the cellar," Franz Polzer, head of the criminal investigations unit in the province of Lower Austria told Reuters by telephone.
Fritzl had also admitted to burning the body of one of the children when it died shortly after birth, said Polzer. Austrian media reported he had burned the corpse in a boiler.

Three of the children -- two girls and one boy -- were brought up by Josef and his wife.



...This is surely one of the most appalling stories I've heard in my life. The grandmother apparently had no idea, which I find hard to believe.

Just been watching the police conference on the television.

I want to know how come that Josef's wife know nothing of the goings on in the basement for 24 years.

Just been watching the police conference on the television.

I want to know how come that Josef's wife know nothing of the goings on in the basement for 24 years.


Now that's what's puzzling me too. Surely the people in the basement must've made noise (especially when the children were still very young). She (the grandmother) must've heard something suspicious at some time...

And what was her husband's excuse whenever he snuck into the basement..? Questions, questions...

Now that's what's puzzling me too. Surely the people in the basement must've made noise (especially when the children were still very young). She (the grandmother) must've heard something suspicious at some time...

And what was her husband's excuse whenever he snuck into the basement..? Questions, questions...


Yeah, I don't believe that she didn't know anything about it. Only time will tell, I guess...

When I read this, my jaw dropped to the floor. It is just horrendous.

i saw this story in the paper this morning. as far as i'm concerned, it didn't actually happen. total denial. it's just too insane.

i saw this story in the paper this morning. as far as i'm concerned, it didn't actually happen. total denial. it's just too insane.


I agree. Still, it seems to be all too true. DNA tests will shed more light on the case.

Imagine those three children that were brought up by grandfather and grandmother...what story were they told? Were they led to believe that those people were their parents? Or were they told that their mother had abandonded them?
Either way, finding out that you've been lied to all your life surely leaves a mark.

Didn't the wife question where these three children came from?

Didn't the wife question where these three children came from?


As I understand it, the (grand)father told her that the children had been left on the doorstep by the daughter, with a story (or a note, I'm not sure) that she couldn't take care of them.

Now that's what's puzzling me too. Surely the people in the basement must've made noise (especially when the children were still very young). She (the grandmother) must've heard something suspicious at some time...


Apparently, the whole basement area was soundproofed!

I don't have kids myself, but if I did, I'd certainly be asking questions if one of them suddenly 'vanished' off the face of the earth...

Apparently, the whole basement area was soundproofed!


I wonder... When exactly was the basement made soundproof...? If this happened before the children were born...it was all premeditated.
And when exactly was the basement converted into some sort of appartment? Whilst the daughter was being held there, or before that? I fear this too, was premeditated. And yet the grandmother never noticed anything...?
This is getting more and more disturbing.


I don't have kids myself, but if I did, I'd certainly be asking questions if one of them suddenly 'vanished' off the face of the earth...


Not Mrs. F., or so it seems.

BTW: I don't recall any other siblings being mentioned, so I take it the daughter was their only child. All the more reason to ask questions, if you ask me...

Another question, regarding those innocent of those in the basement.

If you live in a house, you know every inch of it, and should realise from the dimensions of extra rooms, etc?

Sick...sick...sick!!!

That guy should be hung by his toenails!  >:(

Another question, regarding those innocent of those in the basement.

If you live in a house, you know every inch of it, and should realise from the dimensions of extra rooms, etc?


Indeed... More questions to answer!


Sick...sick...sick!!!

That guy should be hung by his toenails!  >:(


I can think of another part of his body to hang him by...but we don't do corporal punishment anymore.

More and more details are getting out...

The (grand)father told everyone that his daughter had joined some kind of sect (which would explain the lack of communication).


I wonder... When exactly was the basement made soundproof...? If this happened before the children were born...it was all premeditated.
And when exactly was the basement converted into some sort of appartment? Whilst the daughter was being held there, or before that? I fear this too, was premeditated. And yet the grandmother never noticed anything...?
This is getting more and more disturbing.


From what I've heard, there originally was only one room (with sanitary facilities). Other rooms were added later on, as the family extended.


BTW: I don't recall any other siblings being mentioned, so I take it the daughter was their only child. All the more reason to ask questions, if you ask me...


The daughter was not an only child. She has 6 siblings.


Another question, regarding those innocent of those in the basement.

