Quoting:
No !  You are not allowed to over here.  I realise that is beside your point....and I realise that doesn't mean people don't......
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If you are against gun ownership, speak up. I am looking for all opinions. Part of me does not like the idea of having a death machine, but I like the idea of protection better. Is there a "Dirty Harry" here who could give me some gun advice?

Quoting:
Does anyone own a gun to protect their home? I am researching guns and debating the pro's/con's of buying a gun. Are there any reccomendations on a good gun? A police officer who lives next door reccomended a glock (I hope I spelled that right). He said a .45 may be too much gun for the home, but I want a gun with power. A 9mm looks like it is weak. Does anyone have any suggestions on a good gun?
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If you are just starting out, I would suggest a 9mm.  Its not the most powerful gun out there by any means, but it will do the job if you are just using it for home protection.  Plus its easy on the wallet.

On the other hand, if you are willing to shell out more cash, a .45 is a great gun.  And powerful at that. ;)  If you're thinking of getting a Glock, I recommend a "Glock 21", or "Glock 30".  Its just a smaller version of the "21".

Quoting:

If you are against gun ownership, speak up. I am looking for all opinions. Part of me does not like the idea of having a death machine, but I like the idea of protection better. Is there a "Dirty Harry" here who could give me some gun advice?
End Quote

Not particularly, John.  I live in a place where there is simply not a demonstrated need to have a gun to defend yourself, and for that I give thanks every day.  ;)

Quoting:
I own 2 handguns....and won't even go into what they are right now....first thing you need to do is learn how to shoot one...take a class about firearms and get certified and then make sure before you actually buy a gun, that if need be, you can use it to take another person life, cuz that is exactly what a firearm can do in the wrong persons hand
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I have been to a gun range, and shooting was fairly easy for me. I always hit the target, and often was no more than one circle away from the bullseye. I also learned how to shoot prone and from different positions. The problem was, the shooting club as an accuracy club. All they used were .22 rifles.

The other problem I have in picking a gun is most people with good advice tell me I should own multiple guns for multiple reasons. I just want one, if any. The police officer next door also told me the ammo can be more important than the gun. He suggested something called "black talons".

What I would like to know is what is the best gun for personal saftey?

Maybe I should just get a second dog. God knows my current dog would want to hump the leg of a robber rather than scare him.

Quoting:


Not particularly, John.  I live in a place where there is simply not a demonstrated need to have a gun to defend yourself, and for that I give thanks every day.  ;)


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Can I move in with you?  ;D

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Can I move in with you?  ;D
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No !  I read some of your other posts and I'm afraid I would be terribly jealous !  :P ::)

Quoting:


No !  I read some of your other posts and I'm afraid I would be terribly jealous !  :P ::)
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This is anteater discrimination at its worst.  ;D ;D ;D

Quoting:

What I would like to know is what is the best gun for personal saftey?End Quote

like I said above, Glock "21" or Glock "30".  Just my opinion.

Quoting:Maybe I should just get a second dog. God knows my current dog would want to hump the leg of a robber rather than scare him. End Quote

hehe, mine would just bite their ankles, or get stepped on.  Whichever came first. :D

Quoting:


This is anteater discrimination at its worst.  ;D ;D ;D
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I hadn't even thought of that !  That's 2 reasons  ;D

Quoting:
For strictly home protection, and especially for someone not "intimate" with handguns, I wouldn't even suggest a handgun.  (going to a range is one thing, being comfortable and confident enough to hit anything in a crisis is entirely different).

A legal, shortbarrelled shotgun with pistol grip would be my suggestion.  Easy to aim, intimidating to hear and see.

http://webpages.charter.net/ayhab/shotgun.jpg

And you can get it for half the price of a decent automatic handgun.  The Mossberg Maverick 88 goes for about $180 and the pistol grip's about $25.


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Hehehe...oh yeah.  That's my weapon of choice alright.  Burglars best beware, because I'm not afraid of making a few exit wounds ;)

Quoting:

Who do you work for? Tom Ridge, John Ashcroft, John Poindexter?
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Anonymous, care to elaborate on that comment?

Quoting:


Anonymous, care to elaborate on that comment?
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I believe he may be an anti-gun advocate, but associates the gunownership supporters with certain characters he believes to be either "right wing wackos" or "fascists".

Just my humble opinion.

I think you should have a right to protect your home.  The Second Amendment of the Constitution allows you to bear arms.  While it's not justifying you putting a bullet in an intruder's 'nads, I think it makes people feel safer :)

Quoting:
I believe he may be an anti-gun advocate, but associates the gunownership supporters with certain characters he believes to be either "right wing wackos" or "fascists".End Quote

I know, I just wanted him to to admit it himself.  I'm tired of people posting "anonymously" just so they don't have to take any responsibility for what they say.

