In this thread, I am going to make a few guesses. Sadly, I don't think we will ever know for sure why no one remembers it fondly to the point that the "early 2000s" is almost practically used as a euphemism or is a misnomer for the entire decade.


Politically, the 2000s was a lot like the 1980s, when rather fiscally and socially conservative politicians dominated politics. Wars took place and with the advent of 9/11, America's safety felt threatened. With the government's reaction to 9/11 and with it even taking place, and with the occurrence of the economic recession, all hope seemed lost.


Culturally, nothing seemed very groundbreaking - pop music was around but people don't seem to have much to say about it. Ringtone hip-hop and rap seemed to dominate (which made hip-hop seem less credible then, especially compared to that of the 90s). Rock music also dominated, but it has taken on a more androgynous and/or boyish vibe with the popularity of pop punk. Rock music was still popular then, but with hip-hop's increasing popularity, it was starting to sound a little stale (and some guys were just downright homophobic and sexist with the 2000s' flavor of rock music, calling emo boys "girls" or something in a meme I saw - either that or they didn't like how whiny it sounded). There didn't seem to be anything that was inspirational, but I'm not sure. I like the sound of 2000s music especially compared to that of the 2010s' because of their choices of melody.


I wager that among the socially conservative and traditional, aside from 9/11 threatening America's sovereignty, they would have hated the 2000s because of the generations' reduced religious piety and with the increasing tolerance of the LGBT community - homosexuality was legalized nationwide in the US early at around this time, and a few nations have legalized same-sex marriage too (notably the Netherlands, Canada and Spain to my knowledge). Evangelical Christians seem to have a markedly reduced influence at least since the 90s I think, but I think people liked the 90s because of a more groundbreaking and diverse culture in the West, with hip-hop and multicultural movements and/or policies.


Those who are more liberal would hate the 2000s for the xenophobic direction that politics has gone, namely with the US and UK's decision to go to war with Iraq and Afghanistan. I don't think there were really any groundbreaking changes too regarding the plight of the LGBT community, ethnic, religious and other social minorities. For some of them and for the traditional too, I think they would have hated the overly commercialized nature of culture then too, just like from the 80s.


Technology started to dominate in this decade, with low-cost cellphones and laptops being commonplace, thus disrupting the previous notions of what was thought as communication to the point it's become invasive and affected people's biological clocks.


I would like to create a thread about whether people even like the 2010s. I'm worried that what I might type there would be decadeology material though but I hope that it won't end up being the case.


What do you guys think? Have I hit the nail or are there any other reasons I've missed?

YouGov did a survey in the UK recently asking people if they thought life in particular decades was better or worse than now. 35% thought life in the 2000s was better than now. Only 19% think it’s better now. The 90s are currently the most fondly-remembered decade with 41% swaying life was better then but most of that is driven by the big presence of 90s nostalgia that will inevitably wane, but even then a majority of people still think life now is either better or the same.

They also broke it down by age and unsurprisingly, the decades people remember most fondly are the ones they were young in - always. People in their 50s said the 1980s were the best. People over 60 think the 1960s were the best. People in their 30s and 40s think the 90s were best and people aged 18-29 said the same for the 2000s, although 50% of 30-39 year olds still think life in the 2000s was better than now (the highest of any age group).

I think it’s a big stretch to say the 2000s are almost universally loathed. I just don’t think people have much to say about the decade currently because it only ended 10 years ago. It’s still too recent for most people and people who were teens or young adults then are only just getting to the stage of being nostalgic for that time. Also the fact that it’s still quite recent means we will tend to focus more on what was bad rather than the opposite, but thst will certainly change as more time passes.

Also, the 1980s might have been a rather dark decade (AIDS, Thatcher/Reagan, nuclear war threat etc) but people still loved them, and 80s nostalgia was arguably still huge at the start of the 2010s before 90s nostalgia took over. I mean, people over 60 think the 60s were an amazing decade but in the UK we were still suffering hugely from the aftermath of WW2. Nostalgia is a wonderful thing.

YouGov did a survey in the UK recently asking people if they thought life in particular decades was better or worse than now. 35% thought life in the 2000s was better than now. Only 19% think it’s better now. The 90s are currently the most fondly-remembered decade with 41% swaying life was better then but most of that is driven by the big presence of 90s nostalgia that will inevitably wane, but even then a majority of people still think life now is either better or the same.

They also broke it down by age and unsurprisingly, the decades people remember most fondly are the ones they were young in - always. People in their 50s said the 1980s were the best. People over 60 think the 1960s were the best. People in their 30s and 40s think the 90s were best and people aged 18-29 said the same for the 2000s, although 50% of 30-39 year olds still think life in the 2000s was better than now (the highest of any age group).

I think it’s a big stretch to say the 2000s are almost universally loathed. I just don’t think people have much to say about the decade currently because it only ended 10 years ago. It’s still too recent for most people and people who were teens or young adults then are only just getting to the stage of being nostalgic for that time.



Interesting, but I would find it hard to believe that someone who is black or gay, or even just a woman back in the 2000s would find their childhood in the 80s or 90s to be better - this would only be unless they were really conservative and this would only be regarding politics too.


I believe the 2000s were better even though it had more conservative social politics. It's been 9 years into this decade, and I don't really hear people professing themselves as proud 2000s kids. Compare this with the late 2000s, when the "90s kid" memes started popping up. Granted, I don't know about other decades, but consistently throughout the last century, the previous decade's culture was still favoured for some time. In this case, they had to go with euphemisms or misnomers for the 2000s - I think there's a particular stigma to enjoying the 2000s, especially for Americans in the case of 9/11. It killed 3000 civilians on American soil, many of the victims being American citizens.

Interesting, but I would find it hard to believe that someone who is black or gay, or even just a woman back in the 2000s would find their childhood in the 80s or 90s to be better - this would only be unless they were really conservative and this would only be regarding politics too.


I believe the 2000s were better even though it had more conservative social politics. It's been 9 years into this decade, and I don't really hear people professing themselves as proud 2000s kids. Compare this with the late 2000s, when the "90s kid" memes started popping up. Granted, I don't know about other decades, but consistently throughout the last century, the previous decade's culture was still favoured for some time. In this case, they had to go with euphemisms or misnomers for the 2000s - I think there's a particular stigma to enjoying the 2000s, especially for Americans in the case of 9/11. It killed 3000 civilians on American soil, many of the victims being American citizens.


Nostalgia seems to move in 20 year cycles - when a decade hits 20, nostalgia for that decade becomes more prevalent. 70s nostalgia was big in the 90s, 80s in the 00s and 90s in the 10s. As other people have mentioned, 00s nostalgia is picking up steam already but 90s nostalgia is still dominant currently. That will change as we move into the 2020s.

As for the 90s kid stuff - I think one thing you need to keep in mind is that many of us 00s kids overdosed on nostalgia in the early 2010s when 90s kids memes kicked off. We often claimed 2000-2004 was just an extended 90s, and the early 00s often got caught up in 90s kid nostalgia because countless cartoons spanned both decades. For this reason I think most of us are kind of over it. Been there, done that.

The 2000s were clearly better for gay people, attitudes changed significantly. I don’t remember racism ever being an issue, and you certainly didn’t have the right-wing populism of today.

Nostalgia seems to move in 20 year cycles - when a decade hits 20, nostalgia for that decade becomes more prevalent. 70s nostalgia was big in the 90s, 80s in the 00s and 90s in the 10s. As other people have mentioned, 00s nostalgia is picking up steam already but 90s nostalgia is still dominant currently. That will change as we move into the 2020s.

