With all these recalls from China, outsourcing of jobs, etc. I have decided to try to buy American made produces when at all possible. We are in need of new sheets for our bed. I started my search. I spend all day on the computer looking for a company who sells sheets made in the U.S. I can't believe how hard that is. I have found a few but they are outrageously priced. I was expecting prices to be higher than the s**t that is made in China but this is ridiculous. The least expensive was a set that was $145. There was nothing fancy about them-just cotton king-size sheets. I have seen others for 1 flat sheet it was about $85-that was for ONE sheet. So, here is the dilemma, do I pay that outrageous amount and stick to my principles or do I swallow my pride and go with the flow so to speak? Oh, I have seen sheets made in other countries-not just China.


It really angers me that I am in this dilemma. I would love to see more U.S. companies manufacture goods HERE-not in China (or elsewhere).

Any thoughts? Comments?


Oh, BTW, if anyone knows of a company that sells American made sheets, please let me know.


Cat

'Fraid that's how things have turned...not just in the US, but in most of the western world... :-\\

China (and others) can and will 'undercut' as they can afford to do so...

I think I've put this to you before, but the only way to 'level' the playing field is to slap a crippling import tax on Chinese goods...

But with the vast majority of people looking for a 'bargain', this is highly unlikely to happen...the consumer votes with his/her wallet...

These aren't anything special but they're made in the US...
http://www.vermontcountrystore.com/shopping/product/detailmain.jsp?itemID=16286&itemType=PRODUCT&iMainCat=728&iSubCat=745&iProductID=16286

Look at it this way...  Sheets are the product of low skill labor.  It's more feasible to buy high skill products from America -- like cars.  Granted, every mass produced car is the product of several countries when you consider where all the parts are made.  Finding a car that is American-assembled is probably the best route in that market.  Granted, some cars made for American companies are produced in Canada or Mexico, while some made for Japanese companies are actually assembled here.

One thing's for sure: I'm never buying any food from China again.

These aren't anything special but they're made in the US...
http://www.vermontcountrystore.com/shopping/product/detailmain.jsp?itemID=16286&itemType=PRODUCT&iMainCat=728&iSubCat=745&iProductID=16286





Ironic isn't it?  ;)

Actually, I did see those. Those were the ones that want close to $90 a sheet.



Cat

Always buy "Made in the U.S.A." because when you do, you are helping those companies raise the capital they need....to shut their American plants and open new ones in China.
:-\\

I heard a statistic on C-SPAN the other day that 86% of the toys we will get this Xmas are made in China.  I can only conclude one thing:  Santa Claus is Chinese!
http://www.inthe00s.com/smile/09/smilejap.gif

Most of the elves have died from lead poisoning.

It's getting so I don't want to buy anything made in China.  Perhaps China should become the leading manufacturer of lead, if they aren't already

I think China is probably the leading consumer of lead (or, at least, they lead most of the rest of the world to consume it)

$85 for a sheet, though?  What was that, the Turin shroud?  (otherwise known as "Holy sheet")

I can feel a Springsteen parody coming on...

Most of the elves have died from lead poisoning.


*snicker*

Most of the elves have died from lead poisoning.

Here, kid, have some Halloween fangs made with lead enamel. Heh heh heh!
http://www.inthe00s.com/smile/03/devilsmile.gif

The problem is the the US has become dependent on foreign sources for food, clothing, shelter, and transportation. If is the fault of the American public for letting this happen.  There is always room for trade, but not to the point to which we have come to, it is shameful.

Well, I manage to find some sheets that were made in the U.S. (at least I THINK they were) at J.C. Penney's. Most of the sheets say "imported" but a couple didn't so I ASSUMED they are made in the U.S. So I got a set of flannel sheets for $12.99. Not bad-in fact I got 2 sets.  ;D ;D ;D


Anyway, my point is still the same, I am really angered by the fact that majority of what we buy in this country is made in China. I implore everyone on this board to avoid buying products made in China if you can help it. Maybe if we-the consumers-were to boycott the products, maybe the manufacturers will pay attention. But we ALL need to do it.



Cat

With all these recalls from China, outsourcing of jobs, etc. I have decided to try to buy American made produces when at all possible. We are in need of new sheets for our bed. I started my search. I spend all day on the computer looking for a company who sells sheets made in the U.S. I can't believe how hard that is. I have found a few but they are outrageously priced. I was expecting prices to be higher than the s**t that is made in China but this is ridiculous. The least expensive was a set that was $145. There was nothing fancy about them-just cotton king-size sheets. I have seen others for 1 flat sheet it was about $85-that was for ONE sheet. So, here is the dilemma, do I pay that outrageous amount and stick to my principles or do I swallow my pride and go with the flow so to speak? Oh, I have seen sheets made in other countries-not just China.


It really angers me that I am in this dilemma. I would love to see more U.S. companies manufacture goods HERE-not in China (or elsewhere).

Any thoughts? Comments?


Oh, BTW, if anyone knows of a company that sells American made sheets, please let me know.


Cat


I know someone from my church who will basically buy only American. I think I'll ask him if he has any bedsheets made in America. He's also part of a union.

You have to be careful about some things, particularly food items. There was recently a CBC special on food products which carry the 'Made in Canada' label. It's legal under Canadian law to use that label if 51% of the cost to produce the product is borne in Canada. Needless to say, these minimal requirements are abused and you find yourself proudly buying 'Canadian' food products grown or caught in China or Vietnam.

I'm sure things aren't much different in the States.

The problem is the the US has become dependent on foreign sources for food, clothing, shelter, and transportation. If is the fault of the American public for letting this happen.  There is always room for trade, but not to the point to which we have come to, it is shameful.