If you live in a house, you know every inch of it, and should realise from the dimensions of extra rooms, etc?


The basement wasn't under the house, it was under a separate shed/basement/storage facility, yards away from the house.

Someone had to know there was something really really wrong going on.  I cannot imagine the horror of the lives they led. 

Someone had to know there was something really really wrong going on.  I cannot imagine the horror of the lives they led. 


I'm with you on this one Danoota.  THERE IS NO WAY that the pervert kept it hidden from everybody.  >:(

Those poor kids will grow up with messed up lives :\'(

Someone had to know there was something really really wrong going on.  I cannot imagine the horror of the lives they led. 

Never underestimate the power of denial.  Eno supposes his wife must have known.  Of course she knew; when your husband is that sick and scary, you don't dare put up a big fuss about anything he does unless you want to get chained to the cellar wall too!

I usually have macabre wisecrack for situations like this, but the mood I'm in tonight, this just turns my stomach.  I just wonder...I just wonder...how many sick fugs like this are out there in the world who will never get caught!
8-P :\'(

Just been watching the police conference on the television.

I want to know how come that Josef's wife know nothing of the goings on in the basement for 24 years.


how can she have raised three of the kids and known nothing?  where did she think the kids came from?  Didn't she wonder why she hadn't heard from her daughter for 24 years? Was a missing persons report ever filed on the daughter?  This is ridiculous!



see you wondered about it too.

Didn't the wife question where these three children came from?




Quote
BTW: I don't recall any other siblings being mentioned, so I take it the daughter was their only child. All the more reason to ask questions, if you ask me...

The daughter was not an only child. She has 6 siblings.


Now Henk when you say she had 6 siblings you're not counting the 6 siblings she gave birth to are you? (I'm only counting surviving children not the one who died).... 

Never underestimate the power of denial.  Eno supposes his wife must have known.  Of course she knew; when your husband is that sick and scary, you don't dare put up a big fuss about anything he does unless you want to get chained to the cellar wall too!

I usually have macabre wisecrack for situations like this, but the mood I'm in tonight, this just turns my stomach.  I just wonder...I just wonder...how many sick fugs like this are out there in the world who will never get caught!
8-P :\'(



I was watching the Soup... I know not your usual source for hard hitting news but they showed a clip from the Aussie version of 60 minutes about a father and daughter who were having consensual relations... he was in his 60s and she in her 30s  (at least that's how they looked...)... now that's just wrong too.

Uh...this is so freaking sick.

73-year-old  ... holding his daughter captive in a secret, windowless cellar for 24 years and fathering seven children by her ...  burning the body of one of the children when it died shortly after birth ... he had burned the corpse in a boiler ... Three of the children -- two girls and one boy -- were brought up by Josef and his wife.


THE ARISTOCRATS!

(Someone had to take one for the team here and say it, might as well be me.  One ticket to hell, please.  Aisle seating.)

how can she have raised three of the kids and known nothing?  where did she think the kids came from?  Didn't she wonder why she hadn't heard from her daughter for 24 years? Was a missing persons report ever filed on the daughter?  This is ridiculous!


The (grand)father spread the story that the daughter had joined some religious sect, and therefore didn't want (or couldn't) contact the outside world. He would take the children from the basement and leave them on the doorstep, with a note from his daughter (that he had forced her to write), saying that she couldn't take care of the child.
I don't know about any missing persons report.


Now Henk when you say she had 6 siblings you're not counting the 6 siblings she gave birth to are you? (I'm only counting surviving children not the one who died).... 


I don't count the 6 surviving children that she gave birth to as her siblings, no. They are her children.
The siblings I mentioned were born from the same parents, Josef and Rosemarie F., as the daughter that was being held captive in the basement.

This story just turns my stomach. 

What kind of life can that girl or her children have (even if they have the best therapy..)? 

I wonder why she couldn't have tried to escape?  So many horrible things in this world.

This story just turns my stomach. 

What kind of life can that girl or her children have (even if they have the best therapy..)? 


That "girl" is a 42-year old woman now, Patty.  ;) But you're right, they will not be getting much of a life anymore. I don't see how anyone can live with this knowledge. I don't think the children (any of them, legit or incentuous) want to keep in touch with their father.
Then again, it is a known fact that in hostage situations the hostages grow a certain degree of empathy/sympathy for their hostage taker(s). I'm not sure how that applies in this situation, but the human mind is a miraculous thing...