As for the 90s kid stuff - I think one thing you need to keep in mind is that many of us 00s kids overdosed on nostalgia in the early 2010s when 90s kids memes kicked off. We often claimed 2000-2004 was just an extended 90s, and tbh the early 00s often got fought up in 90s kid nostalgia because countless cartoons spanned both decades. For this reason I think most of us are kind of over it. Been there, done that.

Although 2000s nostalgia is kicking off, I see many people today just only wanting to acknowledge the early 2000s - I feel like there's a continued stigma for the events that took place in the 2000s since 9/11 happened. I'm not sure if this were the case, but nostalgia for other decades seems to take the whole individual decades more into account. If I were to witness 2000s nostalgia, I'd have people be enthusiastic for rock music (the last time it was still considered hot), but the sort of rock music with electric guitars that the 2000s had is just fading more and more.

Although 2000s nostalgia is kicking off, I see many people today just only wanting to acknowledge the early 2000s - I feel like there's a continued stigma for the events that took place in the 2000s since 9/11 happened. I'm not sure if this were the case, but nostalgia for other decades seems to take the whole individual decades more into account. If I were to witness 2000s nostalgia, I'd have people be enthusiastic for rock music (the last time it was still considered hot), but the sort of rock music with electric guitars that the 2000s had is just fading more and more.


I think that’s because the early 00s are the oldest part, so they seem most different to today. The late 00s by contrast still feel quite recent.

I think that’s because the early 00s are the oldest part, so they seem most different to today. The late 00s by contrast still feel quite recent.

As someone who is 21 years old (someone who should be used to longer time periods), I feel like that the distance between the late 2000s and now is too far. The hairstyles that are seen as attractive on guys, the music and even the technology seem like worlds apart.

It's because of wars, high oil prices, dumb politicians, terrorism, reality TV, homophobia, Recession, crunk rap, emo and pop punk. Of course the 2010s is worse on many of these fronts but how were we to know that in the 2000s? :P

It's not really that disliked anymore, at best it's "ew 00s fashion" or "the 2000s were a weird time" I keep hearing nowadays.

There was a pretty hefty backlash against the 2000s around 2012 to 2016, but that literally happened to previous decades as well. And since 2017 it has cooled down quite significatly anyway.

What I remember of it and don't care for was how you were absolutely discouraged from being an individual and liking what you liked. If you didn't go with the herd for whatever was popular people let you know how uncool they thought you were. Urban and preppy style were the only "acceptable" things and if you were emo, goth, or alternative of any kind you were a freak according to some.

It was also the era that birthed vapid reality shows that are commonplace now, and when celebrity obsession really ramped up.

It's because of wars, high oil prices, dumb politicians, terrorism, reality TV, homophobia, Recession, crunk rap, emo and pop punk. Of course the 2010s is worse on many of these fronts but how were we to know that in the 2000s? :P


I'm sorry, but I take some offense to your dislike of emo and pop punk in that comment. I don't like the music of this decade, which tries to sound grown-up, artistic, unique and not manufactured, but it all sounds bland or disgusting to me. The messages to songs like Shake It Off and 7 Years by Lukas Graham are good, but they have bad execution, with melodies that sounds like what Dr. Frankenstein could put together. I'd take the slightly or majorly depressing sound of pop-punk otherwise.


As for emo, this to me has been (and probably still remains to me) the only gender non-conforming way people can express themselves. Sure, I've seen more cross-dressing in drag, but drag isn't particularly my taste. What appeals to me about emo is how cool it looks in addition to the relative gender non-conformity it has. People hated emo in part because they couldn't tell if the guys were girls or not (generally as sexist and/or homophobic jibes). People also hated emo too because they believed such individuals were possessed by Satan, a middle finger gesture to religious fundamentalists. Heck, even the Daily Mail called them a cult, the Russian government tried to ban emos, and emos in Iraq were killed too in the early 2010s for no other reason than just refusing to ditch the style in time.



What I remember of it and don't care for was how you were absolutely discouraged from being an individual and liking what you liked. If you didn't go with the herd for whatever was popular people let you know how uncool they thought you were. Urban and preppy style were the only "acceptable" things and if you were emo, goth, or alternative of any kind you were a freak according to some.





I see emo fashion styles a lot less this decade than in the past. I see this as a sign that gender conformity (with "hipster" fashion being seen as cool, where guys wear short hair again) and religious fundamentalism have won despite the events of 2010-2015 and youths' reduced church attendance (including mine).

It's because of wars, high oil prices, dumb politicians, terrorism, reality TV, homophobia, Recession, crunk rap, emo and pop punk. Of course the 2010s is worse on many of these fronts but how were we to know that in the 2000s? :P


Disliking the 2000s due to war is still pretty silly imo - Iraq and Afghanistan had no impact at all on life in the West. It was the people of Baghdad being bombed to bits, not London or New York. The Cold War was far more impacting.

As for terrorism, well.. on this matter, perception is very much out of step with reality.

https://s-i.huffpost.com/gen/3720174/thumbs/o-TERRORISM-570.jpg?7

I'm sorry, but I take some offense to your dislike of emo and pop punk in that comment. I don't like the music of this decade, which tries to sound grown-up, artistic, unique and not manufactured, but it all sounds bland or disgusting to me. The messages to songs like Shake It Off and 7 Years by Lukas Graham are good, but they have bad execution, with melodies that sounds like what Dr. Frankenstein could put together. I'd take the slightly or majorly depressing sound of pop-punk otherwise.


As for emo, this to me has been (and probably still remains to me) the only gender non-conforming way people can express themselves. Sure, I've seen more cross-dressing in drag, but drag isn't particularly my taste. What appeals to me about emo is how cool it looks in addition to the relative gender non-conformity it has. People hated emo in part because they couldn't tell if the guys were girls or not (generally as sexist and/or homophobic jibes). People also hated emo too because they believed such individuals were possessed by Satan, a middle finger gesture to religious fundamentalists. Heck, even the Daily Mail called them a cult, the Russian government tried to ban emos, and emos in Iraq were killed too in the early 2010s for no other reason than just refusing to ditch the style in time.



I see emo fashion styles a lot less this decade than in the past. I see this as a sign that gender conformity (with "hipster" fashion being seen as cool, where guys wear short hair again) and religious fundamentalism have won despite the events of 2010-2015 and youths' reduced church attendance (including mine).


I was talking about why people hated it at the time. There was no 7 Years or Shake it Off to compare to then (the latter by the way poops over most 2000s pop songs :P).

Most people hated on emo for the attention-seeking and fake depression (cutting one's self, dressing in dark clothing) aspects, and the fact that it was against the mainstream. There might have been people who hated it for being feminine but that wasn't my takeaway.

I'm sorry, but I take some offense to your dislike of emo and pop punk in that comment. I don't like the music of this decade, which tries to sound grown-up, artistic, unique and not manufactured, but it all sounds bland or disgusting to me. The messages to songs like Shake It Off and 7 Years by Lukas Graham are good, but they have bad execution, with melodies that sounds like what Dr. Frankenstein could put together. I'd take the slightly or majorly depressing sound of pop-punk otherwise.


As for emo, this to me has been (and probably still remains to me) the only gender non-conforming way people can express themselves. Sure, I've seen more cross-dressing in drag, but drag isn't particularly my taste. What appeals to me about emo is how cool it looks in addition to the relative gender non-conformity it has. People hated emo in part because they couldn't tell if the guys were girls or not (generally as sexist and/or homophobic jibes). People also hated emo too because they believed such individuals were possessed by Satan, a middle finger gesture to religious fundamentalists. Heck, even the Daily Mail called them a cult, the Russian government tried to ban emos, and emos in Iraq were killed too in the early 2010s for no other reason than just refusing to ditch the style in time.