Quoting:I think you should have a right to protect your home.  The Second Amendment of the Constitution allows you to bear arms.  While it's not justifying you putting a bullet in an intruder's 'nads, I think it makes people feel safer :)
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you are absolutely right.  Although I guarantee that taking a bullet in the nads would make you think twice before robbing that house again. ;D

Quoting:
Also, as I recall, Glocks don't have a safety. If I absolutely had to have a gun around the house, I think I'd want one with a safety.
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If I had a gun without a saftey I would just keep the loaded clip out of the gun, and keep the clip next to the gun. It only takes a second to put the clip in the gun. I guess the glocks not having a saftey would make me have to think a little longer about weather or not I would buy that gun.

As for the people who say I should think about "if I could put a bullet in an intruder", all I can say is this is better than a crook shooting me for a TV or DVD player.

The reason I started this thread was to get input from gun owners so I could make a good decision. There is a police officer next door, but his advice was limited as I always seem to catch him leaving for work when he does not have that much time to talk. I do not want to get a gun which will rip through the intruder, then the wall, then another person.

As for Black Talons, they are not "cop killers" and they are legal in my state. Where did you get the idea that they are cop killers? They are very weak bullets which can not penetrate vests like real "cop killers". Black Talons are bullets which mushroom out on impact. That way, if you miss hitting a part of the body which would bring down an intruder, the bullet would spin around inside the person and would do more damage, bringing the crook down. Also, Black Talons could not make it through a criminal into another person because of the mushroom effect. That makes them safer.

Quoting:
Also, as I recall, Glocks don't have a safety. If I absolutely had to have a gun around the house, I think I'd want one with a safety.
End Quote

the Glock "21" and "30"(.45 caliber), actually have 3 safeties.  You must be thinking of another brand.

Quoting:Do I want to have a lethal weapon laying around in my home that someone else could find and use against me?
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anyone who just leaves there gun "laying around the house" shouldn't have a gun in the first place, especially if there's children in the house.  Thats not smart.

Thats what a pistol lockbox is for. ;)  

Quoting:
That's what the police is for.Why should I own a gun or My Family should? They think it's dangerous.

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...must be nice having your own private police officer guarding your house 24/7. ;)

My apartment was robbed 3 years ago when I first moved here.  Thank God I wasn't home that night nor have I been robbed since, but I definitely don't expect the police to protect my home from another incident.  Just not possible, not enough officers to protect every single household at once.

Quoting:
Saying that A Black Talon is a "very weak bullet" shows me how little you know about weapons and ammo. Go to Gunbroker.com and see what they recommend .44 magnum, 500 grain Black Talon shells for. To hunt elk, wild boar, and bear. I'm not going to argue the physics of how certain rounds work or the street name of certain ammo. If thats all you got out of my post then you completely missed my point. I knew I should have stuck to my guns (pardon the pun) about commenting on serious issues on this board. ::)
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That is the whole reason i started the thread. I do not know anything about guns or ammo. All I know is what people tell me in the stores or what the guy next door says. And I do not want to go off the advice of a salesman or a cop who gives me a two sentance reccomendation. I would like to know how the different guns work and what they are capible of. I will be an informed gun owner. I will check out the site that you mentioned.

BTW, it was a salesperson who told me black talons will not go through a person to hit another person where some other bullets can. He was trying to convince me that is the bullet I should buy.

BTW, one last question. If I purchased a .38 or 9mm, could I put in more than one kind of bullet in the magazine? For example, if I wanted to go black talon then a normal bullet and then a black talon again, could I do that or would the gun jam?

One last comment. I still have not purchased anything. I am in the information gathering stage. So I may ask some dumb questions. I figure it is better to get anwsers before I buy then get stuck with a gun I do not want or need.

Quoting:
the Glock "21" and "30"(.45 caliber), actually have 3 safeties.  You must be thinking of another brand.
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Well I wouldn't knew really because if I owned one where I lived I'd be breaking the law. But the 9mm Glocks the state Police have don't have a safety.

Quoting:
anyone who just leaves there gun "laying around the house" shouldn't have a gun in the first place, especially if there's children in the house.  Thats not smart.

Thats what a pistol lockbox is for. ;)  
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I realise you're being facetious here, but my point is, while you have a gun in your home, there's a chance someone could use it against you.

Quoting:
I realise you're being facetious here, but my point is, while you have a gun in your home, there's a chance someone could use it against you.
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yes I suppose there is that chance, although its a very small chance.  However that argument should not deter someone from having a gun, just because of the very very small chance someone would break in and shoot them with it.


BTW, just out of curiosity, where do you live were it is illegal to own a gun?

Quoting:


Well I wouldn't knew really because if I owned one where I lived I'd be breaking the law. But the 9mm Glocks the state Police have don't have a safety.