I wonder why she couldn't have tried to escape?  So many horrible things in this world.


There's no doubt in my mind she has tried, but obviously it proved impossible. Could be because of the building/structure itself, could be because of her (fear for her) father. I don't know what stories he told her to keep her there.

Have the plans of the house being released by the police yet?

Have the plans of the house being released by the police yet?


Don't know about plans, but I have seen pictures of the basement.

Don't know about plans, but I have seen pictures of the basement.
That is all I have seen only pictures, it would be useful to understand the situation better if the plans were available.

Don't know about plans, but I have seen pictures of the basement.

That is all I have seen only pictures, it would be useful to understand the situation better if the plans were available.
From The Times Online Report on Austria: incest father has sex assault conviction

Graphic: House of Horrors Click on Open if you wish to just view it. (it worked for me and I hope for you too).

That is all I have seen only pictures, it would be useful to understand the situation better if the plans were available.


This is what I found: from The Guardian, Amstetten Cellar Interactive. Click through the pages to get to the plan (it's on the last page).


From The Times Online Report on Austria: incest father has sex assault conviction

Graphic: House of Horrors Click on Open if you wish to just view it. (it worked for me and I hope for you too).


Oh, I see you found something too. I'll check this out. :)

This is what I found: from The Guardian, Amstetten Cellar Interactive. Click through the pages to get to the plan (it's on the last page).

Oh, I see you found something too. I'll check this out. :)


Interesting...The two graphics are completely different! :-\\

Interesting...The two graphics are completely different! :-\\
The Times has the basement under the apartment block, where the Guardian has the basement confined area as a separate building in the back garden.

The Times has the basement under the apartment block, where the Guardian has the basement confined area as a separate building in the back garden.


Indeed.

Now from the stories I've heard so far I think The Guardian has it right.

Indeed.

Now from the stories I've heard so far I think The Guardian has it right.
In my copy of The Times (I am trying to find the picture online), it has an aerial shot with the police in overalls standing outside the building in the back garden.

With the daughter (and the other children) being held in the building in the back garden would explain the lack of noise in the main building.

With the daughter (and the other children) being held in the building in the back garden would explain the lack of noise in the main building.


It would also explain how the (grand)father would get to his daughter without rousing suspicion. All he had to do was tell his wife he'd be working in the shed.

Hmm..How do they handle guys like this in Austrian prisons?

Hmm..How do they handle guys like this in Austrian prisons?
I can only guess the same as any other prison.

THE ARISTOCRATS!

(Someone had to take one for the team here and say it, might as well be me.  One ticket to hell, please.  Aisle seating.)

A crack of the ruler on the knuckes for you (and a Karma on the sly!)
;)

I don't count the 6 surviving children that she gave birth to as her siblings, no. They are her children.
The siblings I mentioned were born from the same parents, Josef and Rosemarie F., as the daughter that was being held captive in the basement.


okay so they are her half siblings ..... and her children....

you know I wonder.... because I have a sick mind... about the 3 "children" I mean the two oldest were a boy and a girl.... human nature being what it is and bodily development also being what it is if some other things might have been going on in that basement as well....not having the outlet most teens do to explore and fulfill specific needs...  I know I think way too much....


ok so the only bright spot I can see in this whole thing....and remember this is coming from Snoz....  according to the plans in Henk's link....at least they had a TV.  sorry it's all I got.

you know I wonder.... because I have a sick mind... about the 3 "children" I mean the two oldest were a boy and a girl.... human nature being what it is and bodily development also being what it is if some other things might have been going on in that basement as well....not having the outlet most teens do to explore and fulfill specific needs...  I know I think way too much....


ok so the only bright spot I can see in this whole thing....and remember this is coming from Snoz....  according to the plans in Henk's link....at least they had a TV.  sorry it's all I got.





Something like that happened in the book Flowers in the Attic right?  Wouldn't surprise me if something else was going on down there, unless their mom stopped them from doing it.

The wife must have known what was going on. This is why:

According to the news, the husband to the wife that the daughter ran away with a cult and left each baby on the doorstep.  I believe the wife knew about the kids for this reason.  If the kids lived with the daughter in the basement, then the wife would have known that since the babies were supposedly left on the doorstep.