I see emo fashion styles a lot less this decade than in the past. I see this as a sign that gender conformity (with "hipster" fashion being seen as cool, where guys wear short hair again) and religious fundamentalism have won despite the events of 2010-2015 and youths' reduced church attendance (including mine).

What you're seeing might be the "nu goth" style. I see it on Twitter often. I don't see this decade as the era of gender conformity at all. Quite the opposite. Men may have shorter hair, but they wear junk crushing skinny jeans outfits that some might say look vaguely effeminate. Girls and young women still shave their heads and wear super short hair, so that's not exactly gender conforming either.

Disliking the 2000s due to war is still pretty silly imo - Iraq and Afghanistan had no impact at all on life in the West. It was the people of Baghdad being bombed to bits, not London or New York. The Cold War was far more impacting.

As for terrorism, well.. on this matter, perception is very much out of step with reality.

https://s-i.huffpost.com/gen/3720174/thumbs/o-TERRORISM-570.jpg?7


Not really. Soldiers would come back dead from the war all the time, and many songs, music videos, TV shows, movies, video games, a back then revolved around the war. To say the war had no impact on the perceptions of the decade completely misses the mark. Don't you remember "freedom fries" from 2003?

Also that chart doesn't include the United States–the bar would go off the scale in 2001 and render the other bars as mere blips.

Disliking the 2000s due to war is still pretty silly imo - Iraq and Afghanistan had no impact at all on life in the West. It was the people of Baghdad being bombed to bits, not London or New York. The Cold War was far more impacting.

As for terrorism, well..

https://s-i.huffpost.com/gen/3720174/thumbs/o-TERRORISM-570.jpg?7

I think 9/11 was particularly disastrous because of the number of people that got killed and the fact that evading death was practically impossible. I think that's why there's a particular stigma to the 2000s. Sure, there have been also other terrorist attacks since then, but many seem far more avoidable.


I think people objected to the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan because it was a violent demonstration of American imperialism. America continues to commit war crimes to this day, but I think the 2000s was probably the first time since maybe after Vietnam that this was a big deal. The Red Scare was still a thing for much of the second half of the 20th century until the Berlin Wall fell, so I think people may have accepted the Vietnam War as a way of curtailing Soviet influence.

I was talking about why people hated it at the time. There was no 7 Years or Shake it Off to compare to then (the latter by the way poops over most 2000s pop songs :P ).

Most people hated on emo for the attention-seeking and fake depression (cutting one's self, dressing in dark clothing) aspects, and the fact that it was against the mainstream. There might have been people who hated it for being feminine but that wasn't my takeaway.

I just hate the sound of 2010s music - even with music like that of Adele and Sam Smith, it simply sounds like a bunch of notes were put together deliberately to not sound catchy, out of resentment for 2000s music, especially when pop-punk dominated.


Now why would you prefer 2010s music to 2000s music? Is there anything that makes 2010s music better, musically?

What you're seeing might be the "nu goth" style. I see it on Twitter often. I don't see this decade as the era of gender conformity at all. Quite the opposite. Men may have shorter hair, but they wear junk crushing skinny jeans outfits that some might say look vaguely effeminate. Girls and young women still shave their heads and wear super short hair, so that's not exactly gender conforming either.

In the early 2010s, I saw guys wore their hair quite long to the point they could be mistaken as girls (it looked rather great too) - girls still had their hair in a somewhat "scene" style (e.g. Christina Grimmie's early music videos).
I just hate the side shaves that are fashionable this decade, worn on either sex. It's edgy, but considering where we are socially, I don't think it's there to really make a point. Sure, it may challenge beauty standards, but I personally hate it and prefer a far more feminine and/or androgynous aesthetic that the 2000s and early 2010s had.


Side note: I'd love to keep wearing jeans, but I keep making holes in them, so I'm putting them off for a while. :\'(  I've even talked about considering wearing skirts, but I think that the 2010s hasn't gone far enough in affirming gender non-conformity. I've seen a photo online of a top that said a guy is "not a man" if he doesn't have a beard - such a saying would be unnecessary or regarded offensive worldwide (the photo was maybe from Indonesia) if the 2010s were the most gender non-conforming decade yet.

Not really. Soldiers would come back dead from the war all the time, and many songs, music videos, TV shows, movies, video games, a back then revolved around the war. To say the war had no impact on the perceptions of the decade completely misses the mark.

Also that chart doesn't include the United States–the bar would go off the scale in 2001 and render the other bars as mere blips.


I didn’t say that though. It definitely did have an impact on how people perceive the decade, otherwise we wouldn’t be having this discussion. The point I’m trying to make is that in any meaningful aspect neither war had an impact - that is to say, while we were dropping bombs on houses in the Middle East, we still got to enjoy a very privileged Western existence. Both had an impact on popular culture but unless you had relatives serving at the time you could have very easily lived your life as if neither war was taking place.

And no, it doesn’t include the US. It’s not supposed to. That’s why it says Western Europe. How the 2000s are perceived shouldn’t be solely down to what happens in the US. Until 2008, the 2000s in the UK were a safe, economically prosperous decade where terrorism fell to its lowest level for over 40 years and crime was falling consistently from a 1995 peak. That is how it should be remembered - a decade where our life objectively improved.

The 2000s were clearly better for gay people, attitudes changed significantly. I don’t remember racism ever being an issue, and you certainly didn’t have the right-wing populism of today.

Using "gay" as an insult this decade would be seen as a faux-pas or worse. I've seen it being used in mainstream TV in a what is regarded at least today as a leftist source. This was in an episode of Doctor Who that first came out in 2005 when one of the Doctor's companions called him "gay".


I'm not sure about racism, but I've heard comments online about South Park "raising" kids (I've seen a video of an unrelated show on YouTube, Winx Club, edited to have South Park audio on it too as a meme or YouTube poop), which could possibly explain the influence of figures like Trump.

Using "gay" as an insult this decade would be seen as a faux-pas or worse. I've seen it being used in mainstream TV in a what is regarded at least today as a leftist source. This was in an episode of Doctor Who that first came out in 2005 when one of the Doctor's companions called him "gay".


I'm not sure about racism, but I've heard comments online about South Park "raising" kids (I've seen a video of an unrelated show on YouTube, Winx Club, edited to have South Park audio on it too as a meme or YouTube poop), which could possibly explain the influence of figures like Trump.


Being gay was better in the 2000s than the 90s but worse than the 2010s is what I meant, should have clarified. I don’t hear homophobic language at all anymore but did somewhat often 10 years ago. But in general, the past 20 years has been a constant improvement. The 1980s were pretty terrible by all accounts, and that’s when you had neo-Nazi/skinhead gangs attacking gay people and ethnic minorities.

I feel like overt racism is more common now than in the 2000s. This doesn’t mean people are necessarily more racist but people feel more confident to express those opinions, thanks to the far-right surge.

Anyway, regardless of all this, I will always be here defending the 2000s against its detractors. I am so sick of hearing about the 90s.

Being gay was better in the 2000s than the 90s but worse than the 2010s is what I meant, should have clarified. I don’t hear homophobic language at all anymore but did somewhat often 10 years ago. But in general, the past 20 years has been a constant improvement. The 1980s were pretty terrible by all accounts, and that’s when you had neo-Nazi/skinhead gangs attacking gay people and ethnic minorities.