Sometimes it's enough to make you go, "Weeeell, maybe the world will go so far down the crapper in the next 20 years, I won't have to worry about trade policies, just my next meal, shelter for the night, and killing anybody who tries to take either from me!"  Ah, the simple life of the post-Apocalypse!
:o

Hey Cat, this will make you feel worse:

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/11/02/washington/02FDA.html?ref=health

Take two and call me in the mourning...

I recently went to buy drill bits. I avoided the generic ones that were made in China and bought the Bosch bits, which were almost 3x more expensive, but better quality... or so I thought.

I though Bosch products were Swiss made. Wrong. The drill bits are made in China, and, predictably, lasted no longer than the cheaper bits.

Ant

Hey Cat, this will make you feel worse:

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/11/02/washington/02FDA.html?ref=health

Take two and call me in the mourning...

I recently went to buy drill bits. I avoided the generic ones that were made in China and bought the Bosch bits, which were almost 3x more expensive, but better quality... or so I thought.

I though Bosch products were Swiss made. Wrong. The drill bits are made in China, and, predictably, lasted no longer than the cheaper bits.

Ant

The business press always promotes companies and economies "staying competitive."  What they don't tell you is it's a race to the bottom.  '

What are you gonna do, forge your own drill bits?
::)

Well, my sheets arrived today. I didn't see the "Made in U.S.A." label that I was hoping to see. Instead I found out they were made in Turkmenistan.  ::)  JCPenny's did NOT say they were imported which is a bit deceptive if you ask me. I supposed I could send them back and explain to them that the reason why I bought them was that I THOUGHT they were made in the U.S. when in fact, they weren't. The problem with that is it is such a hassle and we really do need sheets. Well, at least they weren't made in China because I would have definitely sent them back if they were. 



Cat

I bought some shirts from Old Navy today.  They're made in Indonesia.

I bought some shirts from Old Navy today.  They're made in Indonesia.



I'm wearing a dress from Old Navy that was made in Vietnam.



Cat

The latest: We are looking for a gift for our granddaughter's birthday. We thought that a Vermont Teddy Bear would be perfect. They boost that their bears are made in the U.S. (and made in Vermont to boot). On our way home from visiting with my step-daughter, we stopped at the factory. Many of the bears were a bit overpriced if you asked me but there were some that were smaller and priced more reasonably. We picked out the perfect one (mainly because of the price) and I looked at the tag like I am now in the habit of doing. We were surprised, shocked and dismayed to read, "Made in China". We walked out. We emailed the company about this. They did respond. They said that they only sell those bears at their two stores-bears sold on-line or through their catalog are made in the U.S. They also said that they oversee production in China themselves to make sure that standards are met. It is STILL dealing with China. So, we will not patronize them until they stop doing business with China.



Cat

They said that they only sell those bears at their two stores-bears sold on-line or through their catalog are made in the U.S. They also said that they oversee production in China themselves to make sure that standards are met.



Cat


My response to this is always "yeah, right"  They make sure what/whose standards are met? 

My response to this is always "yeah, right"  They make sure what/whose standards are met? 



Here are copies of the email exchange:

First email from us:

Subject: Made in China?

We stopped by your factory today to buy one of your bears for our
granddaughter's birthday. We made a special trip because we thought that
your bears are made in the U.S. by U.S. workers. We found the perfect
one called "Hero Bear" and it said that if we bought one, two would be
donated-which is something we like to see. However, when we looked at
the tag, it said that the bear was made in China. We were surprised,
shocked, and dismayed  to see that. We started looking around and sure
enough, there were a lot that were made in China. We don't understand
how you can claim that ALL your bears are made in the U.S. when they are
not. With all the recalls on toys from China, we are surprised that you
would even considered doing business with them. We hope in the future,
you will stop doing business with a country that doesn't respect the
environment, workers, and children's safety.
Sincerely,
(our names & town)



Their response:


Dear ,

Thank you for contacting us.

I would like to first apologize that you felt our store did not clearly
convey the difference between our imported "Friend for Life" brand and our
made-in-Vermont "Vermont Teddy Bear" brand.  These are two distinct brands
that we offer.  Our Vermont Teddy Bears make up about 95% of our overall
sales and when you visit our website, hear a radio commercial, receive a
catalog or call one of our Bear Counselors, the only Bears that are
offered are our Vermont-made Vermont Teddy Bears.

The only places where we offer an imported "Friend for Life" Bear are in
our two retail stores.  We created this brand because of overwhelming
negative feedback from people who visited our factory with their children
and felt that our Vermont Teddy Bears were too expensive.  They felt that
their children would leave in tears when they could not afford to buy a
Vermont-made Bear.  Thus the VTB Imports, such as the Friend for Life
Bears, were designed by our world-renowned designers and born abroad.

We try to be as clear as possible about the brand differences when
customers visit our factory, by mentioning it on our tour and by creating
a separate room for the imported bears.  There are signs on the walls of
this room and on the Bears that communicate that they are a special,
separate imported brand of Bears.  We appreciate getting notes such as
yours because it lets us know that we need to continue to improve this
communication with our customers.

You should know a few things about our Friend for Life Bears - we
personally visit the factory in China where these Bears are made to make
sure that they meet our rigorous standards for quality and labor
practices.  It is not at all like the sweatshops you read about, and that
so many large corporations use to make their products.  We guarantee all
of our Friend for Life Bears for life just like our Vermont Teddy Bears.

I sincerely hope the above explanation helps clarify the issue.  Again, we
apologize for the confusion and hope that you remain one of our cherished
customers.  Your frank feedback is most appreciated.

