What is your opinion of the cultural significance of the best-known outlaw motorcycle gang, the quintessential motorcycle gang --THE HELL'S ANGELS!  They rose to national prominence in the 1960s with a rash of local terrorism in various places -- mainly, public intoxication, public urinating/vomiting, guys who didn't do it, but won't do it again....
???

I wouldn't trust their culture as far as I could throw it!!!  Over here we have these bikers riding for a Childrens Hospital charity carrying stuffed toys etc (with police escort ...roads blocked from other traffic etc). There are hundreds of them...I know...I counted 800+ one year as I waited at an intersection for them to pass.

Not fooled by them at all. I say pull 'em over and search those stuffed toys!!!

They got to be part of the radical chic thanks to guys like Hunter Thompson and Ken Kesey, but these guys had no guiding principal except being an Angel and riding his Harley.


Back then there were fewer people willing to be more baddass than the Hell's Angel

These guys were very authoritarian within the organization and adhered to a strict military code of how to get into the Angels. 

The Hippies found themselves found themselves getting stomped to hell bye the Hell's Angels.  It may not be true any longer, but once it was the case.  Hells Angels identify strongly with military discipline.  Right from the start, Hell's Angels was denying up and down that biker culture would interfere with metalheads. 

The main man in charge over there for the longest time was a dude named Sonny Barger. 

It's just that now we have a picture of a demon from hell coming through town. 
:o

During the 60s-70s, motorcyclists were identified with Hell's Angels-which lived up to its reputation. Nowadays, many motorcyclists are trying to undo that reputation. Many are law abiding citizens with families who are just trying to live their lives like the rest of us. There is a motorcycle group around here called the Southwest Freedom Riders who help the community.

http://www.swfrvt.com/index.html


Years ago when I was running the food shelf, they collected a lot of food but many places didn't want to accept it because it was a motorcycle group. We accepted the food-gladly.



Cat

During the 60s-70s, motorcyclists were identified with Hell's Angels-which lived up to its reputation. Nowadays, many motorcyclists are trying to undo that reputation. Many are law abiding citizens with families who are just trying to live their lives like the rest of us. There is a motorcycle group around here called the Southwest Freedom Riders who help the community.

http://www.swfrvt.com/index.html


Years ago when I was running the food shelf, they collected a lot of food but many places didn't want to accept it because it was a motorcycle group. We accepted the food-gladly.



It was also like that in 1965.  Most motorcyclists did not want to be associated with the outlaw element.  In fact, I would say they were more vigilant about it in the 1960s than today.  Motorcycle thugs were capturing newspaper headlines from coast to coast and into Canada and Mexico.  

A lot of bikers were scary-looking to people because they subscribed to an individualistic philosophy of living in which they let their hair and their beards grow wild and woolly.  Most of them still weren't outlaws.  They didn't want to hurt anybody.  They wouldn't fight unless somebody provoked them.  One Hell's Angel might start in on you for no reason and before you know it his six buddies are thrashing you with bike chains!  Furthermore, God-fearing squares, there is nothing more of a turn-on to your daughters than an outlaw biker!  So people would feel a kind of morbid fear whenever bikers showed up anywhere.  

Nowadays it seems like there are outlaw chapters of the Hell's Angels and gone-legit chapters of H.A.  I remember seeing a motorcyclist newsletter in which a Hell's Angels chapter was holding a bake sale.  This must have been about 1995.  No crank, no hookers, no stolen motorcycle parts, no hired-guns, just a bake sale like the local Girl Scouts might do!
;D

However, I still hear about the Hell's Angels in the west getting up to nefarious activities and brawls with rival gangs like the old days.

Sometimes bikers pass through here on their way to Loudon.  They've had summer biker rallies up around Lake Winnipesaukee since the 1950s.  Some of the gangs look menacing.  I don't find it a great idea to stare at them looking for gang insignia, so I just mind my own business and let 'em roll by.

Didn't Hunter S. Thompson write a book about the Hells Angel's describing how they befriended him, then, later beat the living snot out of him?