Absolutely, and thanks for the insight. Even though I see far fewer racist incidents, as someone who isn't white, it is something I should be concerned about still, especially with their resurgence at this part of the decade.


What I hate is how even though this decade is more LGBT+ tolerant (I like it for the increased LGBT+ tolerance, as someone who gets sad about gender), it looks more like the 1950s or 1960s just because guys are wearing their hair short again.


Bear in mind too that until recently, even as I moved into the UK in 2004, the only guys I've really seen with long hair were either white or black. This to me showed that it was a sign of gender non-conformity, even if those guys considered themselves men.

I didn’t say that though. It definitely did have an impact on how people perceive the decade, otherwise we wouldn’t be having this discussion. The point I’m trying to make is that in any meaningful aspect neither war had an impact - that is to say, while we were dropping bombs on houses in the Middle East, we still got to enjoy a very privileged Western existence. Both had an impact on popular culture but unless you had relatives serving at the time you could have very easily lived your life as if neither war was taking place.

And no, it doesn’t include the US. It’s not supposed to. That’s why it says Western Europe. How the 2000s are perceived shouldn’t be solely down to what happens in the US. Until 2008, the 2000s in the UK were a safe, economically prosperous decade where terrorism fell to its lowest level for over 40 years and crime was falling consistently from a 1995 peak. That is how it should be remembered - a decade where our life objectively improved.

I know I am talking about the US, but I would argue that people consider this a bad decade due to the widespread use of technology and the various privacy-violating laws and initiatives introduced, particularly the Patriot Act.

I think 9/11 was particularly disastrous because of the number of people that got killed and the fact that evading death was practically impossible. I think that's why there's a particular stigma to the 2000s. Sure, there have been also other terrorist attacks since then, but many seem far more avoidable.


I think people objected to the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan because it was a violent demonstration of American imperialism. America continues to commit war crimes to this day, but I think the 2000s was probably the first time since maybe after Vietnam that this was a big deal. The Red Scare was still a thing for much of the second half of the 20th century until the Berlin Wall fell, so I think people may have accepted the Vietnam War as a way of curtailing Soviet influence.I just hate the sound of 2010s music - even with music like that of Adele and Sam Smith, it simply sounds like a bunch of notes were put together deliberately to not sound catchy, out of resentment for 2000s music, especially when pop-punk dominated.


Now why would you prefer 2010s music to 2000s music? Is there anything that makes 2010s music better, musically?In the early 2010s, I saw guys wore their hair quite long to the point they could be mistaken as girls (it looked rather great too) - girls still had their hair in a somewhat "scene" style (e.g. Christina Grimmie's early music videos).
I just hate the side shaves that are fashionable this decade, worn on either sex. It's edgy, but considering where we are socially, I don't think it's there to really make a point. Sure, it may challenge beauty standards, but I personally hate it and prefer a far more feminine and/or androgynous aesthetic that the 2000s and early 2010s had.


Side note: I'd love to keep wearing jeans, but I keep making holes in them, so I'm putting them off for a while. :\'(  I've even talked about considering wearing skirts, but I think that the 2010s hasn't gone far enough in affirming gender non-conformity. I've seen a photo online of a top that said a guy is "not a man" if he doesn't have a beard - such a saying would be unnecessary or regarded offensive worldwide (the photo was maybe from Indonesia) if the 2010s were the most gender non-conforming decade yet.

Holes are the style though! I can't find a good pair of shorts without tons of holes to my dismay.  >:( Gender nonconformity is still considered taboo, but a little less so than the past. I've seen more cross dressed men in makeup in public this decade than ever. Not that I've seen very many. Long beards for some reason are still also in, accompanied for a time by man buns and tight jeans. Man buns having fallen out of favor more now.

I didn’t say that though. It definitely did have an impact on how people perceive the decade, otherwise we wouldn’t be having this discussion. The point I’m trying to make is that in any meaningful aspect neither war had an impact - that is to say, while we were dropping bombs on houses in the Middle East, we still got to enjoy a very privileged Western existence. Both had an impact on popular culture but unless you had relatives serving at the time you could have very easily lived your life as if neither war was taking place.

And no, it doesn’t include the US. It’s not supposed to. That’s why it says Western Europe. How the 2000s are perceived shouldn’t be solely down to what happens in the US. Until 2008, the 2000s in the UK were a safe, economically prosperous decade where terrorism fell to its lowest level for over 40 years and crime was falling consistently from a 1995 peak. That is how it should be remembered - a decade where our life objectively improved.


Then we are discussing two different things; I was responding directly to the question posed in the thread title.

To say 9/11 (and the Al-Qaeda terrorist attacks in Europe) had no impact on how the 2000s are perceived in the UK or Western Europe (and vice versa for the US) would be so very wrong. The decision to go into Iraq wasn't an instant decision, it was a process drawn over years and had huge ramifications and set the tone for Europe-US relations for the rest of the decade. Also I would sooner say those separatist attacks in the UK and Spain have no international (or even continental – which makes the "Western Europe" grouping baffling) relevance than I would say for the Islamist ones.

Holes are the style though! I can't find a good pair of shorts without tons of holes to my dismay.  >:( Gender nonconformity is still considered taboo, but a little less so than the past. I've seen more cross dressed men in makeup in public this decade than ever. Not that I've seen very many. Long beards for some reason are still also in, accompanied for a time by man buns and tight jeans. Man buns having fallen out of favor more now.

The holes are in the wrong place(s), and I would have preferred the man bun to have stuck around, since this was one of the few signs of gender non-conformity I could see. I so far have seen very few (straight and cisgender) guys, like dye their hair and wear it long like how girls would. Thankfully, I have one classmate who does that.


I just hate how the fashion this decade still tries to accentuate rather than minimize gender differences. Arguably, especially in the early stages of emo, the fashion still looked rather gender specific, but it was mocked enough by even "native" and less homophobic (compared to the East) Western culture for it trying to blur the gender lines.


I also like the dark aesthetic I guess too, because I kind of think that trying to be positive all the time is a form of selling oneself out.

Then we are discussing two different things; I was responding directly to the question posed in the thread title.

To say 9/11 (and the Al-Qaeda terrorist attacks in Europe) had no impact on how the 2000s are perceived in the UK or Western Europe (and vice versa for the US) would be so very wrong. The decision to go into Iraq wasn't an instant decision, it was a process drawn over years and had huge ramifications and set the tone for Europe-US relations for the rest of the decade. Also I would sooner say those separatist attacks in the UK and Spain have no international (or even continental) relevance than I would say for the Islamist ones.


I didn’t say it had no impact at all - 9/11 was obviously a significant event that was very much a big deal in Europe. The point I’m making is that 9/11 shouldn’t entirely overshadow what was an otherwise good decade in Europe where life objectively improved. As I said, there is often a mismatch between perception and reality.

Those separatist attacks had virtually zero international significance but they had a big impact on life here. Terrorism was simply part of life for British people in the late 20th century. Our PM was very nearly murdered in a bombing in the 1980s. You couldn’t imagine that happening now. My point here isn’t that these attacks had a big impact internationally but that they very much put people on edge in the UK, and that calling the 2000s a decade of terrorism simply doesn’t reflect what happened everywhere. I think it’s fair to say that the IRA’s relentless bombing campaign had a bigger impact on life here than 9/11 did.

Now why would you prefer 2010s music to 2000s music? Is there anything that makes 2010s music better, musically?


