Quoting:
OK, I may be mistaken about the tree spiking, but does that mean nothing I said is correct?

If you want to dispute the damage done, just go to the ELF website.  It is http://www.earthliberationfront.com

On that site, they proudly claim responsibility for their actions, including the SUV torchings, and the San Diego apartment torching.
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And you believe what you read there?  ::)  Unless there is physical evidence linking them I highly dispute their so-called "claims".  Everytime there is a terrorist event somewhere in this vastly overpopulated planet, several groups step forward to claim responsibility.  Leveller heads need to prevail.

Right now we have a so-called "major infestation" of mountain pine beetles that are wiping out vast tracts of forests.  The cause: increase in temperature related to global warming.  The logging interests have been heavily pressuring the provincial government to suspend the regulations and let them clear cut the diseased trees.  And with the bad forest fire season we had this summer, they've stepped up the campaign.  What's particularly incidious (spelling?) is that they have been quietly working behind the scenes pressuring to relax the rules to allow them to log parks and wildlife preserves.  So much for corporate responsibility, eh.  I have a friend who works in the Ministry of Forests and is very much an anti-environmentalist and he had an interesting report that the mainstream media doesn't report.  We've had 6 major infestations of the mountain pine beetle in the last 100 years.  Our forests survived without our help.  I could name several more documented incidents of logging sneakiness just in and around my own town.. like the place were they buried a acre of logging cables, oil drums, wrecked machinery and other items and covered it over and planted new trees.  An employee blew the whistle on that one.  :)

Anyways, I think I understand the gist of your message.  There is no place in the world for extremists.  And on that point I completely agree with you.  What I took offense to is your generalization to group anyone who cares, or is concerned with the environment, as a dangerous radical.

By the way, did you know that last week they've jailed a 70 year old grandmother in British Columbia because she refuses to sign an agreement to stay off logging roads because she peacefully protested some old growth (what little we have left) logging last year?  Yeah, that's justice for you.

I keep thinking of that song by Mike & The Mechanics "Silent Running"...  ;)

As for me, i've always been a conservationist with just a hint of anarchist  ;D.  I only use what I need, not what I want, and can conform it into a lifestyle that looks "normal" without looking like a stereotypical "granola cruncher".  I've been recycling since the 1970's and have always considered it a normal thing to do.  I've got several thousand dollars in overpriced solar panels on my roof running my power meter backwards.  I figure it will pay back in 18 years or less as I add to the system, but that's not the point.  I've gained a certain amount of autonomy from the rat race and the system will benefit my son as he grows up and will undoubtedly take it over, it will cost him nothing.  My next step is to tackle the car issue.  I use transit as I attend school.  But I just saw a commercial for a Ford vehicle that runs on hydrogen.

Here's one of my favourite sites: http://www.davidsuzuki.org/

Quoting:
And you believe what you read there?  ::)  Unless there is physical evidence linking them I highly dispute their so-called "claims".  Everytime there is a terrorist event somewhere in this vastly overpopulated planet, several groups step forward to claim responsibility.
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Actually, I *DO* believe everything I read there.  At least, when it comes to things they claim to do.  After all, it is THEIR web site.  While I dispute most of their claims about things that are "destroying the environment", I accept the fact that they are torching car lots, destroying water plants, and destroying construction equipment.

Some things most of these events have in common, they feature in addition to the damage environmentalist grafitti.  This is their "calling card"

Quoting:
Right now we have a so-called "major infestation" of mountain pine beetles that are wiping out vast tracts of forests.  The cause: increase in temperature related to global warming.  
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Yes, I do accept Global Warming.  But I also see it as part of a 10,000+ year cycle.  The earth has been warming since the Ice Age ended 10,000+ years ago.

The Earth has gone through cycles ranging from ice covering the entire surface of the earth to long time periods where there was no polar ice at all.  This is all proven.  In fact, when compared to the average temperature of the earth, we are STILL in an ice age!

Approximately 5,000 years ago, the Sahara desert was covered with forest and plains.  This is proven.  Also less then 2,000 years ago, the Death Valley basin was a freshwater lake of great depth.  Since then, it has dried up and become one of the hottest and deepest places on earth.  This is just another part of the shrinking ice caps and the global climate change.  But Nature did this, not man.