Haven't gotten around to read that story yet, but with Thompson involved, I'm not surprised he got thrashed. ::)

Didn't Hunter S. Thompson write a book about the Hells Angel's describing how they befriended him, then, later beat the living snot out of him?

Haven't gotten around to read that story yet, but with Thompson involved, I'm not surprised he got thrashed. ::)


I just read Hunter S. Thompson, so the Hell's Angels was on my mind. 

He underplays the abuse of women within the organization and its profound racism. 

They seemed to be anti-establishment but fiercely defended the military.  It took authority and discipline to make the Hell's Angels function.  Same as the military.  They were working class guys, not college idealists.  Some of the older ones in Thompson's time with them had served in Korea.  In general, their families had served time in the military.  They weren't about to let a bunch of snot-nosed hippie kids disrespect them. 

The most amusing observation Thompson makes about the Hell's Angels is:

"They respected the free enterprise system, they just couldn't afford it amongst themselves.  He has shares." 

  Hunter S. Thompson, when he actually joined the Hell's Angels in order to write a book about them, I think defined the word "gonzo" quintessentially...

  My oldest sister's ex-husband was in the HA in the 1980s, Big Dave.  At home, great guy, father, brother-in-law.  Loved his kids, my niece and nephew Brian and Jodie.  I never asked him what he did with his biker gang, although I really wanted to.  I spent a weekend in West Sacramento with my sister and Dave when I was 15 y/o and one night they had a gathering at the house.  They sat around watching Beastmaster and doing drugs.  They offered me drugs, too, but I declined.  Actually I was scared stiff and stayed in the other room most of the time. Last I heard he traded his leathers for a suit.  I was under the impression that one couldn't leave the gang and live to tell about it, but apparently he did.  And in those days the Hell's Angels were not yet the fiftysomethings with minivans full of grandchildren who show up at their reunions today...

 

   Hunter S. Thompson, when he actually joined the Hell's Angels in order to write a book about them, I think defined the word "gonzo" quintessentially...

   My oldest sister's ex-husband was in the HA in the 1980s, Big Dave.  At home, great guy, father, brother-in-law.  Loved his kids, my niece and nephew Brian and Jodie.  I never asked him what he did with his biker gang, although I really wanted to.  I spent a weekend in West Sacramento with my sister and Dave when I was 15 y/o and one night they had a gathering at the house.  They sat around watching Beastmaster and doing drugs.  They offered me drugs, too, but I declined.  Actually I was scared stiff and stayed in the other room most of the time. Last I heard he traded his leathers for a suit.  I was under the impression that one couldn't leave the gang and live to tell about it, but apparently he did.  And in those days the Hell's Angels were not yet the fiftysomethings with minivans full of grandchildren who show up at their reunions today...

 


I gathered you could leave on good terms, but the longer you spent in the gang, the harder it was to get out.  That is, to go back to straight life.  If they thought you were going to rat somebody out after you left, you might go for a dirt nap.  Eventually, the body can't take the road, and the booze, and the drugs anymore.  It's just harder to rebound from a crash or a binge at 47 than at 27.  Thus, I think a lot of them consider themselves "retired" rather than "ex."  They become weekend riders with jobs and families, but not true 1% -ers who are on the road 'till it kills them.

Didn't Hunter S. Thompson write a book about the Hells Angel's describing how they befriended him, then, later beat the living snot out of him?

Haven't gotten around to read that story yet, but with Thompson involved, I'm not surprised he got thrashed. ::)


Great book, I highly recommend it.

When the hippies and peaceniks and the chic-niks tried to make friends with the Hell's Angels they discovered a kind of violent nihilism which was often a deal breaker.  Thing is, the Hell's Angels could get you good dope.  The other thing is, the last place you wanted to be was on the sh*tlist of the Hell's Angels.  That's how the hippies became intertwined with gangsters. 

As recently as the Iraq war, the Angels rallied on behalf of the troops.  They were known for roughing up peace marchers as far back as the mid-sixties.  Why?  The Hell's Angels stand up against all authority.  Ah, but they are militaristic in their hierarchy within the organization, thus they feel affinity to the military. 