I prefer electropop, EDM and indie rock over ringtone rap. If you want to talk about 'no melody', look no further than ringtone (snap) rap ;D

UROLAsyc_KU

Pop punk sounded good when I was a kid but by the time I was older I was completely over it. I was over the whole manufactured "rebellious" aspect of pop punk/emo; at that point being respectful of your elders/teachers felt more rebellious and individualistic than actually being rebellious. ;D

I got more into Japanese rock and Scandinavian metal around then (the late 2000s)–obviously none of that was topping the charts here. :P

I prefer electropop, EDM and indie rock over ringtone rap. If you want to talk about 'no melody', look no further than ringtone (snap) rap ;D

UROLAsyc_KU

Pop punk sounded good when I was a kid but by the time I was older I was completely over it. I was over the whole manufactured "rebellious" aspect of pop punk/emo; at that point being respectful of your elders/teachers felt more rebellious and individualistic than actually being rebellious. ;D

I got more into Japanese rock and Scandinavian metal around then (the late 2000s)–obviously none of that was topping the charts here. :P

I would argue too that songs like American Boy by Estelle sounded bland to me back in the 2000s, but generally, I would now prefer the sound of 2000s pop over 2010s pop. Examples:
2000s:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=agrXgrAgQ0U
2010s:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xn676-fLq7I

I hate the latter because of the choice of melody used. I've heard of a song written in the same key that I think sounds far better.
at that point being respectful of your elders/teachers felt more rebellious and individualistic than actually being rebellious. ;D
Unfortunately, this only affirms Ben Shapiro's (or someone else's quote) of conservatism repressive norms being the new punk. Consider too I come from a culture where family is highly regarded even to this day, and obedience to elders is still largely encouraged (sometimes sternly enforced), whatever they're saying is bull to me, especially if they're trying to make this statement true for the whole world. They could just be talking about the west, but this has been a norm for so long and should not be considered "punk", whose tenets involve overthrowing norms for the betterment of society.

This person thinks we are supposedly too nostalgic for the 2000s.  ;D

https://i-d.vice.com/en_uk/article/xwnynw/why-are-we-so-nostalgic-about-the-problematic-noughties

I think one of the main points here is that for people my age, the 2000s are the first decade we can actually be nostalgic about. 90s nostalgia is getting tiring for me mostly because I was too young to remember them and I’m ready for it to be over (and certain people glorify the 90s to such an extent that it makes me want to hate them).

This person thinks we are supposedly too nostalgic for the 2000s.  ;D

https://i-d.vice.com/en_uk/article/xwnynw/why-are-we-so-nostalgic-about-the-problematic-noughties

I think one of the main points here is that for people my age, the 2000s are the first decade we can actually be nostalgic about. 90s nostalgia is getting tiring for me mostly because I was too young to remember them and I’m ready for it to be over (and certain people glorify the 90s to such an extent that it makes me want to hate them).

Yeah, I never really paid attention to celebrity crap then. I don't like any other decade besides the 2000s simply because I only know the 2000s and I generally regard the 2000s (and to a limited extent, the 70s and 80s) as decades that both tried to subvert norms regarding religion and gender with its music and fashion.


On Tumblr,  I have seen people acknowledge these things are problematic too. I might be following the wrong blogs, but I don't see anyone being too nostalgic for the 2000s either. If I did, then I'd see more posts about the post-9/11 2000s from dedicated blogs even if any 2000s posts I see are not political at all.

Yeah, I never really paid attention to celebrity crap then. I don't like any other decade besides the 2000s simply because I only know the 2000s and I generally regard the 2000s (and to a limited extent, the 70s and 80s) as decades that both tried to subvert norms regarding religion and gender with its music and fashion.


On Tumblr,  I have seen people acknowledge these things are problematic too. I might be following the wrong blogs, but I don't see anyone being too nostalgic for the 2000s either. If I did, then I'd see more posts about the post-9/11 2000s from dedicated blogs even if any 2000s posts I see are not political at all.


Like I said, nostalgia for the rest of the decade will increase as we move further away from it. People used to hate on the early 2000s too.

I’d also keep in mind that by early 2000s a lot of people just mean before 2005. It seems to be a common fallacy to think 2004 is early 2000s. The Razr came out in 2004 yet is always lumped with early 2000s trends.

I would argue too that songs like American Boy by Estelle sounded bland to me back in the 2000s, but generally, I would now prefer the sound of 2000s pop over 2010s pop. Examples:
2000s:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=agrXgrAgQ0U
2010s:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xn676-fLq7I

I hate the latter because of the choice of melody used. I've heard of a song written in the same key that I think sounds far better.Unfortunately, this only affirms Ben Shapiro's (or someone else's quote) of conservatism repressive norms being the new punk. Consider too I come from a culture where family is highly regarded even to this day, and obedience to elders is still largely encouraged (sometimes sternly enforced), whatever they're saying is bull to me, especially if they're trying to make this statement true for the whole world. They could just be talking about the west, but this has been a norm for so long and should not be considered "punk", whose tenets involve overthrowing norms for the betterment of society.


That song is good but Fergie released a lot of terrible songs in the 2000s (Fergalicious, London Bridge...) so I have no fond memories of her.

That's my first time hearing that Kelly Clarkson song. I like to think Heartbeat Song is more exemplary of her 2010s work.

I come from a conservative family/culture too, but I like to think my liberalism is based more on reason and humanist principles rather than simply trying to be different from everyone else, which is fallacious. I have no respect for the reactionary far-right for that reason: completely irrational and illogical (and that's no me trying to claim a monopoly on logic).

I generally regard the 2000s (and to a limited extent, the 70s and 80s) as decades that both tried to subvert norms regarding religion and gender with its music and fashion.


Don't forget the 60s. That's when it REALLY started and was truly at it's most subversive. Remember, the original catcall against hippies was "is it a boy or is it a girl" , which was meant to be an insult of the highest magnitude. And spiritually there was quite a rejection of things traditionally Judaeo-Christian in the search for a higher cosmic consciousness greatly influenced by the religions of the East. And the music...oh, the music....MAGNIFICENT. Every barrier was broken down. The 70s continued this to a great extent. The 80s were shallow and all surface. The meaning and that great search for cosmic consciousness had been drained out of it in favor of a more camp and material approach.

That song is good but Fergie released a lot of terrible songs in the 2000s (Fergalicious, London Bridge...) so I have no fond memories of her.
Interesting, but I don't tend to follow individual artists in particular, hence why I make complaints about 2010s music - I see similar traits I hate from other artists with their music too. I'll make sure to avoid those songs then too, but I don't judge the music of one decade by the artists, more by the sound that prevailed. That said, it's why I can say I prefer artists like Eminem and Beyonce in their old days even though I've barely listened to their new stuff. I hear Rap God doesn't really sound so great, as with Single Ladies which I have heard of (came out 2009 though).

I come from a conservative family/culture too, but I like to think my liberalism is based more on reason and humanist principles rather than simply trying to be different from everyone else, which is fallacious. I have no respect for the reactionary far-right for that reason: completely irrational and illogical (and that's no me trying to claim a monopoly on logic).

I will admit that my strain of liberalism is based on progressivism, one that values freedom for people to be who they are regarding particularly gender and sexuality, and with the stuff they do in private and consensually with any adults involved. I do think, or at least can see that a repressive status quo has been maintained over centuries, and that people can't or won't shake it off easily.


I believe religion, especially the two most popular and influential ones in the world, serves a role (not the sole actors, I've seen an atheist and even the Chinese Communist Party support policing gender online too) in maintaining repressive norms especially regarding gender, sexuality and a few unrelated things (like the music you can listen to). While they can and do teach some good things, I believe it's not really enough for me to change my opinion and heart on them.