Best Regards,
Meg
Customer Service Representative
The Vermont Teddy Bear Company


Our last response:

Thank you for your response but might we suggest, without knowledge of your
profit margin, that your Vermont made bears are overpriced. That issue
aside, and given the labor conditions in China beyond your facilities, we
believe it is inappropriate for ANY U.S. company much less a VERMONT company
to conduct business with China.

There are many other non-repressive countries with better labor &
environmental standards where you could find cheap labor. All of the
countries of Central & South America come to mind. There is also a small
island named Puerto Rico which just happen to be a U.S. territory which
offers incentives for companies to go there. As much as we would like to
patronize your company, we cannot do so until you give up your relationship
with the repressive and very dangerous government of China.

Sincerely,
(our names)



Cat

http://www.inthe00s.com/smile/06/luxhello.gif http://www.inthe00s.com/smile/06/luxhello.gif http://www.inthe00s.com/smile/06/luxhello.gif http://www.inthe00s.com/smile/06/luxhello.gif

Karma to you, Catwoman.

If I may play Devi's Advocate for a moment: How much are Vermont Teddy Bears? I've been watching a show called "How It's Made" for the past few days. Things that seem really easy to make often aren't. A quality teddy bear might take one worker 90 minutes to make from start to finish. If you figure in at least 12$/hr labor and the same for materials/packaging/shipping, that's a 30$ cost to the company. Add in marketing, rent on the building/machinery, some small reject rate, profit margin, etc.,  and I would think one of their teddy bears would cost at least 60$.

*now looks at VTB website*

Okay, 60-90$ per bear (from my quick look). While that's a LOT for a stuffed animal, I think it's probably inline with their costs and profit margin.


The business press always promotes companies and economies "staying competitive."  What they don't tell you is it's a race to the bottom.  '

What are you gonna do, forge your own drill bits?
::)


Having drilled a lot of tough stuff (concrete, rebar, steel plate) over the past three days, I can say that next time I buy bits they will come from Hilti, if possible. There's nothing worse that a tool breaking or wearing out halfway through a job. I can't tell you how many dollars worth of bits we've destroyed since Monday morning, not to mention the lost time running back and forth to stores for more of them.

Ant

Having drilled a lot of tough stuff (concrete, rebar, steel plate) over the past three days, I can say that next time I buy bits they will come from Hilti, if possible. There's nothing worse that a tool breaking or wearing out halfway through a job. I can't tell you how many dollars worth of bits we've destroyed since Monday morning, not to mention the lost time running back and forth to stores for more of them.

Pcha!  That ain't nuthin... a few years ago, I had to drill a 6" hole through 10" of prison wall... not that I actually did the drilling myself, but eighteen hours with a water-cooled diamond-edged cutter was quite a bit of work.  I loved the thought of going into a tool hire shop and asking "what have you got that'll go through a prison wall" :D

If I may play Devi's Advocate for a moment: How much are Vermont Teddy Bears? I've been watching a show called "How It's Made" for the past few days. Things that seem really easy to make often aren't. A quality teddy bear might take one worker 90 minutes to make from start to finish. If you figure in at least 12$/hr labor and the same for materials/packaging/shipping, that's a 30$ cost to the company. Add in marketing, rent on the building/machinery, some small reject rate, profit margin, etc.,  and I would think one of their teddy bears would cost at least 60$.






Well, how many are you gonna buy?  I would say that as far as Teddies go, one very special one is enough.  You take the child for a special birthday, they make a special  teddy that will last them their whole lives.  My sister got a teddy bear and still has it(she is over 60, but don't tell her I told you.)  I would say $60 to $100 is a decent price for a high quality item that is intended to last a lifetime. The parents who frequent Vermont Teddy spend more than that on a manicure.

In the store, we noticed the higher priced ones (the ones made in the U.S.) were bigger. The smaller (and cheaper) ones were the ones made in China. I think they probably could make smaller ones-and I'm sure the price would be fairly reasonable.


Oh BTW, I read in the paper today about another recall-this time it is toy jewelry-with (you guessed it) lead paint and yes, it was made in China.  >:( >:( >:(


Cat

this article made me effin' sick.  :\'(

http://www.newswithviews.com/Devvy/kidd144.htm

Wal Mart is selling Christmas ornaments made by Chinese slave laborers(probably children) who work 12-14 hour days for 27 cents a day.  I am shocked  ::) , WalMart?  Only WalMart?

You know, as sad as the killing of innocent cats and dogs in China is (regardless of the reasons), what is truly disheartening isn't even the fact that they're killed, but that they're tortured to death slowly. It's hard to believe anyone could have the heart to do that just for the sake of making a few dollars or a product to sell in stores (i.e. fur coats). As much as I detest that in any form, even if they kill them, why not in the very least do it humanely?

Sure, in the US, what we do with cattle and especially chickens isn't always much better in theory, but at least it's (for the most part) much more humanely done, and they're killed instantly so they don't feel any pain. That's why we have animal treatment laws.

You know, as sad as the killing of innocent cats and dogs in China is (regardless of the reasons), what is truly disheartening isn't even the fact that they're killed, but that they're tortured to death slowly. It's hard to believe anyone could have the heart to do that just for the sake of making a few dollars or a product to sell in stores (i.e. fur coats). As much as I detest that in any form, even if they kill them, why not in the very least do it humanely?

Sure, in the US, what we do with cattle and especially chickens isn't always much better in theory, but at least it's (for the most part) much more humanely done, and they're killed instantly so they don't feel any pain. That's why we have animal treatment laws.


Maybe  Michael Vick should be made to stand in front of us and explain it.