The wife must have known what was going on. This is why:

According to the news, the husband to the wife that the daughter ran away with a cult and left each baby on the doorstep.  I believe the wife knew about the kids for this reason.  If the kids lived with the daughter in the basement, then the wife would have known that since the babies were supposedly left on the doorstep.



but there were 6 kids....3 in the basement and 3 left on the doorstep.  I just think the wife knew because the wife always knows  ::)  ya know.

What happened to the children's education over the years in the basement?

Something like that happened in the book Flowers in the Attic right?  Wouldn't surprise me if something else was going on down there, unless their mom stopped them from doing it.
Flowers in the Attic was first published in 1977, a good 7 years (1984) before these events started, but the film was released in 1987.

Something like that happened in the book Flowers in the Attic right?  Wouldn't surprise me if something else was going on down there, unless their mom stopped them from doing it.


That was a very good series of books (well I got as far as book 3 (Petals on the Wind) then gave up on the series.  Yeah, the mother (in the book) had an incestuos affair (as I recall) with her half-uncle (I think) and then he died in a car accident, so being from a rich family, (the mother moves with her four children) back to her parents mansion where the grandmother is ashamed of the grandchildren and they are hidden away in the attic. 

The movie was atrocious though.

but there were 6 kids....3 in the basement and 3 left on the doorstep.   I just think the wife knew because the wife always knows   ::)   ya know.
i saw this thing this morning where this dude was talking about how horrible the wife was because she had to have known and she never told anyone. and i think there's something to it but at the same time i think it's really possible she just lied to herself the whole time. it's amazing sometimes the way we're capable of denying reality and lying to ourselves, and particularly when the truth is as bizarre as this.

That was a very good series of books (well I got as far as book 3 (Petals on the Wind) then gave up on the series.  Yeah, the mother (in the book) had an incestuos affair (as I recall) with her half-uncle (I think) and then he died in a car accident, so being from a rich family, (the mother moves with her four children) back to her parents mansion where the grandmother is ashamed of the grandchildren and they are hidden away in the attic. 

The movie was atrocious though.


I'm reading them right now. Gotta have my cheesy gothic horror crap. ;)

Petals On The Wind is the second book. If There Be Thorns is the third book. The last one is a prequel and is called Seeds of Yesterday. The momma didn't marry her half-uncle, it was her half-BROTHER because her daddy raped his father's second wife, which resulted in the evil momma being born. Her brother was born three years before her, but they never knew they were half-brother and sister. Just that he was her half-uncle.

And if that's not confusing, I don't know what is. Ms. Andrews must have been on some powerful painkillers for her chronic pain to write that story.

The movie was lame, although I adore Louise Fletcher.

I'm reading them right now. Gotta have my cheesy gothic horror crap. ;)

Petals On The Wind is the second book. If There Be Thorns is the third book. The last one is a prequel and is called Seeds of Yesterday. The momma didn't marry her half-uncle, it was her half-BROTHER because her daddy raped his father's second wife, which resulted in the evil momma being born. Her brother was born three years before her, but they never knew they were half-brother and sister. Just that he was her half-uncle.

And if that's not confusing, I don't know what is. Ms. Andrews must have been on some powerful painkillers for her chronic pain to write that story.

The movie was lame, although I adore Louise Fletcher.


Oh!  Well that explains alot.  I guess I should have kept reading the series.  Its been a long time since I read them.  I couldn't even remember the order of the books and I never did manage to read any of the other series the author did (amazingly after she died!  ???  ;D )  I'm sure she had a few started but I think they came out with like some 20 books or so after she died. 

Oh!  Well that explains alot.  I guess I should have kept reading the series.  Its been a long time since I read them.  I couldn't even remember the order of the books and I never did manage to read any of the other series the author did (amazingly after she died!  ???  ;D )  I'm sure she had a few started but I think they came out with like some 20 books or so after she died. 