Don't forget the 60s. That's when it REALLY started and was truly at it's most subversive. Remember, the original catcall against hippies was "is it a boy or is it a girl" , which was meant to be an insult of the highest magnitude. And spiritually there was quite a rejection of things traditionally Judaeo-Christian in the search for a higher cosmic consciousness greatly influenced by the religions of the East. And the music...oh, the music....MAGNIFICENT. Every barrier was broken down. The 70s continued this to a great extent. The 80s were shallow and all surface. The meaning and that great search for cosmic consciousness had been drained out of it in favor of a more camp and material approach.

I feel like that the subversiveness of the 60s took place either in its second half or late in the decade. I do admit though that the Beatles doesn't really interest me, but I saw a documentary where one boy didn't like their (the Beatles') haircut, and that's possibly the only reason I would ever have solidarity with that band. And yes, I dislike the 80s for the resurgence of conservative politics and for it sparking the neoliberal hell we still live through today. I do like that rock music and androgyny were still a thing though then, and I liked the geometric designs of everything (like the polygonal-shaped cars and consumer electronics they had).

There was heart in the 2000s, especially I think in the earlier 2000s. Here's an example, a very popular song from 2003, Black Eyed Peas "Where Is The Love?"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WpYeekQkAdc

It's an uplifting song written against the background of the War on Terror and hyper-materialism and meanspirited media of that time (none of which has changed since then). I think the 2000s were generally toned down compared to the 90s, though the 90s had a lot of sheeshtiness (disrespectfulness for the sake of disrespectfulness, a hardening of people's attitudes toward those who are struggling, rising incarceration rates etc.) mixed in with good stuff, like the 2000s also had.

I think of the 2000s as a period when dark clouds were gathering over the general sunnier attitude of the post-WWII peace and of the post-Cold War 90s especially, but the rain didn't start until 2008, and now, since the mid-2010s and the outright political hatred and instability on display we're starting to hear the thunder and see the lighting. But there's still good stuff out there.

Are there even any huge hit songs today like "Where Is The Love?" that speak openly against the trends of today, or is mass culture so far gone it can no longer put out such stuff?

Don't forget the 60s. That's when it REALLY started and was truly at it's most subversive. Remember, the original catcall against hippies was "is it a boy or is it a girl" , which was meant to be an insult of the highest magnitude. And spiritually there was quite a rejection of things traditionally Judaeo-Christian in the search for a higher cosmic consciousness greatly influenced by the religions of the East. And the music...oh, the music....MAGNIFICENT. Every barrier was broken down. The 70s continued this to a great extent. The 80s were shallow and all surface. The meaning and that great search for cosmic consciousness had been drained out of it in favor of a more camp and material approach.


We could use a new awakening of consciousness, the Age of Aquarius as it were. We need to let the sun shine in and overcome this darkness.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ILSr9BbhoJQ

This song has perhaps the best outro even, where the climax just building and building as it goes on. The longer it goes the better it gets.

Glory Day!

Interesting, but I don't tend to follow individual artists in particular, hence why I make complaints about 2010s music - I see similar traits I hate from other artists with their music too. I'll make sure to avoid those songs then too, but I don't judge the music of one decade by the artists, more by the sound that prevailed. That said, it's why I can say I prefer artists like Eminem and Beyonce in their old days even though I've barely listened to their new stuff. I hear Rap God doesn't really sound so great, as with Single Ladies which I have heard of (came out 2009 though).I will admit that my strain of liberalism is based on progressivism, one that values freedom for people to be who they are regarding particularly gender and sexuality, and with the stuff they do in private and consensually with any adults involved. I do think, or at least can see that a repressive status quo has been maintained over centuries, and that people can't or won't shake it off easily.


I believe religion, especially the two most popular and influential ones in the world, serves a role (not the sole actors, I've seen an atheist and even the Chinese Communist Party support policing gender online too) in maintaining repressive norms especially regarding gender, sexuality and a few unrelated things (like the music you can listen to). While they can and do teach some good things, I believe it's not really enough for me to change my opinion and heart on them.I feel like that the subversiveness of the 60s took place either in its second half or late in the decade. I do admit though that the Beatles doesn't really interest me, but I saw a documentary where one boy didn't like their (the Beatles') haircut, and that's possibly the only reason I would ever have solidarity with that band. And yes, I dislike the 80s for the resurgence of conservative politics and for it sparking the neoliberal hell we still live through today. I do like that rock music and androgyny were still a thing though then, and I liked the geometric designs of everything (like the polygonal-shaped cars and consumer electronics they had).


Out of curiosity, why is it you feel little for The Beatles? I ask because songs like "Here Comes the Sun," "Let It Be," "In My Life" and many others of theirs I find very moving. They weren't just pop and coolness. There was a lot of brilliance and originality in them.

There was heart in the 2000s, especially I think in the earlier 2000s. Here's an example, a very popular song from 2003, Black Eyed Peas "Where Is The Love?"

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WpYeekQkAdc

It's an uplifting song written against the background of the War on Terror and hyper-materialism and meanspirited media of that time (none of which has changed since then). I think the 2000s were generally toned down compared to the 90s, though the 90s had a lot of sheeshtiness (disrespectfulness for the sake of disrespectfulness, a hardening of people's attitudes toward those who are struggling, rising incarceration rates etc.) mixed in with good stuff, like the 2000s also had.

I think of the 2000s as a period when dark clouds were gathering over the general sunnier attitude of the post-WWII peace and of the post-Cold War 90s especially, but the rain didn't start until 2008, and now, since the mid-2010s and the outright political hatred and instability on display we're starting to hear the thunder and see the lighting. But there's still good stuff out there.

Are there even any huge hit songs today like "Where Is The Love?" that speak openly against the trends of today, or is mass culture so far gone it can no longer put out such stuff?


It’s funny that quite often I hear people wishing it was 2013 or something again simply because the political landscape wasn’t so messed up. The biggest scandal for us then was our Prime Minister supposedly having sex with a pig’s head in the 80s. The economy was still in recovery mode but society was much less divisive, politics much less partisan.

Where Is The Love is an amazing song by the way, in my opinion one of the most iconic hits of the 2000s.

Out of curiosity, why is it you feel little for The Beatles? I ask because songs like "Here Comes the Sun," "Let It Be," "In My Life" and many others of theirs I find very moving. They weren't just pop and coolness. There was a lot of brilliance and originality in them.

Simply not my taste I guess, and I have yet to see the significance of their songs. I know of Imagine by John Lennon, when the band then I believe split up.

It’s funny that quite often I hear people wishing it was 2013 or something again simply because the political landscape wasn’t so messed up. The biggest scandal for us then was our Prime Minister supposedly having sex with a pig’s head in the 80s. The economy was still in recovery mode but society was much less divisive, politics much less partisan.

Where Is The Love is an amazing song by the way, in my opinion one of the most iconic hits of the 2000s.


"Where Is The Love?" is definitely one of the best examples of post-millennial era core 2000s music. Even for a song that old, from 2003, it has almost half a billion views on youtube.

Simply not my taste I guess, and I have yet to see the significance of their songs. I know of Imagine by John Lennon, when the band then I believe split up.


"Imagine" is John Lennon solo in 1971 after The Beatles officially split up in 1970. Have you listened to many of their songs? Their range is pretty wide and output very large, so there's probably some stuff you'd like.