I went shopping yesterday evening for gifts. One of the things on the list was a pair of shoes. I got them and noticed the store was offering 50% off for the second pair, so I looked... I only found one brand not made in China. "Screw this", I said to myself. "I'll go to the Red Wing outlet and get some American made shoes".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Red_Wing_Shoes

"Red Wing uses facilities in China to produce its WORX, Vasque, Irish Setter and Carhartt products, as well as the upper portions of some Red Wing–branded items."

I need a Motrin or two now.

I'm willing to accept that not everything made in China is a steaming pile of crap, but does nearly every goddamned product for sale in the US have to be made there?

Erin, I saw your link. To argue for a moment, I'm not going to condemn China for using cute and abundant animals (i.e., cats and dogs) for pelts and food. However, the handling and killing methods of these animals makes me sick. If an animal has to die for some need, there is no reason to make the thing suffer. Skinning alive a wounded and defenseless animal and then throwing it away....  >:( >:(

It's times like this I wish PETA wasn't such a nutcase organization, otherwise I'd probably lend them my support and time.

Ant

  Yeah, "Made in China" still carries a stigma...

  I recently purchased a Fender accoustic and noted it's manufature in China.  I'm picturing a guitar factory in China where Fender, Ibanez, Martin, Gibson, &etc are all assembled on the same line with the logo on the box being the only difference.  I mean guitars as we know them are, what, Spanish in origin (don't quote me on that) but they are a kind of Americana, aren't they..?

  I know it shouldn't matter, but I can't help feeling duped.  Then I get angry...

 

Well, I manage to find some sheets that were made in the U.S. (at least I THINK they were) at J.C. Penney's. Most of the sheets say "imported" but a couple didn't so I ASSUMED they are made in the U.S. So I got a set of flannel sheets for $12.99. Not bad-in fact I got 2 sets.  ;D ;D ;D


Anyway, my point is still the same, I am really angered by the fact that majority of what we buy in this country is made in China. I implore everyone on this board to avoid buying products made in China if you can help it. Maybe if we-the consumers-were to boycott the products, maybe the manufacturers will pay attention. But we ALL need to do it.

Cat


I agree with you Cat.  However most Americans tend to vote with their wallet, and you see them flocking to Japanese and Korean car dealerships.

I used to be a manager in a manufacturing plant, and I often asked the Union Steward, "Hey, how come you smoke those ciggies that were made with non-union labor?".  His answer every time:  "They're cheaper".

All this said I am completely AGAINST putting in punitive anti-trade tariffs, that ends up being a lose-lose situation (I am 100% for keeping truly unsafe products from coming in though).

Imports grow in the USA because the public does not support american manufacturers.

And as a result, domestic manufacturers turn to importing, or else they too go completely out of business.

The country needs a TRUE GRASSROOTS "Buy American" movement.

Wal Mart is selling Christmas ornaments made by Chinese slave laborers(probably children) who work 12-14 hour days for 27 cents a day.  I am shocked  ::) , WalMart?  Only WalMart?


o, it is not just wal mart.

You will see that Chinese crap sold at every store in the country.

Including the ones who are represented by the SCIU and other unions.

The latest schtick from the Unions is "don;t buy at Wal mart because their product is made in china".

Somehow I would give this campaign more credence if the SCIU, et. al., threatened to walk out on any of their employers who did not commit to reducing Chinese Content in their products.

By the way, there are a numbe of large companies who have "diversity programs" where they have to do X% of their business with black-owned companies, Y% with woman-owned companies, and so on.

So why do they not set goals for AMERICAN-MADE suppliers as well?  In addition to the "diversity goals" these would be goals that cut across lines of race etc.

I think that if a large consumer products company came out with a campaign like this, suppliers and customers would beat a path to their door...

o, it is not just wal mart.

You will see that Chinese crap sold at every store in the country.

Including the ones who are represented by the SCIU and other unions.

The latest schtick from the Unions is "don;t buy at Wal mart because their product is made in china".


o, it is not just wal mart. You will see that Chinese crap sold at every store in the country.



Yeah, I was being sarcastic

I have continually suggested in some stores that they have a "Made in USA" section.  I was at the Kittery Trading Post in Maine and noticed that they had one for work shirts.  The rest of the store was China.  I am continually berating, yes berating, fellow union members whenever they say the went to Wal-Mart, and I am continually taking off my offering them to take a look at the tags on my clothes to see the "Made in USA" label.  They try to catch me out but haven't yet. The USA cannot feed clothe or fuel itself, iwe actually refuse to reed, clothe, and fuel ourselves, it is our own fault, it is a disgrace.

I don't shop at Wal-Mart, but then again, I don't do much shopping.  Period.  I don't have a family and thus I don't have a family budget to meet.  I agree with LB, there needs to be a truly grassroots "Buy American" movement, but much of the grassroots doesn't care, or cannot afford to pick-and-choose in the first place.  If you're trying to maintain a home with four kids on 30K or less a year, you'll shop at Wal-Mart.  I wouldn't begrudge anybody for that. 

I agree with you Cat.  However most Americans tend to vote with their wallet, and you see them flocking to Japanese and Korean car dealerships.

I used to be a manager in a manufacturing plant, and I often asked the Union Steward, "Hey, how come you smoke those ciggies that were made with non-union labor?".  His answer every time:  "They're cheaper".

All this said I am completely AGAINST putting in punitive anti-trade tariffs, that ends up being a lose-lose situation (I am 100% for keeping truly unsafe products from coming in though).

Imports grow in the USA because the public does not support american manufacturers.

And as a result, domestic manufacturers turn to importing, or else they too go completely out of business.

The country needs a TRUE GRASSROOTS "Buy American" movement.
Thats funny I was just gonna post something about my last car purchase a few days ago.

