Now here is a case which I find very disturbing.  A man is being tried in Afganistan, after being charged with aspostacy.  This is because 16 years ago, he became a Christian.  Under Islamic Law, this calls for the Death Penalty.

http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/554FAF3A-B267-427A-B9EC-54881BDE0A2E.htm?printguid={7BB654F1-7D5C-4E7D-B251-28A6E20A461D}

Glad to see Afghanistan is free from the oppressive chains of religious extremism.

Now here is a case which I find very disturbing.  A man is being tried in Afganistan, after being charged with aspostacy.  This is because 16 years ago, he became a Christian.  Under Islamic Law, this calls for the Death Penalty.

http://www.lhup.edu/~dsimanek/fe-scidi.htm


I have no idea why this link is here, but I must say, the article to which you linked is slightly scarier than your what you've written before it... ;)

In all seriousness, though, here's a link to the Afghanistan story: http://today.reuters.com/news/newsArticle.aspx?type=topNews&storyID=2006-03-22T181312Z_01_N22376671_RTRUKOC_0_US-RELIGION-AFGHAN-BUSH.xml&archived=False

I thought Bush "freed" Afghanistan, what a joke.

I thought Bush "freed" Afghanistan, what a joke.


Yeah, he's doing a great job.  ::)

Yeah, we did our job over there.  ::)

Now here is a case which I find very disturbing.  A man is being tried in Afganistan, after being charged with aspostacy.  This is because 16 years ago, he became a Christian.  Under Islamic Law, this calls for the Death Penalty.

http://www.lhup.edu/~dsimanek/fe-scidi.htm


so what? he broke the law, so now let him deal with the consequences

I heard about this yesterday.  It disgusts me that the United Kingdom, where he has lived for the past decade+, or the Americans who are in there in force, haven't stepped in and demanded that he be let go.

I heard about this yesterday.  It disgusts me that the United Kingdom, where he has lived for the past decade+, or the Americans who are in there in force, haven't stepped in and demanded that he be let go.


is the man in question a citizen of the UK or USA ?

so what? he broke the law, so now let him deal with the consequences



You agree with them putting this man to death? 

is the man in question a citizen of the UK or USA ?


I'm not sure if he gained citizenship but has lived in the UK since college.  He returned to Afghanistan because his wife took off
back there with his children and he wanted to get them and bring them back to the UK.  She outed his religious conversion from
Muslim to Christian in order to keep custody.

is the man in question a citizen of the UK or USA ?


Neither, he is a citizen of Afganistan.

Actually, the President of Afganistan is one of the ones trying to find a way out of this mess.  This really seems to be the actions of local judicial administrators, not the Government itself.

The problem is how the Constitution is written.  It states that Freedom of Religion is allowed, but then it also states that Islamic Law must be followed.  Normally this prevents no problems, exceit in this case.

Under Islamic law, somebody who converts away from Islam performs Apostacy.  And this is punished by death.  It is not a charge that could be used against any other Christians, Jews, or any other faith.

Even though Afganistan is trying hard to become more secular, it is the officials that work at the local level that still run a lot of things.  These are often holdovers from the old Taliban days.  And there is still a huge fundamentalist movement in the country.  It is going to take a long time for this sort of thing to settle down.

Part of the President's problem is that he is an Afgan citizen.  He can not be deported.  And it was his own family that requested that he be arrested.  Since he is in a custody battle with his parents (they have his 2 children), this makes a normally messy situation even messier.

It seems that their trying to find a way out by having him declaired mentally incompetant.  I am sure that they are going to use the old "Russian Insanity" plea.  "What, you do not love Communism/Islam?  You must be crazy!"

And thanks Windbreaker.  I accidentially used a shortcut to another post.  I already changed it to the correct one, and am reposting it here:

http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/554FAF3A-B267-427A-B9EC-54881BDE0A2E.htm?printguid={7BB654F1-7D5C-4E7D-B251-28A6E20A461D}

I heard about this yesterday.  It disgusts me that the United Kingdom, where he has lived for the past decade+, or the Americans who are in there in force, haven't stepped in and demanded that he be let go.


there doesn't appear to eb anything about it on the news pages here

You agree with them putting this man to death? 


I don't think it's any of my business.

I'm not sure if he gained citizenship but has lived in the UK since college.  He returned to Afghanistan because his wife took off
back there with his children and he wanted to get them and bring them back to the UK.  She outed his religious conversion from
Muslim to Christian in order to keep custody.


Now that's the wife from hell! :D

Now that's the wife from hell! :D


Actually, it was his parents who reported him to the authorities in his village.

From everything I have read, all of the charges so far was instigated at a local level.  By the time the National authorities got involved, it had already become the mess that it is now.  They just want this to go away.

I don't think it's any of my business.