"Imagine" is John Lennon solo in 1971 after The Beatles officially split up in 1970. Have you listened to many of their songs? Their range is pretty wide and output very large, so there's probably some stuff you'd like.

I admit, not really.

It was a frightening time under Bush. But I look fondly back on the pop culture, especially the movies, music, and games of the latter half of the decade.

Edit: I am a big, big fan of the Beatles. If you just tell me what kind of vibes/moods you like, I can find a song you'll like.

Edit 2: Also, I am very much on the earthier, more mature-sounding 2010s music style bandwagon. I like a lot of the pop music from the mid-2010s, from around when Bruno Mars hit his stride and Lorde came onto the scene. I dunno, I'm just into it in a way I wasn't with pop music in the 2000s. My musical tastes in the 2000s were so far out of the scene it wasn't even funny.

Edit 2: Also, I am very much on the earthier, more mature-sounding 2010s music style bandwagon. I like a lot of the pop music from the mid-2010s, from around when Bruno Mars hit his stride and Lorde came onto the scene. I dunno, I'm just into it in a way I wasn't with pop music in the 2000s. My musical tastes in the 2000s were so far out of the scene it wasn't even funny.
I'm not a fan of the sound because I feel like that either the melody is deliberately difficult to get into (like post-modern art, although understandably as a backlash against catchy but derivative sounding music from years before - wasn't this like the decade when indie music labels started thriving?), the musicians have little knowledge of theory or they have a weird taste, possibly affected by the hipster vibe of the 2010s that is rather post-modern and restrained (i.e. praising gender-conforming fashion and less edgy and emotional sounding music). Either way, I'm not a fan of the music. It's like a waste of potential to me - cash-grabbing and having a good melody are not mutually exclusive.


I wonder what sort of stuff you were into back in the 2000s. Some of the songs from the 2000s I like are:


- Monster by Meg and Dia
- Many of the songs in Boys Like Girls' debut album
- Misery Business by Paramore
- Irreplaceable by Beyonce
- Scandalous by Mis-Teeq
- Independent Woman by Destiny's Child
- Big Girls Don't Cry by Fergie
- All The Things She Said by t.A.T.u.


What would you say about such songs?

That song is good but Fergie released a lot of terrible songs in the 2000s (Fergalicious, London Bridge...) so I have no fond memories of her.

"London Bridge"'s beat is siiiiiick and the whole song is borderline avant-garde. Absolute banger if I never knew one, so don't disrespect it >:(

I agree though that "Fergalicious" is Garbagio Maximo. Super lazy sample, and we already had "Bootylicious", we didn't need a second -licious song only 5 years later!

I'm not a fan of the sound because I feel like that either the melody is deliberately difficult to get into (like post-modern art, although understandably as a backlash against catchy but derivative sounding music from years before - wasn't this like the decade when indie music labels started thriving?), the musicians have little knowledge of theory or they have a weird taste, possibly affected by the hipster vibe of the 2010s that is rather post-modern and restrained (i.e. praising gender-conforming fashion and less edgy and emotional sounding music). Either way, I'm not a fan of the music. It's like a waste of potential to me - cash-grabbing and having a good melody are not mutually exclusive.


I wonder what sort of stuff you were into back in the 2000s. Some of the songs from the 2000s I like are:


- Monster by Meg and Dia
- Many of the songs in Boys Like Girls' debut album
- Misery Business by Paramore
- Irreplaceable by Beyonce
- Scandalous by Mis-Teeq
- Independent Woman by Destiny's Child
- Big Girls Don't Cry by Fergie
- All The Things She Said by t.A.T.u.


What would you say about such songs?


I would say I know some of those songs. ;D

But seriously, it is the melding of disparate styles that made 2010s music so great. Tracks like The Mother We Share, Downtown, m.A.A.d. City, Ain't It Fun, Sail...to my estimation, there is no comparison. Sure, not all 2010s music was great (I loathe nearly all of Taylor Swift's catalogue) and there absolutely were gems in the 2000s like Hey There, Delilah and Ohio is for Lovers (although I am personally more partial to the music of the early 2000s - stuff like late Backstreet Boys and early OutKast). But 2010s music has been, to my estimation, the best period in pop music that I have personally lived through.

Also, the 1980s might have been a rather dark decade (AIDS, Thatcher/Reagan, nuclear war threat etc) but people still loved them, and 80s nostalgia was arguably still huge at the start of the 2010s before 90s nostalgia took over. I mean, people over 60 think the 60s were an amazing decade but in the UK we were still suffering hugely from the aftermath of WW2. Nostalgia is a wonderful thing.


80s nostalgia is still pretty big, with Stranger Things and Black Mirror's Sun Junipero that came out a few years ago. I do notice less 80s inspired music now than I did in the late 2000s and early 2010s though. Aside from Paramore and Ellie Goulding there's not much new wavey stuff coming out recently.

80s nostalgia is still pretty big, with Stranger Things and Black Mirror's Sun Junipero that came out a few years ago. I do notice less 80s inspired music now than I did in the late 2000s and early 2010s though. Aside from Paramore and Ellie Goulding there's not much new wavey stuff coming out recently.
O0

Thanks for reminding me, I must start watching "Stranger Things" and "Black Mirror".

Because people often misattribute early 2000s stuff to the 90s and solely the 90s.

You don’t know how many facepalms I did when Buzzfeed made a “90s TV” quiz with lots of commercials from 2000-2004.

I prefer electropop, EDM and indie rock over ringtone rap. If you want to talk about 'no melody', look no further than ringtone (snap) rap ;D

UROLAsyc_KU

Pop punk sounded good when I was a kid but by the time I was older I was completely over it. I was over the whole manufactured "rebellious" aspect of pop punk/emo; at that point being respectful of your elders/teachers felt more rebellious and individualistic than actually being rebellious. ;D

I got more into Japanese rock and Scandinavian metal around then (the late 2000s)–obviously none of that was topping the charts here. :P


http://tinyurl.com/jordanlaff
When inthe00s tries to talk about rap, it kills me.

Never change, inthe00s.

Also guess which song is back to haunt mid-00s haters 8)

BV-WEb2oxLk

http://tinyurl.com/jordanlaff
When inthe00s tries to talk about rap, it kills me.

Never change, inthe00s.


That's the song my cousin demonstrated to me to show that "rap is better than rock", so I didn't go out of my way to pick a bad rap song :P

That's the song my cousin demonstrated to me to show that "rap is better than rock", so I didn't go out of my way to pick a bad rap song :P

Aside from the lack of racial diversity in rock music, I'm not sure how rap can be seen as better. I'd say they're about equal, but rock appeals to me more aesthetically.


What were the arguments given in the 2000s as to why rock was worse than rap? Could homophobia, transphobia and outright sexism play a part in this too that accelerated rock's demise?

Aside from the lack of racial diversity in rock music, I'm not sure how rap can be seen as better. I'd say they're about equal, but rock appeals to me more aesthetically.


What were the arguments given in the 2000s as to why rock was worse than rap? Could homophobia, transphobia and outright sexism play a part in this too that accelerated rock's demise?


There were a lot of wangsters in the 2000s who tried to pretend they were black. Another reason to dislike the 2000s ;D

Every middle schooler circa 1999-2007:

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-K23gISTZ-Lk/TWU0MD53BgI/AAAAAAAAAAo/VnbGXSB2wt0/s250/wannabe.jpghttp://media.urbandictionary.com/image/large/wigger-15345.jpg

I blame Eminem (1999) and subsequently John Cena (2005)

The 2000s were interesting from 2000 to 2004 or 2005. I thought the 2000s were fun until 2009 came along.