Now I just purchased a 2007 Mazda 6 in September that was made in Flat Rock, Michigan with UAW workers since Ford owns the Flat Rock Plant(Ford owns 33-34 percent of Mazda) and the Mazda 6 has 65% American Parts content and 35% foreign parts content. Now the Ford Fusion which is based off the Mazda 6 platform is built in Mexico and only has 20% American Parts content and 80% Foreign Parts content I beileve. Is there something wrong with this picture that a Mazda is using way more American Parts than a Ford?

I still won;t buy a Gm, Ford, or Chrysler until they make something that appeals to me more than what Honda or Mazda offer. I think the Domestics negelcted the passenger car business in favor of the SUV segement in the 90's/early 00's and are now paying for it because SUVs aren;t selling well because of rising of gas prices. I understand the Domestics have mid-size cars that are competitive with the Japanese now like the Fusion, 08 Chevy Malibu, and the Saturn Aura but those 3 models don;t have as much brand equity to outsell Toyota Camry and Honda Accord in the US.

The Domestic Big 3 had "The Buy Grassroots American movement" in the 80's/early 90's and people got tired of it. It was only in the late 90's that people started to flock to import brands in increasing numbers.

The Domestics have lost most of their business to Toyota in the past 10 years anyway not to Honda, Nissan, and Hyundai as much as Toyota but still those 3 makes(Honda, Nissan, and Hyundai) have taken market share away from the Domestics. I mean Toyota has gained 7.7 points of market share in the past 10 years:

Toyota's 1998 market share: 8.5% of the Us market
Toyota's 2007 market share(so far Year To Date) 16.2 percent of the US market.

Ford is the main US manufacturer thats taken a hit in the past 9-11 years worth their market share in the US:

Ford's 1997 US market share(don;t have 1998 figures): 28 percent of the market
Fords 1999 US market share: 22-23 percent of the market
Ford's 2007 market share(so far year to date): 13 percent of the US market

I agree with you Cat.  However most Americans tend to vote with their wallet, and you see them flocking to Japanese and Korean car dealerships.

I used to be a manager in a manufacturing plant, and I often asked the Union Steward, "Hey, how come you smoke those ciggies that were made with non-union labor?".  His answer every time:  "They're cheaper".

All this said I am completely AGAINST putting in punitive anti-trade tariffs, that ends up being a lose-lose situation (I am 100% for keeping truly unsafe products from coming in though).

Imports grow in the USA because the public does not support american manufacturers.

And as a result, domestic manufacturers turn to importing, or else they too go completely out of business.

The country needs a TRUE GRASSROOTS "Buy American" movement.



I think you are wrong about the public not supporting American manufacturers-I believe it is the other way around-the manufacturers are NOT supporting the American public. Why? Pure & simple-GREED! The want bigger profits so they outsource everything to China (as well as other places) for cheap labor. They could care less about anything but their bottom line. Walmart opened its doors to people with offerings of cheaper prices. When it did that, most people were not looking at labels, just the price tags. Now, with all the recalls in the past few months, I think people are starting to look at labels and I think people are starting to "get it". This Christmas season, many local toy manufacturers are saying they are seeing an increase in orders. That, my friend, is indeed your "TRUE GRASSROOTS "Buy American" movement."


Cat

I don't shop at Wal-Mart, but then again, I don't do much shopping.  Period.  I don't have a family and thus I don't have a family budget to meet.  I agree with LB, there needs to be a truly grassroots "Buy American" movement, but much of the grassroots doesn't care, or cannot afford to pick-and-choose in the first place.  If you're trying to maintain a home with four kids on 30K or less a year, you'll shop at Wal-Mart.  I wouldn't begrudge anybody for that. 



I was reluctant to say anything about this issue because we are one of those that can't afford to pick and choose. We get the cheapest we can right now because of our budget. However, I do keep a close eye on toys and stuff. We've been lucky so far. That's not to say that Jason gets everything in the world, but with Christmas upon us and the relatives buying him stuff, we have to watch out. I shop at Walmart (although not so much now because of the sweatshop crap...I still feel guilty because we bought our Christmas stuff there before I heard about this :-[) and at Kmart and anywhere else that I can get cheap clothes, cheap shoes, cheap bedding, etc. There would be nothing I would like better than to shop all USA, but right now, that is NOT an option. If I have to choose between a $10 sweatshirt from Kmart that was made in China and a $30 sweatshirt that was made in the US....well, you know what's going to win.

I'm hoping after Rice gets done with school, I can jump on the made in the USA, all natural, organic, hormone free bandwagon. Until then....

I was reluctant to say anything about this issue because we are one of those that can't afford to pick and choose. We get the cheapest we can right now because of our budget. However, I do keep a close eye on toys and stuff. We've been lucky so far. That's not to say that Jason gets everything in the world, but with Christmas upon us and the relatives buying him stuff, we have to watch out. I shop at Walmart (although not so much now because of the sweatshop crap...I still feel guilty because we bought our Christmas stuff there before I heard about this :-[) and at Kmart and anywhere else that I can get cheap clothes, cheap shoes, cheap bedding, etc. There would be nothing I would like better than to shop all USA, but right now, that is NOT an option. If I have to choose between a $10 sweatshirt from Kmart that was made in China and a $30 sweatshirt that was made in the US....well, you know what's going to win.

I'm hoping after Rice gets done with school, I can jump on the made in the USA, all natural, organic, hormone free bandwagon. Until then....



There are many, many people in this country who are in the same boat as you. Many of them are in that boat because they lost their jobs when they were outsourced overseas by the greedy manufacturers. It is a never ending cycle. Unfortunately, I don't think you can find a "shop all USA" today. As I posted earlier, even companies that claim to have products made in the U.S., have some that are made in China.