So they're a strange blend of cultural values.  Well, I use the term "values" lightly regarding the H.A.
:D

When the hippies and peaceniks and the chic-niks tried to make friends with the Hell's Angels they discovered a kind of violent nihilism which was often a deal breaker.  Thing is, the Hell's Angels could get you good dope.  The other thing is, the last place you wanted to be was on the sh*tlist of the Hell's Angels.  That's how the hippies became intertwined with gangsters. 

As recently as the Iraq war, the Angels rallied on behalf of the troops.  They were known for roughing up peace marchers as far back as the mid-sixties.  Why?  The Hell's Angels stand up against all authority.  Ah, but they are militaristic in their hierarchy within the organization, thus they feel affinity to the military. 

So they're a strange blend of cultural values.  Well, I use the term "values" lightly regarding the H.A.
:D


One of the reasons they got pissed at Hunter was because he said that will all their anti authority gas, they were just tools.  He said if they were really against authority they would cozy up to the blacks instead of being thugs for the pro war Republicans.  They hated hearing that.

Hell's Angels...?

Probably best to avoid them  ;)

One of the reasons they got pissed at Hunter was because he said that will all their anti authority gas, they were just tools.  He said if they were really against authority they would cozy up to the blacks instead of being thugs for the pro war Republicans.  They hated hearing that.


Thompson calls them "losers."  Just for that I'd sit facing the door for the rest of my life!
:o

He's more nuanced.  They came from so-called poor white trash and for whatever they might have been worth to society as that, they had the last laugh by banding together and scaring the hell out of society.  Thompson makes it clear that whatever else they might be, the Hell's Angels are anything but losers when they're riding their Harleys, when they're together being Angels.

I think the counterculture got wind of the motorcycle mystique and misconstrued it as something more profound, some kind of Zen.  Then Hollywood gave us "Easy Rider" in which bikers were misunderstood peaceful hippie nomads.  But if YOU walked into a Hell's Angels bar, they'd say: "There's a citizen!  Let's light him up, and piss him out!"*
http://www.inthe00s.com/smile/01/baddevil.gif

*credit to Gilbert Shelton and the Fabulous Furry Freak Brothers!

"Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance," Robert Pirsig

Zen and the Art of beat your brains out with a crowbar! Sonny Barger
:o

What is your opinion of the cultural significance of the best-known outlaw motorcycle gang, the quintessential motorcycle gang --THE HELL'S ANGELS!  They rose to national prominence in the 1960s with a rash of local terrorism in various places -- mainly, public intoxication, public urinating/vomiting, guys who didn't do it, but won't do it again....
???


Max, the Hell Angel's weren't as bad as the newspapers made them out to be, don't get wrong, they were bad ass dudes but were amongest their world of bike gangs. One night we were in Greenwich Village around 63' and we turned down a street to get to a club and the whole street was lined with about 50 neatly parked "hogs and "choppers" all belonging to the Hell's Angels, they had their local chapter headquarters on that street. There was no problem with them or police it was their normal meeting going on. Their bikes were picture perfect. I think everyone who owned a bike or owns one today has a little bit of the Hell's Angels attitude in them because you have to be a little nuts to drive one. They had an influence on me in getting me interested in buying my bike in 67'. I'll try to post a photo of it. 

They got to be part of the radical chic thanks to guys like Hunter Thompson and Ken Kesey, but these guys had no guiding principal except being an Angel and riding his Harley.


Back then there were fewer people willing to be more baddass than the Hell's Angel

These guys were very authoritarian within the organization and adhered to a strict military code of how to get into the Angels.  

The Hippies found themselves found themselves getting stomped to hell bye the Hell's Angels.  It may not be true any longer, but once it was the case.  Hells Angels identify strongly with military discipline.  Right from the start, Hell's Angels was denying up and down that biker culture would interfere with metalheads.  

The main man in charge over there for the longest time was a dude named Sonny Barger.  