Also compared to the extinctions worldwide over the eons, we have had nothing major here.  There have been times when 95% of life on earth vanished, often with no explanation.

Quoting:
The logging interests have been heavily pressuring the provincial government to suspend the regulations and let them clear cut the diseased trees.
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There is a difference between managed forests, and clear cutting.  For the most part, I am against clear cutting.  It can be good, because it gives other environments for other animals and plants to thrive.  But if you are talking about denuding vast areas of forest just for lumber, I am very much against that.

If for no other reason, placing some "clear cut" strips of land helps prevent the spread of fires.  And most fires are the results of lightning, not man.  Plus those cleared regions give animals such as deer a place to thrive.

Quoting:
Anyways, I think I understand the gist of your message.  There is no place in the world for extremists.  And on that point I completely agree with you.  What I took offense to is your generalization to group anyone who cares, or is concerned with the environment, as a dangerous radical.
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I agree with your thought in extremists.  But it is also dangerous to deny they exist.  I admit that 98% of Islam is a peaceful religion.  It is the 2% that gives them the bad name.  But when that 98% claims that the 2% does not exist at all, that is when they are tuned out as irrelevant.

I care greatly about the environment.  Idaho make almost all of it;s money from lumber, farming, and mining.  And I am sure if you look, you will not see the kind of damage you see in other areas of the world.  That is because they care about their state, and want to see it continue.

Quoting:
By the way, did you know that last week they've jailed a 70 year old grandmother in British Columbia.
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I did not hear that.  I guess it was not major enough to hear about down here in Ala-BLEEPing-Bama.  :)  So without more info, it would be hard for me to comment.  But to some people, "peaceful protest" means chaning themselves to trees and trying to block the equipment.  I can see her being arrested in that situation for her own protection.

Well, in some ways I am the same.  I am the former Marine (10 years infantry) with long hair and the normal "laid-back California attitude".  I love taking long walks in the woods, and can stop and stare for long periods of time at a deer, lizard, or almost any animal I find on my walks.  I have trained myself how to identify a great number of animal tracks.

I have also spent a lot of time in other areas.  I spent 3 months in Alaska and Yukon.  A great many nights wandering the tundra, fishing and watching nature.  3 months in the jungles and rainforest of Panama.  I remember comming across some old French canal digging equipment.  Mostly it was rusting junk, but the jungle resiliantly reclaimed it.  From more then 10 meters away, you would not recognize it for what it was.  I spent a lot of time over the years hiking and camping in the deserts of California.  And also uncounted nights in the forests and marshes of Alabama and North Carolina.

I have seen areas damaged by all kinds of forces of nature as well as man, and nature always took it back.  I saw the devistation of Mt. St. Helens, and when I visited again almost 20 years later, you could hardly tell anything happened.  I have been through Mt. Larsen, and the devistation from 100 years ago is repaired.

I have a deep and abiding love for nature, but it's power still can leave me in awe.  When I realized that most of the forests around my new home are younger then I was, I was amazed.  In less then 40 years SE Alabama went from farmland back to forest.  When left alone, nature will always reclaim it's previous area.

As for David Suzuki, I watched his show "The Nature Of Things" every week in the mid-1980's.  I have not seen anything by him recently though.

I agree with newer car technology though.  Hybred cars are the way to go with current technology.  They work the same way our current naval vessels work, and are very efficient.  I am waiting for the prices to drop to a reasonable level though.  I see SUVs as wasteful for anybody that does not NEED such a vehicle.  To me, there was little more wasteful or stupid then a new-generation Yuppie in Los Angeles getting a SUV to drive from Brentwood to Downtown LA.  But for people like my mom who lived in a remote area of Idaho, who had to drive over 10 miles of unplowed roads just to get her mail and supplies in winter (10 miles unplowed, 25 miles of plowed highway), I can see how such a vehicle is a lifesaver.

The two of us actually see things very similarly I think.  I just take a view of people more as caretakers and assistants to nature.  We have only been civilized for around 3,000 years, and industrialized for less then 200 years.  While we have done some incredibly stupid things to the environment, I feel that we are getting better.  And a lot of things that used to devistate nature (such as disease) are much less damaging now then they used to be.