BTW, personally I would rather shop at KMart than Walmart-and I have.



Cat

There are many, many people in this country who are in the same boat as you. Many of them are in that boat because they lost their jobs when they were outsourced overseas by the greedy manufacturers. It is a never ending cycle. Unfortunately, I don't think you can find a "shop all USA" today. As I posted earlier, even companies that claim to have products made in the U.S., have some that are made in China.

BTW, personally I would rather shop at KMart than Walmart-and I have.



Cat


Ours is a combination of debt from repairing that effin' car and trying to stretch a salary three ways when it was meant for one person. However, that should start improving once this quarter is over. I've started looking at labels a bit more and buying green products (the Seventh Generation dishwasher soap works WAY better than Cascade). And if something that I need is made in the US and within my budget, I'll buy it.

Re: Kmart. They closed down a lot of them in California, but there are actually quite a few here in the Midwest, which makes me happy.

I once ran across a website that purported to sell all US products. I need to find that again and check it out.

I think you are wrong about the public not supporting American manufacturers-I believe it is the other way around-the manufacturers are NOT supporting the American public. Why? Pure & simple-GREED! The want bigger profits so they outsource everything to China (as well as other places) for cheap labor. They could care less about anything but their bottom line. Walmart opened its doors to people with offerings of cheaper prices. When it did that, most people were not looking at labels, just the price tags. Now, with all the recalls in the past few months, I think people are starting to look at labels and I think people are starting to "get it". This Christmas season, many local toy manufacturers are saying they are seeing an increase in orders. That, my friend, is indeed your "TRUE GRASSROOTS "Buy American" movement."


Cat


Then that would certainly explain the growth of Toyota and other foreign car brands in the United States, whose car prices are not even cheap!  And there are some of the Korean brands which are extremely cheap... and people are flocking to them too.

You can still buy cars of most sizes from the American producers, but people increasingly flock to the foreign brands.

It is an easy, cheap shot to blame all of this on "the greed of corporate america".  I do not buy it, whilst I see people carping about Chinese goods while they drive their VW's and Hyundais to work.  (By the way I drive a Saturn)

Wal-Mart grew because it promised super-low prices, and its clientel said "I don;t give a rat's ass how you lower prices, just LOWER them!"... and so Wal-Mart went to China.  And its competitors do likewise to keep from losing market share and going out of business.

Hopefully the grassroots movement will reverse this trend.


By the way, I was looking for a set of hiking boots today and could not find any Made in the USA.  I shall now do a web search to find some made here.  Gotta do my bit...

I was reluctant to say anything about this issue because we are one of those that can't afford to pick and choose. We get the cheapest we can right now because of our budget. However, I do keep a close eye on toys and stuff. We've been lucky so far. That's not to say that Jason gets everything in the world, but with Christmas upon us and the relatives buying him stuff, we have to watch out. I shop at Walmart (although not so much now because of the sweatshop crap...I still feel guilty because we bought our Christmas stuff there before I heard about this :-[) and at Kmart and anywhere else that I can get cheap clothes, cheap shoes, cheap bedding, etc. There would be nothing I would like better than to shop all USA, but right now, that is NOT an option. If I have to choose between a $10 sweatshirt from Kmart that was made in China and a $30 sweatshirt that was made in the US....well, you know what's going to win.

I'm hoping after Rice gets done with school, I can jump on the made in the USA, all natural, organic, hormone free bandwagon. Until then....

I wish you didn't feel the need to be reluctant in the first place.  That's the way it's gotta be for many millions.  At least you can look forward to things getting easier once Rice finishes school.

By the way, I was looking for a set of hiking boots today and could not find any Made in the USA.  I shall now do a web search to find some made here.  Gotta do my bit...




This is where I go for my work boots, they do have a hiker.  I have suggested this to a couple of people and they love them as much as I do.  Very comfortable.  So far the Xtra Depth line is made in USA, be quick though, that could all change.  Like Red Wing, who would ever believe it?


P.W. Minor

www.pwminor.com/Products/Category.aspx?cat=2&pg=13

Then that would certainly explain the growth of Toyota and other foreign car brands in the United States, whose car prices are not even cheap!  And there are some of the Korean brands which are extremely cheap... and people are flocking to them too.

You can still buy cars of most sizes from the American producers, but people increasingly flock to the foreign brands.

It is an easy, cheap shot to blame all of this on "the greed of corporate america".  I do not buy it, whilst I see people carping about Chinese goods while they drive their VW's and Hyundais to work.  (By the way I drive a Saturn)

Wal-Mart grew because it promised super-low prices, and its clientel said "I don;t give a rat's ass how you lower prices, just LOWER them!"... and so Wal-Mart went to China.  And its competitors do likewise to keep from losing market share and going out of business.

Hopefully the grassroots movement will reverse this trend.


By the way, I was looking for a set of hiking boots today and could not find any Made in the USA.  I shall now do a web search to find some made here.  Gotta do my bit...


I think many people are flocking to "foreign" cars is because many of the so-called American cars are gas-guzzlers. GM & Ford didn't really learn the lessons of the Energy Crisis of the 70s when there was a big gas shortage. They make a lot of SUVs.  Most of the so-called "foreign" car makers did-they made more fuel-efficient cars. Only now are the "American" car makers starting to catch up. I also think that people are looking for quality, too. Toyota & Honda have been named the top cars for several years by Consumer Reports not only for fuel efficiency, but performance. We have a 2001 Honda Civic that we have driven across country a few times. Besides normal wear and tear, the car has not had any major problems. 

The reason why I call them "foreign" or "American" because those terms really don't mean much. Many so-called "American" cars are no longer being made in Detroit like they used to. Many are being made in Mexico-or much of their parts are. The so-called "foreign" cars are being being built in the U.S. I had a Nissan Sentra that was made in Tenn. by American workers. 