It's just that now we have a picture of a demon from hell coming through town.  
:o



It was also like that in 1965.  Most motorcyclists did not want to be associated with the outlaw element.  In fact, I would say they were more vigilant about it in the 1960s than today.  Motorcycle thugs were capturing newspaper headlines from coast to coast and into Canada and Mexico.  

A lot of bikers were scary-looking to people because they subscribed to an individualistic philosophy of living in which they let their hair and their beards grow wild and woolly.  Most of them still weren't outlaws.  They didn't want to hurt anybody.  They wouldn't fight unless somebody provoked them.  One Hell's Angel might start in on you for no reason and before you know it his six buddies are thrashing you with bike chains!  Furthermore, God-fearing squares, there is nothing more of a turn-on to your daughters than an outlaw biker!  So people would feel a kind of morbid fear whenever bikers showed up anywhere.  

Nowadays it seems like there are outlaw chapters of the Hell's Angels and gone-legit chapters of H.A.  I remember seeing a motorcyclist newsletter in which a Hell's Angels chapter was holding a bake sale.  This must have been about 1995.  No crank, no hookers, no stolen motorcycle parts, no hired-guns, just a bake sale like the local Girl Scouts might do!
;D

However, I still hear about the Hell's Angels in the west getting up to nefarious activities and brawls with rival gangs like the old days.

Sometimes bikers pass through here on their way to Loudon.  They've had summer biker rallies up around Lake Winnipesaukee since the 1950s.  Some of the gangs look menacing.  I don't find it a great idea to stare at them looking for gang insignia, so I just mind my own business and let 'em roll by.


Their rival gangs were the Pagans and the Breed. They had some bad ass fights.

Their rival gangs were the Pagans and the Breed. They had some bad ass fights.


I met one of the Pagans the night everyone came together at a clothing store head shop I was running in 69' to go to Woodstock Concert. Kids from Union who knew kids from other towns who knew someone, who someone who wanted to go Woodstock told them to meet at my store. By 9:00 pm that Friday night, about 30 kids, strangers from other the towns were ready to go in a caravan of cars and one motorcycle, with a gang member from the Pagans riding it with his old lady behind him. We we knew her well and she heard about meeting at the store and brought him there for the caravan. He was a cool dude, nice guy, in full colors, but I didn't like it when he drove his bike into doorway vestibule of the store, but it was night of Peace and Love and he was cool he smiled and backed it out, also I didn't want to confront him on it and be on the Pagans sheesh list. His nickname was Fingers, Why? rumor was because he would cut a finger off a dude who they battled with and wear them like badges of honor at rallies.

photo on the site after 6 years on it.

This is my old chopper Max. I was influenced by the Hell's Angel's like everyone else was at that time, only in their carefree sprite.

This is the store everyone met before they caravaned up to Woodstock. I was caught up in the "Easy Rider" look here. 

What is your opinion of the cultural significance of the best-known outlaw motorcycle gang, the quintessential motorcycle gang --THE HELL'S ANGELS!  They rose to national prominence in the 1960s with a rash of local terrorism in various places -- mainly, public intoxication, public urinating/vomiting, guys who didn't do it, but won't do it again....
???


There is a scene in the movie "A Bronx Tale" when a group of bikers in mid 60's wanted to break up a bar and got their ass kicked by a Mafia gang, owner's of the bar. The bikers weren't wearing any gang colors in the movie to see what gang they were from, but back then only the Hell's Angel's were known for busting up bars, so they got the bad rap for it anyway in the minds of the audience wathing the movie. Good movie! 

This is the store everyone met before they caravaned up to Woodstock. I was caught up in the "Easy Rider" look here. 



It is nice to see what you look like-FINALLY. Quite handsome if you don't mind me saying so.



Cat

It is nice to see what you look like-FINALLY. Quite handsome if you don't mind me saying so.



Cat


Hi Cat!, I could never get photos onto this site, always to large, I got a new scanner that resizes photos and now i'm like a pig in doo doo putting photos on face book and now "In The 00's"

and thanks for the compliment, so are you, cute that is. It was a long time ago that this photo was taken.