She only wrote the first two serials that came out: the Dollanganger series (Flowers In The Attic) and the Casteel series (Heaven). She also wrote the stand alone novel My Sweet Audrina. The rest were ghostwritten by some dude and published under her name. Her estate is apparently greedy. :P

She only wrote the first two serials that came out: the Dollanganger series (Flowers In The Attic) and the Casteel series (Heaven). She also wrote the stand alone novel My Sweet Audrina. The rest were ghostwritten by some dude and published under her name. Her estate is apparently greedy. :P

My sister was nuts about those books, along with L'Engle's "A Wrinkle in Time."
8)

The latest reports say that the children act like animals, have lost their childhood education and have only knew what they have learned from television.

The latest reports say that the children act like animals, have lost their childhood education and have only knew what they have learned from television.
feral, basically. i remember a case like this from when I was a kid in the 70s, some poor boy who was kept in a closet for 7 years and lived on hershey bars. they would slip hershey bars under the door and that's what he lived on. messed me up because i like hershey bars but i didnt like the story so...

I just read an article in today's Hartford Courant which claims that this case has re-opened debate about the more lenient sentencing rules in Europe "and whether harsher, U.S.-style sentencing guidelines might help deter such heinous crimes." 

Given that a number of states have the death penalty but that doesn't stop murders, do people here think the sentence he might receive really would have affected whehter he chose to commit this crime?

The latest reports say that the children act like animals, have lost their childhood education and have only knew what they have learned from television.

http://www.geocities.com/stimpysvideotrading/bandb.jpg

Josef Fritzl is of a certain generation associated in Germany and Austria, and when it was announced yesterday of threatening to gas his children in the basement, the whole notion fell into place.

Josef Fritzl is of a certain generation associated in Germany and Austria, and when it was announced yesterday of threatening to gas his children in the basement, the whole notion fell into place.


Gas his own children?!?  :o What a charming man this Josef Fritzl is... That's simply beyond belief. He needs to be put away for the rest of his life.

Gas his own children?!?  :o What a charming man this Josef Fritzl is... That's simply beyond belief. He needs to be put away for the rest of his life.
Something else I cannot crasp with that. It was to gas the children if they escaped, but if they have escaped, they would not be there.

This is just too much :-\\ I hope that woman and her kids get a chance to overcome this and have a safe life away from the spotlight. I think that other girl Natasha is being completely exploited by the media in the worse way possible 8-P

The latest reports say that the children act like animals, have lost their childhood education and have only knew what they have learned from television.



hey there's lots of good stuff to be learned from tv....first thing you learn.... most people in the world are not held captive in a basement by their father/grandfather. 

 

Am I the only person who thinks Josef Fritzl looks like a cross between Vincent Price and The Grinch?

Am I the only person who thinks Josef Fritzl looks like a cross between Vincent Price and The Grinch?


I definitely see the grinch...its in the eyebrows  I would've gone with Jack Albertson ( the man from Chico & the Man) instead of Vincent Price tho

Just been watching the police conference on the television.

I want to know how come that Josef's wife know nothing of the goings on in the basement for 24 years.
Well,he was well-liked in the community,but what he said went at home.

She only wrote the first two serials that came out: the Dollanganger series (Flowers In The Attic) and the Casteel series (Heaven). She also wrote the stand alone novel My Sweet Audrina. The rest were ghostwritten by some dude and published under her name. Her estate is apparently greedy. :P
She died and her family finished stuff she wrote.She was probably molested when she was young.

I just read an article in today's Hartford Courant which claims that this case has re-opened debate about the more lenient sentencing rules in Europe "and whether harsher, U.S.-style sentencing guidelines might help deter such heinous crimes." 

Given that a number of states have the death penalty but that doesn't stop murders, do people here think the sentence he might receive really would have affected whehter he chose to commit this crime?

Not 24 hours, not 24 days, not 24 months, but 24 years!  That's how long Josef Fritzl carried on his wicked scheme.  Threat of capital punishment does not deter criminals as evil as Fritzl because they think they're better and smarter than the rest of society and thus won't get caught.  In fact, Fritzl came within a hair's breadth of not getting caught at all.  He got soft in his old age and instead of letting his granddaughter/daughter die of kidney failure, he allowed medics to take her to the emergency room.  Elisabeth Fritzl secreted a distress note in Kerstin's pocket--which got past the fastidious Josef--and that's what tipped the authorities that something was awry at the Fritzl home.  Josef is trying to spin damage control with more creepy lies, but the cops are having none of it. 