Cat

www.uaw.org/uawmade/auto/2006/uawcars.cfm

I think you are wrong about the public not supporting American manufacturers-I believe it is the other way around-the manufacturers are NOT supporting the American public. Why? Pure & simple-GREED! The want bigger profits so they outsource everything to China (as well as other places) for cheap labor. They could care less about anything but their bottom line. Walmart opened its doors to people with offerings of cheaper prices. When it did that, most people were not looking at labels, just the price tags. Now, with all the recalls in the past few months, I think people are starting to look at labels and I think people are starting to "get it". This Christmas season, many local toy manufacturers are saying they are seeing an increase in orders. That, my friend, is indeed your "TRUE GRASSROOTS "Buy American" movement."


Cat


My grandfather told about some guy who owned a toy company. When the plant was in the US, he made over a million in profits every year. Then he moved the work to China, which turned him into a billionaire. Wasn't making millions enough? No, not for him apparently.

What makes me mad about it is that many major american companies claim that they can't afford to have their products made here, but they still profit more than enough off of it even if it's made here.

Most are too greedy(except for the rare few who keep their plants here), I agree there. They are not satisfied with making hundreds of thousands or millions on their products in profits.

Most are too greedy(except for the rare few who keep their plants here), I agree there. They are not satisfied with making hundreds of thousands or millions on their products in profits.


Exactly.  Their main priority by far is keeping their shareholders happy and richer.  Never mind anything else.

Then that would certainly explain the growth of Toyota and other foreign car brands in the United States, whose car prices are not even cheap!  And there are some of the Korean brands which are extremely cheap... and people are flocking to them too.


Hyundai;s aren;t even that cheap anymore as they were in the early 00's(like 2001.)

BTW, the Mazda 6 that I bought only cost me 19,695 dollars(thats w/tax etc.) I think and the negotiated price was like 17,997 dollars. Now if I bought a Honda Accord or Toyota Camry I would have spent more money.

As far as Saturn goes isn;t the Aura and new Astra(hatchback) being made in Europe and being shipped to the US?

Exactly.  Their main priority by far is keeping their shareholders happy and richer.  Never mind anything else.


Exactly, shareholders need an attitude adjustment.(Like that will happen)

*bump*

I went shopping yesterday for a birthday present for my mother. She needs some new flatware that matches (and can handle scooping ice cream w/o bending the spoons  ;D), so I thought I'd get her a set.

Three kitchenware stores later (at the Prime Outlets), I came out empty handed. With the exception of a few appliances and some serious pot sets, everything I checked, including flatware, was made in China. They should rename that stuff "Beware". It ranged from cheap Chinese junk to decent Chinese junk.

Anyone know an American company that makes decent flatware? It doesn't have to be made from Argentium Sterling Silver, just some quality flatware that isn't from a country where substandard seems to be the order of the day.

Ant

You have to be careful about some things, particularly food items. There was recently a CBC special on food products which carry the 'Made in Canada' label. It's legal under Canadian law to use that label if 51% of the cost to produce the product is borne in Canada. Needless to say, these minimal requirements are abused and you find yourself proudly buying 'Canadian' food products grown or caught in China or Vietnam.

I'm sure things aren't much different in the States.


I think I saw that same special.  They were discussing the Highliner Fish plant in Nova Scotia, on how the fish is imported from another country, so it's not really made in Canada, just packaged in Canada.  I did find that a little upsetting

They recently had a meat scare in Canada, recalling products under the 'Maple Leaf' and 'Schniders' brand labels, which really scared me because I often eat those products.  It's getting so I don't know what's safe anymore :(

*bump*

I went shopping yesterday for a birthday present for my mother. She needs some new flatware that matches (and can handle scooping ice cream w/o bending the spoons  ;D), so I thought I'd get her a set.

Three kitchenware stores later (at the Prime Outlets), I came out empty handed. With the exception of a few appliances and some serious pot sets, everything I checked, including flatware, was made in China. They should rename that stuff "Beware". It ranged from cheap Chinese junk to decent Chinese junk.

Anyone know an American company that makes decent flatware? It doesn't have to be made from Argentium Sterling Silver, just some quality flatware that isn't from a country where substandard seems to be the order of the day.

Ant



I was going to suggest Oneida but after doing a quick search, I found out that I am wrong about that. They closed their last U.S. factory down in 2005.  :\'( :\'( :\'(  Anyway, I find this site that may interest you.

http://www.flatware.org/stainless_steel_flatware_silverware/stainless_flatware_manufacturers.html

You may be better off going to yard sales/second hand stores and finding some vintage stuff-it is probably better made than the crap they make today.


FYI, I did my undergraduate honor's thesis on the founder of the Oneida Community-which started as a Utopian society.



Cat

Always buy "Made in the U.S.A." because when you do, you are helping those companies raise the capital they need....to shut their American plants and open new ones in China.
:-\\

I heard a statistic on C-SPAN the other day that 86% of the toys we will get this Xmas are made in China.  I can only conclude one thing:  Santa Claus is Chinese!
http://www.inthe00s.com/smile/09/smilejap.gif


I guess instead of Oreos and milk we should leave him eggs rolls and lo-mein!!!!

In the store, we noticed the higher priced ones (the ones made in the U.S.) were bigger. The smaller (and cheaper) ones were the ones made in China. I think they probably could make smaller ones-and I'm sure the price would be fairly reasonable.