Hi Cat!, I could never get photos onto this site, always to large, I got a new scanner that resizes photos and now i'm like a pig in doo doo putting photos on face book and now "In The 00's"

and thanks for the compliment, so are you, cute that is. It was a long time ago that this photo was taken.



Awww, thanks.

Getting off topic here:  You can also open a photobucket account (it's free) and up load your photos there and copy them here. You don't have to resize them. Also, you can venture over to the photo section and you can see what some of the people around here look like-and add your own to the mix.  ;)


BTW, I don't trust Facebook and will not open an account there. But that is a different story.


Ok, back to the topic.



Cat

I met one of the Pagans the night everyone came together at a clothing store head shop I was running in 69' to go to Woodstock Concert. Kids from Union who knew kids from other towns who knew someone, who someone who wanted to go Woodstock told them to meet at my store. By 9:00 pm that Friday night, about 30 kids, strangers from other the towns were ready to go in a caravan of cars and one motorcycle, with a gang member from the Pagans riding it with his old lady behind him. We we knew her well and she heard about meeting at the store and brought him there for the caravan. He was a cool dude, nice guy, in full colors, but I didn't like it when he drove his bike into doorway vestibule of the store, but it was night of Peace and Love and he was cool he smiled and backed it out, also I didn't want to confront him on it and be on the Pagans sheesh list. His nickname was Fingers, Why? rumor was because he would cut a finger off a dude who they battled with and wear them like badges of honor at rallies.


Wow!  What a story.  So you were right in the middle of it.  Where did you run a head shop?

The Angels set the pace for the outlaw biker subculture of today.  The violence is gang-on-gang.  I mean the really nasty stuff.  Maybe they rolled in and busted up a bar or beat holy hell out of a guy for some kind theft or disrespect, but if you weren't involved in sh*t, they weren't gonna bother you.

If you're at a roadhouse and you see guys riding up flying Pagans or Mongols colors, then it's time to leave.  Use finesse.  Be polite...but leave.  That helps us avoid potential misunderstandings between "citizens" and "outlaw bikers" who don't tolerate b.s. from citizens, especially nervous citizens who didn't mean to give any b.s.  

One thing that did happen to biker gangs is their legendary terror did them a disservice day-by-day.  Thus, the bikers roll into town to fill up their tanks and get a beer.  The bikers don't want trouble with anyone.  They need a breather.  It's a long way up that coast.  But the local rednecks start to snarl and look for a fight.  That's when things get terrifying...for the local rednecks.  Most of us are the local rednecks...what better to fear than lawless motorcycle thug?  So the local boys try to play hero.  They get their testicles handed to them in a scotch bottle and the gangsters roll outta town!  And the legend goes on!
http://www.inthe00s.com/smile/13/la.gif

Awww, thanks.

Getting off topic here:  You can also open a photobucket account (it's free) and up load your photos there and copy them here. You don't have to resize them. Also, you can venture over to the photo section and you can see what some of the people around here look like-and add your own to the mix.  ;)


BTW, I don't trust Facebook and will not open an account there. But that is a different story.


Ok, back to the topic.



Cat


That's great news, thanks for the information, I have many many photos that only I only wish I could have displayed with my older postings over the past years. I had some nice ones when I took you our prom Cat. But now there's life in me again with "In the 00's" thanks again.

Wow!  What a story.  So you were right in the middle of it.  Where did you run a head shop?

The Angels set the pace for the outlaw biker subculture of today.  The violence is gang-on-gang.  I mean the really nasty stuff.  Maybe they rolled in and busted up a bar or beat holy hell out of a guy for some kind theft or disrespect, but if you weren't involved in sh*t, they weren't gonna bother you.

If you're at a roadhouse and you see guys riding up flying Pagans or Mongols colors, then it's time to leave.  Use finesse.  Be polite...but leave.  That helps us avoid potential misunderstandings between "citizens" and "outlaw bikers" who don't tolerate b.s. from citizens, especially nervous citizens who didn't mean to give any b.s. 