I think yo might agree with me. ^
I have spent years and years traveling, living overseas and working with other cultures. I firmly believe that
there is no right or wrong between them...they are all different. I have been hurt and insulted and my country has been injured.
Still, if you were objective outside the world we live in, you will see that you can't stand in anyone's shoes.  We think this is wrong to kill this man because of our belief system.  They say they can kill him because of theirs.
We will not agree and we cannot assume to be right.

In my heart, I don't want to see him killed.. but, in a way, it's  like Star70 says. it's not ANY of our business.

I think yo might agree with me. ^
I have spent years and years traveling, living overseas and working with other cultures. I firmly believe that
there is no right or wrong between them...they are all different. I have been hurt and insulted and my country has been injured.
Still, if you were objective outside the world we live in, you will see that you can't stand in anyone's shoes.  We think this is wrong to kill this man because of our belief system.  They say they can kill him because of theirs.
We will not agree and we cannot assume to be right.

In my heart, I don't want to see him killed.. but, in a way, it's  like Star70 says. it's not ANY of our business.


There is one thing however that does bring this issue into the international spotlight.

Afganistan is a signatory member of the UN Charter for Religious Freedom.  They have agreed to guarantee freedom of religion to all it's citizens and visitors.  The current trial is counter to everything in this promise.

However, before the UN ever gets around to doing anything, Mr Rahman will be cold and dead in the ground (even if he dies of old age).

http://www.newkerala.com/news2.php?action=fullnews&id=30272

There is one thing however that does bring this issue into the international spotlight.

Afganistan is a signatory member of the UN Charter for Religious Freedom.  They have agreed to guarantee freedom of religion to all it's citizens and visitors.  The current trial is counter to everything in this promise.

However, before the UN ever gets around to doing anything, Mr Rahman will be cold and dead in the ground (even if he dies of old age).

http://www.newkerala.com/news2.php?action=fullnews&id=30272


Oh certainly...
but I just wanted to point out that we tend to judge without considering where the behavior comes from.
Your point is most valid.

The more I think about it, the better a solution it seems... but it should be applied equally to all faiths not just people who become Christians ;)

Well, I guess Muslim to Christian is a slight improvement.  ;)

Seriously though, I'm against the death penalty altogether, and this is especially harsh considering changing a religion doesn't even hurt anybody.  But I guess that's how things work in some countries.

I think yo might agree with me. ^
I have spent years and years traveling, living overseas and working with other cultures. I firmly believe that
there is no right or wrong between them...they are all different. I have been hurt and insulted and my country has been injured.
Still, if you were objective outside the world we live in, you will see that you can't stand in anyone's shoes.  We think this is wrong to kill this man because of our belief system.  They say they can kill him because of theirs.
We will not agree and we cannot assume to be right.

In my heart, I don't want to see him killed.. but, in a way, it's  like Star70 says. it's not ANY of our business.



I view it this way: the Afghans don't come to my country and impose their system upon me, so why should I tell them what to do in their country?

the idiot should have come to america before converting

all charges have been dropped and it is presumed the doofus has left Afghanistan.

all charges have been dropped and it is presumed the doofus has left Afghanistan.

Hey, maybe things are improving over there. The old Taliban guys would have summarily executed said doofus within 48 hours!
I notice the Christian Right speaking up on behalf of the doofus, once again coming to the defense of religious freedom...that is the freedom to be Christian and nothing else.  Oh, now you can get a Jew pass, as long as you're pro-Israeli U.S. taxpayer-bought-and-paid-for armageddon machine! 
:P

all charges have been dropped and it is presumed the doofus has left Afghanistan.


He's gone to Italy.

He's gone to Italy.


Viva Italia!

I know Islam is REALLY strict about abandoning your faith... it's really big in the Koran that people who leave Islam can't return or something.. like, they're punished worst of all people.

LOL!
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v473/TheMoonandAntarctica/PostwhoreDance.gif

I know Islam is REALLY strict about abandoning your faith... it's really big in the Koran that people who leave Islam can't return or something.. like, they're punished worst of all people.


It is called "Apostacy", and it is one of the few crimes where Summary Execution is allowed in the Koran itself.

And it is not the only religion to have made this a crime, the Roman Catholic Church once had a similar policy, but it was largely discarded after Martin Luther.  During that time it became obvious that the more of Luther's converts were killed, the stronger the movement would become.  Rather like the early days of the Roman Catholic Church itself.

And rather like I expected, he was found mentally unfit, and allowed to leave the counrty.  He is in Italy now.

Actually, the finding is more or less what I expected.  Their approach is a classic one from the old Soviet Union.  They often held dissidents for many years, under the concept that "If you do not love the Soviet Union, you must be crazy".

I have a great amount of religious tolerance.  And if you remember, many times I have stated that I have no problem with a religion unless it involves "unwilling human sacrifice".  To me, this falls right under that definition.