Oh BTW, I read in the paper today about another recall-this time it is toy jewelry-with (you guessed it) lead paint and yes, it was made in China.  >:( >:( >:(


Cat


Karma to you Cat. We bought one of these about 10 years ago as a graduation present for my boss. It was 45.00
outrageuos. I'm not buying anythin from China, I check all Dantes toys to make sure they are made in the U.S. Its not easy though.

Well, not everything made in China is of inferior quality. Right now, I'm wearing a digital watch that was made in China that I bought at Wal-Mart for about US$12.15. I find it to be a very reliable time piece. I'd say it's the best quality watch you can find anywhere in that price range.

The factory workers in China work as hard as people in the manufacturing sector anywhere else in the world, so if they make a product that's of good quality at a competitive price, it deserves as much of a chance as every other item on the market.

Well, not everything made in China is of inferior quality. Right now, I'm wearing a digital watch that was made in China that I bought at Wal-Mart for about US$12.15. I find it to be a very reliable time piece. I'd say it's the best quality watch you can find anywhere in that price range.

The factory workers in China work as hard as people in the manufacturing sector anywhere else in the world, so if they make a product that's of good quality at a competitive price, it deserves as much of a chance as every other item on the market.


Sprawalmart is evi, they pack as many goods as possible into thier stores, thereby forcing more community based businesses out of buisiness treat their employees like sh!t. I got across the street and shop at Target or K mart. But our Kmart is so poorly stocked. I agree a boycott is needed on Chinese  goods. Look what is happening to the milk over there. Thousands of babies developing kidney failure ffrom poor manufacturing processes?  And now there seems to be some question about powdered milk too.

Sprawalmart is evi, they pack as many goods as possible into thier stores, thereby forcing more community based businesses out of buisiness treat their employees like sh!t. I got across the street and shop at Target or K mart. But our Kmart is so poorly stocked. I agree a boycott is needed on Chinese  goods. Look what is happening to the milk over there. Thousands of babies developing kidney failure ffrom poor manufacturing processes?  And now there seems to be some question about powdered milk too.


You tell 'em. AND the conditions under which many of the workers have to work is down right immoral.  Isn't it nice you(Satish) can get a reliable watch for $12.15.  Well how about spending a bit more and getting one made by a worker who is over the age of 12 getting paid more than $10 a week working 12 hour days.  It isn't the Chinese worker who is the problem, it is the Chinese manufacturer.

The factory workers in China work as hard as people in the manufacturing sector anywhere else in the world, so if they make a product that's of good quality at a competitive price, it deserves as much of a chance as every other item on the market.


That's not the issue.  Of course they do - or else.  A big part of the problem is they they are grossly underpaid, and they can't unionize, so the competition is unfair to U.S. workers.

About 80% of goods at Walmart are made in China. Walmart also imports about 10% of ALL goods made in China into the U.S.


http://74.125.45.104/search?q=cache:fBnreZm_zkEJ:www.epi.org/newsroom/releases/2007/06/070625-walmart-china-release.pdf+percentage+of+u.s+goods+made+in+china+for+walmart&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=7&gl=us


Yes, Walmart is a BIG part of the problem.



Cat

Sprawalmart is evi, they pack as many goods as possible into thier stores, thereby forcing more community based businesses out of buisiness treat their employees like sh!t. I got across the street and shop at Target or K mart. But our Kmart is so poorly stocked. I agree a boycott is needed on Chinese  goods. Look what is happening to the milk over there. Thousands of babies developing kidney failure ffrom poor manufacturing processes?  And now there seems to be some question about powdered milk too.


Not to mention, part of how Walmart gets its edge is by lobbying local governments for tax breaks.  The reason why Walmart often targets small towns is because of the lower tax burden and greater leverage they can get over smaller governments.  These areas also have small businesses that are more vulnerable to big business than ones in big cities because of their limited consumer markets.

That's not the issue.  Of course they do - or else.  A big part of the problem is they they are grossly underpaid, and they can't unionize, so the competition is unfair to U.S. workers.


The unfair competition worries me less than our dependency on Chinese trade.  I think it's pretty obvious by now that America can't expect to go back to being a major manufacturer of low tech products.  What's much more bothersome is how China now has an immense amount of power over our economy.  Not only do we import a ton of their stuff, but we're literally borrowing money from China to pay for the Iraq occupation.

In addition to this, Chinese businesses have bought around $24 billion worth of assets from Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae.  Now that the government has taken control of these institutions, we can literally say now that American taxpayers are subject to the whims of Chinese stockholders.

The unfair competition worries me less than our dependency on Chinese trade.  I think it's pretty obvious by now that America can't expect to go back to being a major manufacturer of low tech products.  What's much more bothersome is how China now has an immense amount of power over our economy.  Not only do we import a ton of their stuff, but we're literally borrowing money from China to pay for the Iraq occupation.

In addition to this, Chinese businesses have bought around $24 billion worth of assets from Freddie Mac and Fannie Mae.  Now that the government has taken control of these institutions, we can literally say now that American taxpayers are subject to the whims of Chinese stockholders.



Scary isn't it. But we can all feel good about it because we can buy a watch for $12.15.  ::)



Cat

Frank Zappa said it best
"I'm a moron 'n' this is my wife
She's frosting a cake
With a paper knife
All what we got here's
American made
It's a little bit cheesy,
But it's nicely displayed
Well we don't get excited when it
Crumbles 'n' breaks
We just get on the phone
And call up some Flakes
They rush on over
'N' wreck it some more
'N' we are so dumb
They're lining' up at our door"

Todays car commercials for imports no longer bother to compare to US brands......They target other Japanese cars.....America is slipping out of the loop!

Todays car commercials for imports no longer bother to compare to US brands......They target other Japanese cars.....America is slipping out of the loop!




We are out of the loop, in the noose, and it is getting tighter every hour.

truth in pictures