The were saying CNN last night that the children suffer from Psychosocial Dwarfism (aka Psychogenic Dwarfism or Kaspar Hauser Syndrome).
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psychosocial_dwarfism
Whatever deleterious effects the incest might have wrought are perhaps overwhelmed by the extremely deprived environment in which the children were forced to live. 

This case is absolutely fascinating for the diabolical racket Fritzl carried on for nearly a quarter century and the profound horror of the results. 

Fritzl is a an electrical engineer and a wealthy man.  These two factors gave him the know-how and the resources to keep the abuse going for all that time.  He could design soundproof rooms, keyless alarm systems, and afford a big enough home to provide that kind of isolation.  The guy actually had the cajones to rent out flats on the same property.  His tenants never caught on.  One of the said he heard "sounds from the basement" in 1995, but who hasn't heard "sounds from the basement" and chalked it up to one's own mind playing tricks?

Scaaaaary sh*t!
:o

This case is absolutely fascinating for the diabolical racket Fritzl carried on for nearly a quarter century and the profound horror of the results. 


Make that 30 years...

Permission to construct the cellars/basement was granted in 1978, which means he must've had plans even before that.

Make that 30 years...

Permission to construct the cellars/basement was granted in 1978, which means he must've had plans even before that.

I see what you're saying. 

My theory is Fritzl was plainning to imprison his daughter once she became legally an adult and he had no legal standing to keep her in his home. 

Just been watching the police conference on the television.

I want to know how come that Josef's wife know nothing of the goings on in the basement for 24 years.


I saw the headlines some time ago about this sick cretin but haven't heard any more developments. I can't fathom how a man could imprison and rape his daughter, father children with her in his own home and get away with it for 24 years - it's just completely beyond me.

You can bet his wife had something to do with it. Like Paul said, I wouldn't shrug off my childrens' dissapearances just like that and I don't have much of a paternal instinct.

Now he's saying he's not a monster and his daughter is defending him.  Yes, he is a monster.  As for the daughter it is common for a victim of severe abuse to side with the perpetrator.  Often they're so brainwashed into believing their abuser is a good person they will defend them.  I was abused by a family member, no one knew about it for years.  When the truth started to come out, I venomously defended her.  However after a lot of therapy I cannot defend anything she did to me.

Now he's saying he's not a monster and his daughter is defending him.  Yes, he is a monster.  As for the daughter it is common for a victim of severe abuse to side with the perpetrator.  Often they're so brainwashed into believing their abuser is a good person they will defend them.  I was abused by a family member, no one knew about it for years.  When the truth started to come out, I venomously defended her.  However after a lot of therapy I cannot defend anything she did to me.


Also take into account that she suffered imprisonment and rape for most of her life. It's all she's ever known.

I am sorry to hear you have had problems with abuse and am happy to know you are coming to terms with and beating it's effects.  :)

Now he's saying he's not a monster and his daughter is defending him.  Yes, he is a monster.  As for the daughter it is common for a victim of severe abuse to side with the perpetrator.  Often they're so brainwashed into believing their abuser is a good person they will defend them.  I was abused by a family member, no one knew about it for years.  When the truth started to come out, I venomously defended her.  However after a lot of therapy I cannot defend anything she did to me.

Stockholm Syndrome comes to mind, though this is probably a deeper pathology. 

Yeah, I went through some pretty bad sh*t in my family too....but this is the stuff of terrifying Teutonic legends of yore!
:o

Also take into account that she suffered imprisonment and rape for most of her life. It's all she's ever known.

I am sorry to hear you have had problems with abuse and am happy to know you are coming to terms with and beating it's effects.  :)


Yeah, the environment is all she knows therefore it is normal to her.

Thanks, I'm just thankful that I turned out to be a better person than her. :)

Stockholm Syndrome comes to mind, though this is probably a deeper pathology. 

Yeah, I went through some pretty bad sh*t in my family too....but this is the stuff of terrifying Teutonic legends of yore!
:o


In this case it is deeper than Stockholm Syndrome.  With Stockholm Syndrome the person is conditioned to sympathize with their abuser.  In this situation, there need not be any conditioning because it was happening to a person who experienced nothing else.  Those kids are never going to be OK.  As for Fritzl, there is no real redeeming quality to his existence.  I believe he has no conscience.  Lock him away for the rest of his life.