I realise you're being facetious here, but my point is, while you have a gun in your home, there's a chance someone could use it against you.
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Quoting:
the way that you disengage the safety on a Glock is to pull the triggerEnd Quote

ROFL!! LMAO!!  ;D ;D ;D

That is HALLARIOUS! You remind me of an instructor I had in ROTC. That is where we shot the .22's. One of the guys in the class was looking down the barrel of the gun and asked "how do i clean the barrel". The instructer said "pull the trigger". He later said this is how they "weed out the bottom feeders". Of course it was all a joke, there was no bullet in the rifle.

Anyways, I am starting to lean toward getting a second dog. I have been thinking about this a long time, and I think a robber would not want to pick a house with 2 dogs. The dogs would make to much noise. I figure robbers are cowards who like to remain hidden and out of view. Instead I am going to start going to a local range to test out a few guns. Maybe I will buy a gun if something goes down in the future.

One last thought for those against legal gun ownership. I remember a quote from Archie Bunker where his daughter said "guns are bad, the only purpose of a gun is to kill people" and Archie responded: "would you feel better if people were pushed out windows." I think what Archie was getting at is human nature can be bad, and you have to protect yourself first.

Quoting:


Well I wouldn't knew really because if I owned one where I lived I'd be breaking the law. But the 9mm Glocks the state Police have don't have a safety.

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i don't think i'd want to live someplace where the police have guns but the common man is a criminal if he has one. smacks of fascism to me.

Quoting:
BTW, just out of curiosity, where do you live were it is illegal to own a gun?
End Quote

Australia. Actually it's not illegal to own a gun, as long as it's not a semi-automatic rifle or a handgun. Rifles and shotguns are fine, as long as you're a farmer or a professional shooter. Even if you're a sports shooter, you can't keep your gun at home. It has to be locked up at the gun club and only used while you're there. Owning a gun for protection of property or person is not an adequate reason to own a firearm. If you want to know why, put it down to Sunday, April 28, 1996.

http://www.crimelibrary.com/notorious_murders/mass/bryant/index_1.html

Quoting:


i don't think i'd want to live someplace where the police have guns but the common man is a criminal if he has one. smacks of fascism to me.
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What you have them use instead of guns? Big sticks?

Quoting:


I believe he may be an anti-gun advocate, but associates the gunownership supporters with certain characters he believes to be either "right wing wackos" or "fascists".

Just my humble opinion.

End Quote

Wrong. I'm as pro-gun as you can get.

Quoting:
i don't think i'd want to live someplace where the police have guns but the common man is a criminal if he has one. smacks of fascism to me.
End Quote

I agree 100%.  

Quoting:
What you have them use instead of guns? Big sticks?
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huh?  I think you misunderstood what he was saying.

Quoting:
...you can own certain types of guns if you have a good reason. End Quote

...which begs the question:  what happens when the Australian govt decides to change the acceptable "reasons" for owning guns, leaving all guns in the hands of police and criminals.  

I don't like that at all.

Quoting:I will also add here that cops aren't allowed to take their guns home with them either.
End Quote

Wow, I didn't know that.  Sounds insane to me.  

Thats just my opinion.

Quoting:
...which begs the question:  what happens when the Australian govt decides to change the acceptable "reasons" for owning guns, leaving all guns in the hands of police and criminals.  
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I doubt they will do that, because that would put them up against the farmers, who are allowed to own rifles and shotguns to keep down the numbers of kangaroos, dingos, rabbits, etc. and the Farmers Association is a group that governments here mess with at their peril. In any case, my previous posts may have been a little misleading. Gun ownership isn't banned, only certain types of guns: handguns, automatic weapons, rimfire rifles and any self-loading rifle with a capacity of more than 15 rounds. You can own a gun, you're just not allowed to carry it in public or keep it at home. So, effectively, gun ownership is actually useless!

Quoting:
You can own a gun, you're just not allowed to carry it or keep it at home.
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Thats the part I am having trouble with.  

Has Australia always been that way?  I'll admit, before having this conversation, I didn't know Australia was so strict on gun possession.

Quoting:

But, if a handgun is your choice, why not choose a revolver?  Regardless of the "reliability factor" of automatic weapons, they still can't make the same claim as revolvers, that they NEVER jam.  Also, revolvers are cheaper, easier to clean and maintain, and generally safer - from an "accidental discharge" point of view.  Owning an automatic weapon with a 17-shot staggered clip is good if you're in a shootout and don't wanna reload really often, but in a home confrontation, it's gonna be over within six shots, probably within 3.

I always thought a 357 magnum - which will fire .38 caliber as well,  was a good choice.  You can shoot .38s to practice, and buy .38 cal semi-wadcutters - (cheap, low powder charge practice rounds), at any gun shop.  So, you can practice all you like without going broke, and then just keep the gun loaded with the more expensive .357 magnum steel-jacketed hollowpoints for home protection.

/quote]