The 2000s do not stack up against the 80s and early 90s. There were too many reality shows on in the 2000s. TV started to pale in comparison to the internet in the 2000s.

The 2000s do not stack up against the 80s and early 90s. There were too many reality shows on in the 2000s. TV started to pale in comparison to the internet in the 2000s.

That's funny, because the 2000s are still widely considered the start of a third-wave tv golden age. There's even a whole Wikipedia article about it: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Golden_Age_of_Television_(2000s–present)

That's funny, because the 2000s are still widely considered the start of a third-wave tv golden age. There's even a whole Wikipedia article about it: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Golden_Age_of_Television_(2000s–present)


Yeah, 2005+ TV has been really good.

Also I felt like Internet didn't over take TV as people's main source of information until the very end (maybe 2009 or even 2010). Most people I knew spent waaaay more time on TV than the Internet before social media came along.

Traditional TV subscriptions were still growing year-on-year until 2013. They really started falling off a cliff over the past 3-4 years.

https://cdn-images-1.medium.com/max/1600/0*qivHWLAt3cABjxAS.png

Seems like the switch was very sudden.

https://amp.businessinsider.com/images/5936e72d79474c1c008b7158-750-513.png

That's funny, because the 2000s are still widely considered the start of a third-wave tv golden age. There's even a whole Wikipedia article about it: https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Golden_Age_of_Television_(2000s–present)


The Disney Channel shows and CBS dramas were great, but watching them was nothing like seeing the Saturday morning cartoons, weekday afternoon cartoons, afterschool specials, dance shows, and sitcoms of the 70s, 80s, and 90s.

The Disney Channel shows and CBS dramas were great, but watching them was nothing like seeing the Saturday morning cartoons, weekday afternoon cartoons, afterschool specials, dance shows, and sitcoms of the 70s, 80s, and 90s.
Yeah, the rose-colored tinted glasses are hard to put down huh

Yeah, the rose-colored tinted glasses are hard to put down huh


I prefer wayfarers, blades, and Mumbos.

Theres also a common misconception that 1999 babies are 90s kids and 2000 babies are 2000s kids. When that's wrong, they're both 2000s kids, just that 1999 was born in the 90s.

Another one is that anyone born in the mid-late 2000s is a 2000s kid because they were born in it, and like the above, that's not true.

The early 2000s feel more like a name for the entire 2000s decade than a part of the decade. I've always thought that the actual early 2000s was 2000-2002, the mid 2000s would be 2003-2006, and the late 2000s was 2007-2009. However, everyone seems to think the early 2000s are either 2000-2009 or 2000-2004 when that isn't true.

I can kinda see why they're loathed. By the late 90s, at least in terms of western society, the future seemed to be bright for the new millennium, the economy was good, the social order was relatively sound, and people really thought we were at the "End of history".

But these hopes were quickly dashed and proven to be naive optimism in the 2000s with 9/11, the Recession, etc. and the pains have continued further into the 2010s with the effects of social media, skyrocketing depression, polarized politics, etc.

So I can see why older people hate the 2000s so much, even if I have fond childhood memories of them. People also hated the 70s for similar reasons: optimism dashed, and a crash after the wild party of the 60s, leading to a malaise-ridden hangover.

Theres also a common misconception that 1999 babies are 90s kids and 2000 babies are 2000s kids. When that's wrong, they're both 2000s kids, just that 1999 was born in the 90s.

Yeah. I distinctly remember back in like 2012, when the "90s kid debate" was big, people (mostly smug nostalgia gatekeepers, lol) came to a general agreement that ~1983-1993 was the "true 90s kids".

But now in 2019, enough time has passed that the "True 90s kid" debates faded from memory, and the "90s kid" phrase was interpreted more literally by Zoomers. So now in current memes, those born December 1999 are 90s kids and those born January 2000 are 00s kids, full stop, lol.

I can kinda see why they're loathed. By the late 90s, at least in terms of western society, the future seemed to be bright for the new millennium, the economy was good, the social order was relatively sound, and people really thought we were at the "End of history".

But these hopes were quickly dashed and proven to be naive optimism in the 2000s with 9/11, the Recession, etc. and the pains have continued further into the 2010s with the effects of social media, skyrocketing depression, polarized politics, etc.

So I can see why older people hate the 2000s so much, even if I have fond childhood memories of them. People also hated the 70s for similar reasons: optimism dashed, and a crash after the wild party of the 60s, leading to a malaise-ridden hangover.

I think you've given some good reasons here.

My friends were not impressed with the 2000s while we were living in them because none of these were on the market in January of 2000:

https://jacobsmedia.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/11/jetsons-alamy.jpg

https://www.extremetech.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/03/huvr-hoverboard-back-to-the-future-II-pink.jpg

Traditional TV subscriptions were still growing year-on-year until 2013. They really started falling off a cliff over the past 3-4 years.

https://cdn-images-1.medium.com/max/1600/0*qivHWLAt3cABjxAS.png

Seems like the switch was very sudden.

https://amp.businessinsider.com/images/5936e72d79474c1c008b7158-750-513.png


From the looks of this graph, Pay TV plummeted like a rock in 2017-2018 and I couldn’t imagine what 2019 will look like. Streaming TV became popular in 2015 according to this graph.

There were a lot of wangsters in the 2000s who tried to pretend they were black. Another reason to dislike the 2000s ;D

Every middle schooler circa 1999-2007:

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-K23gISTZ-Lk/TWU0MD53BgI/AAAAAAAAAAo/VnbGXSB2wt0/s250/wannabe.jpghttp://media.urbandictionary.com/image/large/wigger-15345.jpg

I blame Eminem (1999) and subsequently John Cena (2005)

People still try and pretend be to black today (men & women). And it's often times more cringe than back then.

I can kinda see why they're loathed. By the late 90s, at least in terms of western society, the future seemed to be bright for the new millennium, the economy was good, the social order was relatively sound, and people really thought we were at the "End of history".

But these hopes were quickly dashed and proven to be naive optimism in the 2000s with 9/11, the Recession, etc. and the pains have continued further into the 2010s with the effects of social media, skyrocketing depression, polarized politics, etc.

So I can see why older people hate the 2000s so much, even if I have fond childhood memories of them. People also hated the 70s for similar reasons: optimism dashed, and a crash after the wild party of the 60s, leading to a malaise-ridden hangover.


The 1970s have a somewhat poor reputation in the UK - we had incessant terrorism, a poor economy, sky-high inflation, constant strikes, rolling blackouts, rubbish piling up on the streets and a general feeling of chaos and disorder. We came close to defaulting on our debt and going to the IMF for a bailout. Oh and the spectre of nuclear war.

But nevertheless, people who grew up in the 70s love them. Older people in general think the 70s were good even though they were undeniably quite chaotic. I think as the 2000s get further away the bad things about them will get overlooked in a typical ‘rose coloured glasses’ way.

That being said, while the 1970s in the UK were quite tumultuous, I don’t think the 2000s were at all, at least not in respect to prior decades. Life was pretty good for the most part - low crime, no riots, high living standards, falling poverty etc. Indeed I’d say the Tony Blair years (1997-2007) were the best this country ever had.

People still try and pretend be to black today (men & women). And it's often times more cringe than back then.
The white boy gangsta look. It's funny that more white boyd listen to rap today than they did when Enimen was in his prime but act wayy less gangsta. Most white boys that listen to rap are pretty normally dressed white boys.

The 2000s happened directly after the 90s and some people do not like the 90s.

I think the statement above answers this question perfectly.