In this case it is deeper than Stockholm Syndrome.  With Stockholm Syndrome the person is conditioned to sympathize with their abuser.  In this situation, there need not be any conditioning because it was happening to a person who experienced nothing else.  Those kids are never going to be OK.  As for Fritzl, there is no real redeeming quality to his existence.  I believe he has no conscience.  Lock him away for the rest of his life.

The baby might recover quite a bit more than the others but will never be "normal" due to those conditions -- both medically and environmentally--in the first two years of life.
:(

The baby might recover quite a bit more than the others but will never be "normal" due to those conditions -- both medically and environmentally--in the first two years of life.
:(


A heck of a lot of medical and cognitive growth happens during the first two years.  So yes, you're right.

You're either dealing with Monty Python or a total psycho when the guy's defense is:

I could have done worse, I could have killed them all!

That's pretty much what Fritzl said as to why he's not a monster.
::)

You're either dealing with Monty Python or a total psycho when the guy's defense is:

I could have done worse, I could have killed them all!

That's pretty much what Fritzl said as to why he's not a monster.
::)


Don't forget he also said he loved them.  I guess he was trying to present some sort of emotion. ::)

Don't forget he also said he loved them.  I guess he was trying to present some sort of emotion. ::)

Oh groovy far out! What a cool guy.  I wish he was my dad!
::)

What a horrifying story...

Oh groovy far out! What a cool guy.  I wish he was my dad!
::)


I think the situation goes beyond "tough love".  With most forms of tough love there's a lesson.  "The Monster" was a born sadist.

I'm guessing he's not getting a Father's Day card  8-P

Regarding the children's retarded development, there are also complications from inbreeding to consider; however, these are still less of an issue than the environmental conditions.

Regarding the children's retarded development, there are also complications from inbreeding to consider; however, these are still less of an issue than the environmental conditions.



Stagnant gene pool is infamous for disorders that either cannot be treated or no one knows how to treat.  There aren't too many doctors that can provide them with the care they would need.

Yeah, I read yesterday that he was upset about being portrayed as a monster or some bullschitt.

Yeah dude, what the f**k are you then? A f**king saint? Jeez. ::)

The trial of Josef Fritzl that starts today in the city of St Poelten, is attracting intense media interest.

Josef Fritzl, accused of imprisoning his daughter and fathering her children, has pleaded guilty to rape and incest but not guilty to murder.

The Austrian is accused of the murder by neglect of one of his daughter's children. He also denied enslavement.

TV pictures showed the 73-year-old enter the courtroom with his face concealed by a blue file. He refused to answer journalists' questions.

TV pictures showed the 73-year-old enter the courtroom with his face concealed by a blue file. He refused to answer journalists' questions.
http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/45570000/jpg/_45570260_-1.jpg

This is so wrong, in so many ways...

::)

Just been watching the police conference on the television.

I want to know how come that Josef's wife know nothing of the goings on in the basement for 24 years.
Maybe she's autistic?

Maybe she's autistic?


Maybe she just didn't want to know.... denial ain't just a river in Egypt ya know  ;)

Maybe she's autistic?
JF made himself so convincing his wife believed everything he said and told her.

JF made himself so convincing his wife believed everything he said and told her.


I think its like the women who live in the house with abusers (where the abuse is actually going on in the house instead of under it) I think she had suspicions but denial was easier than the truth.

I think its like the women who live in the house with abusers (where the abuse is actually going on in the house instead of under it) I think she had suspicions but denial was easier than the truth.


If I was his old lady I'd be thinking all the time about when I was gonna end up in the basement condo too!
:o

Josef Fritzl has changed all his pleas to guilty, including murder.

How repugnant. Honestly, this guy is a piece of shît. They should put him under the jail with some big, bad, homosexual neo-nazis who will teach him how it feels to get f**ked in a basement.

Josef Fritzl has changed all his pleas to guilty, including murder.


I think he knew there was too much evidence against him.  I have to wonder if a person like this should remain alive.  Not to be aesthetic but does he have any redeeming value?  I can't find any.

I think he knew there was too much evidence against him.  I have to wonder if a person like this should remain alive.  Not to be aesthetic but does he have any redeeming value?  I can't find any.


He's 74 years old.  They'll stick him in a cell and he'll die soon enough.  Nothing can undo the damage he's done.
:(