One thing that did happen to biker gangs is their legendary terror did them a disservice day-by-day.  Thus, the bikers roll into town to fill up their tanks and get a beer.  The bikers don't want trouble with anyone.  They need a breather.  It's a long way up that coast.  But the local rednecks start to snarl and look for a fight.  That's when things get terrifying...for the local rednecks.  Most of us are the local rednecks...what better to fear than lawless motorcycle thug?  So the local boys try to play hero.  They get their testicles handed to them in a scotch bottle and the gangsters roll outta town!  And the legend goes on!
http://www.inthe00s.com/smile/13/la.gif


Max, you are right on. The store was in Union NJ. In 1966 I was on my way to my National Guard meeting in Freehold NJ. Getting there, I had to drive south on the Garden State Parkway and get of and drive down about 20 miles east on RT. 33 to Freehold. Well, 20 miles of deserted counrty farm roads lined with corn fields. One early morning driving there I see coming up behind me a gang of bikers, I didn't know who they were, but I pulled to side of the road so they can pass, they did and I didn't know what gang it was, I know it wasn't the Angel's though, they looked like them but I would have known they're insignia on their backs, this gang wasn't wearing anything I knew, but they were a gang old dudes and young ones some with old ladies on the backs. They were cool, I was giving them the thumbs up sign and some did the same back to me, maybe because I gave them the respect by pulling over to the of the road or maybe they saw I was in a Army uniform that they didn't bother with me. I stop counting them after 35 or so bikes, there must have ben about 60 of them just rolling along, it was impressive to see and hear their thunder roll by.

Max, you are right on.
Gosh, aw shucks, thanks!
:)

The store was in Union NJ. In 1966 I was on my way to my National Guard meeting in Freehold NJ. Getting there, I had to drive south on the Garden State Parkway and get of and drive down about 20 miles east on RT. 33 to Freehold. Well, 20 miles of deserted counrty farm roads lined with corn fields. One early morning driving there I see coming up behind me a gang of bikers, I didn't know who they were, but I pulled to side of the road so they can pass, they did and I didn't know what gang it was, I know it wasn't the Angel's though, they looked like them but I would have known they're insignia on their backs, this gang wasn't wearing anything I knew, but they were a gang old dudes and young ones some with old ladies on the backs. They were cool, I was giving them the thumbs up sign and some did the same back to me, maybe because I gave them the respect by pulling over to the of the road or maybe they saw I was in a Army uniform that they didn't bother with me. I stop counting them after 35 or so bikes, there must have ben about 60 of them just rolling along, it was impressive to see and hear their thunder roll by.


You can remember 1966.  You have the advantage of presence.  You can imagine how scary that would look to Ward Cleaver.  There's a gang of barbarians on monster motorcycles coming to town!

Growing up I heard second-hand stories about bikers.  No matter where these guys went, it always ended with destruction, murder, and rape, and rape.

You said rape twice.

I like rape.

(forgive my theft from Blazing Saddles)
:-\\

My friend's mother's boyfriend was a biker.  Don.  Or Donnie.  Depends on what mood he's in.  Better get it right!  His old lady (as in girlfriend) also my friend's old lady (as in mother) got a nice little house together and she stuck with him until he started smoking PCP and shooting through the windowpanes at "demons" in the garden!  And don't tell Don..uhhh...Donnie, um, that there ARE no demons in the garden like you did yesterday, otherwise you'll be walkin' around with TWO shiners!  So his old lady split!  Donnie continued work the place over with a chainsaw until the local constabulary took him for a ride!
:o

That was my first impression of bikers.  Don.  Or Donnie.  Scary. Destructive.  Nothing like "Easy Rider."  Also, a story line from a Fabulous Furry Freak Brothers comic (which I started reading way too early) featured Fat Freddy entering a bar where all the patrons wore leather jackets emblazoned "Hog F**kers."  When they spot Fat Freddy they say, "There's a citizen, let's light him up -- and p*ss him out!"  In the next frame Fat Freddy has been thrown through the plate glass window! That's one place where Gilbert Shelton got it wrong.  They don't HAVE plate glass windows at biker bars!
8)